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Doolittle Raid - 11/14/2015 4:05:31 AM   
Texican

 

Posts: 248
Joined: 10/30/2006
Status: offline 		Carriers can load land-based planes and "transfer" them or unload them. Not sure which. Can they fly land-based planes off their deck in a transfer mission?

Doolittle Raid

Now ... if a carrier were not above 115% capacity, could it not launch land-based planes in an attack provided they landed somewhere else?

Is there any allowance for a Doolittle type of raid in the game?

< Message edited by Texican -- 11/14/2015 5:06:10 AM >
Post #: 1
RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/14/2015 4:50:50 AM   
Puhis


Posts: 1737
Joined: 11/30/2008
From: Finland
Status: offline 		No.

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/14/2015 6:54:06 AM   
Barb


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From: Bratislava, Slovakia
Status: offline 		No, but one can fiddle a little with the editor to make things work:
- create a B-25 carrier capable version with appropriate range (to fly from Hornet, strike Tokyo and return to carrier)
- create a squadron arriving with 16 planes arriving few days before Hornet at San Diego
- you can also hand-create/assign pilots there
- make the squadron disband/withdraw at a certain date
- Fly one mission from Hornet against Tokyo and next day transfer them to China (whatever plane is left on Hornet, dump it)
- never again use the B-25 carrier capable version in any other squadron

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/15/2015 1:45:47 PM   
Texican

 

Posts: 248
Joined: 10/30/2006
Status: offline 		Better yet, they could just introduce the one-use unit into the game and say if it attacks Tokyo, it earns the Allied player 300 victory points or something. Just make it a B25 unit that can be added to a carrier in Pearl, fly one time off a carrier deck to make a max range attack, then it disappears after attack.

Shouldn't have to be a player-made editor fix. The Doolittle Raid is intrinsic to any Pacific War type of game.

< Message edited by Texican -- 11/15/2015 2:46:41 PM >

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/15/2015 3:27:18 PM   
Numdydar

 

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Status: offline 		The raid was so meaningless from a military standpoint, I am happy it is not in the game But that is what the editor is for so anyone can 'fix' the game the way they want

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 2:24:49 AM   
rustysi


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quote:

The raid was so meaningless from a military standpoint,


Oh, I beg to differ with that view. The military damage may have been insignificant, but the U.S. did gain some meaningful benefit from the raid. If nothing else it was a morale boost at a time when news from all fronts was nothing but bad. Of course that can't be replicated within the game engine, can it?

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 3:12:59 PM   
Numdydar

 

Posts: 3211
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Status: offline 		It was a PysOps event for sure. Which the game does not model at all. Other than psyching out your PBEM partner

So there is absolutely no reason for it to be in the game.

Also if you did use the editor to change things around, I can see a bunch of CVs running around with 4Es

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 4:24:05 PM   
Zorch

 

Posts: 7087
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Status: offline 		It was a tremendous loss of face for the Japanese government. They kept more planes at home as a result of the Doolitle raid.
I have also heard that the Midway operation was prioritized because of it.

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 5:58:32 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zorch

It was a tremendous loss of face for the Japanese government. They kept more planes at home as a result of the Doolitle raid.
I have also heard that the Midway operation was prioritized because of it.
warspite1

+1


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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 6:46:22 PM   
Jorge_Stanbury


Posts: 4320
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From: Toronto and Lima
Status: offline 		As already mentioned, in real life it had a significant moral boost/ loss of face, but in game terms it will be irrelevant as these factors are not modeled

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 6:48:18 PM   
crsutton


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quote:

ORIGINAL: rustysi

quote:

The raid was so meaningless from a military standpoint,


Oh, I beg to differ with that view. The military damage may have been insignificant, but the U.S. did gain some meaningful benefit from the raid. If nothing else it was a morale boost at a time when news from all fronts was nothing but bad. Of course that can't be replicated within the game engine, can it?


It is in the eye of the beholder. Our Chinese Allies very much did not want the raid and it is estimated that half a million Chinese died from various forms of retaliation as a result. But, the Allies were going to bomb Japan sooner or later so maybe that did not matter. Hard for me to say.

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 8:12:48 PM   
AW1Steve


Posts: 14507
Joined: 3/10/2007
From: Mordor Illlinois
Status: offline 		Lets not forget....1) a CV in dry dock caught a bomb, delaying her completion for several months. 2) the raid so upset the Japanese people that the Army (and the rest of the Navy) withdrew any objection to "the Midway operation". 3) more combat planes were held back for Japanese home island defense and most of all , more long range patrol aircraft were kept home. That were badly needed at the front.

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 9:27:34 PM   
spence

 

Posts: 5400
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From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline 		Loss of face to the Japanese mind of 1942 was no more militarily insignificant than the real life naval search ability of the Glen. Given its "lightning speed and incredible range" a search of a single 10 degree sector to a range of 4 hexes is only just barely physically possible in a half a 12 hour daylight period yet it seems capable of 2 decent 360 degree searches to a range of 4 hexes according to the program .

(in reply to Texican)
Post #: 13
RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 10:08:18 PM   
LargeSlowTarget


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From: Hessen, Germany - now living in France
Status: offline 		So does Walrus and Seagull.Grind your axe on something else

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Post #: 14
RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 10:29:13 PM   
spence

 

Posts: 5400
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From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline 		I guess you're right. I have an axe to grind against surrealistic capabilities granted to only the Japanese side. Would it be too much to mention that the platform from which a Walrus and Seagull conducts its searches is a surface platform that gets killed instantaneously when it sails into the enemy's rear base areas while Glens are essentially immune to counterattack in corresponding locations.

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Post #: 15
RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/17/2015 11:21:37 PM   
LargeSlowTarget


Posts: 4443
Joined: 9/23/2000
From: Hessen, Germany - now living in France
Status: offline 		Yes, it is well-known that the Japanese side is way too overpowered. That's the reason why most games reaching 1944 see Japan being victorious.
Allies having 1945 level supply production from Day 1 does not seem count, the typical early Burma offensive by the British is not surealistic etc. But well, everyone has his own bias.
Btw, a spotted Japanese sub is a dead sub from 1943 on, so Glen subs are not Supermen.

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/18/2015 12:22:01 AM   
wdolson

 

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The Doolittle Raid had impact by keeping the Japanese off balance. They didn't really figure out what happened until after the war. The impact was Japan didn't know what was going to happen next. With player 20/20 hindsight a Japanese player in game can shake off the raid as the stunt it was and continue like nothing happened.

The Ryuho hit by the Doolittle Raid was delayed, but it didn't make much difference. She was classed as a CVL, but mostly used as an aircraft ferry. I think she was a marginal design.

Bill

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RE: Doolittle Raid - 11/18/2015 1:44:12 PM   
HansBolter


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From: United States
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Numdydar

It was a PysOps event for sure. Which the game does not model at all. Other than psyching out your PBEM partner

So there is absolutely no reason for it to be in the game.

Also if you did use the editor to change things around, I can see a bunch of CVs running around with 4Es


Aren't B25s 2Es.....just sayin

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