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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> Uncommon Valor - Campaign for the South Pacific >> 2.3 Patch Questions

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2.3 Patch Questions - 3/10/2003 12:00:29 AM

Attack Condor

Posts: 425
Joined: 12/27/2002
From: Chicago
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Just a request for clarification on David's post with the changes for 2.3:

(4) deals with the update about submarines attacking shipping transiting through hexes with subs as opposed to only attacking TFs that end their move in the sub's hex. The base sighting chance is 20% for daytime and 10% for nighttime. Are these new sighting chances applicable for hexes the TF ends its turn in or just for hexes the TF is transiting through?

(5) deals with the "wolfpack" concept - removing benefits to stacking subs in a hex. It also refers to an "enhanced chance of aircraft flying search to find and hit a submarine in the hex." Is this across the board or only for those hexes with more than one sub in it (and if the latter is true, does the chance to find subs increase with each sub over one in the hex - greater # of subs within a 30 mile patch of ocean leading to an increased chance of finding something in that 30 mile patch of ocean)?

Thanks for info - just trying to keep my sub drivers informed :)

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"Shouldn't we be leading the shark into shore...instead him leading us out to sea?"

Post #: 1

- 3/10/2003 12:29:12 AM

bradfordkay

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline

Condor, my impressions from what I have read and seen is that the new sighting chance is for every hex the TF enters, whether it is a transit hex or end of turn hex. This seems reasonable as the TF spends no more actual time in the end of turn hex than it does in any other hex it transits during the turn.

I also believe that the increased chance of asw a/c finding and attacking subs is per each additional sub in one hex.

Can someone verify these impressions?

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fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Attack Condor)

Post #: 2

- 3/10/2003 12:41:40 AM

Mr.Frag

Posts: 13410
Joined: 12/18/2002
From: Purgatory
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I set up a line of 5 subs, and ran two groups of 5 ships over the line from one hex before it to one hex after it.

Out of the 5 subs passed over, 2 attacked.

Thats 40% success rate. Almost seems higher then they intended.

This is with green crew (starting subs with no experience) vs 5 AP or 5 DD (all ASW 4 level).

I'm going to hate to see this after 6 months of play when you have sub aces out there as right now, they are doing great.

The sad side note, the group of 5 ASW DD's DID put two subs in the hurt shop so Allied player beware, Japan ASW teams will be on the lookout for you!

AC, from a stacking standpoint, once any sub in the hex launches an attack, ALL other subs in then hex are ignored, so stacking offers nothing now except higher odds of getting killed.

(in reply to Attack Condor)

Post #: 3

- 3/10/2003 2:26:09 AM

Attack Condor

Posts: 425
Joined: 12/27/2002
From: Chicago
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Thanks for the info Mr. Frag and bradfordkay.... couple of things to perhaps clear up what I may have not explained the first time:

bradfordkay: I agree with your assessment that all hexes would be considered "transit" hexes - except for the destination hex. If the DH is in the middle of the ocean and just a "waypoint" to route a TF around a danger zone (e.g. minefield) then that DH could be considered "transit". A TF in port (unloading supplies, etc.) would, however, lose the benefit of being a "moving target". Would the sub's spotting chance revert back to 33% for that situation?

Mr. Frag: Agreed on the loss of benefit for "sub stackers" but my question is if aircraft search/attack benefits apply to only hexes with subs stacked, or if the lone sub in the 30 mile patch of ocean is also subjected to an increased chance of being spotted/attacked from the air.

Thanks for the chance to clarify :)

_____________________________

"Shouldn't we be leading the shark into shore...instead him leading us out to sea?"

(in reply to Attack Condor)

Post #: 4

- 3/10/2003 4:33:26 AM

Mr.Frag

Posts: 13410
Joined: 12/18/2002
From: Purgatory
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My understanding of that base chance was for the sub to spot a enemy ft moving through IT'S hex.

33% if it stops in sub hex
20% if it passed through in day phase
10% if it passed through in night phase

The air search/attack change only applies to stacked subs from how it reads. The actual amount is not the above %'s. It is not listed how much better...

Hope that answers what you wanted.

(in reply to Attack Condor)

Post #: 5

- 3/10/2003 5:18:37 AM

CapAndGown

Posts: 3206
Joined: 3/6/2001
From: Virginia, USA
Status: offline

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mr.Frag
[B]I set up a line of 5 subs, and ran two groups of 5 ships over the line from one hex before it to one hex after it.

Out of the 5 subs passed over, 2 attacked.

Thats 40% success rate. Almost seems higher then they intended.

This is with green crew (starting subs with no experience) vs 5 AP or 5 DD (all ASW 4 level).

I'm going to hate to see this after 6 months of play when you have sub aces out there as right now, they are doing great.
[/B][/QUOTE]

Frag,

I would say this is just randomness. When I ran the tests on the beta, I did the same thing you did. Guess what? I didn't see any attacks for quite a while. At first I thought it was not working. But I kept running the test until I finally was able to confirm there was a mid move attack.

As they say, your mileage will vary (along with your luck. glad to hear your Jap DDs did so well. gives me some hope. ;) )

(in reply to Attack Condor)

Post #: 6