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Population Question - 6/2/2015 2:30:20 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		Hey guys I am playing a game as Mortalen, I've noticed that after some years of war...my population on my main planet which was like 22billion....22102k(as it reads) is like 10 billion now and my revenue has plummeted as a result.

Is this from migration to other planets in my empire? Troops recruitment? or both? I've never seen such a population drop (which brings with it the corresponding revenue drop) when playing as humans no matter how long my wars were, sure the humans got unhappy after a while and stuff like that sometimes, but half the population never disappeared, I've only noticed it with the mortalens.

Post #: 1
RE: Population Question - 6/2/2015 3:05:19 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		My guess is migration and possibly tourism. I have seen it happen to Quameno ages ago, and while doing my Universe AAR the enslaved Atuuk left my main income colony.

Are you aggressive with zero tax on a lot of developing colonies of good quality (including culture/development)?

(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 2
RE: Population Question - 6/2/2015 3:21:30 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		I've realized now war, doesn't matter either, I am not at war and population is dropping rapid.

I've got about 4 other high quality developing with good culture yeah..... will they ever get as good as the main colony revenue? I would rather have a main colony whose revenue was 700k.......like it was and I was earning 350k in cash flow of taxing it, than colonize so many stupid planets and have all my population go to them....... destroying my main income planet....

thats one peeve I have, especially how long you just have to sit there staring...colonies take so long.

Another thing is those computer allies man. You form a defence pak, you help them, they send fleets with yours, they are all happy, and then for no reason they are furious with you...you've done nothing wrong......and they covert your resources and they don't like your reputation, yet you've declared war on people they asked you to declare war on........

(in reply to Bingeling)
Post #: 3
RE: Population Question - 6/2/2015 3:31:48 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		There is nothing magic about the starting colony. A 95% "random" colony will outshine your 85% starting colony once it is populated. Except for possible things like you having built wonders on the original capital and such.

From an old AAR, probably during ROTS or Legends, and with somewhat nasty home system settings, but see where the capital is:


(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 4
RE: Population Question - 6/2/2015 3:55:38 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		I'll report back with a human game... never recall my population just doing this and I always played with humans, this is first time as mortalens. I'll let you know, will start a new game and see how it goes.

That's how my colony list used to look with young colonies vs old ones.

(in reply to Bingeling)
Post #: 5
RE: Population Question - 6/2/2015 5:35:37 PM   
mordachai


Posts: 207
Joined: 3/6/2015
Status: offline 		You sure you didn't miss a major event - like a super-quake, or super-flood?

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Post #: 6
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 12:08:11 AM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		nope major events are off and the population decline is continuing and the colony is extremely happy with a high level of development and 0 corruption. Just on a downward spiral.

At some point my old human games got like above, and thats when I knew I had won and could just end the game, sicne it was only a matter of time.

that difficulty on extreme Bing?

< Message edited by Cruis.In -- 6/3/2015 1:09:28 AM >

(in reply to mordachai)
Post #: 7
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 6:16:19 AM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		It was not extreme difficulty, probably hard.

It should be a mix of over-eager desire for migration and low reproduction rate behind this. I had another game where a very good independent did not go above 8000M or so because they were too eager to migrate. That was in my Shadows release AAR.

(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 8
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 11:23:45 AM   
Spidey


Posts: 411
Joined: 12/8/2013
Status: offline 		I suspect that it might also play a role how much capacity you put into your passenger ships, as well as what fuel capacity they have, and whether they even have warp drives. They presumably cannot ship a gazilion people away to zero tax havens in the blink of an eye if it takes them forever to ship just a few million tax payers off to the next system, after all.

(in reply to Bingeling)
Post #: 9
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 5:45:59 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		Should I gimp my passenger ships then? I am at tech level 7 so they have fast warp drives, range and space!

(in reply to Spidey)
Post #: 10
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 5:55:21 PM   
Spidey


Posts: 411
Joined: 12/8/2013
Status: offline 		At this point it might not make the greatest difference. I don't know how keen the AI is on retrofitting backwards. But in general I don't see a need to improve your passenger moving capacity too much. What's the best thing that can come from that? You've obviously seen the worst one.

(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 11
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 6:30:41 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		I did a test. I saved the game on a new save to play around with it. I edited the colony to full population. 20billion. A few days later its down by 600 million. to 19.4 billion.

Looking on some more, I've noticed a constant stream of passenger ships from MANY other empires, coming to my system (sol 2) to transport migrants AWAY, they are taking my humans in the millions! Thats how they are moving so fast, my humans aren't going to my other worlds via my passenger ships, they are all leaving on foreign ships...

whats up with this?

< Message edited by Cruis.In -- 6/3/2015 7:37:37 PM >

(in reply to Spidey)
Post #: 12
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 6:37:00 PM   
Ashery

 

Posts: 10
Joined: 6/3/2015
Status: offline 		Would it be viable to upload the save somewhere for someone else to poke around in?

Since you already started a new save to run tests on, you could also just follow your various passenger ships and see where they're going.

(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 13
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 6:39:33 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		Looking on some more, I've noticed a constant stream of passenger ships from MANY other empires, coming to my system (sol 2) to transport migrants AWAY, they are taking my humans in the millions! Thats how they are moving so fast, my humans aren't going to my other worlds via my passenger ships, they are all leaving on foreign ships...

It was suspicious since my other colonies weren't growing by the millions I was losing from sol2.

*edit

I've traced the human migration to two main empires Ugnari and another. My colonies are happier, more developed than theirs. I've also noticed that in exchange I Have a high set of migrants on my OTHER worlds, so so like SOL 3 has 600m+ Ugnari. While SOL2 my main planet which is bleeding population has 0 of any other race beside humans.

SO it would seem the AI is taking migrants from SOL 2....and bringing migrants to SOL 3 and others because I realize my other planets have migrants too. So SOL 2 is the only one not getting migrants.

This really seems like a bug in migration. The fact that sol 2 has no migrants, the fact that 2 races are draining it of migrants but not bringing any to sol 2, the fact that it is the top colony with 175percent development...

< Message edited by Cruis.In -- 6/3/2015 7:57:15 PM >

(in reply to Ashery)
Post #: 14
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 7:11:18 PM   
Bingeling

 

Posts: 5186
Joined: 8/12/2010
Status: offline 		I think that test save could defend a tech forum post headlining excessive migration. Upload it, of course.

Is the tax rate excessive? I don't think the Mortalen should be too eager to transfer to non-mortalen worlds.

(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 15
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 9:32:51 PM   
Twigster

 

Posts: 1023
Joined: 1/13/2015
Status: offline 		Interested to hear what the answer ultimately ends up being for this.

(in reply to Bingeling)
Post #: 16
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 10:15:51 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		Hi, I tested this on humans AND mortalens......same result, and immigration is SO FAST. within DAYS you could drop from 21000k to 20500...

It's madness, within a year you're like half the population. I lowered the tax rate to ZERO and it was still doing the same thing. I then even put the tax rate on all the other colonies to 100 and it still did the same thing. Like I said, development high, no taxes, lots of luxury resources.

And I tracked the migration to them going to the Dayuts and Ugnari...mainly them. Many many passenger ships, a constant stream. Colony happiness is high high high.

(in reply to Twigster)
Post #: 17
RE: Population Question - 6/3/2015 10:23:34 PM   
Cruis.In

 

Posts: 202
Joined: 11/10/2012
Status: offline 		SAVE FILE

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=3872676&mpage=1&key=�

(in reply to Cruis.In)
Post #: 18
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