Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: wdolson

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ORIGINAL: bomccarthy

That was an interesting article on battery vs hydrogen fuel cell technology. I haven't gone too deep into electric car technology, so I started reading some articles written from the car enthusiast side. I didn't realize that current electric cars are so much heavier than internal combustion cars. I'll wait until someone gets some more sporting models into the 3,000 - 3,500 lb range. Cars heavier than that just aren't much fun in corners.

Weight is also the main reason for the lack of progress in gas mileage over the past two decades. Your early 90s Buick probably weighed less than 3,500 lbs (a 1992 Regal had a curb weight of 3,300 lbs). With modern impact standards and design emphasis on rigid structure, the 2017 Regal has a curb weight of just over 4,000 lbs.

Tesla's stroke of genius was to put the batteries under the floor in between the wheels. It puts the center of gravity extremely low as well as fantastically balanced. It makes the car almost impossible to flip as well as very solid in the corners despite the weight. I've driven a lot of mountain roads, but mostly in large cars, so my data is a bit skewed, but this car handles better on curvy roads than anything I've driven. Most of Elon Musk's cars before getting involved with Tesla were European sports cars or otherwise performance cars. Making the car well handling was a priority.

My Buick was a Roadmaster with a 5.7L V-8 and a curb weight of 4100 pounds. It still got 25 mpg on the highway.

Bill

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ORIGINAL: bomccarthy

I checked out Car and Driver's story on their annual Lightning Lap at Virginia International Raceway - they included a Tesla Model S P85D. They charged the battery to 100% and ran one lap - the car went into reduced power mode 40 seconds into the lap (which they eventually clocked at 3:17.4) to protect the battery from excessive heat. Apparently, this is normal when performance testing a Tesla. As a result, the Tesla recorded the slowest lap time. From an enthusiast's standpoint, that seems to be the main problem with the current generation of electric cars - they can't sustain spirited driving for very long. In addition, their weight puts them at a disadvantage when compared to internal combustion sporty cars. Even with a low center of gravity, a heavy car does not change direction as easily as a light car and isn't as responsive in corners.

Here is the web article and video of the Tesla lap (check out the other cars tested as well): http://www.caranddriver.com/features/tesla-model-s-p85d-at-lightning-lap-2016-feature

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

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ORIGINAL: geofflambert

I remember back in the '70 I think, in Rantoul, IL (where Chanute AFB was) that an AMC dealer had a buy one Gremlin, get one free sale. I wonder how many Air Force jockeys took that deal.

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ORIGINAL: wdolson

Tesla won't be entering NASCAR any time soon. If you drive over 100 mph for long stretches, a Tesla probably isn't for you, but the only place in the world you can do that legally is the Autobahn in Germany. There are some stretches of interstate in the middle of nowhere you can get away with it, but for the vast majority of people driving the way people drive, you have enough performance for what you want to do. As I said, I drove 80 pretty consistently in northern end of the Sacramento Valley in California and the car didn't have any overheating problems. The entire trip I was on the fast side for most of the traffic on I-5, and there were no limitations on power. On the stretch from Weed to the CA-OR border northbound it was after dark and there were no other cars visible for most of that stretch, I was over 90 for a fair bit of it and didn't slow down going up the Siskuyous to cross the 4000 foot pass at the border.

Ultimately there is no overcoming the momentum created by mass, but having it as low as it is sure helps.

Today's li-ion batteries have a liquid electrolyte, but several different labs are working on solid state batteries which have a dry electrolyte. It was discovered just a few months ago that the material used for disposable contact lens makes a great electrolyte for dry lithium batteries. A dry electrolyte also allows for a solid lithium anode making the energy density 2-3 times what it is now. Solid state batteries are showing promise and will probably be in full production by the middle of the next decade. When that happens, battery packs will be getting smaller and lighter.

Tesla also plans to build a second generation Roadster at some point. It will be a smaller, more nimble car than the current cars.

I would recommend scheduling a test drive just to get a feel for how the Model S handles. I believe you live in Los Angeles area where there are 12 Tesla stores, more than just about anyplace else in the world (the entire Portland area has one on the opposite corner of the metro area from us). When I did the test drive they took me on a short stretch of curvy road where I really threw it into the corners. I was suitably impressed but I'm not a sports car guy either. For a 4 door sedan it's incredibly impressive.

Bill

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ORIGINAL: zuluhour

c'mon man where's the love?

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ORIGINAL: bomccarthy

One day I'll have to check them out.

I watched Youtube episode of Jay Leno's Garage last night on the late Fisker Karma (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7SeaIDDJEdM). That used a 2.3 liter 4 cylinder gasoline engine to charge the battery pack (but not to drive the wheels, as hybrids do). It could go 50 miles on a fully charged battery before the engine kicked in to start charging the battery; the battery could also be charged overnight via a 110v or 220v connection. They began selling them at about $120k, before the company went under due to a disorganized manufacturing structure (manufacturing was subcontracted to unrelated companies who were unreliable). Picture below.

The problem at the moment is actually not sustained high speed but very hard acceleration - I believe that none of the magazines testing the Tesla have been able to conduct more than a single 1/4 mile pass before battery heat intervenes and the car needs to be rested and recharged for at least an hour. I will have to search the web for any written tests on Angeles Crest Highway (for those not familiar with the LA region, this has been one of the favorite spots for car magazines and commercials since the 60s). Accelerating hard out of corners while climbing 5,000 feet over 20 miles would put an electric car to a serious test.

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

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I got up to 101 mph on the highway by accident.

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ORIGINAL: geofflambert

Art by the Rogue-USMC

WITP Admiral's Edition: Ship & Sub Art/Base Unit Art/Map Icon Art

"If destruction be our lot - it will come from within"...Abraham Lincoln

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ORIGINAL: geofflambert

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ORIGINAL: TOMLABEL
Wasn't that car in the movie "TOP SECRET"??

Oh, no wait! That was a Pinto I believe!

TOMLABEL

WitP AE - Test team lead, programmer

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ORIGINAL: Zorch

'Steve McQueen's "Bullitt" Mustang found in Mexico junkyard'

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/steve-mcqueen-bullitt-mustang-mexico-junkyard/

'The iconic Mustang Steve McQueen drove in the 1968 film “Bullitt” has been missing for decades, but it may have been found -- in a junkyard in Mexico.

The car -- a green ‘68 Ford Mustang fastback, one of two used in the film -- went missing shortly after filming and hasn’t been seen in more than 40 years. McQueen had made attempts to find and buy the missing car before his death, but he was unsuccessful.

According to a Southern California body shop owner, the car finally turned up recently in a scrapyard in Mexico’s Baja region.

Ralph Garcia Jr. told the L.A. Times that he regularly turns similar Mustangs into replicas of the “Eleanor” car driven by Nicolas Cage in “Gone in 60 Seconds,” and an associate in Mexico had identified a new potential candidate.

“I was going to turn it into another ‘Eleanor’ car, but my partner Googled the VIN,” Garcia said. “That’s how he found out it was the ‘Bullitt’ car. He said, ‘You can’t touch it!’”

Garcia and his associates are now at work restoring the “Bullitt” Mustang, and he’s already had to turn down offers from private parties for the car. An automotive historian estimated that the vehicle could be worth more than $1 million at auction.'

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ORIGINAL: wdolson

The straw that broke the camel's back for Fiskar was hurricane Sandy. The first shipment for Europe had arrived in the east coast just before the storm hit. All the cars along with a number of other cars destined for Europe were stored in a parking lot in New Jersey and the lot flooded. Some cars caught fire both Fiskars and at least one Prius parked there. Between the flooding and the fires, all the cars were a write off. They had transport insurance, but the policy was too narrow and didn't cover the cars while in storage and the loss bankrupted the company. They were barely holding on before that.