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RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/24/2016 9:04:13 AM

morvael

Posts: 11762
Joined: 9/8/2006
From: Poland
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This is working as designed. You are supposed to see logistics phase losses the first time you see losses screen, and then it is zeroed for the rest of turn. The problem is it doesn't come up automatically like in local games, so you can delay the moment of resetting. But the TOTAL values are always correct.

(in reply to malyhin1517)

Post #: 121

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/24/2016 9:23:06 AM

malyhin1517

Posts: 1426
Joined: 9/20/2015
From: Ukraine Dnepropetrovsk
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Yes, but it must occur before the start of the move! But if at the beginning of turn loss look, then this reset happens during the turn! Maybe this screen should display all the losses since the beginning of the turn Germany!

< Message edited by malyhin1517 -- 2/24/2016 9:25:04 AM >

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(in reply to morvael)

Post #: 122

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/24/2016 10:13:34 AM

Icier

Posts: 564
Joined: 7/15/2014
From: a sunny beach nsw
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You may still have the copies in your send email file.

(in reply to loki100)

Post #: 123

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/26/2016 5:58:30 PM

Pilsator

Posts: 77
Joined: 11/24/2014
From: Berlin
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playing against the "AI" as the Soviets, no tactic or strategy is needed with this patch on normal settings. It is like having a great wall with the morale boost. Cant give the germans that much help.

When patching pls dont forget the majority that are Solo players. I guess the majority is, else it would have sold under 1000 copies looking at the "Opponent wanted section".

(in reply to Icier)

Post #: 124

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/26/2016 6:23:48 PM

No idea

Posts: 495
Joined: 6/24/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pilsator

playing against the "AI" as the Soviets, no tactic or strategy is needed with this patch on normal settings. It is like having a great wall with the morale boost. Cant give the germans that much help.

When patching pls dont forget the majority that are Solo players. I guess the majority is, else it would have sold under 1000 copies looking at the "Opponent wanted section".

Patch or no patch, the AI (especially the german AI) is very lame

(in reply to Pilsator)

Post #: 125

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/26/2016 7:09:22 PM

Wuffer

Posts: 402
Joined: 6/16/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pilsator

playing against the "AI" as the Soviets, no tactic or strategy is needed with this patch on normal settings. It is like having a great wall with the morale boost. Cant give the germans that much help.

When patching pls dont forget the majority that are Solo players. I guess the majority is, else it would have sold under 1000 copies looking at the "Opponent wanted section".

yes, but what to exspect?
chess is really simple in comparision, because every chess programm simply calculates by brute force, basically looking at each possible move.
For once piece at a time, on a map with 64 'hexes'....

I could only strongly encourage you to try a human opponent if you were searching for an challenge.

(in reply to Pilsator)

Post #: 126

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 2/26/2016 8:34:31 PM

uw06670

Posts: 221
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This might be something for the WitE 2.0 thread but, thinking about AI strategy. I'm not sure what the current system does (perhaps it already does this). But thinking about chess, what if the AI had a list of "openings" that it could pick from on Turn 1, especially as Germans. They could be human configured/inspired (or perhaps even copied from real player games) and would add some variety to the challenge. It could even be a setting such as "Historic opening" vs. Random Opening.

(in reply to Wuffer)

Post #: 127

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/7/2016 11:24:08 PM

malyhin1517

Posts: 1426
Joined: 9/20/2015
From: Ukraine Dnepropetrovsk
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Found this information about the number of Soviet aircraft on 22 June 1941 in the Internet in Russian:
http://www.airpages.ru/dc/ww2.shtml
For example, in the memoirs G. K. Zhukov, and then in other sources, it is stated that on 22.06.41 01.01.39 G. G. the red army received from industry of 17,745 combat AIRCRAFT, of them 3719 new types of aircraft: Yak-1, MiG-3, LAST-3, Il-2, PE-2, etc. In fact it was much worse:
The Il-2 was approved for mass production by the decision of the defence Committee under the USSR, the UK in early January 1941, the First production Il-2 at plant No. 18 (Voronezh) was adopted by the military representative only 21 March 1941 when the war started the state tests of the aircraft at NII VVS were not completed (V. I. Alekseenko. The Soviet air force before and during the great Patriotic war). On June 22 in line units of this aircraft was not: 2 was tests and 8 at the transition training of flight crews)!
The first production LAGG-3 was adopted by the military representative at factory # 21 (Gorky) 24 February 1941 State tests of LAGG-3 of the first series was completed a few days before the war, but has revealed a large number of defects. In the ranks were 29 units.
Only combat units of the Soviet air force by the beginning of the war there were 706 new aircraft type, which was retrained 1354 pilot. Of them of the MiG-3 - 407 (686 retrained pilots), Yak-1 - 142 (156 retrained pilots), LAGG-3 - 29 (90 retrained pilots), PE-2 - 128 (retrained 362 pilot), Il-2 - 0 (retrained 60 pilots). Including in the Western border districts were 304 73 fighter and PE-2, i.e. a total of 377 aircraft of a new type. It was less than 6% of the total fleet of these five districts (V. I. Alekseenko. The Soviet air force before and during the great Patriotic war).

These data differ significantly from the games, while on German aircraft data matches almost perfectly! If you remove from the game overestimated the number of new types of aircraft, in the beginning of the war almost never will, and old types of aircraft are much more serious losses. The losses of Russian aviation in 1941, almost 2 times higher than the production of new aircraft, but the Germans also losses exceeded their production, but only slightly. Until 1942 the Germans had a strong advantage in the air! They lost it completely in 1944 with the launch of the YAK-7.

< Message edited by malyhin1517 -- 3/7/2016 11:25:17 PM >

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Post #: 128

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 5:35:07 PM

HardLuckYetAgain

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Is this correct? I have seen 3 consecutive blizzard turns for December in the Eurupean zone with a forcast of a 4th in a random weather game. Is this chart correct? Or am I just having a lot of "Hard Luck" on the dice rolls?

Weather Zone
Europe 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20

DEC M S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S B

< Message edited by HardLuckYetAgain -- 3/14/2016 5:36:58 PM >

(in reply to Andrew Loveridge)

Post #: 129

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 7:36:28 PM

Hermann

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain

Is this correct? I have seen 3 consecutive blizzard turns for December in the Eurupean zone with a forcast of a 4th in a random weather game. Is this chart correct? Or am I just having a lot of "Hard Luck" on the dice rolls?

Weather Zone
Europe 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20

DEC M S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S B

Ive got a book somewhere that's the official Russian version of the air war it has every phase of the Russian air war broken down into campaigns with engagements, losses, pilots, aircraft losses and types etc.. problem being its a propaganda book and the numbers are insane.
http://www.amazon.com/The-Soviet-Air-Force-World/dp/0385047681

its available in Russian - its a good base to start from if youre researching units and locations aircraft types etc...

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)

Post #: 130

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 8:39:00 PM

DesertedFox

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain

Is this correct? I have seen 3 consecutive blizzard turns for December in the Eurupean zone with a forcast of a 4th in a random weather game. Is this chart correct? Or am I just having a lot of "Hard Luck" on the dice rolls?

Weather Zone
Europe 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20

DEC M S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S B

I believe this is the overriding rule for that occurance.

v1.03 Beta 2 - January 21, 2011
There will be no snow or mud during December 1941 and January 1942 (only Blizzard).

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)

Post #: 131

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 9:31:49 PM

morvael

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But that 1.08.08 change about no blizzard in Europe was newer.

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Post #: 132

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 9:38:43 PM

morvael

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quote:

Updated weather tables, see Appendix A. The rule preventing more than one Snow in December will not apply to Europe weather zone. There will be no mud in July 1941.

Fixing it for 1.08.09. That part about one snow was working... except the game never got there, because for all zones in 12/41 and 1/42 it choose blizzard.
edit: technically it was correct, because that change from 1.08.08 never promised to lift forced blizzard. The table would be used except first winter.

< Message edited by morvael -- 3/14/2016 9:40:48 PM >

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Post #: 133

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 10:43:14 PM

HardLuckYetAgain

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Thank you for the answer. So reading into this Feb 42 would still be considered the 1st "forced" blizzard by the game which would result in the die roll = to blizzard as the random roll for the Month of Feb in Europe zone too, correct? Or does it end at the end Jan 42 per Deserted Fox's post?

Europe 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20

FEB B S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S S M

quote:

ORIGINAL: morvael

quote:

Updated weather tables, see Appendix A. The rule preventing more than one Snow in December will not apply to Europe weather zone. There will be no mud in July 1941.

Fixing it for 1.08.09. That part about one snow was working... except the game never got there, because for all zones in 12/41 and 1/42 it choose blizzard.
edit: technically it was correct, because that change from 1.08.08 never promised to lift forced blizzard. The table would be used except first winter.

< Message edited by HardLuckYetAgain -- 3/14/2016 10:48:50 PM >

(in reply to morvael)

Post #: 134

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 11:09:18 PM

morvael

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Weather tables work as normal in February 1942, other rules apply (so only one mud allowed).

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)

Post #: 135

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/14/2016 11:12:30 PM

HardLuckYetAgain

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Thank you again.

quote:

ORIGINAL: morvael

Weather tables work as normal in February 1942, other rules apply (so only one mud allowed).

(in reply to morvael)

Post #: 136

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 7:59:56 AM

loki100

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I realise there is little point complaining (yet again) about .08 and the decision to make German Panzers invincible.

Having said that, in my current game, it is getting completely ridiculous. Due to excessive losses my better tank corps (March 1944) are 12 cv.

But since the Germans are no longer allowed to lose AFVs their Panzer divisions mostly remain in the 25+cv range - despite being cut off and running around stemming my offensive.

But when I found this impressive big boy, I think its time to note this patch really has changed play balance:

So if I managed to bring the equivalent of 3 tank armies (say around 50 cv each), I just might have a decent chance of pushing that back if its in a level 1 fort or light woods. In better terrain or behind a river that really is invincible.

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by loki100 -- 3/15/2016 8:02:52 AM >

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Post #: 137

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 8:04:47 AM

morvael

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In my game it was at about 35CV. Tough nut to crack. I'm in the process of rebalancing losses and they look better now.

(in reply to loki100)

Post #: 138

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 9:00:08 AM

loki100

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quote:

ORIGINAL: morvael

In my game it was at about 35CV. Tough nut to crack. I'm in the process of rebalancing losses and they look better now.

so in effect, over a 3 month period when the Germans are getting quite a beating, the effect of the patch has been to increase the combat value of their Pzrs by 33%.

I know its a tough unit and a serious barrier in the late game, but the patch has converted into something that can munch its way through Soviet lines with the only limit being its MP capacity.

I'll be honest, with these wild shifts in the patches my current 2 campaigns are the last I'm starting. There seems to be no interest in stability in how the game plays. WiTW is much newer, but the patches are increasingly incremental - sorting out bugs, play balance and so on, but never leaving you with the feeling that continuing to play an existing game is a waste of time.

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Post #: 139

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 9:22:39 AM

morvael

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I think I had to withdraw all my tank armies to the rear after summer 1944 for three months long refit at the railhead, disband all support units that used medium tanks, and this allowed me to make one last great strike of the war, by the end of which they were already gutted. As T-34 production winds down there is no way to keep all those tank, mechanized and cavalry corps running at full strength. We usually build more of them than the Soviets did, and we keep those 20 cavalry corps, which use some 3000 medium tanks. These are fine units, but maybe they are not worth it - it's better to put your tanks in 50MP units than 25MP units.

It's a shame you're always hitting the worst period for given patch, 41-42 works well with the new rules, but they needed rebalancing for 43-45. With all the changes I already listed made for 1.08.09 I think Soviet tanks will be fine. But still, players may not expect to run 28 tank corps, 6 mech corps and 20 cav corps (like I did) and expect all will be filled with tanks to the max.

WitW follows the standard way of a game that's no longer main focus of the developers - changes are smaller and conservative. That's why it's more stable. In WitE we try some new things, which IMHO in the long run works, but there are many unpleasant events along the way.

(in reply to loki100)

Post #: 140

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 9:25:08 AM

VigaBrand

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This division hasn't fight in the last three month, so the CV from this division has nothing to do with the patch.
My infantery division are nearly with no value after 1943, so there is no problem. You had so much tank, mech, cav corps and so on and you get land enough. Don't forget the NM change in april'44. Your air force is still strong and now usefull. Your guards tank corps will have more experience than my infantery, so you will have the chance of the new events, if something went wrong.
My army is bigger than the army of pelton. Because I didn't burn all I can to get better chances or something like that. And what bring this bigger army? Nothing! My NM drops, your will be increased. I save some good formations with high moral and if I really bring them to action, you will grind them down with a few fights and it isn't the casualties, it is the moral which will bring them down.
The CV monster with 47 cv is a full division with moral nearly 99 and three support units (one will be the heavy tank unit with tigers). And experience will be so soon.
Some battles which this monster losses, will reduce the NM and so by time will reduce experience and it will go down.
But it has nothing to do with the patch or the change with the events after fighting.
Did you want a patch, where the game is finish, if the germans didn't win before 1943?

< Message edited by VigaBrand -- 3/15/2016 9:47:35 AM >

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Post #: 141

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 9:50:59 AM

Wuffer

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G'men,
just wait for the next patch, please. :-)

Would be a pity if this great match ends unsatisfactioned.

@ Viga
you should continue your AAR, you have excellent stuff on the other forum...
One of the most astonishing '42 offensives ever.

(in reply to VigaBrand)

Post #: 142

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 9:55:21 AM

Wuffer

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we should all agree that the main issues are based on very dubious design decisions in the pre-alpha stadium of the original release.

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Post #: 143

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/15/2016 9:56:31 AM

VigaBrand

Posts: 303
Joined: 12/19/2014
From: Germany
Status: offline

It is like the reality. As the germans move forward, you find much writen from them and in the end of the war, you find many from the Soviets. Nobody will write about his failures

I only find for the longest delay I could get.

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Post #: 144

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/27/2016 8:15:52 PM

Mordeep

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I ran the patch 1.08.08 before I noticed the 1.08.07 patch.

Did I need to install the 1.08.07 patch before 1.08.08? Or is everything included in the 1.08.08 patch?

(in reply to VigaBrand)

Post #: 145

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/29/2016 10:22:12 PM

Icier

Posts: 564
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From: a sunny beach nsw
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There may still be a problem with Moral...I doing a practice game (41-45 alt cv) & noticed that the a lot of German units had a national moral of 67.

(in reply to charlie0311)

Post #: 146

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/31/2016 6:49:41 AM

STEF78

Posts: 2094
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From: Versailles, France
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quote:

ORIGINAL: loki100

I'll be honest, with these wild shifts in the patches my current 2 campaigns are the last I'm starting. There seems to be no interest in stability in how the game plays. WiTW is much newer, but the patches are increasingly incremental - sorting out bugs, play balance and so on, but never leaving you with the feeling that continuing to play an existing game is a waste of time.

Losing a player and AAR writer like Loki is a pity

You should be more careful while rebalancing the game. Some players are only one sided....

Mild blizzard was a fantastic idea, fixing bug is fine but changing NM, replacements... has huge impacts on the long term.

I have 2 campaigns ongoing, I hope they will not stop due to this upgrade.

(in reply to loki100)

Post #: 147

RE: Public Beta v1.08.08 now available - 3/31/2016 9:40:03 PM

RKhan

Posts: 315
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I vote for stability. (and with respect for the great effort and intent of the developers)

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RKhan

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Post #: 148

BETA REPORT - 4/1/2016 1:40:54 AM

mogami

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Hi, Bought the game on March 10th. Playing Soviets against AI. Public Beta Alt CV
1. Soviet Rifle Div that surrender prior to Nov 41 return but never take replacements. I have 2 million+ arms and 2.6 million manpower. 40 rifle/motorized div surrendered prior to Nov 41 and all have been sitting on refit around Moscow since. Stay at 20% TOE
2. Finland surrendered on turn 59. I held Vyborg but was 10 miles from Narva and 30 miles from Psykov. Most Finnish units were isolated.
3. Naval Infantry/Rifle Brigades are supposed to be able to combine into rifle div. Most did but I have 9 that refuse to. All set to same HQ.
4. The only way to kill German Armor is to force it to surrender. Very rare to kill an Axis tank.
5. Axis AI Admin points always at 500. AI spends around 5 points per turn
6. AI turns are very slow. My machine exceeds recommended specs. Often goes unresponsive but corrects after time. (I am only on turn 60 because AI turns sometimes take all night.)

Over all I am very satisfied with game. Can't wait to play when Beta turns public.

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Post #: 149

RE: BETA REPORT - 4/2/2016 4:40:11 AM

mogami

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Hi, OK it has been pointed out to me that the units not getting replacements were in fact set to only accept 20%
I went and reset 84 divisions to 100% The default setting should be 100%
Pool levels might require players to lower the setting but it is easier to do a few units at a time rather then every unit that arrives.

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I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

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Post #: 150