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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal

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Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 2:39:12 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

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Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
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So this is the weirdest carrier battle I have ever seen, results are inconclusive, and I feel this was a wasted opportunity to reduce the # of enemy carriers

Bif1961: You were absolutely right, there were more carriers: Yorktown and Hermes are there. But in a sense I was also right.. they were there, yes, but they were not present... and I am really struggling to understand how so many carriers could provide so little... they should had massacred my TF.. was he keeping all squadrons on stand down? was he hoping to bait me, then hopefully find me from long range and then "turn on" the lights? surprise, surprise! did I just caught him before he could setup his trap?, thoughts gentlemen please that is the only explanation I have.. and thinking more about it, it makes quite a lot of sense, I mean he was driving his carriers as if it was the full KB on December 41, giving me plenty of time to identify the ships and squadrons he wanted me to find... so sneaky

So, key results:
- Nothing happened on the surface combat phase, I am disappointed with my supposedly aggresive BB TF commander, he either shine tomorrow or start sharpening his knife for some harakiri practice; I mean the TF ended one hex below a returning bombardment TF
- Very little happened in the AM phase, damn weather!!! he actually bombarded Akyab with TBDs/ SBDs. My Army guys tried and failed to hit the Hermes, got slaughtered of course. CL Kitakami ate 2 1,000 pound bombs A lot more details to follow
- PM turn Japan: Japanese strike was weak, and being at 7 hex distance, Vals were carrying 60kg bombs.. really useless, I put a few torpedoes, but all enemy carriers survived, Wasp received 2 torpedoes and ended with "heavy damage", but no explosions and since it is very close to Calcutta, I doubt it will sink. Other TFs were attacked, and Warspite ate a torpedo, I might be able to catch him later on
- PM turn Allies: US strike was a total blood feast disaster, Japanese CAP won big time and the ships are undamaged (other than the heavy "flank speed" damage incurred

Lots and lots of details to follow

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 1:49:13 PM >

(in reply to Jorge_Stanbury)

Post #: 301

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 3:38:29 AM

Chickenboy

Posts: 24520
Joined: 6/29/2002
From: San Antonio, TX
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How was your coordination?

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Post #: 302

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 4:01:57 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Chickenboy

How was your coordination?

one strike at the carriers,slightly understrength, but coordinated.

another small (6 Kates) without escorts, on a TF that was not in range of land based or carrier aircraft

EDIT: I think it was entirely my fault that the strike was under strength, Shokaku, which I overloaded (to 15%) didn't launch, probably the game decided to add the reserves to the already 15% over capacity carrier and cancel all flights

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 4:35:46 AM >

(in reply to Chickenboy)

Post #: 303

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 4:05:11 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
Status: offline

AM phase

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Akyab , at 54,45

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Allied aircraft
SBD-3 Dauntless x 10
TBF-1 Avenger x 14

Allied aircraft losses
SBD-3 Dauntless: 1 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
7 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Airbase hits 3
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 12

Aircraft Attacking:
14 x TBF-1 Avenger bombing from 5000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
10 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 2000'
Airfield Attack: 1 x 1000 lb GP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 15th Army, at 54,43 (Cox's Bazar)

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 12

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x Blenheim IV bombing from 5000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
4 x Blenheim IV bombing from 5000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 7th Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion, at 54,43 (Cox's Bazar)

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
Blenheim IV x 3
Hudson IIIa x 2

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Blenheim IV bombing from 6000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb
2 x Hudson IIIa bombing from 5000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 1st Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion, at 54,43 (Cox's Bazar)

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hudson IIIa x 8
Hurricane I Trop x 2

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x Hudson IIIa bombing from 5000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 250 lb GP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 2nd Mortar Battalion, at 54,43 (Cox's Bazar)

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 19 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Allied aircraft
A-24 Banshee x 6

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x A-24 Banshee releasing from 4000'
Ground Attack: 1 x 1000 lb GP Bomb
4 x A-24 Banshee releasing from 2000'
Ground Attack: 1 x 1000 lb GP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 2nd Mortar Battalion, at 54,43 (Cox's Bazar)

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Allied aircraft
A-20A Havoc x 3

Allied aircraft losses
A-20A Havoc: 1 damaged

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x A-20A Havoc bombing from 5000 feet
Ground Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Diamond Harbour at 51,41

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid detected at 46 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 14 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 11
Ki-48-Ib Lily x 16

Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 8
Sea Hurricane Ib x 4
Hurricane IIb Trop x 1
P-40E Warhawk x 1
F4F-3 Wildcat x 13
F4F-4 Wildcat x 10

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-48-Ib Lily: 6 destroyed, 1 damaged
Ki-48-Ib Lily: 1 destroyed by flak

Allied aircraft losses
Fulmar II: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed
F4F-3 Wildcat: 1 destroyed

Allied Ships
CVL Hermes

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Ki-48-Ib Lily bombing from 100 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 100 kg SAP Bomb

CAP engaged:
VF-42 with F4F-3 Wildcat (1 airborne, 3 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters to 12000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 11 minutes
3 planes vectored on to bombers
VF-71 with F4F-4 Wildcat (3 airborne, 7 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters between 4000 and 13000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 12 minutes
6 planes vectored on to bombers
No.880 Sqn FAA with Sea Hurricane Ib (1 airborne, 3 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 18000 , scrambling fighters to 8000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 8 minutes
5 planes vectored on to bombers
VMO-251 with F4F-3 Wildcat (3 airborne, 6 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 8000 and 9000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 9 minutes
1-Vl.G.IV with P-40E Warhawk (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 5000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 5000.
Raid is overhead
No.135 Sqn RAF with Hurricane IIb Trop (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead
No.273 Sqn RAF with Fulmar II (2 airborne, 6 on standby, 0 scrambling)
2 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 12000 , scrambling fighters between 11000 and 12000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 15 minutes
6 planes vectored on to bombers

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Cuttack at 46,45

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 14,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
SBD-3 Dauntless x 39

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
CL Jintsu
CL Natori
CL Kitakami, Bomb hits 2, on fire
CA Ashigara

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb GP Bomb
1 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 4000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
4 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
11 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
8 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 4000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb GP Bomb
4 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 4000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
4 x SBD-3 Dauntless releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb

Carrier support unable to supply air cover..
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring CL Kitakami

Attachment (1)

(in reply to Jorge_Stanbury)

Post #: 304

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 4:06:41 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
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PM Phase

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Diamond Harbour at 51,41

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 77 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 28 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 60
B5N1 Kate x 32
B5N2 Kate x 29
D3A1 Val x 43

Allied aircraft
Fulmar II x 13
Sea Hurricane Ib x 6
Hurricane IIb Trop x 1
P-40E Warhawk x 1
F4F-3 Wildcat x 23
F4F-4 Wildcat x 21

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 5 destroyed
B5N1 Kate: 6 destroyed, 8 damaged
B5N1 Kate: 1 destroyed by flak
B5N2 Kate: 4 destroyed, 4 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 2 destroyed by flak
D3A1 Val: 2 destroyed, 20 damaged
D3A1 Val: 3 destroyed by flak

Allied aircraft losses
Fulmar II: 1 destroyed
P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed
F4F-3 Wildcat: 1 destroyed
F4F-4 Wildcat: 1 destroyed

Allied Ships
CV Hornet
CV Wasp, Bomb hits 4, Torpedo hits 2, heavy damage
CV Yorktown, Bomb hits 2
BB North Carolina, Torpedo hits 1
CA Quincy, Torpedo hits 1
CV Illustrious, Bomb hits 5, Torpedo hits 1
CLAA San Juan

Aircraft Attacking:
13 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
14 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
9 x B5N1 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
7 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
8 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
7 x B5N1 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
2 x B5N1 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp
6 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
6 x D3A1 Val releasing from 1000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
4 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
VF-42 with F4F-3 Wildcat (0 airborne, 2 on standby, 5 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 9000 and 15000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 17 minutes
1 planes vectored on to bombers
VF-71 with F4F-4 Wildcat (0 airborne, 6 on standby, 12 scrambling)
3 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 13000 , scrambling fighters between 10000 and 14000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 29 minutes
No.880 Sqn FAA with Sea Hurricane Ib (0 airborne, 3 on standby, 2 scrambling)
1 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 18000 , scrambling fighters between 3000 and 18000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 23 minutes
VMO-251 with F4F-3 Wildcat (0 airborne, 6 on standby, 7 scrambling)
2 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 4000 and 12000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 26 minutes
7 planes vectored on to bombers
1-Vl.G.IV with P-40E Warhawk (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 5000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 5000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 8 minutes
No.135 Sqn RAF with Hurricane IIb Trop (0 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
0 plane(s) not yet engaged, 1 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 8 minutes
No.273 Sqn RAF with Fulmar II (0 airborne, 5 on standby, 6 scrambling)
2 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 12000 , scrambling fighters between 4000 and 16000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 33 minutes
6 planes vectored on to bombers
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Cuttack at 46,44

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 73 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 48 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 71

Allied aircraft
Swordfish I x 12
SBD-3 Dauntless x 60
TBF-1 Avenger x 22

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
Swordfish I: 6 destroyed
SBD-3 Dauntless: 24 destroyed
TBF-1 Avenger: 15 destroyed

CAP engaged:
Kanoya Ku S-1/A with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 6 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000 , scrambling fighters between 3000 and 6000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 7 minutes
Kanoya Ku S-1/B with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 6 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 5000 , scrambling fighters between 4000 and 29070.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 15 minutes
Kanoya Ku S-1/C with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 6 on standby, 0 scrambling)
2 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 5000 , scrambling fighters to 7000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 29 minutes
Shoho-1 with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 9 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 15000
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 10 minutes
Zuiho-1 with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 12 on standby, 0 scrambling)
6 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 7000 and 10000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 23 minutes
Hosho-1 with A6M2 Zero (0 airborne, 10 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) not yet engaged, 0 being recalled, 0 out of immediate contact.
Group patrol altitude is 5000 , scrambling fighters between 5000 and 11000.
Time for all group planes to reach interception is 9 minutes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Vizagapatnam at 44,43

Weather in hex: Heavy cloud

Raid detected at 56 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 23 minutes

Japanese aircraft
B5N2 Kate x 6

Japanese aircraft losses
B5N2 Kate: 2 damaged
B5N2 Kate: 1 destroyed by flak

Allied Ships
CA Cornwall
BB Warspite, Torpedo hits 1

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x B5N2 Kate launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 45cm Type 91 Torp

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Diamond Harbour at 51,38

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 45 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 10
Ki-21-IIa Sally x 17
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 21

Allied aircraft
Hurricane I Trop x 1

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-21-IIa Sally: 3 damaged

No Allied losses

Allied Ships
DD Grayson
DD Reid, Shell hits 1
DD Duncan

Aircraft Attacking:
17 x Ki-21-IIa Sally bombing from 100 feet *
Naval Attack: 1 x 250 kg SAP Bomb

CAP engaged:
No.261 Sqn RAF with Hurricane I Trop (1 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
(1 plane(s) diverted to support CAP in hex.)
1 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 5000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 5000.
Raid is overhead

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 4:07:45 AM >

(in reply to Jorge_Stanbury)

Post #: 305

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 4:24:32 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
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So I need to think about what to do tomorrow, first I will need to fully study the battle and understand the striking capacity of the enemy. I will certainly not go farther North East, probably start moving closer to Japanese waters. In any case, I am not afraid of another "dance", but I will only fight closer to Japanese waters. No desire to meet Calcutta's CAP at full alert

These are the aircraft losses, and ships damaged:
Notice "bomb hits" are crappy 60kgs

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 4:25:18 AM >

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Post #: 306

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 4:41:17 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

Posts: 4320
Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
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The Shokaku fiasco:

Last turn I added another squadron segment to Shokaku, on paper it was all fine last turn (exactly at 15%), but probably the turn after the game decided to add the reserves and then I was definitively over capacity

Big lesson learnt, and the consequences were not as bad: All Zeros on Shokaku were tasked with CAP, which was not needed, and the 27 Vals would had died for 60kg bombs.. not worth it... Only big what-if is the Kates... would 18 additional Kates had put another torpedo in Wasp???

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 4:48:12 AM >

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Post #: 307

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 12:02:59 PM

ny59giants

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Shokaku (72) for me goes after re-sizing - 30(3) Zero, 21 (1) Val, 21(1) Kate.

As long as you don't have a HR against re-sizing of other IJN airgroups, I try to have a couple of the Kates at either 21 or 24 plane near my CV TF so I could fly off Vals and go heavy strike, if needed.

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 12:48:38 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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Joined: 2/29/2012
From: Toronto and Lima
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Shokaku, actually all fleet carriers, were recently resized by scenario specific augmented fighter component (was it in July??). I was in short supply of Zeroes A6M2, and already focusing in building M3, so I was not paying too much attention to optimal sizes, as I was not even able to keep my fleet at full 27 plane capacity. The addition of 3 KuS-1 /C was more a closing gap for a coming battle, it was never supposed to be permanent.
Lesson learnt: DO NOT GO OVER 10% CAPACITY IF YOU ARE ALSO CARRYING RESERVES

I will certainly review all my fleet sizes, if I remember correctly, we have a sizing limit, but is within reason (I think it is 30something planes).

I will also see if I can accelerate my Judys.. Vals didn't shine yesterday; like I am seriously thinking on changing maximum range allowed to 6 hexes... really pointless to risk CAP and AA for puny 60kgs bombs

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 12:52:04 PM >

(in reply to ny59giants)

Post #: 309

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 2:21:34 PM

Chickenboy

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From: San Antonio, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury
Shokaku, which I overloaded (to 15%) didn't launch, probably the game decided to add the reserves to the already 15% over capacity carrier and cancel all flights

Yes. That would do it.

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 2:28:18 PM

Chickenboy

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From: San Antonio, TX
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You've shredded much of your opponent's carrier air offensive strength and significantly reduced the enemy CAP expected (Wasp is likely >50 combined damage=no flight OPS). That makes another attack more tempting in my eyes. Finish them.

Of course, your opponent might realize they're on the 'dirty end of the stick' now and flee to a nearby port and LRCAP with LBA to attrit your naval air. That's the cat and mouse.

I'd say that it's worth a try, but don't be surprised if your opponent doesn't want to let them die and fights like hell to keep them alive. Expect all manner of techniques and slight of hand to deny your prize.

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 3:17:39 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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From: Toronto and Lima
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My opponent is very aggressive, I won't be surprised if he come forward with his remaining carriers. He now has a "fast" division (Hornet, Yorktown) and a slow one (damaged Illustrious and Hermes). I would ideally like to bring the battle closer to my LBAs. somewhere south east, where I can get support from Pt Blair and Magwe's Netties and A6M3s/ Oscars

It is hard to assess tomorrow's offensive capabilities, simply because I don't know which carrier's bombers I shot, maybe I massacred Wasps' and then there is still a credible capability at Hornet and Yorktown. Also, I am near the main British base, which means there has to be plenty of Martlets, Swordfish and Albacores that can readily jump into any carrier with excess space. I remember using Albacores quite extensively in my Allied PBEM, same kind of timeline, May to July 42, but that game was PDU-ON if that matters

So I am still not decided on what to do, but I definitively won't do the following:
- Run away at flank speed
- Get into Calcutta or Chittagong strike range. I can accept some LRCAP noise, but I won't get into a head-on battle with the port's CAP and murderous AA.. That means that if Wasp can reach Calcutta, it will survive.

These are my aircraft numbers after the battle:

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 3:30:38 PM >

(in reply to Chickenboy)

Post #: 312

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 3:23:32 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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From: Toronto and Lima
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And these are the hypothetical enemy numbers vs. what he brought to the fight... he certainly was not expecting me, yet.
tricky, sneaky tactics are dangerous, for both the hunter and the prey
I think he can still pack a 200 plane strike force for tomorrow

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 3:25:20 PM >

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Post #: 313

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 3:37:18 PM

ny59giants

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I would go with 80 to 90 Zeros on 100% CAP from your best air groups with range set to 00. The rest are assigned Escorts and let the AI decide if additional Zeros will need to remain. If you set CAP at 50% for all your fighters, you don't know how many good pilots are sent off as escorts. I want my best over my CVs!!

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 3:42:25 PM

Chickenboy

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From: San Antonio, TX
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

I would go with 80 to 90 Zeros on 100% CAP from your best air groups with range set to 00. The rest are assigned Escorts and let the AI decide if additional Zeros will need to remain. If you set CAP at 50% for all your fighters, you don't know how many good pilots are sent off as escorts. I want my best over my CVs!!

Don't you think that may increase the danger of uncoordinated / poorly coordinated attacks, considering the polyglot nature of this air combat TF?

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 5:37:24 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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My preference has always been the all or nothing: some squadrons on 100% CAP, 0 range, some others on 0% CAP, escort up to at the striking punch's range. With multiple squadrons you can be sure that at least some will fly. It is also a lot easier to maintain and control fatigue levels, as 100% CAP 0 range will keep pilot's fatigue at no more than 12 points. You also guarantee a concentrated CAP over your TF and not over empty sea hexes.

All that being said, I think this turn I will have some squadrons doing both CAP and escort, reason is I plan to unleash the battleships as there are 2 SCTFs nearby (map will be posted soon). So because it will be hard to keep all task forces ending in the same hex, I will put some squadrons at CAP-Escort so that there is at least some token air support over Yamato and friends

(in reply to Chickenboy)

Post #: 316

RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 5:51:35 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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From: Toronto and Lima
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants
I want my best over my CVs!!

I do this picking of squadrons a lot more when playing Allies (early war in particular). I mean for Japan they are all flying the same plane and only the best quality pilots go into carriers; with Allies you might still need some below average guys flying the Buffaloes/ Fulmars etc

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/26/2017 5:52:21 PM >

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/26/2017 10:38:09 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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I think this was it all, I doubt there is going to be another carrier battle tomorrow unless he goes head-on into dangerous waters

That said, there is a very good chance of surface combat

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 9:38:07 PM

Bif1961

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Since your position would cut him off from Calcutta he will probable head for madras of Ceylon and max land base air CAP, in other words except for a Surface Tf as a buffer between you and his retreating carriers he is done with this fight. I believe what happened to him happens frequently to the Allie sin their early carrier battles, some CV TFs reacted and some did not. That ensured his coordination between carrier TFs and airstrikes, including escorting his afternoon strike was disrupted. If your gaol is to kill as many Allied carriers before his Essexs arrive I would drive west hard with a BB TF and your carriers one hex behind it. this is your chance he is damaged and disorganized you are relatively unscathed.

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:13:41 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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I haven't yet talked to my opponent, I think he is having some time off, but I still believe this was a deliberate attempt to fool me into a trap, and not a failure to react
TF composition, according to 5 naval search reports is still at 10 ships, followed by a small DD TF, then there are these very small strikes using always the same squadrons; this was a trap attempt

The silver linen: because of the Shokaku fiasco, he has not seen it, so as far as he can tell, there was only Zuikaku + little guys of mini-KB. He might still want to keep dancing. as Hornet + Yorktown are more than a match against one fleet and multiple light/ escort carriers

The surface TF are all returning bombardment fleets, which means low to no ammo.. and in the case of Warspite, also it also received a, hopefully slowing, torpedo strike, which means that if Yamato finally acts, and the world wonders why it had not yet! then they are all going to meet Davy Jones

At the end I went to the safest route, and I agree going to Madras would had meant better chances to meet him, but not counting fuel (which is becoming an issue), it also adds too much unknown factors. I mean, as far as I can tell, Enterprise and Saratoga could be coming from Ceylon, At the end of the day, I am more interested in preserving my carries than sinking his.

< Message edited by Jorge_Stanbury -- 5/28/2017 12:02:23 AM >

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:36:38 PM

Bif1961

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You didn't mention anything about submarines in the area. Do you have any and are you vectoring them to cut off his escapes routes and maybe pick off a crippled capitol vessel?

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:54:50 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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And the carriers are actually the TF 4 hexes east of Chittagong (apologies for not specifying this in the map). So if he really wants to go defensive, he just needs to use the carriers to escort heavy damaged Wasp into Calcutta. staying one or two hexes outside Calcutta or Diamond Harbor will avoid the penalty while still remaining very close for land based CAP and put me in range of his own LBAs for strike. Hornet + Yorkwown + Hermes + Illustrious + Calcutta LBAs + Chittagong LBAs is too much firepower against my carriers

Once Wasp is safe at port, he can then go flank speed to in either west or south west direction. This would be the defensive approach, trying to avoid another carrier battle.

A more aggresive play would be to use damaged Illustrious (assuming damage to engine/ speed) or Hermes, or both to escort Wasp and hunt me with Yorktown and Hornet

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:55:33 PM

Lowpe

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The naval search popup only ever lists 10 ships...never anymore.

Lots of players have been shafted by seeing only combat ships and no invasions ships for example...

It can be really tough...

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:56:19 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bif1961

You didn't mention anything about submarines in the area. Do you have any and are you vectoring them to cut off his escapes routes and maybe pick off a crippled capitol vessel?

Only one near Calcutta, sighted and probably going to be harassed heavily, another one moving on, but likely will arrive to late

I have a lot more submarines near Colombo, they might catch something, but much later on

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:58:02 PM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

. Hornet + Yorkwown + Hermes + Illustrious + Calcutta LBAs + Chittagong LBAs is too much firepower against my carriers

Nonsense.

Land base air LRCAP over fleet carriers is pitiful.

Land based air attacks against your carriers will fragment and go down easily.

You have the advantage now...push for it.

Alternative strategy is to naval search heavily (which you should be doing anyhow)...they will most likely make a lot of attacks on the damaged Wasp.

1 Betty squadron on strike, 3 Oscar/Zero on Escort flying at 25,000 feet....I can't really tell what's up from the map....but you might be able to do it. Air HQ, torpedoes, good DL...he won't be able to stop this attack...only the weather will.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/28/2017 12:04:46 AM >

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/27/2017 11:58:52 PM

Jorge_Stanbury

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

The naval search popup only ever lists 10 ships...never anymore.

Lots of players have been shafted by seeing only combat ships and no invasions ships for example...

It can be really tough...

I didn't know that! I thought it would somehow show accurate numbers, Still there is the fact he was not striking with all his squadrons (I mean not even CAP with all his potential fighter squadrons until a LRCAP mission forced him to set VF-8 to rest)

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/28/2017 12:02:55 AM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

The naval search popup only ever lists 10 ships...never anymore.

Lots of players have been shafted by seeing only combat ships and no invasions ships for example...

It can be really tough...

I didn't know that! I thought it would somehow show accurate numbers, Still there is the fact he was not striking with all his squadrons (I mean not even CAP with all his potential fighter squadrons until a LRCAP mission forced him to set VF-8 to rest)

All sorts of strange things happen on ships...for example if he set a squadron to rest for the day...it could have gone into maintenance. Or planes diverted from Wasp overloaded a carrier or two. Or he overstacked his carrier like you did.

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/28/2017 12:03:38 AM >

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/28/2017 12:07:56 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

. Hornet + Yorkwown + Hermes + Illustrious + Calcutta LBAs + Chittagong LBAs is too much firepower against my carriers

Nonsense. Land base air LRCAP over fleet carriers is pitiful.

Land based air attacks against your carriers will fragment and go down easily.

You have the advantage now...push for it.

Alternative strategy is to naval search heavily (which you should be doing anyhow)...they will most likely make a lot of attacks on the damaged Wasp.

1 Betty squadron on strike, 3 Oscar/Zero on Escort flying at 25,000 feet....I can't really tell what's up from the map....but you might be able to do it. Air HQ, torpedoes, good DL...he won't be able to stop this attack...only the weather will.

OK I have withdrawn the turn (doesn't seems that he has picked it up). Assuming he really has not yet picked it, then I will study if it makes sense to go a bit closer... I still won't attack Calcutta's hex, but I might go one or two hexes south

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/28/2017 12:25:48 AM

Jorge_Stanbury

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Lowpe: quick question, if I have a squadron at Pt Blair, and I rebase it to Magwe... would they still fly next turn? maybe PM only?

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RE: Carrier Battle: Bay of Bengal - 5/28/2017 12:56:17 AM

Lowpe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jorge_Stanbury

Lowpe: quick question, if I have a squadron at Pt Blair, and I rebase it to Magwe... would they still fly next turn? maybe PM only?

They have to pass checks, but if you have a good HQa there (check the leader); plentiful supply, torpedoes, and the morale and leadership of the squadron you are transferring is good and finally you have decent DL on a carrier...then they will fly.

Weather can hurt you...but then that is always true for land based ops in Burma.

I have pulled off many fly in and attack raids like this, and fly out the following day. Not very realistic I guess, but it is a game and we are Japan!

< Message edited by Lowpe -- 5/28/2017 1:01:03 AM >

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