[FIXED B696] Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem.

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[FIXED B696] Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem.

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Command: Modern Operations series >> Tech Support >> [FIXED B696] Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem.

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[FIXED B696] Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/22/2015 5:53:35 PM

RobotCriminal

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Joined: 1/2/2015
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Ok, so I spent some time trying to figure out why it seemed like my patrol aircraft seemed to have some trouble engaging subsurface contacts (they tend to overfly it a whole bunch and take a very long time to engage even with a precise location) and I think I have figured out the issues.

The first one is pretty simple in that the aircraft seem to want to pop up above the 1000ft max alt for an air dropped torp when they are circling around to re-engage, but this is pretty simple to take care of by setting a 1000ft or lower manual alt (would be nice if they were a bit more inclined to do this themselves but nbd).

The second seems to be the way that their OODA loop is being calculated. Looking at the P-3C for an example, it has a 24 second OODA at regular proficiency. However, by continuously trying to order a manual engagement what seems to be happening is this:

1. On the way inbound to the attack (engaged offensive), at anything greater then 0.4nm the standard "ASW torpedo must be dropped within XXnm" message is received.
2. Once the aircraft is right over the contact, only THEN does the message switch to "Weapon cannot engage this target for another 24 sec (OODA loop limitation)"
3. Aircraft overshoots its target and tries to circle around for a while (often popping over 1k feet if not set) trying to re-engage.

Hopefully this makes sense, I think the issue is that instead of starting the loop at first detection (or when the attack run is started) it is waiting until it is within the point blank weapon range? Not really sure how this works "under the hood" but figured I would bring it up. As it is the best way to get a first pass hit is to micro manage it and do a BOL from about .5nm, but you need to be really paying attention.

I didn't attach a scenario since this seems so far to be the same for pretty much all MPA torpedo attacks that I have looked at, but I can throw one together if needed I guess.

< Message edited by emsoy -- 4/29/2015 12:46:39 PM >

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/23/2015 3:38:36 AM

JPFisher55

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Joined: 11/22/2014
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I have encountered this issue. Usually, it is due to having the ignore plotted course when attacking set to no; when I set it to yes, the a/c or helicopter attacks the sub rather than just circling it.

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/24/2015 12:22:38 AM

mikmykWS

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I've added this to our list of things to look at. Files always help just because we see what you see.

Thanks!

Mike

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/24/2015 7:38:46 AM

p1t1o

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Joined: 4/6/2015
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JPFisher55

I have encountered this issue. Usually, it is due to having the ignore plotted course when attacking set to no; when I set it to yes, the a/c or helicopter attacks the sub rather than just circling it.

There's two types of behavior, firstly (when ignore plotted course is "no", often on ASW strike missions) where the aircraft just circles the sub at a distance. Secondly, (usually seen on ASW patrols or if ignore plotted course is set to "yes") there is the behavior where aircraft make multiple passes over the sub but fail to drop torpedos - this appears (as noted above by the OP) to be caused by the combination of 0.4nm attack range and long OODA loop but the plane does sometimes drop after multiple passes, so Im not sure if this is a bug or designed behavior related to veterancy and such (I assume higher veterancy, with faster OODA time would drop sooner). Manual bearing-only launches seem to drop ASAP.

< Message edited by p1t1o -- 4/24/2015 8:40:30 AM >

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/24/2015 3:50:14 PM

JPFisher55

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True, I have seen this too, but the a/c eventually drops the torpedo. It does take a while though.

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/27/2015 4:42:46 PM

Dimitris

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OP <--- Yes, please post an example save. Thanks.

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/27/2015 6:31:21 PM

kaburke61

Posts: 225
Joined: 9/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JPFisher55

True, I have seen this too, but the a/c eventually drops the torpedo. It does take a while though.

+1, I see this now (recent builds) in most of my games. I hadn't looked into why it was
delaying. The above OODA explanation makes sense. I don't have a save either, as it would drop eventually.
Advanced ASW exercise is a great scenario to experience it, as anytime you exploit one of the sub-surface
contacts with an airborne asset, it seems to exhibit the behavior, whether its the Nimrod, or the helos.

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RE: Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem. - 4/28/2015 4:21:31 PM

Dimitris

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We need a pre-attack save in order to investigate this.

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> Command: Modern Operations series >> Tech Support >> [FIXED B696] Air launched torpedo OODA loop problem.

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