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RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe

 
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RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 5:04:04 PM   
tiemanjw

 

Posts: 580
Joined: 12/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

I don't know what this "base TOE" is, either. A unit doesn't come in without a TOE...


"base TO&E" is a term I purely made up, and does not exist within the context of the game vocabulary.

It is short hand for:
The unit arrives with devices as defined in the editor. Each unit also has a TO&E assigned (which may or may not match up with the devices in it). I used the term "base TO&E" to describe this:






Attachment (1)

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 31
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 5:04:55 PM   
JocMeister

 

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		Thanks guys. I´ll think I´ll lay this to rest and try and make due without the 2nd armored. I made a mistake by not checking if the TOE was due to upgrade. I just looked after the Lees and saw that there was no = sign and didn´t double check everything. So my bad really.

That being said I´ll drop a note of it in the tech support so Michelm can possible correct the TOE in the next patch or something.

(in reply to tiemanjw)
Post #: 32
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 5:15:09 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna


quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs

There might be some special situation that I am not aware of, but AFAIK:

- TOW upgrades can only occur in a friendly base, with a Command HQ within a certain range, and with the LCU in Rest mode.
- Device upgrades can only occur if the 'upgrade' button is 'yes', the unit is in a friendly base, enough supply & enough devices in the pool.

The notion of the LCU upgrading to a 'base TOE' is something I haven't heard about before.


I don't know what this "base TOE" is, either. A unit doesn't come in without a TOE...

You have to have Upgrade Allowed selected in order for the unit to upgrade its TOE as well. You can prevent TOE upgrades by turning upgrade to off. Or at least, so I think... I keep all my units to off except when I explicitly want upgrades to occur, so there are times when I miss TOE upgrades. Periodically, I go check through my LCU list to see how many units have "0 days until upgrade" and where they're at/is there a command HQ in range, etc.

At least the overwhelming majority of them have a TOE. But some units have come in without a TOE. This was true of rare units in my current PBM, but the Babes version was from November 2011, so they might have caught all the stragglers by now. At any rate the point is that a unit can have no TOE specified when it arrives, but I'm not sure how upgrades to the TOE for that unit work.

Totally agree with your advice on managing TOE upgrades. I carefully manage device upgrades too.

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(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 33
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 5:54:12 PM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		I know at one point MichaelM was considering placing a column in the LCU in which a player could stockpile devices in each LCU vs across the board. Maybe time to revisit that enhancement.

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Post #: 34
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 5:58:15 PM   
witpqs


Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

I know at one point MichaelM was considering placing a column in the LCU in which a player could stockpile devices in each LCU vs across the board. Maybe time to revisit that enhancement.

I asked for that but it wasn't in the cards. Might be a ton of work.

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Post #: 35
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 7:49:08 PM   
paradigmblue

 

Posts: 784
Joined: 9/16/2014
From: Fairbanks, Alaska
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: tiemanj

quote:

I don't know what this "base TOE" is, either. A unit doesn't come in without a TOE...


"base TO&E" is a term I purely made up, and does not exist within the context of the game vocabulary.

It is short hand for:
The unit arrives with devices as defined in the editor. Each unit also has a TO&E assigned (which may or may not match up with the devices in it). I used the term "base TO&E" to describe this:







Yes, this is what I was referring to as well. When TOE upgrades are on, the unit will try to "upgrade" to the referenced TOE. Otherwise it will use it's individual TOE. Many times you won't want it to "upgrade" to the referenced/"base" TOE because it is worse than the original.

In this case you can see there is no "upgrade TOE", only the referenced/base TOE. When the upgrade was turned on, the unit upgraded to the referenced/base TOE, regardless of available squads for that TOE. (I'm not an expert on this by any means, but this seems consistent with my experience. We really should sandbox this to confirm.)

< Message edited by paradigmblue -- 7/1/2016 7:57:17 PM >

(in reply to tiemanjw)
Post #: 36
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 7:59:18 PM   
paradigmblue

 

Posts: 784
Joined: 9/16/2014
From: Fairbanks, Alaska
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: witpqs
At least the overwhelming majority of them have a TOE. But some units have come in without a TOE. This was true of rare units in my current PBM, but the Babes version was from November 2011, so they might have caught all the stragglers by now. At any rate the point is that a unit can have no TOE specified when it arrives, but I'm not sure how upgrades to the TOE for that unit work.


That unit would only upgrade its individual devices if the device itself had an upgrade path, but would not have a standard TOE to upgrade/conform to, and would always use its original configuration as its template.

(in reply to witpqs)
Post #: 37
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 8:25:07 PM   
Lokasenna


Posts: 9297
Joined: 3/3/2012
From: Iowan in MD/DC
Status: offline 		Ah, I see what you're saying. Seems a silly/lazy way to have units arrive. Why have them arrive with 150 tanks of one type if the unit doesn't even have a TOE with those tanks at all? Why not have the unit arrive with a TOE that defines those as part of the unit, since presumably the person putting the unit in is including those tanks for a reason (that they were there historically)?

(in reply to paradigmblue)
Post #: 38
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 8:29:29 PM   
JocMeister

 

Posts: 8262
Joined: 7/29/2009
From: Sweden
Status: offline 		Wow, I´m too drunk to understand this.

Note to tomorrow me: Read the above posts. Seems important.

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 39
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/1/2016 8:59:22 PM   
Bullwinkle58


Posts: 11302
Joined: 2/24/2009
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: JocMeister

Wow, I´m too drunk to understand this.

Note to tomorrow me: Read the above posts. Seems important.


Yeahbut, are you too drunk to write that in Swedish?

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The Moose

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Post #: 40
RE: Question on Upgrade/TOE. No Lowpe - 7/2/2016 7:39:04 AM   
Chris21wen

 

Posts: 6249
Joined: 1/17/2002
From: Cottesmore, Rutland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lokasenna



I don't know that base size matters for fixing units. I think you just need to tick these boxes for best fixing:
1) Are you at a base?
2) Does unit have enough supply?
3) Is the leader good at Admin?
4) Is there an HQ present?
5) Are you in Rest mode?

That's it, I think?




I learnt a long time ago to play with upgrades off. I also turn stocking pile on for all future devices., I only turning them on once I have a number that can be used to upgrade anything. I then tend too leave in off unless I think it's necessary to do otherwise.

I my experience:_

Only the top two are needed for device upgrades but it's supply at the base that matters. I do not think supply matters for TOE upgrades although I can't be sure about that.
Leader admin only seems to help determine the order in which LCU upgrade. I ignore it.
The last two play no part in upgrading devices. They are needed for upgrading TOEs but a command HQ only needs to be within 2 x command radius of the LCU.
Because the unit needs to be at rest, TOEs cannot be done with an enemy unit in the same hex. Devices can, but the base has to be yours.
One more, device upgrades require the equivalent number of devices, TOE upgrades do not. They will upgrade even if there are none in stock.



< Message edited by Chris H -- 7/3/2016 6:55:58 AM >

(in reply to Lokasenna)
Post #: 41
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