RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/4/2017 9:56:12 PM

Lowpe

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It is a donnybrook....those 11 units in the plains are worrisome. In your experience will they be getting enough supply from Ramree? My guess is yes.

Anyone have experience using low layered LRCAP as opposed to CAP? The Allies will throw everything at the troops once they arrive northeast of Shwebo.

Good AA will be there, hopefully it will be enough!

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/4/2017 10:06:28 PM

Lowpe

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Down near Rabaul, this is a good time to ambush I think.

I should have set those ACM to lay mines and then move away LRCAPing them. Didn't think of it really, I had them set to disband in port but they weren't fast enough. No loss, other than the chance to catch some Allied planes though since they were almost out of fuel.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/4/2017 10:17:30 PM

Lowpe

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In less than 2 months the Frank R will start production. I will have 12 eligible sentai to upgrade, however, 3 of them need the Frank B which won't come until Oct/Nov of 1944 most likely...unless I move some of the Frank R r&d factories to it (which I might).

So 9 Frank R squadrons, plus a steady trickle of arriving reinforcements.

But also in two months George and Jacks start showing up. Not numerous but very, very good.

One of the great difficulties I have had this game is that Jocke hardly every uses his Jugs and Lightnings. However, I am betting they will come out and play in two days over the central plains of Burma. I must be ready to inflict maximum losses, even to the point of sacrificing some protection over the oil at Magwe.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/4/2017 10:22:22 PM

Lowpe

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There are 4 large Sentai and one small sized 12 unit that upgrade to the Frank B...a significant group. All Frank B's may advance to the Frank R.

I am uncertain at this point if I would elect to keep them Frank B for the cannons, or move them up to Frank R.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/4/2017 10:28:32 PM

Lowpe

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10 days...these bad girls will get TRACOM pilots...I had thought to send them to Rabaul...but I think they will go to the air war over Rabaul instead.

The only other recent long lasting PDU off game I know about is NJP's excellent game where he elected I recall not to bother even making the Judy since so few squadrons flew it.

I plan to use mine heavily.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 12:56:21 AM

witpqs

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quote:

It is a donnybrook....those 11 units in the plains are worrisome. In your experience will they be getting enough supply from Ramree? My guess is yes.

Yes.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 3:48:20 PM

Lokasenna

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Level 9 runway...

Just because there's no stacking limit doesn't mean there isn't stacking

. Lots of planes there = easier to hit them. I punished MM's level 9 AFs many times on this, so I'm mostly speaking from observation rather than direct knowledge - more planes at an airfield means higher likelihood that they'll be hit by any given airfield hit. Overstacking increases the likelihood further. Level 9 AFs are simply immune to overstacking.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 5:21:13 PM

Lowpe

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Turn is away, heavy rains here, and our internet is spotty.

Allies pushing, pushing, pushing.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 7:01:18 PM

Lowpe

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Sept 22, 1943

You just have to get used to this kind of stuff. Happens with regularity.

Big invasion at Rabaul..2 divisions. The MTB retreat a hex, and then bounce back and forth having several encounters with Allied SAG's before going down.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 7:02:48 PM

Lowpe

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You have to be happy one of the four midgets actually even got in a launch.

But they do add flavor!

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/5/2017 7:03:22 PM >

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 7:05:30 PM

Lowpe

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Burma, big happenings.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 7:15:53 PM

jwolf

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Kudos to Jocke ... going right for the jugular at Rabaul ... takes guts. Can you hold very long there, or some sort of counter?

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 7:21:32 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwolf

Kudos to Jocke ... going right for the jugular at Rabaul ... takes guts. Can you hold very long there, or some sort of counter?

Plentiful supplies.

Ground combat at Rabaul (106,125)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 15473 troops, 112 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 525

Defending force 34030 troops, 509 guns, 419 vehicles, Assault Value = 869

Japanese ground losses:
71 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 3 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Allied ground losses:
49 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
17th Ind.Mixed Brigade
144th Infantry Regiment
Maizuru 1st SNLF
14th Garrison Unit
19th Naval Guard Unit
15th Base Force
51st Base Force
24th Air Flotilla
4th Air Defense AA Regiment
Yokosuka 5th SNLF /5
8th Base Force
12th Ind.AA Gun Co /5

Defending units:
2nd Marine Division
Americal Infantry Division
1st USMC Tank Battalion
South Pacific
134th Field Artillery Battalion
198th Field Artillery Battalion
1st Medium Regiment
205th Field Artillery Battalion
2nd Medium Regiment
1st Marine Defense Battalion
147th Field Artillery Battalion
II Australian
2nd RAA Jungle Regiment

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/5/2017 7:22:07 PM >

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 7:45:01 PM

Lowpe

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I have 9 factories working on the Sam, and today, 9/22/43 the first factory fully repaired. I am months away from the engine, though, but still this is huge progress.

For you JFBs out there, allocating 9-10 size 30 factories on the Sam, plus 3-4 engine r&d groups, you should be able to really accelerate the Sam for 44 action.

A big investment, certainly. But a must, especially in scenario 2 games.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 10:54:14 PM

Lowpe

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I have a massive low level layered CAP over my troops north of Shwebo, and only 2 radar sets present (but they are good ones). I am quite skeptical how well the low level cap will do away from a base. This could be real bad.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 11:32:08 PM

mind_messing

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

I have 9 factories working on the Sam, and today, 9/22/43 the first factory fully repaired. I am months away from the engine, though, but still this is huge progress.

For you JFBs out there, allocating 9-10 size 30 factories on the Sam, plus 3-4 engine r&d groups, you should be able to really accelerate the Sam for 44 action.

A big investment, certainly. But a must, especially in scenario 2 games.

I can't like the Sam. It's essential, even with PDU On, but I just can't like the air-frame. I feel that I build it just for the CV's, and it's sub-par at everything other than a CV escort. It's just as well that CV's are limited to the magic 8 hex range, as otherwise it wouldn't even be worth that.

I wonder how getting it in 1944 will work out - I'll be watching closely to see how it compares against the late-war Allied air-frames.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/5/2017 11:44:34 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

I have 9 factories working on the Sam, and today, 9/22/43 the first factory fully repaired. I am months away from the engine, though, but still this is huge progress.

For you JFBs out there, allocating 9-10 size 30 factories on the Sam, plus 3-4 engine r&d groups, you should be able to really accelerate the Sam for 44 action.

A big investment, certainly. But a must, especially in scenario 2 games.

I can't like the Sam. It's essential, even with PDU On, but I just can't like the air-frame. I feel that I build it just for the CV's, and it's sub-par at everything other than a CV escort. It's just as well that CV's are limited to the magic 8 hex range, as otherwise it wouldn't even be worth that.

I wonder how getting it in 1944 will work out - I'll be watching closely to see how it compares against the late-war Allied air-frames.

To tell the truth, I don't think I will get it early enough. Most of the factories where ones I added after picking up the game. I suspect another 2 months before the next factory repairs.

I agree with how you feel, but in a pdu off game it is super critical.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:10:35 AM

Lowpe

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Sept 23, 1943

A hard day for Japan, but one that had to be spent.

Massive air combat north of Shwebo. Japan uses a low layered LRCAP. The first fighters in are Corsairs, followed by Hurricanes, followed by Jugs, followed by Lightnings, followed by Warhawks, followed by Hellcats, followed by Mustangs.

Losses are steep for Japan...but the price has to be paid. I believe we are at above 2-1 ratio of Japanese ftr losses to Allied losses. Corsairs are always tough, and LRCAP makes it even harder.

The Allied fighter strength is simply overwhelming, a factor of the West Coast Invasion.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:25:53 AM

Lowpe

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Allied fighters sweeping, all at 30K:

8 sweeps of corsairs (prob 7 squadrons) 139
10 sweeps of Hurricanes (2 models, 9 squadrons) 128
3 sweeps of Hellcats (3 squadrons): 107
7 sweeps of P40s (6 squadrons): 143
5 sweeps of P47s (4 squadrons): 86
1 sweep of P51a (1 squadron): 25

Total fighter strength: 628. Estimated fighter strength in theatre from recon is over 800 on the front lines.

I was hoping to be hit by the Hurricanes first, as that had been normal routine prior. Because of this, I allocated Tonies and they were simply shredded by the Corsairs. The 61-a was in general my 9000 foot LRCAP and I suspect 18 were lost in the first sweep of 31 Corsairs. They did however, protect the Franks that were flying half of them at 9 and the other half at 7.

Conclusion: low layered LRCAP is simply inferior to base low layered CAP as the defense cannot mass their fighters as well. However, even against overwhelming numbers, top of the line fighters do well enough challenge everywhere as they rapidly tire out and can achieve less than 2-1 in plane losses.

However, if the Allies have learned an important lesson here too, and one that bodes ill for Japan.

Morning Air attack on 23rd Air Defense AA Regiment, at 60,44 , near Shwebo

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 15 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 4
A6M5b Zero x 6
A6M5c Zero x 11
Ki-43-IIb Oscar x 38
Ki-43-IV Oscar x 26
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 14
Ki-44-IIc Tojo x 15
Ki-61-Ia Tony x 35
Ki-84a Frank x 75

Allied aircraft
F4U-1 Corsair x 31

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5c Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed
Ki-61-Ia Tony: 9 destroyed
Ki-84a Frank: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F4U-1 Corsair: 3 destroyed

CAP engaged:
Yokosuka Ku S-2 with A6M5b Zero (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 6 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 7000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 7000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 40 minutes
Ryujo-1/A with A6M5c Zero (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 4 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 7000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 7000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 38 minutes
261 Ku S-2 with A6M5 Zero (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 7000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 7000.
Raid is overhead
Ryujo-1/B with A6M5c Zero (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 4 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 7000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 7000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
Shoho-1/B with A6M5c Zero (3 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 7000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 7000.
Raid is overhead
1st Sentai with Ki-84a Frank (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 19 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 8000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 8000.
Raid is overhead
11th Sentai with Ki-84a Frank (21 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
21 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 9000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 9000.
Raid is overhead
24th Sentai with Ki-43-IV Oscar (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 10 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 4000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 4000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 40 minutes
25th Sentai with Ki-84a Frank (19 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
19 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 9000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 9000.
Raid is overhead
47th I.F.Chutai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (2 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 9000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 9000.
Raid is overhead
50th Sentai with Ki-84a Frank (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 16 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 7000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 7000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 40 minutes
54th Sentai with Ki-43-IV Oscar (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 16 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 4000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 4000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 35 minutes
59th Sentai with Ki-43-IIb Oscar (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 19 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 4000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 4000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 36 minutes
63rd Sentai with Ki-43-IIb Oscar (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 19 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 4000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 4000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
68th Sentai with Ki-61-Ia Tony (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 19 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 9000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 9000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
78th Sentai with Ki-61-Ia Tony (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 16 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 9000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 9000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
87th Sentai with Ki-44-IIa Tojo (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 12 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 8000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 8000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 1 minutes
246th Sentai with Ki-44-IIc Tojo (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 15 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 4000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 4000.
Raid is overhead

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/6/2017 11:29:44 AM >

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:41:21 AM

Lowpe

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Rabaul theatre

Four SAG Task Forces bombard Rabaul....no mine hits. No fire from the DP guns present which is one of the better Japanese units with 15cm and 8 cm guns. They have been a huge under performer.

Adding to the plane losses was this attack. There is an invasion task force to the west of the attack, and it was targeted too, but the planes could not locate them in the bad weather. A blessing no doubt.

I would have preferred to fly one squadron in at high altitude with escorts. Losses would have been less among the fighters for Japan, but the bombers would have all died. Still, not that many losses for the information gathered.

But the fighter losses here raise the loss ratio to slightly over 3-1. And considering no Jugs were lost to speak off, a decided Allied victory in the Air.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:42:03 AM

Lowpe

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Hard day, was it worth it? No. Allies did lose 4 4E beasts.

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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/6/2017 11:43:04 AM >

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:45:35 AM

Lowpe

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Heavy AA over the clear ground north of Shwebo does do a good job of protecting the troops and the hexside is mine now. Unfortunately the Allied motorized AA moved north up the road in one day and avoided being wiped out. Allied troops are always so darn fast.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:50:42 AM

Lowpe

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Massive, strange war of movement going on here.

Note the use of the 1000 point Chinese unit in the jungle rough east of Pegu. An excellent use for those troops.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:51:31 AM

Lowpe

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Massive Allied strength moving here...

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:55:13 AM

Lowpe

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Then, in the afternoon, disaster strikes...I foolishly allowed the KB to pick her path. I had thought about moving her further away from the coast but decided against it...it was the last thing I considered doing the turn and was tire. I should take a page from other players and do the KB first thing, when fresh and not tired.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:57:07 AM

Lowpe

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Really bad.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 11:58:46 AM

Lowpe

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So the heavy African AA escaped, all those planes spent at a bad ratio (but important lessons learned) and the KB severely weakened and the flagship potential toast.

Not a good day.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 12:05:41 PM

ny59giants

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Burma - With Allied control of Ramree and hexside control into the Irrawaddy River valley, supplies will migrate to his troops up north. You might need to get a LCU into hex west of Magwe to stop this. As Allies, I've had Shwebo not get any supply through the jungles from India, but have plenty with LCUs in clear terrain next to it. I would be making plans and moves to deny Jocke having supplies get from Ramree to any bases he captures.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 12:07:44 PM

ny59giants

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quote:

I should take a page from other players and do the KB first thing, when fresh and not tired.

I do CVs and major operations first and then double check b4 I send the turn. Just my OCD-ness.

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RE: Gnashing of Teeth: Cries of Fury - 5/6/2017 12:19:27 PM

Lowpe

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Just sent the replay and combat report to Jocke..should make his day. He is busy today, so no more turns for this day...which is probably a good thing.

I need to focus all my energy on saving the carrier I think. A bold Allied player might rush north with his carriers, anticipating a heavy ASW performance on the KB's part, and only a few sized 4 or larger runways to worry about. There are however some 8cm dp guns at Umboi...but they don't pose too much of a threat.

However, I don't think the Allies are that bold. Rather they will sweep the area with search and subs.

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