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RE: Turns 23 – 24: 11-24 December 1943

 
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RE: Turns 23 – 24: 11-24 December 1943 - 3/24/2015 2:19:27 PM   
jwolf

 

Posts: 2493
Joined: 12/3/2013
Status: offline 		It is impressive -- or depressive -- how intense and bloody the air war is. What is more of a sideshow in WITE is front and center in WITW, brutal and bloody.

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Post #: 61
RE: Turns 23 – 24: 11-24 December 1943 - 3/25/2015 8:54:44 AM   
loki100


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf

It is impressive -- or depressive -- how intense and bloody the air war is. What is more of a sideshow in WITE is front and center in WITW, brutal and bloody.


Aye, for at least half the game in truth the air war dominates.

What I'm trying to do is to weaken the Luftwaffe badly and if I hit something on the ground that is a bonus. My logic is that the Allied airforce is so strong in 1944 that if you have just one invasion area there is little the Germans can do about it (in contrast to the game start). But if you have 2 to protect, then they might be able to overwhelm the weaker one by cutting supply etc. So my goal is to make the Luftwaffe so weak that it lacks the power to inflict serious interdiction even on a secondary (or tertiary) invasion.

Goal #1 of my 1944 planning is the 10 hexes I need to avoid the 1000 pt penalty.

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Post #: 62
Turns 25-26: 25 December 1943 – 6 January 1944 - 3/25/2015 8:56:15 AM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turns 25-26: 25 December 1943 – 6 January 1944

Again I'll run these turns together as both turns saw poor weather little action.

At the end of 1943 my VP situation was predictably negative, but if I can manage a successful invasion in 1944 I can still see this ending in a draw.



The only real action on T25 was a Christmas raid on Berlin by Bomber Command. This seemed to catch out the Luftwaffe as it did a lot of damage for very few losses.



The start of 1944 again saw bad weather, but US 15 Air was able to hit Munich.



Now its really a case of maximising the VP score from bombing and preparing for the main event ...

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Post #: 63
Turns 27-28: 3 – 16 January 1944 - 3/30/2015 8:46:26 PM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turns 27-28: 3 – 16 January 1944

Again I'll run these together as T27 saw no real action due to poor weather.

The good news on T27 was that my early bombing of the V-weapon launch sites meant that the VP gain for the Gemans was minimal. Overall, I'm finding it much easier to avoid too many lost VP for the V-weapons compared to the U-boats in 1943. By T28, this was down to a loss of 2 pts.



Despite the poor weather on T28, I decided to risk hitting the Ruhr. My normal bombing score is dropping (in part due to the lower 1944 modifier), so I decide to risk higher operational losses for hopefully inflicting some damage.



With Bomber Command, the result was predictably unimpressive, but I sent the P-47s of 9 Air over the Ruhr in an attempt to lure the Luftwaffe into playing ... with good results.



Overall this phase of WiTW is a bit like the spring mud turns in WiTE. Its all about planning for the next stage and taking small advantages of openings while you wait.

My primary goal is to try and wreck the Luftwaffe as air power is really my only hope of making progress when I make the main landings.

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Post #: 64
Turns 29 -30 : 17 January – 31 January 1944 - 4/5/2015 5:23:26 PM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turns 29 -30 : 17 January – 31 January 1944

I find the sequence of turns from about this stage to May/June 1944 a little bit predictable. Unless the game has gone very wrong in 1943 its all about waiting for, and planning, the main invasion. Its like the spring mud turns in WiTE. Its realistic, you need the preparation time and towards the end you are more than ready for something to actually happen.

My bombing score has suffered a bit for the recent poor weather but I'm happy at keeping the V-weapon score at -2/-3. I do think this is a bit easier to manage than the U-Boats, even if the launch sites do seem to repair more quickly.

Weather remained very bad but I decided I really needed to keep the strategic bombing campaign going.

The main target was the Ruhr with 15 Air hitting the region around Munich.



The results reflected the problem of finding Germany in a blizzard -especially at night. I'll spare you a screenshot of what I actually managed.

More successful was the decision to start bombing the major ports in southern France



On T30 the weather remained a blizzard and my strategic bombing remained ineffective apart from 8 Air that did do some damage. It both found the Ruhr and I gambled that Dave's fighters wouldn't want to play in a blizzard so went for the V-weapon sites on the Baltic.



However, the shocking news was of a German attack ...



Dave took advantage that I'd left brigades in my frontline so as to avoid too much attrition and rest the bulk of 8 Army.

I mean what is the game coming to ... Germans doing actual attacks? I'll show him who is meant to do the attacks in this game.

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Post #: 65
RE: Turns 29 -30 : 17 January – 31 January 1944 - 4/5/2015 6:31:13 PM   
jwolf

 

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Status: offline 		LOL you show him!

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Post #: 66
RE: Turns 29 -30 : 17 January – 31 January 1944 - 4/6/2015 2:26:55 AM   
LiquidSky


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You should have put the units behind in reserve. That would have shown him.

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Post #: 67
RE: Turns 29 -30 : 17 January – 31 January 1944 - 4/6/2015 9:54:13 AM   
loki100


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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf

LOL you show him!


I did ... I pointed out that this sort of thing was very unsporting ...

quote:

ORIGINAL: LiquidSky

You should have put the units behind in reserve. That would have shown him.


They were ... ... thats why it took him 5 attacks to bounce my brigade. I think he just became frustrated and carried on attacking to see if it would finally pay off


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Post #: 68
Turns 31-32: 5-18 February 1944 - 4/9/2015 9:27:12 AM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turns 31-32: 5-18 February 1944

Again I'll run these turns together.

On T31 the strategic air war was rather brutal especially over the Ruhr. Bomber Command did a decent job at Mannheim destroying a lot of HI for relatively few losses.

It was US 8 Air that bore the brunt.



The raids at Dortmund did a lot of damage with 3 missions a day but both the Americans and the Luftwaffe suffered heavy losses. The other target was Braunschweig where the Luftwaffe was overwhelmed and substantial damage inflicted.

At the start of T32 VP situation remains unremarkable. Bit disappointed with such a low gain for bombing (reflecting lack of sustained attacks in January) but happy that the V-weapon menace is under control.



Unfortunately bad weather shut down most of the air war, the exception was a relatively successful US 8 Air attack on the V-weapons at Neustrelitz.



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Post #: 69
Turns 33-34: 19 February 1944 – 3 March 1944 - 4/13/2015 7:16:27 PM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turns 33-34: 19 February 1944 – 3 March 1944

I do find I start suffering from a degree of cabin fever by this stage of a WiTW campaign. Its realistic, it reflects the weather and the degree of planning needed for a successful invasion. It is akin to the spring mud turns in WiTE ... its just not really the most exciting phase of the game.

Anyway the weather table started to draw my attention, but for T33 it was better to let the allied airforces have a 'duvet-week' than try anything dramatic.



So that is what I did.

T34 was better.

Overall the VP situation is ok, given my lack of progress in Italy. At least I seem to have the v-weapon menace under control.



The airforce is standing up fairly well to the demands being placed on it



In particular I have decent stocks of my key fighter bombers and most of the rocket armed squadrons are at full strength.

Although the weather remained bad, I decided to let both Bomber Command and 8 Air have a vacation on the Baltic. My guess is that Hamburg will be weakly defended now and 8 Air can hit the V-Weapon sites around Peenemunde.



In addition, 8 Air carries on levelling the Ruhr.

In the circumstances the results were pretty good.



I took a lot of losses but the Luftwaffe suffered heavily too. In particular the Ruhr raids were costly for them, mainly due to the P-47s.

From this game and my AI game I'm coming to think there are 3 distinct phases to the strategic air war and your interaction with the Luftwaffe.

1 – at start, and probably most of 1943 ... try to avoid interceptors, plan to select weakly defended targets
2 – first half of 1944 ... rough parity between escorts and interceptors, airwar is a bruising set of attritional battles but no particular need to worry so much about avoiding the Luftwaffe
3 – rest of the game ... basically you can ignore the threat of interceptors, even to some extent set up raids to make the Luftwaffe have to fight as it will lose experienced pilots and take substantial operational losses.



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Post #: 70
Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/15/2015 7:41:01 AM   
loki100


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Status: offline 		Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944

Since we've managed to play a long way ahead of my write ups I'll cover some of the pre-invasion turns more quickly.

For the most part I'm not doing much of any surprise. The strategic airwar is mostly aimed at building a VP score for when I need to divert all my aircraft to France. I've been bombing out rail yards and ports in France since late 1943 so there is no need to make that a real focus at this stage.

My 'innovation' on T35 was pretty stupid.

I'd spotted that the airbase at the centre of the Ruhr was stuffed with German night fighters. Since I did a lot of damage to the Luftwaffe in Italy by hitting its bases for some reason I decided that repeating this trick in a region stuffed with flak would be a good idea.



Yep, a really good idea



I think the only reason any of my planes survived the week was that Dave's AA gunners were laughing too much.

Still overall, I am grinding down the Luftwaffe. My goal is to able to sustain air control over two different landing sites in N Europe at the same time. To do this means I have to weaken the Luftwaffe.



Next turn I returned to some common sense with the bombing. I'm now less worried about avoiding Geman interceptors as most of my raids are well escorted. This turn Bomber Command returned to the Hamburg region. For some reason (someone using old bombing maps?), they hit my old friends the U-boats.



8 Air also had a Baltic theme, taking out the v-weapon factories in the north.

I also started a recon campaign in France. Since I don't want Dave to know my target I spread this over most of the plausible sites. The information is not that valuable, I have most of my invasion already prepared to 90 and have no real intention of switching targets.



In this game I'm doing a better job of managing my recon assets than in my AI game. I think the key is not to allocate too many planes to a mission. Often all you need is one or two squadrons. If you allocate too few the target area is coloured brown so I just juggle till I have enough. This is allowing me to avoid too much attrition.

Late March brought a renewed interest in the weather.



Don't think I'll invade this turn. In fact I decided to suspend most air operations to allow the bombers to rest for the tasks ahead.



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Post #: 71
RE: Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/15/2015 1:57:53 PM   
jwolf

 

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Status: offline 		You can't really invade, can you, until you can count on good weather for a sustained period?

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Post #: 72
RE: Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/15/2015 3:07:43 PM   
Q-Ball


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From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		I personally think recon of invasion sites is useless. If you use that information to plan an invasion, it's going to be a couple months old by the time you go. All it does it tip your hand. Better to simply plan the invasion blind, and save your recon.

The one purpose of unit recon before an invasion is last-minute recon of your airdrop zones. In my game vs. Dave, recon spotted a Para unit in one of my drop hexes the turn I was invading; I cancelled that drop. Turns out that was a full-strength FJ division; cancelling was a good call!

The one thing you should do is bomb all the major ports and railyards in France. Spread it around, and you won't tip anything. Paris is an important rail junction, in particular wipe out the railyard there.

If you haven't done so already, re-train alot of your FB to primary skill of Bomber, particularly RAF planes. The reason RAF is because the Brits have several rocket-equipped models, Typhoon but I prefer Hurricane IIc because you get it in numbers and can take losses. For USAAF units trained to FB, use the P-40; it's not that special a plane, but the loadout is OK, and most important you can afford large losses of this type. You also should have a fair number of P-38 in pool, those are good FBs. Mustangs I save for escort over Europe.

You should also be expanding every airbase in Southern England, if you are not already. Max them all out at size-3. Build new ones in the towns.

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Post #: 73
RE: Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/15/2015 4:16:30 PM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf

You can't really invade, can you, until you can count on good weather for a sustained period?


No, there is one AAR where someone tested out landing in the winter mud. It was a complete disaster. The only real advantage the Western Allies have is the sheer power of their tactical airforce, so you have to plan to invade when that is at its most deadly

Also early May you receive 3-4 new squadrons for 9 Air and as I said to Dave ... I really didn't want his army to feel it was being under-bombed

quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

I personally think recon of invasion sites is useless. If you use that information to plan an invasion, it's going to be a couple months old by the time you go. All it does it tip your hand. Better to simply plan the invasion blind, and save your recon.

The one purpose of unit recon before an invasion is last-minute recon of your airdrop zones. In my game vs. Dave, recon spotted a Para unit in one of my drop hexes the turn I was invading; I cancelled that drop. Turns out that was a full-strength FJ division; cancelling was a good call!

The one thing you should do is bomb all the major ports and railyards in France. Spread it around, and you won't tip anything. Paris is an important rail junction, in particular wipe out the railyard there.

If you haven't done so already, re-train alot of your FB to primary skill of Bomber, particularly RAF planes. The reason RAF is because the Brits have several rocket-equipped models, Typhoon but I prefer Hurricane IIc because you get it in numbers and can take losses. For USAAF units trained to FB, use the P-40; it's not that special a plane, but the loadout is OK, and most important you can afford large losses of this type. You also should have a fair number of P-38 in pool, those are good FBs. Mustangs I save for escort over Europe.

You should also be expanding every airbase in Southern England, if you are not already. Max them all out at size-3. Build new ones in the towns.


To be honest, I did it to wind him up

The three places I stuck my nose into all are feasible landing sites so I thought I'd provide some uncertainty. Agree that in the context of this game early and sustained recon is a waste of time.

France's rail and port network is a pile of ruins, I started on it pretty early in the game as I find it a good use for the Wellingtons and Stirlings. They tend to hinder the main bombing campaign but can be effective on their own for hitting rail bases and the v-weapon pads on the Channel coast (and you have masses of them).

Southern England is well and truely concreted over. Almost all of tactical air went off to train on bombers over winter as did a lot of US squadrons. I find you don't need many pure fighters in either 2 Tac Air or 9 Air (I use fighter command on AS to offer some protection). If you've done a decent job on harming the Luftwaffe, its safe to send in the FBs unescorted (or minimally escorted) as they can look after themselves.

< Message edited by loki100 -- 4/15/2015 5:18:11 PM >

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RE: Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/15/2015 5:37:44 PM   
jwolf

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: loki100

as I said to Dave ... I really didn't want his army to feel it was being under-bombed



Loki, full of compassion!

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Post #: 75
RE: Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/15/2015 7:32:12 PM   
Seminole


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quote:

The only real advantage the Western Allies have is the sheer power of their tactical airforce, so you have to plan to invade when that is at its most deadly


Aside from the weather, there are modifiers to efficacy based on hours of daylight. Even on a clear day you're going to get better interdiction in the summer than the winter because you have more time.

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Post #: 76
RE: Turns 35-37: 4 – 24 March 1944 - 4/16/2015 7:23:20 AM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf


quote:

ORIGINAL: loki100

as I said to Dave ... I really didn't want his army to feel it was being under-bombed



Loki, full of compassion!



At the moment I think he is really appreciating my care and attention to detail. Nothing says 'Good morning have a nice day' like 500 Allied tactical bombers turning up twice a day to pay a visit.

More seriously, I'm becoming convinced that it is the targetted application of tactical airpower that really gives the Allies an edge. Strat bombing is a bit *mheh*, which is right - its better those factories are damaged and so on, its good to divert the luftwaffe - but its a small contribution which only pays once you start to hurt the Germans on the battlefield. Operational attacks (rail, larger area interdiction and so on) also help but the Germans can shrug that off. But really concentrating tactical air on a few selected sectors means even the strongest German defence falls apart over time ... oh and this is helped by regular interventions by the 'death star'.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Seminole

quote:

The only real advantage the Western Allies have is the sheer power of their tactical airforce, so you have to plan to invade when that is at its most deadly


Aside from the weather, there are modifiers to efficacy based on hours of daylight. Even on a clear day you're going to get better interdiction in the summer than the winter because you have more time.


Hadn't realised that but it makes sense, nice addition to the overall simulation

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Post #: 77
Turns 38-40: 25 March 1944 – 14 April 1944 - 4/16/2015 7:26:03 AM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turns 38-40: 25 March 1944 – 14 April 1944

Again, I'm going to combine these turns to move this along. I'm not doing anything particularly unusual or interesting till the Italian campaign restarts in late April.

My bombing patterns are 6 clusters of strategic attacks, mostly within escort range and hunting out V-weapons and industry. I'm mixing up HI, aircraft and afvs. Not really sure what actually hurts the German economy or war effort, but I'd like to think that any combat losses I inflict will be hard to replace. In France I'm making sure his rail yards are not repairing and ensuring the V-weapon launch sites are kept out of action.

Big news on T38 was that the Maquis struck a deadly blow against the Swiss invaders with an attack skillfully designed to isolate Geneva. That should warn the Germans and make them surrender?


[1]

I also started to bomb Ploesti with decent results.


[2]

April arrived bearing rain and mud.



And a worsening VP score. Main reason is that Dave is picking up 5/6 per turn as he can allocate excess Garrisons. Since this reflects my lack of progress in Italy I can't really complain.



The Luftwaffe seems to be in its slow death spiral. I'm hoping that this reflects both steady attrition in the air war over Germany and that I have been hitting a number of the main production sites. 15 Air is good for this as there are some nice targets in Southern Germany and Austria.



Bomber Command protested at being forced to fly in the rain by not bombing the set target ... mostly I'm now doing ok for night bombing but this does rather stand out, especially as other raids that turn did reasonable amounts of damage.



Since Bomber Command did such a good job on Kassel last turn I sent them back to try again


[3]

Again other raids went well, especially in the Ruhr where a number of HI factories were badly damaged.



8 Air revisited its Baltic hunting grounds, taking out both aircraft factories and V-weapon sites.



[1] – I find in WiTE that partisans have a habit of attacking isolated and unimportant rail lines such as this.
[2] – we found a bug/feature that meant this was a bit one sided so I stopped after a few turns. It appears as if the Germans can't resupply their airbases in Romania making this too easy to inflict damage with no real response (and that explains why I did so much damage in my AI game). I agreed to only do raids every now and then to balance for this.
[3] – one definition of madness being to repeat something you strongly suspect won't work this time either ...

< Message edited by loki100 -- 4/16/2015 8:33:34 AM >

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Post #: 78
Turns 41-43: 15 April – 5 May 194 - 4/18/2015 7:46:09 PM   
loki100


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Status: offline 		Turns 41-43: 15 April – 5 May 1944

Again a lot of turns conflated here to move this forward. T41 was heavy rain and mud so nothing actually happened in any case.

But on T42 the main change was I went back onto the offensive in Italy. At this stage I wasn't sure what I could achieve but it seemed possible that the Germans have weakened their defences to send units to France and that I could grab all of Southern Italy. A nice bonus in terms of city VP score and better airbases for 15 Air.



As in my AI game, that shows the benefit of sustained localised interdiction by tactical air as an apparently strong unit collapsed in combat.

T43 saw an improvement in the weather. My air campaign was a combination of trying to build VP score, hit German industry and ensure the V-weapon sites in France were in ruins. I also started hitting some key rail junctions but done so as to make Dave think I was going for the region to the east of Le Havre.



Bomber Command did a good job



And 8 Air enjoyed its trip to the Ruhr



At the same time 9 Air drew the Luftwaffe into battles on my terms over the Netherlands



Hopefully this raid by 15 Air will make it harder for the Germans to replace those air losses



I think I am starting to seriously weaken the Luftwaffe.



T43 saw a renewal of the Italian offensive with steady gains along the coast of the Gulf of Taranto.



This led me to redeploy some armoured and motorised units back to Italy that I had withdrawn to North Africa. All of sudden this looks like its worth trying to exploit.

The region I've just taken is around a small town called Eboli. This was aptly described in one of the classics of post-war Italian literature (Cristo se e fermato a Eboli) as a place so politically and geographically remote even Christianity never quite made it there.

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Post #: 79
Turns 44-45: 6-19 May 1944 - 4/21/2015 7:42:06 AM   
loki100


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Status: offline 		Turns 44-45: 6-19 May 1944

And finally, things are on the verge of happening.

T44 was pretty normal, as I didn't want to give Dave too many clues (I've no idea if he was taken in or not ... my guess is that pragmatically he didn't really care where I landed). The main action was in Italy where my opportunistic offensive carried on towards Taranto. To reinforce I've brought up some new US armoured divisions to see if I can properly exploit the situation.



On T45, the weather was ok with the possibility that T46 could be clear.



So I decided to take a chance. If I've gambled right I'll have one or two more completely clear turns when I am ashore. Also starting earlier may make it easier to actually take the 10 hexes I need to avoid the 1000 vp penalty.

I'd decided on Normandy for a few reasons. First the four beaches along the Seine are linked and as there are no enemy held ports the navy will take little attrition. Equally while the bocage will slow me, it will also protect me.

So the plan is 2 British army to land 2 corps at Caen and 1 US to land 2 corps at Carentan.







All my nice tactical bombers that have spent the winter resting are committed. I've come to realise how useful the direct ground support mission is so each invading army has an air directive in support but most is aimed at interdiction of one sort or another.



The entire airforce is to be committed.

At sea, naval interdiction was to come from a combination of Lancasters from Bomber Command and Coastal Command.



Only Fighter Command was on air superiority. One group were to operate over the bay and the other to protect the various bombing missions against the rail network.



On the ground, basically the various level bombers are hitting the German rear, either to cause tactical interdiction or to damage their ability to resupply and move into the area.



Over 1,000 rocket armed fighter-bombers are planned to strike their defences at Caen while around 500 planes from 9 Air support the US 1 Army.



I also spent a lot of time on loadouts. Where possible planes are not using fuel tanks in order to maximise the bomb load.

And the VP situation before all this commences:



I fear it is going to become a lot worse before it improves (if it ever does).

Now all I needed was some luck with my gamble over the weather.

And US 3 Army is also fully prepared for an invasion … but any discussion of that will have to wait

< Message edited by loki100 -- 4/21/2015 8:42:45 AM >

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Post #: 80
Turn 46: 20-26 May 1944 - 4/24/2015 8:05:33 AM   
loki100


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From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turn 46: 20-26 May 1944

Before we start, here is the VP position. I strongly suspect it is never going to be that good again.



As you can see my VP cost for casualties went up ... a lot, as did the actual losses:



But the best news is that my weather gamble paid off, clear skies and solid ground. Clear skies of course means the Allied airforce can deploy in all its power.



Which led to heavy losses. 262 shot down and 1676 damaged. The pay off was impressive levels of interdiction and every body ashore or landing. The 2 paratroop divisions will help me make some progress inland.



Elements of 1 US Army were able to push onto 101 Airborne and crack part of the defensive line in their sector.



Even better, VIII British corps actually managed not just to exploit that victory but hammer the retreating Germans again.



Of importance, forcing a retreat in hexes with high interdiction is a really useful loss multiplier, they take actual casualties on the retreat and even more disruptions.

However, reality sets in with a significant defeat on 1 British Army's sector. Caen holds out.



Despite this, I'm able to push 2 divisions off the beaches onto the hex captured by 6 Airborne.

You can't sustain Soviet style attrition attacks with the Allies but I think there are times when you need to persist with low odds attacks. Due to my interdiction, those Germans at Caen will only receive limited supplies and struggle to convert disrupted units back to combat ready (and will take fatigue in any case). I need Caen to really be able to break out so I'll persist despite the losses and impact on the VP score.

I hastily bring in some fresh units to occupy the spare beaches but leave all the command formations at sea for the moment.



So far my decision to go for Normandy feels vindicated. The sheer volume of tactical airpower is enough to negate the German defensive benefit for the bocage (at least in a few key hexes) but the bocage is protecting my advances. A stack of 3 full strength allied Infantry divisions can easily generate a defensive value of 60-70 with the terrain multiplier. To shift that would mean a massive commitment, in a region where every hex is well plastered by air interdiction.

My first goal is to avoid the penalty for not having 10 hexes by August. That is 7 already. In turn this means I can make secondary invasions exactly when it suits me, rather than to meet the VP criteria (and to be clear, I approve of this penalty).

In turn that means I can keep all my tactical air power concentrated on a very small area and that escalates the damage inflicted on the German army to the point that it starts to fall apart.

I think the Allies have two key tactical advantages. First while you can never match the CV of the very best German divisions a well constructed Allied infantry division can have a CV of 10-12. 2 full stacks of those will move all but the strongest defender, so you can probe for weak spots. The key one is to concentrate your tactical airpower, this helps in the short term but creates a situation of escalating damage if you maintain this level of interdiction for 4-5 turns.

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Post #: 81
RE: Turn 46: 20-26 May 1944 - 4/24/2015 1:50:25 PM   
jwolf

 

Posts: 2493
Joined: 12/3/2013
Status: offline 		Two big related questions:

Did you land early enough that his defensive preparation wasn't so effective?

Can he counterattack, and how badly will you be hit?

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Post #: 82
RE: Turn 46: 20-26 May 1944 - 4/24/2015 3:53:25 PM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf

Two big related questions:

Did you land early enough that his defensive preparation wasn't so effective?

Can he counterattack, and how badly will you be hit?


For the first question. No I don't think it'll make much difference. Haven't played from the German side yet so maybe I've just avoided some reinforcements but I can't think they would be critical. The exploit of the early game trick of moving the invasion to France is at start most of the German army in France is frozen. People seem to do this to Pelton quite a lot and looking at the AARs one person won big as a result but the others failed - I think the logic that the British had in reality of being too weak to take on the Germans in open combat was valid.

He could attack, the AI did in my other game. But Dave has been more cautious and I've learnt quite a bit. The levels of interdiction that I've generated means anything moving into the battle area is going to get chewed up and if it pulls back it'll get a second going over (or a square do as it is sometimes called in the more genteel corners of Glasgow).

But he is facing stacks of about 65-70 defensive CV, built up from 3 infantry divisions at a base cv of 10-12 each and then doubled by the bocage penalty, plus being surrounded by high interdiction. That means Dave would need to attack with 130 or so and that would mean the bulk of his decent units coming to exactly where my airpower is strongest. The reason my stacks are stronger is I've got better at allocating support units.

Equally that is why I chose Normandy. The bocage is both friend and foe. It doubles his cv but I can find weak spots and really hammer them, first with air then on the ground. If I advance it makes my gains almost irreversible. Again looking at other AARs, ironically landing in clear terrain, such as east of Le Havre, seems to lead to a quicker stalemate as the allies daren't advance too much.


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Post #: 83
RE: Turn 46: 20-26 May 1944 - 4/24/2015 7:24:51 PM   
jwolf

 

Posts: 2493
Joined: 12/3/2013
Status: offline 		Thanks for the review of your strategy in choosing that area. It's an irony that you can turn his good defensive terrain against him.

Thanks also for another lesson in Scottish.

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Post #: 84
RE: Turn 46: 20-26 May 1944 - 4/25/2015 6:45:57 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf

Thanks for the review of your strategy in choosing that area. It's an irony that you can turn his good defensive terrain against him.

Thanks also for another lesson in Scottish.


aye the bocage is a good and bad for us both. Its like in WiTE in a situation where the two sides are equal, its 'easy' enough to drive the enemy out of a hex but hard to hold it. With the Soviets that sort of attritional struggle ends up playing into your hands but the VP/loss mechanism in WiTW makes it less practical. Also in the first phase off the beaches its near impossible to leave slots for units to retreat so you run the risk of allied units routing off to Northern Ireland (why they all go to NI being one of the stranger game decisions ... the often grumpy locals around places like South Armagh must get very confused).

But Dave needs to cover everywhere, I can concentrate airpower to peel open one small section of his front.

my long term plan is to find a situation I can legitimately describe as a 'stairheid rammy' for a drawn out contested battle (the term reflects both a style of housing common in Glasgow and our tendency to explain, in a respectful way, why some one is a total numpty who you wouldn't trust with the messages). We shall see.

< Message edited by loki100 -- 4/25/2015 3:23:16 PM >

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Post #: 85
Turn 47: 27 May – 2 June 1944 - 4/27/2015 7:40:48 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turn 47: 27 May – 2 June 1944

One difference to playing the Allies in WiTW as opposed to the Soviets in WiTE is taking next to no interest in the various manpower and resource pools. On the assumption I avoid any major disasters, it seems as if this is no constraint at all.



For the air war, decided I was doing well enough over Normandy to release some of the heavier bombers to hit Germany.



The outturn was not too bad. 313 shot down, 2130 damaged. Bomber Command did an effective job around Bonn and 8 Air hit the fuel plants at the Ruhr.



Good interdiction levels over the main battlefields. Should help US 1 Army make progress on the west side of the Cotentin.



After a few turns shuffling units up that narrow coastal road, decided to try and expand my position on the Basento in southern Italy. Bit of a disaster but again that unit should now be weakened.



US 1 Army shows 8 Army how its to be done.

First attack re-opens the gap I'd created at the end of last turn and another breaks out towards Cherbourg.



However, Caen holds out again. Again my logic is the only way I am going to take this is by keeping up the pressure.



I bring across some armour for 1 US so that I can start to exploit the gaps I'm punching in the German lines.



Not that good a turn, both successful attacks were against weak units but I'm pretty sure the Germans are starting to suffer under the constant air attacks. But I am now sure I'm going to hold at least 10 hexes by 1 August (thus escaping that penalty).

I've repeated the idea from my AI game of a corp optimised for fortress busting. So it has all the heavy artillery, lots of engineers and so on. That is still in the UK at the moment, but with that, plus better use of the task forces, I hope to clear out any fortified ports with ease.

Second invasion is fully prepared but I'm going to hold that back. In part the threat is probably forcing Dave to divert more units than he'd need to block any further advance. Second, I like to keep my tactical air concentrated and at the moment its doing a lot of damage in Normandy. Finally, although I'm ok for shipping my priority now is more armour in Normandy to put his defences under extra pressure.

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Post #: 86
RE: Turn 47: 27 May – 2 June 1944 - 4/28/2015 10:33:47 PM   
carlkay58

 

Posts: 8650
Joined: 7/25/2010
Status: offline 		Loki, the British and the US Manpower pools can be a real problem by late 44 and 45 if you aren't careful with manpower usage. If you take too many casualties you will see empty pools. Equipment pools are not a worry - whether for air, AFV, vehicles, etc. the Western Allied production is large enough to handle it all but the manpower pools have to be watched.

I have typically found that when the US Army Group HQs come into play in late 44 it is time to disband the British ones and let that manpower enter the British manpower pool for a good safety margin.

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Post #: 87
RE: Turn 47: 27 May – 2 June 1944 - 4/29/2015 9:45:38 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: carlkay58

Loki, the British and the US Manpower pools can be a real problem by late 44 and 45 if you aren't careful with manpower usage. If you take too many casualties you will see empty pools. Equipment pools are not a worry - whether for air, AFV, vehicles, etc. the Western Allied production is large enough to handle it all but the manpower pools have to be watched.

I have typically found that when the US Army Group HQs come into play in late 44 it is time to disband the British ones and let that manpower enter the British manpower pool for a good safety margin.



thanks for that, I've been struggling to make much sense of how to use the various Army Group commands as they seem pretty redundant, the allied commanders seem much more a similar bunch than either the Germans or the Soviets so the extra safety net doesn't seem to be that important.

I've been scrapping the British and Free French AA formations and some US ones. In part for the manpower but also as I really do not fear a massed luftwaffe campaign of ground interdiction any longer

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Post #: 88
Turn 48: 3-9 June 1944 - 4/29/2015 9:47:53 AM   
loki100


Posts: 10920
Joined: 10/20/2012
From: Utlima Thule
Status: offline 		Turn 48: 3-9 June 1944

Not shown the VP table for a while. Its getting steadily worse as I'm basically trying to force the Germans back and see if I can generate some pockets in Normandy. Bombing campaign is doing pretty well given the lack of attention.



In response I commit some of 8 Air to the Baltic to hunt the v-weapons, some of Bomber Command hits the Ruhr but the bulk of the airforce is in support of the ground battles. I'm keeping to the same patter of fighter bombers operating on the front lines and level bombers hitting communication links and trying to slow any behind the lines movements.

Results are ok, not even that many planes damaged. Bomber Command had a good trip to the Ruhr as did 8 Air on the Baltic.



I also bring over almost all the Hurricanes and a lot of Spitfires to France. The short range of the rocket armed Hurricanes means you really need to keep them close to the front, also, unlike the early game, I'm not really that worried about German attacks on my airfields.

On the ground, 2 British Army carries on trying to capture Caen.



Better is that 1 US cracks open the German lines protecting Cherbourg and makes some more progress towards Avranches and Vire. I now have some space to move behind the lines and that should make it easier to exploit gains. That is also the 10 hexes I needed to avoid the 1000 point penalty. So I've managed to achieve my first goal.



Some gains also in Italy, have almost reached Taranto.



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Post #: 89
RE: Turn 48: 3-9 June 1944 - 4/29/2015 1:14:37 PM   
jwolf

 

Posts: 2493
Joined: 12/3/2013
Status: offline 		Dumb question about Italy: is there much risk of getting cut off along the Gulf of Taranto?

(in reply to loki100)
Post #: 90
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