Finnish Set-Up bug

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Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/4/2015 12:39:57 AM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

I mentioned this in another thread, but the Finns have been setting up [second time around] with two air units too many, and no convoy points. They set up properly when first DoW by the Soviets, but after peace, they set up with their whole air force. Also - and this was a new quirk that might be a bug - if I did not reorganize the Finn oil dependent units prior to enforcing a peace, those units set-up disorganized when I aligned Finland the next turn. I didn't think to try to emulate that this time around.
I saved during the set-up.

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/4/2015 9:43:26 AM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

Moreover, those nasty Finns managed to take Leningrad, and after, when the Germans compelled peace, those Finns not only demolished the blue factory in Leningrad - without permission - they also managed to muck up the red factory.

I kept forgetting to repair the Leningrad factories, but when I finally remembered, it was the end of May/Jun 1940, and while the engineer was still in Leningrad, there was no option for repairing the factories. The port was repaired!

Here's another save, near the end of the turn. On another note, after moving the Italian mot [in South France] down through Marseille and into Touloun, I had to scatter the French Fleet. When I installed Vichy France, I only had four of eight battleships in Metropolitan France, the other four were on Corsica. I am curious about why the game considers Corsica to be part of Metropolitan Vichy France with regard to attacking the hexes [eg: port strikes], yet it does not do the same when deciding whether the French capital ships are all in the Home OCuntry or not.

(in reply to Larry Smith)

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/4/2015 9:44:32 AM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

I must have hit "fast reply" Sorry!

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/5/2015 5:02:36 PM

Centuur

Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
Status: offline

Corsica is not part of Metropolitan France. This is written in the FAQ:

Q17.1-1 17.1 Does the Vichy France home nation
include Corsica?
No, Corsica is a territory. The Vichy
French administration group that includes
the Vichy French home nation also
includes Corsica. Date 20/01/2009
17.1: If you install a Vichy government, Metropolitan
France itself is divided into 2 countries - Metropolitan
Vichy France (including Corsica if still French
controlled) and Occupied France.
20/01/2009

So that isn't a bug. The Finnish one on set up is. You shouldn't have gotten those aircraft...

Any chance of giving us a saved game from before the alignment of Finland?

< Message edited by Centuur -- 4/5/2015 6:04:12 PM >

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Peter

(in reply to Larry Smith)

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/6/2015 11:06:59 AM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

Here you go! I had to fast-forward things from the beginning of the turn that the Soviets declared war on Finland! When I did this, I ran a "bad" Soviet attack, and wanted to see what the game would do if the Finns took Leningrad! Well... in my game, once the peace was enforced and Leningrad was given back, the Soviets could not repair the factories. Oddly, the "Finns" destroyed the blue factory, too, or did something to it, because I never got a Repair Factory unit on the Soviet production form, and the Soviet engineers wouldn't repair the red factory, either. They fixed the port, but not the factory.

I had something similar occur when I collapsed Vichy, and then tried to get the red factory in Lyons running with a German engineer. It didn't work, though, and I'm sure I left it there till the next turn.

Anyhow, this save is just before the declaration of war phase, with the Axis going first. Maybe once you've checked why the plans keep coming up that way [and aren't there supposed to be 3 CP, too? There were the first time around], you can then run to the end of the turn and see if the Russian engineers fix Leningrad. Heck - I railed those guys in, out, and back in again [successive turns], and nothing!

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/6/2015 11:07:42 AM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

Oh, and thanks for the info on Vichy - I missed that detail.

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/6/2015 11:26:31 AM

Centuur

Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
Status: offline

Thanks for the gamesave. It's strange, but on my saved games I couldn't recreate this one. Using your game save, I can. Well, something for Steve to investigate...

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Peter

(in reply to Larry Smith)

Post #: 7

RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/6/2015 5:44:15 PM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

I just checked the Air Units file, and the "NB" flags are in place [right there after the year codes]. So they were not improperly flagged. In your saved games, do the Finns get the 3 Convoy Points? I can understand if the post-Winter War set up assumes they were either sunk, or absorbed by Germany, but... if the minors [that can be attacked in game] that can survive their wars [only Finland & Rumania, as I don't know if there is a coded rule to let a war "lapse" with a minor] can lose their entire military, then be set-up at full strength again the very next turn when re-activated - if that is the case, strange as it sounds - why would they not set up EXACTLY the same. I realize getting all four air units is a bug, but why not also the three CP points? I wonder if those two are not connected [if there is not another rule dictating otherwise]?

Also, did the game get screwy with you about reinstating the Leningrad factories? I never had the Finns demo those, so they should not have been destroyed.

(in reply to Centuur)

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/6/2015 5:51:59 PM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

If playing with the Construction engineer option, the red factory in Leningrad would require repair if the hex was ever occupied by an enemy unit.

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Paul

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/6/2015 7:43:13 PM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

Yes, I know. The problem is that despite sending the Soviet engineer there after they got Leningrad back, the red factory did not get fixed. Also, as I understand, there is no automatic destruction of blue factories, so when did the game decide that the blue factory was dead? The only reason I didn't too chuffed about it is because the Nazi-Soviet Pact was bleeding sufficiently from the Russian resources that Leningrad's two factories just weren't required. Now that Russian has been invaded, I will see if the Germans can get the red Leningrad factory up and running. I am also making another attempt at getting Lyon on line!

When I collapsed Vichy and seized Algeria [Rommel was there; Allies in Morocco, and Tunisia had been taken by the Italians], Oran was left to Germany as-is, meaning it was fully operational. The French Med ports had been overrun [except Nice], and all but Toulouse and Lyons had been taken when I installed Vichy [Lyons was occupied, and the only Mil left for France to build was the Lyons one, and the French had BP coming from the UK through Spain [otherwise, how could they have had any BP - I had all their ports, all their continental resources, and Lyons was surrounded].
Anyway, I'll let you know what happens.

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 10

RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/15/2015 12:51:42 AM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Larry Smith

Yes, I know. The problem is that despite sending the Soviet engineer there after they got Leningrad back, the red factory did not get fixed. Also, as I understand, there is no automatic destruction of blue factories, so when did the game decide that the blue factory was dead? The only reason I didn't too chuffed about it is because the Nazi-Soviet Pact was bleeding sufficiently from the Russian resources that Leningrad's two factories just weren't required. Now that Russian has been invaded, I will see if the Germans can get the red Leningrad factory up and running. I am also making another attempt at getting Lyon on line!

When I collapsed Vichy and seized Algeria [Rommel was there; Allies in Morocco, and Tunisia had been taken by the Italians], Oran was left to Germany as-is, meaning it was fully operational. The French Med ports had been overrun [except Nice], and all but Toulouse and Lyons had been taken when I installed Vichy [Lyons was occupied, and the only Mil left for France to build was the Lyons one, and the French had BP coming from the UK through Spain [otherwise, how could they have had any BP - I had all their ports, all their continental resources, and Lyons was surrounded].
Anyway, I'll let you know what happens.

Major ports are repaired for free and automatically if there is an engineer in the hex during the production phase. Factories can be repaired if there is an engineer in the hex but you have to pay for the repair during the Production phase.

I'll investigate the major port that you reported as staying damaged.

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Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

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RE: Finnish Set-Up bug - 4/15/2015 6:00:20 AM

Larry Smith

Posts: 203
Joined: 4/14/2001
From: Williams Lake, BC, Canada
Status: offline

There was no major port that stayed damaged. It was the Leningrad factories. After the Russians got them back at the conclusion of war with Finland, they were never allowed to repair the factories, nor were they allowed to just get the red one back up and running. When the Germans took the city after invading Russia, they did get to bring the red one up [just with an ENG there, at no cost]. But on the German form, there was an option to repair the Leningrad factory, so I did it, but the repaired factory just... vanished later. Maybe it was placed, and then the program remembered it was conquered - I don;t know. That was when I realized the two factories I had the CW help the FF build had also vanished, so I just stopped playing there.

Sometimes I wonder if bugs in a game like this breed more bugs as various values get funny. Regardless, time to start a new one, and see what else I can stir up.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 12