RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fcharton (A)

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fcharton (A)

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RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/3/2015 4:17:20 PM

JocMeister

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Methinks Jocke knows what he is talking about here.

Sadly, yes.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 61

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/4/2015 1:43:07 AM

PaxMondo

Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

quote:

ORIGINAL: Kofiman

The best recent performance in China has been witpqs in his Rumble in the Southwest AAR. China never ended up falling, and it's Sept 44. Chungking was taken in summer 43. He was quite agressive and defended forward.

I may not be experienced, but I would be much more interested in emulating success, rather than failure. Witpqs' performance was far from perfect, but the results are very hard to argue with. If you do not give your opponent challenges, you cannot expect your opponent to make many mistakes.

That one was started some four years ago. Not sure if that qualifies as recent!

Francois, Pax gives good advice. But I have found that its extremely hard to rotate units as the Chinese. The problem is that once they start moving the air hammer drops on them and they are usually spent before they arrive into position. And if the hammer doesn´t drop they will arrive without forts and will suffer the brunt of the next attack and bombardments.

So you need to have fallback positions. But the problem with that is that once the first position is routed they overstack the next hex and all supply is pretty much burnt up the same turn. SL is not without problems.

Absolutely accurate and true as I know it. Totally agree. Do not under estimate any of Joc's points.

The attacker faces exactly the same problems, and more often as he has to cycle his units more frequently.

SL makes it more difficult all the way around. I honestly do not feel there is any advantage for either side overall, but I do feel the transitory advantage lies with the defender. Your advantage on defense is that you can plan your avenues. You can use TP's to extract squads. Every hex of advance worsens the supply issues for the attacker.
And here is the kicker in this specific situation (allied defense of china): you don't have to win on a time table; he does. If you last into '43 you win. You've tied up his units for 6 months longer than he can afford. You should have been able to exploit that
with a sinister offensive like Mr. Kane or Nemo to the complete undoing of your opponent.

< Message edited by PaxMondo -- 11/4/2015 2:49:53 AM >

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to JocMeister)

Post #: 62

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/4/2015 1:55:05 AM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
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That is the holistic Chinese Defense approach.

(in reply to PaxMondo)

Post #: 63

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/10/2015 9:34:42 PM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

The first turn was exchanged a week ago, but my second turn was delayed by work. It is now almost ready. Joseph is out on holidays until Wednesday, and the war will be on as soon as he is back.

December 7th 1941 – A huzzah that will live in infamy, or something to that effect

Hawaii, of all places!

Our war began in the most classical way, with Kido Butai at full strength raiding Pearl Harbor. I believe so because the raid was advertised in the combat report as 72 Zeroes, 144 Kates and 126 Vals. It was not a very successful one, though. Only the port and the installations were targeted, the Arizona was sunk, the other battleships are at various levels of damage, but none is at risk. Bomb hits on the San Francisco, the Honolulu, a couple of destroyers and AV Wright will need about a month repair, and the shipyard was damaged, but that is all there is to it. No port, no runway, no air installation damage, no losses to the units stationed there. Fifteen Kates and five Vals were shot down by the flak.

Not having targeted the airfield means I will have 135 fighters on patrol tomorrow, and flak at full strength, though slightly disrupted. The navy will remain in port except two ASW squadrons that will operate close by, under fighter protection. Bombers will either search or conduct anti-submarine patrols. KB has a hundred fighters with excellent pilots. I am not wasting my squadrons.

Will my opponent try another day? I sure hope he does.

Meanwhile, in the Philippines

… my opponent had a much better first day. A very well coordinated port attack on Manila sank SS Pickerel and damaged, to various extent, five more submarines, two destroyers, and a handful of small combatants. Over Clark Field, the runway was damaged and a number of planes disabled.

Landings took place in Vigan, Appari and Laoag. Since Batan island was not captured, KB is in the Pacific, and mini-KB in the Celebes sea, those troops will have very little air cover tomorrow. I will try to bomb Appari and Laoag, both in clear terrain, and set the rest of my planes (including the Vildebeest squadron from Hong Kong) to naval attack. Whatever PT boats, DD, and MTB I could muster will try and disrupt the unloading ships. With a little luck, I might do some damage.

Signal Intelligence reported troops on their way to Mauban. Boise and Houston are on their way, and I am trying to rush two Philippine divisions and some armor from Manila. If he takes his time, I might be able to disrupt the southern landing. Around Subic and Clark Field, I have been sorting the good units (a Marine regiment, a couple of armored battalions, some artillery), and plan to build a small reserve.

The rest of the Philippines were quiet. Mini-KB (apparently just one light carrier strong) was in the Celebes, overseeing the invasion of Manado, but nothing else was detected around Mindanao.

Good gracious!

The Japanese did not stop at raiding Hawaii and bombing Luzon: they went straight for the Crown possessions, and landed in Kuching, Brunei and Kota Baru. Once again, my opponent achieved a very concentrated raid on Georgetown, and my bombers flew unescorted against the landings, to be shredded by a large contingent of Nates. Another task force was detected north of Borneo, probably going for a quick capture of Singkawang, and yet another near Puerta Princesa, maybe going for Jesselton. There is no sign of an attempt against Mersing, which I will try to reinforce. There were no raids against Rangoon, or Burma. I am expecting them tomorrow.

What now?

So far, I am presented with a relatively standard opening, Pearl Harbor, northern Luzon and Kota. Baru, and the first turn was pretty nice for the Allies. Enemy intentions are difficult to assess, but the landings in Manado suggest a quick advance in the Celebes, maybe as far as Darwin, and if the task force off northern Borneo goest for Singkawang, an early conquest of Palembang is very likely.

I have spent most of the week-end on the 8th of December turn, and most of the initial administrative tasks seem to be done, which means turns should be much easier for me now. My opponent should be back tomorrow, and the war will begin.

< Message edited by fcharton -- 11/10/2015 10:35:10 PM >

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 64

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/10/2015 10:12:12 PM

Rio Bravo

Posts: 1794
Joined: 7/13/2013
From: Grass Valley, California
Status: offline

Francois-

This will be one fun war to watch!

I wished pesky Squeeze Emperor good luck, but I will be following your AAR.

The best to you in smashing Japan into submission.

*chuckling*

Best Regards,

-Terry

_____________________________

"No one throws me my own guns and tells me to run. No one."

-Bret (James Coburn); The Magnificent Seven

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 65

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/10/2015 11:18:35 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
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Good luck.

To kill China the Japanese player need only invade Northern India. With no supply China dies a slow death. The X3 terrain is more of a handicap with stacking limits and hurts the Chinese greatly. See the thread in the forum on "snowplowing." But as said, the Allied player need not win in China only hold out for a decent interval. Early to mid 43 is desirable and can be done. And, I have always believed that the Allied player can lose China and still win the campaign. But for the Japanese player to leave China intact just gives the Allies a major boost later in the war. It is too easy for them to mount a counter attack with Chinese troops once the supply route from Burma is open. It cost a lot of resources to take China in 1942/43 but that pales in comparison to the costs of fighting the Allies there in 1944/45. Quite frankly, a lot of players have not run a pbemail campaign late into the war. It is a shame because that is when the ramifications of what happens in 1942 really take hold.

_____________________________

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Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to Rio Bravo)

Post #: 66

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/11/2015 1:07:34 AM

PaxMondo

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Joined: 6/6/2008
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Francois,

I had wanted to share your AAR, but I finished a couple of frothies with Joseph here in Phoenix last night. So, I will abstain for a while until anything we discussed becomes irrelevant.

Good Luck!

_____________________________

Pax

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 67

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/11/2015 2:55:25 AM

Lowpe

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Joined: 2/25/2013
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo

Francois,

I had wanted to share your AAR, but I finished a couple of frothies with Joseph here in Phoenix last night. So, I will abstain for a while until anything we discussed becomes irrelevant.

Good Luck!

Ever have old Frothingslosher? She gets quite attractive after a few...just saying.

Attachment (1)

(in reply to PaxMondo)

Post #: 68

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/11/2015 3:27:15 AM

PaxMondo

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Joined: 6/6/2008
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Can't say that I have ... I'll stick with my Porter, thank you!

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Pax

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 69

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/11/2015 10:11:13 PM

spence

Posts: 5400
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline

Good luck Francois...it is rewarding to know that like Darth Vader in the end you have recognized your service to the dark side has been misguided.

(in reply to PaxMondo)

Post #: 70

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/12/2015 1:01:57 AM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

December 8th 1941 – And the war began on Armistice day

The better part of valour

I think I know my opponent relatively well. Back in 2010, when I learnt my job as an evil emperor, his AAR against Smeulders was one of my references. One thing Joseph is good at is not waging lost battles out of pride. This might sound obvious, but it is more difficult than one might think. After a bad first day in Hawaii, many players would probably have gone for a second try, and I was certainly welcoming such a bold move…

KB was spotted around the French Frigate Shoals, today, retiring towards Japan. I left the navy in port, and kept the heavy CAP for one more day, you never know, but it seems that the day that will live in infamy was easy on me. The Arizona was my only loss. But on the other hand, KB is still at full strength, and it will be a long time until I can match it.

Rule Britannia, rule the waves!

Thanks to a merciful home rule, Force Z was spared her historical fate, and therefore were available today to try and punish the enemy invasion of Kuching. Two task forces were created, a small cruiser squadron, under captain Butler (of friggin’ in the rigging fame…), composed of light cruisers Durban, Danae and Dragon, call them the D team, and Force Z proper, under vice-admiral Phillips, and were ordered to Kuching.

Force Z arrived first, and dispatched two APD (Fuji and Haji). The D team found the main invasion force, sank one TB and two DMS, and damaged half a dozen of cargoes, and escaped unscathed. The cruisers need to rearm, but force Z hardly expended any ammunition, and retired to Muntok, ready to strike again.

In the Philippines, the Hong Kong destroyers, in a flourish of gallantry (Britons never shall be slaves, eh?) attacked the Vigan landing force, three destroyers, three sub chasers, and a dozen cargoes, and managed to sink a destroyer, and to damage a number of ships. Both Scout and Thanet are in bad shape, and trying to return to Manila. But at the end of the day, eight Japanese ships were reported sunk.

On Luzon, PT boats and Catilinas from Clarke and Subic attacked the landing forces in Vigan and Appari, and did some damage. But, as the French general in charge of this good guy team, I hate to admit that most of our victories, today, were the Royal Navy’s…

Malaya and other Crown possessions

Since the first turn invasions had been bold and deep, I was expecting a landing in Mersing today. It did not happen, and no enemy task forces were detected close by. Two Australian brigades are on their way, one will arrive tomorrow, the other in three days, and I have reinforced torpedo bombers in Singapore. Mersing looks like a chancy affair now.

With Mersing out of the way, it becomes easier to evacuate units from the third Indian division, and send them to Burma, eastern India, or the Andamans, to complicate the capture of Burma, and therefore delay the fall of China (I agree with crsutton on this). To achieve this, I have bought the DC-2 squadron that begins the game in Kunming, and sent it to Tavoy, to reinforce Port Blair, and try to prevent a paradrop capture. Dutch Dorniers have also been flying aviation support to Medan, to build a fighter base there, that can provide air cover to evacuees from Singapore. The SSVF brigade is now loading in Singapore, and the AVG is in Rangoon to protect supply convoys from India.

I do realize that I cannot, at this point of the game, prevent a determined emperor from taking Burma and Eastern India, and then China, but by reinforcing Burma, northern Sumatra and the Andamans, I expect to make this costly.

Elsewhere, in Malaya, I am trying to use my MTB and PT boats as “Nell traps”. So far, it seems to work : two MTB from Singapore on their way to Mersing were sunk by Nells, but five Nells were downed in the process. Over Georgetown, Nells from Indochina attacked HDML patrolling the port, one boat was sunk three Nells downed, and an Indian battalion managed to load and escape to Medan.

Enemy Nells had more success in the Malacca straits, three tankers fleeing Malaya were sunk.

Overall, we had a pretty good day in the air: Japan lost 17 planes (13 Nells), we lost four (three Hudsons).

Half baked

This is the second day of the war, too early to predict enemy intentions. But I do have a half-baked plan, which I will try to follow if the enemy lets me. As I said before, I want to defend China, and one way to achieve this is to keep Burma open for as long as possible, and then reopen it as early as I can. To achieve the former, I intend to reinforce Rangoon, but also try to defend Northern Sumatra and the Andamans, and reinforce Bengal and Assam, to force a capture of Burma by land, and complicate an invasion of India.

It is quite possible that my opponent, making the same calculation (note to the readers, since we both have AAR: please be prudent when discussing this on any of our threads), does the same, and puts a lot of weight on Burma and India, but I believe that in this case, I can turn this area in a long and expensive theater, which will help the allies in the Pacific.

(in reply to spence)

Post #: 71

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/13/2015 6:26:57 PM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

December 9th 1941 – Waiting for the barbarians

As a former, and nostalgic, evil emperor, I recall the early days of the war as a long series of invasions, with wave after wave of converted merchant ships landing on scarcely defended shorelines, for the greater glory of the empire.

Maybe it is just my memory, but this good boy newbie is slightly disappointed. Japan landed in Luzon, Brunei, Kuching, Manado, and Kota Baru on day one, took all those bases on day two, together with Makin, but that was all.

PT-boat-fest

Most of the naval action happened around Luzon. I have three squadrons of PT boats operating in the area. They are not very successful, but sometimes manage a hit on some torpedo boat or sub chaser, and seem to used up a lot of ammunition before they die.

Later that day, Catalinas from Manila attacked a cruiser squadron of the north eastern coast of Luzon, and managed to put a torpedo into CL Kuma. She is reported sunk, and would be my first enemy cruiser. Over the last two days, around Luzon, we traded four PT boats for a cruiser, a light cargo and a destroyer.

On the ground, reinforcements have arrived in San Fernando. Tomorrow, I will have two Philippine divisions, artillery and some armor there. If my opponent moves in with too little, he might get hurt. If he lands on Lingayen instead, well…

Mauban is being reinforced too. The enemy invasion is yet nowhere in sight, Houston and Boise are keeping watch a few hexes away, and a fairly strong welcome party will be waiting on the beach tomorrow. If the enemy lands south instead (say, in Atimonan), my troops will have enough time to regroup.

Empty battlefields

In Malaya, no invasion appeared off Mersing or Kuantan. I have an Australian division in Mersing, another one and an Indian Brigade in Kluong, and the two brigades in Alor Star are packed and ready to board the train to Singapore. I believe it is too late for Mersing now (and I never really understood the use of a landing in Kuantan. Various evacuations are proceeding nicely. Medan was reinforced by an Indian battalion and a couple of Dutch base forces, and the SSVF brigade is on its way to Port Blair.

In Burma, no enemy planes appeared over Moulmein or Rangoon. I evacuated the ships that begin the war there, a first supply convoy is on its way, together with the two brigades of the fast Sing’ reinf. With no Mersing invasion in sight and no air war over Rangoon, I am seriously considering defending Burma and eastern India.

The last enemy battlefield is New Guinea. I am trying to reinforce Port Moresby. The company that begins the game in Kavieng was air transported yesterday, I am now taking in some of the New Guinea troops, a transport task force is arriving in Rabaul, and reinforcements from Sydney are on their way. I have selected a handful of bases in this area (Port Moresby, Horn Island, Koepang and Ambon, namely) where I am trying to concentrate about 150 AV, with supplies, some forts, some support, to force my opponent to commit large units and if possible delay his advance.

Losses so far

These three days were very light on the Allies. Air losses are 53 Allied for 48 Japanese. At sea, I lost seventeen ships, including nine PT boats, two cargoes and three tankers. BB Arizona and SS Pickerel were the only warships lost so far. Ten enemy ships are reported sunk (most of them probably are for real, as I saw them go down during the naval battle in Kuching yesterday), including a light cruiser (Kuma), five DD types (one DD, two APD, two DMS), and a TB.

Ground losses are heavy. Two battles in China trashed two KMT corps, and the attacks on Manado, Kota and Kuching were unforgiving. LCU victory points stand at 93:0.

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 72

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/19/2015 9:53:12 PM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

And then, the barbarians came, just a few blocks away, and it was not a game, even though it all seemed so unreal, and all of a sudden, wargaming, and AAR writing just felt wrong. So this AAR fell back, even though we exchanged a few turns. Anyway, here is a brief catch-up post.

December 10th 1941

Hong Kong was bombarded today. This invasion force is relatively small, just one division, two engineer regiments and assorted artillery. I expect to hold for a couple of days. Wake, Ternate, and Nauru were invaded and captured.

On Luzon, my fighters had a bad day over Clark Field at the hand of an equal number of Zeroes. But we had some revenge for this over Alor Star, where the first AVG, in transit to Singapore, shot down a dozen Sallies.

In Malaya, the enemy landed in Kuantuan, with four infantry regiment, a recon regiment, an AF company, the 25th army HQ. Bombers sortied from Singapore, and even though no ship seems to have been sunk, several cargoes were bombed or torpedoes, and Japanese VP for ground units went up by 20 points. I will try again tomorrow, but it was a good day.

December 11th 1941

A fairly uneventful turn. Bombardments continue in Hong Kong, with little effect on the defenders. Ternate falls. In Kuantan a first deliberate attack reduces the fortifications. A second series of naval attacks against unloading ships damages a few more cargoes, even though none show up as sunk. A few cargoes fleeing Manila are sunk in the Philippines sea.

In China, my opponent has apparently evacuated Ichang. I am moving in. He is also using his battleships to bombard Wenchow, destroying the installations, but doing little damage to the troops there.

December 12th 1941

Since many enemy ships were damaged in Kuantan, and enemy bombers don’t seem very effective so far, I ordered Force Z to attack Kuantan today. My opponent had apparently anticipated the move, and sent a battleship force my way. A series of naval battles ensued…

During the first engagement, we lost a destroyer, but managed a few hits on Haruna.

Night Time Surface Combat, near Djemadja at 53,82, Range 9,000 Yards
Japanese Ships
BB Kongo
BB Haruna, Shell hits 4, on fire
CA Takao
CA Atago
DD Asashio, Shell hits 1
DD Oshio
DD Michishio, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Arashio
DD Akatsuki
DD Hibiki

Allied Ships
BB Prince of Wales, Shell hits 5
BC Repulse, Shell hits 6, on fire
DD Vampire, Shell hits 2, and is sunk
DD Tenedos
DD Electra, Shell hits 1
DD Express

Night Time Surface Combat, near Djemadja at 53,82, Range 9,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Kongo, Shell hits 1
BB Haruna, Shell hits 2, on fire
CA Takao
CA Atago, Shell hits 1
DD Asashio
DD Oshio
DD Michishio, on fire
DD Arashio
DD Akatsuki
DD Hibiki

Allied Ships
BB Prince of Wales, Shell hits 1, on fire
BC Repulse, Shell hits 5, on fire, heavy damage
DD Tenedos
DD Electra, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Express

At this point, Repulse broke off, but the engagement went on, and we got more hits on Haruna.

Night Time Surface Combat, near Djemadja at 53,83, Range 9,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
BB Kongo, Shell hits 1
BB Haruna, Shell hits 4, heavy fires
CA Takao
CA Atago
DD Asashio
DD Oshio
DD Michishio, on fire
DD Arashio
DD Akatsuki
DD Hibiki

Allied Ships
BB Prince of Wales, Shell hits 8, on fire
DD Tenedos, Shell hits 1
DD Electra, on fire

Repulse made it to Singapore, on fire, with 70 points of system damage. She will survive, if I can manage to evacuate her from Singapore before it falls. Prince of Wales ended up with 30 sys damage, and is back in Batavia. No Japanese ship shows up as sunk, but I have noticed a 180 VP increase today, which might actually be Haruna. If it were so, the raid on Kuantan would be a success.

My opponent is doing a good job at eliminating my fleeing merchantmen. He parked two task forces in the Celebes, one around Jolo, the other near Tarakan, which destroy a lot of shipping. Today, I lost a dozen ships to them, xAKL mostly, but a few tankers too.

In other news, Kuantan fell to a deliberate attack. In Hong Kong, the first deliberate attack ended on 1:2 odds,

Ground combat at Hong Kong (77,61)
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 16023 troops, 251 guns, 181 vehicles, Assault Value = 415
Defending force 7834 troops, 131 guns, 74 vehicles, Assault Value = 184
Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 2
Japanese adjusted assault: 308
Allied adjusted defense: 377
Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 2)

Japanese ground losses:
679 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 22 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 22 disabled
Engineers: 4 destroyed, 20 disabled

Allied ground losses:
155 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 21 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled

December 13th 1941

Another fairly uneventful day. A few more ships were sunk in the Celebes, and Japanese battleships bombarded Wenchow. Several ground battles took place in China. In every case, a Japanese division easily routed a Chinese corps. My opponent seems to be advancing on Changsha, and Nanyang.

So far, my Chinese have been retreating and repairing disablements. Morale is still very low, but a few defensive positions are getting set up, and so far, we have avoided most of the slaughter that usually happens in the central plains. I have a few surprises in store, so this theater should become interesting soon.

Elsewhere, Port Blair now has 85 AV, and should be safe against paradrop attempts. If Joseph wants it, he will have to fight on the beaches. I am planning to build another base in the area. Reinforcements should arrive in Rangoon and Calcutta in a few days, and Port Moresby, Ambon and Horn Island are beginning to look nice.

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 73

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/19/2015 10:20:03 PM

Rio Bravo

Posts: 1794
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From: Grass Valley, California
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It is beginning to appear to me that you plan an aggressive defense.

I enjoy your writing style.

Thank you for the fun reading.

-Best Regards,

-Terry

_____________________________

"No one throws me my own guns and tells me to run. No one."

-Bret (James Coburn); The Magnificent Seven

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 74

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/19/2015 11:50:23 PM

FeurerKrieg

Posts: 3397
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Denver, CO
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quote:

And then, the barbarians came, just a few blocks away, and it was not a game, even though it all seemed so unreal, and all of a sudden, wargaming, and AAR writing just felt wrong. So this AAR fell back, even though we exchanged a few turns. Anyway, here is a brief catch-up post.

Glad to hear you are okay!

_____________________________

Upper portion used with permission of www.subart.net, copyright John Meeks

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 75

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/20/2015 12:33:07 AM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Feurer Krieg

quote:

And then, the barbarians came, just a few blocks away, and it was not a game, even though it all seemed so unreal, and all of a sudden, wargaming, and AAR writing just felt wrong. So this AAR fell back, even though we exchanged a few turns. Anyway, here is a brief catch-up post.

Glad to hear you are okay!

Ditto!

I had no idea Nemours was close to that horrible madness ...

< Message edited by BBfanboy -- 11/20/2015 1:33:10 AM >

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to FeurerKrieg)

Post #: 76

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/20/2015 12:45:37 AM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

I have connections to several French citizens that belong to the Sons of the American Revolution and sadly one young member lost his life.

They are French and can trace their ancestry back to a relation that fought for the French in the War of Independence in America. In fact, most French (that I know) know more American history than Americans in my experience.

(in reply to BBfanboy)

Post #: 77

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/20/2015 12:49:38 AM

FeurerKrieg

Posts: 3397
Joined: 6/15/2005
From: Denver, CO
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

I have connections to several French citizens that belong to the Sons of the American Revolution and sadly one young member lost his life.

They are French and can trace their ancestry back to a relation that fought for the French in the War of Independence in America. In fact, most French (that I know) know more American history than Americans in my experience.

I can believe it, although I suspect that wouldn't be the case for this forum's membership.

_____________________________

Upper portion used with permission of www.subart.net, copyright John Meeks

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 78

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/20/2015 6:07:17 AM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy
I had no idea Nemours was close to that horrible madness ...

Nemours is 75 km away, but I work in Paris, and live there five days a week to avoid commuting. It is my place in Paris that is close to the sites. Sorry for not being clearer, I'm not thinking very straight, these days.

Francois

< Message edited by fcharton -- 11/20/2015 7:16:53 AM >

(in reply to BBfanboy)

Post #: 79

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/20/2015 7:27:24 PM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

December 14th 1941

Gallant Boise

Since the beginning of the war, after signal intelligence have been announcing landings in Mauban (which have yet to materialize), Boise and Houston have been stalking around Naga, in the hope of catching a landing force in the South Philippines. They found, or were found (this is not clear) today by an enemy cruiser squadron.

Four Japanese CA, and four destroyers, against Boise and Houston, the prospects were not good… A first night engagement was inconclusive

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba
CA Kinugasa
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Oboro
DD Uzuki
DD Kikuzuki
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston
CL Boise, Shell hits 1

With CA Kako on fire, the next night engagement favored the US cruisers.

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba
CA Kinugasa, Shell hits 3, on fire
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, on fire
DD Oboro, Shell hits 1
DD Uzuki
DD Kikuzuki
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston, Shell hits 1
CL Boise, Shell hits 2

Night Time Surface Combat, near Legaspi at 83,83, Range 10,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba
CA Kinugasa, Shell hits 1, on fire
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, on fire
DD Oboro
DD Uzuki
DD Kikuzuki, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston
CL Boise, Shell hits 2

But at sunrise, my cruisers could not compensate their numerical inferiority.

Day Time Surface Combat, near Catbalogan at 84,84, Range 20,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba, Shell hits 1
CA Kinugasa, Shell hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, Shell hits 5, heavy fires
DD Oboro
DD Uzuki, Shell hits 1
DD Kikuzuki, Shell hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston, Shell hits 1
CL Boise, Shell hits 13, heavy fires, heavy damage

Boise sank on the way home. Houston is only lightly hit. Kinugasa shows up as sunk, and I suspect Kako is not in a good shape, and not very close to base. Losing Boise is sad, but if we really traded her for two Japanese cruisers, it was worth the loss.

Meanwhile in Burma

Port Blair now sports over 100 AV. Most of the small units that begin the war on the coast of Burma, near Thailand, have been evacuated. I now need engineers to build the airfield and forts. I am also considering reinforcing another base in the Andamans.

In Burma, two Indian brigades are unloading in Rangoon, and two more will arrive in a few days. Calcutta is getting the rest of the early commonwealth reinforcements. There is still no sign of an advance on Burma, and no attempt to dispute air superiority over Rangoon. Moulmein is being garrisoned and fortified, so that if the Japanese advance with too little (one reinforced division, which is what I usually divert for Burma), their first attempt will fail, and the more troops Japan nees in Burma, the less there is for the Indies and South Pacific. I do not hope to defend Burma, but I believe keeping it Allied for a while can only help China.

Chinese roadblocks

In northern China, the area between Tsiaotso and Yenan is being garrisoned. 500 AV are in the mountain hex on the road to Sian, and the Japanese column advancing towards them apparently decided to double back. Tsiaotso has 1100 AV, forts going up. In Yenan, the 8th route army is recovering nicely, with morale in the 80s, and will make for a decent reserve.

Two Japanese columns are marching on Changsha. I have my doubts about the feasibility of such an early offensive. Changsha has good terrain, large stacking limits, some supply producing industry, and level four forts. I have good units in the area, and a lot of headquarters to provide support.

Ichang was abandoned and recaptured, its level three forts intact.

In Central China, most enemy efforts concentrate on Wenchow. I have good units there, but I am seriously contemplating evacuating, and marching my troops south, towards Kukong and Kweilin.

In the south, nothing happens except a few bombardments by planes based in Canton. I sent a few Chinese bombers attack the port Haiphong today, and a Japanese unit that had advanced in the plains, just to try to keep my opponent honest.

Slow steamrolling

So far, the Japanese advance has been rather slow. Wake was captured but not Guam or Tarawa. Yesterday, Vanimo was the first New Guinean base invaded. There were no moves, yet, against Rabaul, Kavieng or the Solomons, and no invasion of Singkawang or Miri, followed those of Kuching and Brunei.

This allows me to reinforce a few areas. I have evacuated most of the troops that begin the war in New Guinea to Port Moresby. Ambon and Horn Island were reinforced as well.

Malaysia is the only theater where Japan seems to move fast. Since there were no landings on Mersing, most of my troops will make it to Singapore, and I will try to evacuate some of them to reinforce Ceylon and India. I probably can hope Singapore to hold until January (late January would be ideal). In the Philippines, enemy intentions are unclear. Neither Mindanao nor any of the Philippine islands have been invaded, and Luzon seems to be progressing relatively slowly.

KB is nowhere in sight, but I suppose I will know soon enough where the next enemy push is meant to happen.

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 80

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/21/2015 7:13:53 PM

Rio Bravo

Posts: 1794
Joined: 7/13/2013
From: Grass Valley, California
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: fcharton

December 14th 1941

Gallant Boise

Since the beginning of the war, after signal intelligence have been announcing landings in Mauban (which have yet to materialize), Boise and Houston have been stalking around Naga, in the hope of catching a landing force in the South Philippines. They found, or were found (this is not clear) today by an enemy cruiser squadron.

Four Japanese CA, and four destroyers, against Boise and Houston, the prospects were not good… A first night engagement was inconclusive

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba
CA Kinugasa
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Oboro
DD Uzuki
DD Kikuzuki
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston
CL Boise, Shell hits 1

With CA Kako on fire, the next night engagement favored the US cruisers.

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba
CA Kinugasa, Shell hits 3, on fire
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, on fire
DD Oboro, Shell hits 1
DD Uzuki
DD Kikuzuki
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston, Shell hits 1
CL Boise, Shell hits 2

Night Time Surface Combat, near Legaspi at 83,83, Range 10,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba
CA Kinugasa, Shell hits 1, on fire
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, on fire
DD Oboro
DD Uzuki
DD Kikuzuki, Shell hits 1, on fire
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston
CL Boise, Shell hits 2

But at sunrise, my cruisers could not compensate their numerical inferiority.

Day Time Surface Combat, near Catbalogan at 84,84, Range 20,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Aoba, Shell hits 1
CA Kinugasa, Shell hits 8, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Furutaka
CA Kako, Shell hits 5, heavy fires
DD Oboro
DD Uzuki, Shell hits 1
DD Kikuzuki, Shell hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Yuzuki

Allied Ships
CA Houston, Shell hits 1
CL Boise, Shell hits 13, heavy fires, heavy damage

Boise sank on the way home. Houston is only lightly hit. Kinugasa shows up as sunk, and I suspect Kako is not in a good shape, and not very close to base. Losing Boise is sad, but if we really traded her for two Japanese cruisers, it was worth the loss.

Meanwhile in Burma

Port Blair now sports over 100 AV. Most of the small units that begin the war on the coast of Burma, near Thailand, have been evacuated. I now need engineers to build the airfield and forts. I am also considering reinforcing another base in the Andamans.

In Burma, two Indian brigades are unloading in Rangoon, and two more will arrive in a few days. Calcutta is getting the rest of the early commonwealth reinforcements. There is still no sign of an advance on Burma, and no attempt to dispute air superiority over Rangoon. Moulmein is being garrisoned and fortified, so that if the Japanese advance with too little (one reinforced division, which is what I usually divert for Burma), their first attempt will fail, and the more troops Japan nees in Burma, the less there is for the Indies and South Pacific. I do not hope to defend Burma, but I believe keeping it Allied for a while can only help China.

Chinese roadblocks

In northern China, the area between Tsiaotso and Yenan is being garrisoned. 500 AV are in the mountain hex on the road to Sian, and the Japanese column advancing towards them apparently decided to double back. Tsiaotso has 1100 AV, forts going up. In Yenan, the 8th route army is recovering nicely, with morale in the 80s, and will make for a decent reserve.

Two Japanese columns are marching on Changsha. I have my doubts about the feasibility of such an early offensive. Changsha has good terrain, large stacking limits, some supply producing industry, and level four forts. I have good units in the area, and a lot of headquarters to provide support.

Ichang was abandoned and recaptured, its level three forts intact.

In Central China, most enemy efforts concentrate on Wenchow. I have good units there, but I am seriously contemplating evacuating, and marching my troops south, towards Kukong and Kweilin.

In the south, nothing happens except a few bombardments by planes based in Canton. I sent a few Chinese bombers attack the port Haiphong today, and a Japanese unit that had advanced in the plains, just to try to keep my opponent honest.

Slow steamrolling

So far, the Japanese advance has been rather slow. Wake was captured but not Guam or Tarawa. Yesterday, Vanimo was the first New Guinean base invaded. There were no moves, yet, against Rabaul, Kavieng or the Solomons, and no invasion of Singkawang or Miri, followed those of Kuching and Brunei.

This allows me to reinforce a few areas. I have evacuated most of the troops that begin the war in New Guinea to Port Moresby. Ambon and Horn Island were reinforced as well.

Malaysia is the only theater where Japan seems to move fast. Since there were no landings on Mersing, most of my troops will make it to Singapore, and I will try to evacuate some of them to reinforce Ceylon and India. I probably can hope Singapore to hold until January (late January would be ideal). In the Philippines, enemy intentions are unclear. Neither Mindanao nor any of the Philippine islands have been invaded, and Luzon seems to be progressing relatively slowly.

KB is nowhere in sight, but I suppose I will know soon enough where the next enemy push is meant to happen.

fcharton-

Ah, the Boisie!

I too lost the Boisie early on after she alone engaged a Japanese Combat surface fleet. She was heavily outnumbered but managed to inflict some serious hits before she slipped under the waves.

I am liking your aggressive defense more and more.

Good luck!

-Best Regards,

-Terry

_____________________________

"No one throws me my own guns and tells me to run. No one."

-Bret (James Coburn); The Magnificent Seven

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 81

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/21/2015 10:08:19 PM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

December 15th 1941

Q-ships

At the very bottom of the map, west of the Gambiers, a fleet of cargoes on their way to Panama were attacked today by Japanese merchant cruisers.

Japanese Ships
AMC Aikoku Maru
AMC Hokoku Maru, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
TK Fosna, Shell hits 3, on fire
xAK Peshawur, Shell hits 8, on fire
xAK Arizonan
xAK Dakotan, Shell hits 3, heavy fires
xAK Puerto Rican
xAK Santa Rita, Shell hits 1
xAK Atlanta City
xAK Andrea Luckenbach, Shell hits 3, on fire

Peshawur and Dakotan are on fire, and will probably sink. The rest will make it to the Gambiers provided enemy cruiser do not chase them. Incidentally, two US carriers are in this area. With a little luck, I might catch the Q-ships.

The siege of Taiping

Having bypassed Alor Star and captured Georgetown, the IJA reached Taiping. The token force I left there managed to hold for a day. The base will fall tomorrow. Most of my troops in Malaya are now south of a line that goes from Mersing to Kluong. I have evacuated the third Indian corps artillery, and one of the two air HQ that begin the game in Singapore (air HQ, and commonwealth heavy weapons, are rare enough to be worth saving). A number of transports are now arriving in Singapore. I want to try and evacuate the third corps, first to Palembang, and then maybe to Oosthaven and India.

Building Burma

Three Indian brigades are now unloading in Rangoon. One more is on the way. I have reconned Rahaeng since the beginning of the war, but the invasion column is nowhere to be seen. Moulmein and Rangoon are both building nicely. I have good hopes of derailing a first attempt at capturing southern Burma.

That is pretty much all there was to this turn. In other news, a handful of light cargoes were sunk around the Philippines, we lost four planes each in inconclusive engagement, a depleted Chinese division was defeated. December routine…

(in reply to Rio Bravo)

Post #: 82

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 1:09:20 PM

fcharton

Posts: 1112
Joined: 10/4/2010
From: France
Status: offline

December 16th 1941

Souffre-douleur

That is the French for whipping boy, and in AE parlance, you’d say “AM Penguin”. In every game I have seen, this poor ship which begins the war in Guam either stumbles on KB on its way back from Hawaii, or is found by Nells out of Guam, or just gets forgotten, and is sunk once Guam is captured. In this game, with the invasion of Guam postponed for a while, and no bombardment happening, I did try to evacuate the little ship... and send it to Midway.

But a curse lies of the poor penguin

Japanese Ships
CL Kiso
DD Minekaze
DD Sawakaze
DD Okikaze
DD Yakaze

Allied Ships
AM Penguin, Shell hits 15, and is sunk

New Guinea rising

So far, precious nothing happened in this theater, which gave me a lot of time to evacuate everything to Port Moresby. Vanimo was invaded a few days ago, and today, there were landings in Kavieng. My last transport convoy to Port Moresby, one AP ordered to repatriate Lark Battalion is a day off Rabaul, and had three cruisers in her escort. I might as well detach them and see if I can sink some unloading ships.

KB is still nowhere in sight. As its last documented position was not west of Hawaii, I suspected it might appear in the South Pacific, but with most of the action in the South China Sea…

The slow buildup in New Guinea is a good thing for me. Port Moresby is now 160 AV strong, it will end up over 200 once Rabaul is evacuated, and forts are building nicely (slowly though, but in DaBabes everything is slow).

Out of mines

Most of the minelayers I am issues at game start use the same model of mines: VH MkII. All the Dutch and Australian boats use them, and after mining Merak, Palembang, Balikpapan and a few other bases, I am out of those, and production is at a lofty 30/month… I have one usable ship left: CM Oglala, now in Pearl Harbor, the rest will retire, and become patrol boats for convoys.

I have almost a thousand mines of other models in the pool, does anyone know how one can trace the ships that might use them?

Two to tango

In China, having noticed how deadly Idas and Anns can be over clear terrain, I thought it was worth a try. The B17 from the Philippines, which are useless now that my opponent has good fighters all around, have been relocated to Chungking (the only base that would accommodate them), and began bombing Japanese unit crossing the central plains (and therefore difficult to CAP). A few Chinese bomber squadrons joined the fray.

The first results were underwhelming, but I am transferring more bombers to China. This is probably the best use for my heavy bombers right now (and an almost ideal training ground).

Morning Air attack on 35th/B Division, at 87,45 , near Chengchow

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid spotted at 32 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Allied aircraft
B-17D Fortress x 6

No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
18 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Elsewhere in China, we are about to see if my early attempt at troop concentration work. A very large column is marching on Changsha. I have 500 AV in the woods (three Chinese corps), one hex away (and a lot more behind forts in Changsha). We had a first bombardment probe today, which did not do any damage, and revealed over 700 AV of Japanese units, who must be close to the stacking limit. I am pretty certain that this forward outpost is doomed, as more troops are apparently on their way, but it is too late to retreat.

In Shanxi, in the mountain hex, near Tsiaotso, on the northern road to Sian, the Japanese tried a deliberate attack which didn’t work as advertised.

Ground combat at 88,41 (near Kaoping)
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 22457 troops, 196 guns, 40 vehicles, Assault Value = 657
Defending force 18915 troops, 147 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 449
Japanese adjusted assault: 236
Allied adjusted defense: 334
Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2
Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), morale(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
682 casualties reported
Squads: 3 destroyed, 66 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 13 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 13 disabled

Allied ground losses:
418 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 54 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 14 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Enemy troops have been seen retreating. Reinforcements are on their way from Sian, and more are available in Tsiaotso. I am under the impression that my opponent is not focused on northern China. Kaoping, next to Tsiaotso, has been abandoned, nothing seems to be moving towards Yenan or west of Paotow (Paotow might actually be abandoned), and this northern column to Sian seems to be retreating.

Hong Kong holds

Much to my surprise, a deliberate attack on Hong Kong failed today. Losses were low, but odds were bad, which means disablement, rest, and more time before the city falls.

Ground combat at Hong Kong (77,61)
Japanese Deliberate attack
Attacking force 14349 troops, 251 guns, 169 vehicles, Assault Value = 403
Defending force 7890 troops, 133 guns, 79 vehicles, Assault Value = 168
Japanese assault odds: 1 to 4 (fort level 2)

Japanese ground losses:
282 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 27 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Allied ground losses:
110 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 36 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 83

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 1:35:59 PM

Yaab

Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline

I always use the Dutch CMc and minelaying subs who carry 12-30 mines for minelaying. All CMc loading 50-75 mines are collected at start and moved somewhere safe i.e Christmas Island 10, so they do not drain the Dutch mine pool.

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 84

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 2:00:43 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

I saw poor Penguin live once in an Obvert game.

I am not sure that basing 4E in Chungking is a good idea....we will see what happens.

(in reply to Yaab)

Post #: 85

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 2:38:28 PM

Yaab

Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline

It is a great idea. You can maximise eng squad numbers in the Chungking's units at start plus move some nearby corps into the city to help with airfield construction, and you should have level 5 airfield in Chungking in 10-14 days. Thus, B-17 will fly with the full set of bombs.

B-17s in Chungking are the best help Allies can provide to China in the early war.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 86

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 2:39:52 PM

BBfanboy

Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

Unless Tracker can help you with it, the only way I know of to trace Mine types to ships/subs that can use them is to use the All Ships display button at the top of the screen, deselect everything, then click on mine vessels, DDs and Subs. You only need to look at one example of each class of these to see what mine type, if any, they can carry.

IIRC most or all of the US DDs cannot lay mines, but Dutch and British/Australian/NZ ones can. Not sure about the Indian DEs.

Look for CM Abdiel - carries a lot of mines and is very fast - capable of 40 kts in RL. Has decent AA armament for a minelayer so getting caught on the return trip isn't always a death sentence! The down side is it takes a lot of ops points to lay that many mines.

Most US subs can lay a few mines but only a few can lay quite a few. Argonaut take 40 IIRC, and Dolphin or Drum (whichever one has the 6000 nm range) can carry about 20. Can't remember what Narwhal and Nautilus take, but they are probably more valuable as SSTs and mine pools/production are so poor that you do not really need to risk them mining enemy ports (which may already have Japanese mines in them).

When looking at your mine pools and production numbers, also note that a lot of mines on the list cease production in 12/41 or in 1942. Then to complicate things the Upgrades must convert some mine ships to carry different types, or even remove the mine rails completely in favour of AA guns!

Lets call the whole mine game "Minecraft

" ...

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to Yaab)

Post #: 87

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 2:41:36 PM

Lowpe

Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

It is a great idea. You can maximise eng squad numbers in the Chungking's units at start plus move some nearby corps into the city to help with airfield construction, and you should have level 5 airfield in Chungking in 10-14 days. Thus, B-17 will fly with the full set of bombs.

B-17s in Chungking are the best help Allies can provide to China in the early war.

I beg to differ, but we shall see what happens.

(in reply to Yaab)

Post #: 88

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 2:59:33 PM

Yaab

Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline

There is only a handful of B-17Ds at start. Some of the units do not upgrade to B-17E and get withdrawn after some time. If Japs start a fast offensive in China from the get-go aimed at i.e Changsha, the B-17Ds represent the most powerful Allied aid to China available at start. I cannot think of any other offensive asset (arty, tanks, LCU etc) that can be relocated to China as fast as the B-17Ds. Actually, their mere presence in Chungking should boost the Chinese morale by 10 points or so across the whole Chinese army.

(in reply to Lowpe)

Post #: 89

RE: Being good, for a change – SqzMyLemon (J) vs fchart... - 11/22/2015 3:00:35 PM

spence

Posts: 5400
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline

Once you've got the base built up and a bit of training perhaps you can find some industry within range of Chungking for your B-17s. You can try a bit of recon with those longer ranged x-Russian bomber types to find something juicy for the bigger bombload that the B-17s can carry.

I'd watch carefully to make sure you don't burn up too much supply getting ready though. You can always pull the bombers back to India though for their training.

(in reply to fcharton)

Post #: 90

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