RE: Notes from a Small Island

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/13/2019 5:44:27 PM

Canoerebel

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Erik and I are fine with the House Rules, so far as I know. At least, I am.

I agree with you. House Rules are bad things. Too many unintended consequences, unfunded mandates, devil in the details, slippery slopes, and twilight zones.

(in reply to BillBrown)

Post #: 4231

RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/14/2019 3:39:08 AM

Canoerebel

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8/8/45

Singers: An awesome crossing shock attack, as you might expect. The Allied army of 7k AV, 100% prepped, Army and Corps HQs 100% prepped with top-notch leaders, well-rested, fully supplied, modern equipment, shock attacks. With all those taken into consideration, the adjustment should be something like 5x upwards! Huzzah! Indeed, the adjustment is a factor of 5x....downwards! The adjusted AV is 1,500....against 10k for the Japanese (which is about what I expected). The resulting 1:6 attack doesn't drop 6 forts and does ugly things. The Allies lose 500 squads with 2k disabled (that's just the combat squads). The Japanese lose 100 squads with 400 disabled.

How can 7k AV, with all those terrific multipliers, go from a 5x adjustment upwards to a .25x adjustment upwards?

Yuck. My battered army will take awhile to rest. The air force will continue to do it's work.

I'll post the screenie tomorrow afternoon, after I return from a hike in the mountains. It's late and I'll be arising at 4:30 a.m.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/14/2019 5:48:38 AM

CaptBeefheart

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Ouch on Singers.

I agree with Bill on house rules. If the players are happy, who are we to gripe?

Cheers,
CB

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Post #: 4233

RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/14/2019 8:49:08 AM

Canoerebel

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From where I'm sitting, there doesn't seem to be any angst about anything. Y'all must be seeing some kinda carnage in Erik's AAR. :)

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/14/2019 8:57:27 AM

Canoerebel

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8/8/45

I'm up way too early, preparing to head to the Cohutta Wilderness Area today on a reasonably short 10-mile hike. Having had a good but short night's rest, I'm glad to say that the combat report is...even worse than my initial glance last night. But that was an abbreviated glance, as who wants to spend time at a feature flick in which Phyllis Diller is the leading actress when Ingrid Bergman is on another screen?

Singapore: Yikes, look at the engineers slaughtered! This looked like a pretty good set-up, as best I could tell. But the math eludes me. In a few weeks, I'll bring over some big ships to handle bombardments and such. Eventually, if the war lasts long enough, supply should become an issue for Erik's stout men. It might be two months before I chance another attack.

China/Indochina: Loading of the big army is proceeding well at Haiphong, though it's going to take at least two more days to get everybody aboard and squared away. This army of about 4k AV is bound for China. The difference maker is that it includes a score big AA units. I think that will allow the Allies to proceed with a ground campaign in the open terrain. I think it may be better to go up into the open terrain, not far south of where the Soviets will be in a month, rather than first taking on Shanghai. More progress can be made coordinating with the Soviets up where enemy fortifications might not be quite so impressive.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/14/2019 11:34:00 AM

HansBolter

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I had similar results at Singapore in my game.

It made me wonder if a better approach might be to cross with half the force ready, taking the huge hit on a smaller force and crossing later with the other half, that won't be forced into a mandatory shock attack.

This might lead to an even more heavily damaged crossing force, but the follow on forces would be ready sooner for a deliberate attack.
The devastated early crossers, having established the beachhead for the follow on forces, can then be withdrawn across the straits to recover.

After my horrendous crossing I did end up pulling divisions out to facilitate faster recovery.

In this approach the engineers would be held back to cross in the follow up wave, basically writing off any opportunity to reduce forts with the crossing, but saving the engineers for the follow up deliberate attack.

I'm determined to give this approach a try in my next game.

< Message edited by HansBolter -- 6/14/2019 11:38:16 AM >

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/14/2019 1:24:11 PM

BBfanboy

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+1 to Hans' analysis. The follow-on troops for the second crossing need only be delayed by one day in starting their march so they will arrive before the enemy can counterattack the shattered first wave.

Looking at the numbers, you still have a 2:1 advantage in troops and AV after deducting your losses. And a lot of his troops appear to be base forces. I think if you can withdraw the hardest hit units to recover in Johore Bharu you should be ready to go in a month.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/15/2019 12:25:13 AM

Canoerebel

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From my post a ten turns back: 7/30/45

Singapore: Allied units are still arriving in strat mode. The last contingent will arrive in about two or three days. Then comes the decision whether to attack and, if so, whether to commit all troops to the crossing or just a portion (probably 50%).

The only forumite who chimed in was Barb, who kindly recommended an all-out commitment (and I appreciate his good faith effort to be helpful).

Where were you guys when I needed you?

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Post #: 4238

RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/15/2019 1:04:50 AM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

From my post a ten turns back: 7/30/45

Singapore: Allied units are still arriving in strat mode. The last contingent will arrive in about two or three days. Then comes the decision whether to attack and, if so, whether to commit all troops to the crossing or just a portion (probably 50%).

The only forumite who chimed in was Barb, who kindly recommended an all-out commitment (and I appreciate his good faith effort to be helpful).

Where were you guys when I needed you?

I was considering chiming in but never having actually done the crossing I felt I didn't have the tested goods to offer.

If it helps, I use the partial landing to put poorly prepped troops on unoccupied islands/atolls so that only a few troops suffer the landing penalty. Once the base has flipped the surf seems to get much gentler! An APD full of combat squads is a good way to do such a landing.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/15/2019 1:10:06 AM

Canoerebel

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That makes sense.

On a separate note, my hiking companion had to change our itinerary today. We diverted to an "up and down section with no steep climbs, totaling 9.5 miles." It was unusually cool for Georgia in June (lows in the high 40s, highs in the 70s up there), so I'm thinking, "Easy." Instead the hike turned into 12.0 miles of constant steep uphills and downhills. I was (and am) utterly gassed. The payoff? Lawn mowing time tomorrow.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/15/2019 9:47:10 PM

Barb

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Yup, I did propose the full size-attack, but you did understate the opposing force as a battered division and couple (2) of Mixed brigades. What can be seen here (although I do not know the strength of the actual units) is more like a Division, 5 Mixed Brigades, 6 Regiments, 7 battalions plus 2 Tank regiments and Tank battalion - or equivalent of 59 infantry and 5 tank battalions. And that is roughly 6 Divisions of infantry (although light on artillery).

And btw... did you focus your bombers on ground attack on the turn of the crossing? Or were the ground units undisrupted?

Eventually your Artillery will take the effect...

< Message edited by Barb -- 6/15/2019 9:51:21 PM >

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/15/2019 9:55:13 PM

Canoerebel

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Barb, I wasn't complaining and hope I didn't come across that way. I tried to emphasize that I appreciated your help.

I did note that the enemy garrison included a division and a battered divisions plus mixed brigades etc. I knew exactly what was there and exactly what I had, though I didn't state with specificity. I didn't think that was necessary for general advice about how to approach Singers.

My bombers have been concentrated on Singers for more than a month without facing opposition. Their divided roughly in half - airfield (to hit supply points) and ground troops. They bombings on the day of the attack seemed somewhat productive and helpful in causing some disruption.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/16/2019 12:19:34 AM

Capt. Harlock

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

From my post a ten turns back: 7/30/45

Singapore: Allied units are still arriving in strat mode. The last contingent will arrive in about two or three days. Then comes the decision whether to attack and, if so, whether to commit all troops to the crossing or just a portion (probably 50%).

The only forumite who chimed in was Barb, who kindly recommended an all-out commitment (and I appreciate his good faith effort to be helpful).

Where were you guys when I needed you?

Reading both AAR's and therefore forbidden to comment.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/16/2019 10:10:33 AM

HansBolter

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Sorry I wasn't more timely with my anecdotal evidence and recommendation. Sometimes I'm just not paying attention closely enough.

I also combined a massive paratroop drop of every British and Commonwealth para unit with my Singapore crossing. Mostly because I had never done a massive drop in game and wanted to see the effect.

It was an bloody disaster. The British para arm was gutted for the remainder of the war. I guess when you don't succeed in taking the base on the initial assault paratroops take a huge hit.

They haven't had the replacements to replenish the units. Thankfully, the 1st Para Division arrived full strength from Europe and will likely be used on Hokkaido as I started a Kuriles campaign with the late arriving European transfers coming in at Vancouver. Any losses it takes will not get replenished.

Thought long about how to improve on my dismal performance at Singers and finally came up with the idea of a basically sacrificial force establishing a beachhead for a stronger follow on force.

Whatever you do, don't include a paratroop drop!

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/16/2019 3:40:57 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter

Sorry I wasn't more timely with my anecdotal evidence and recommendation. Sometimes I'm just not paying attention closely enough.

I also combined a massive paratroop drop of every British and Commonwealth para unit with my Singapore crossing. Mostly because I had never done a massive drop in game and wanted to see the effect.

It was an bloody disaster. The British para arm was gutted for the remainder of the war. I guess when you don't succeed in taking the base on the initial assault paratroops take a huge hit.

They haven't had the replacements to replenish the units. Thankfully, the 1st Para Division arrived full strength from Europe and will likely be used on Hokkaido as I started a Kuriles campaign with the late arriving European transfers coming in at Vancouver. Any losses it takes will not get replenished.

Thought long about how to improve on my dismal performance at Singers and finally came up with the idea of a basically sacrificial force establishing a beachhead for a stronger follow on force.

Whatever you do, don't include a paratroop drop!

Just one other thing - the follow-on force (IIUC) can only be up to 30% of the AV of the force that is across (I presume the remaining AV of the first group) or it will shock attack too. So the follow on troops need to be spread out a bit but can increase in size as the AV on the Singapore side accumulates.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 12:36:15 PM

Barb

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Canoerebel, yup not taken as complaining, I would probably do the same being in your shoes, with similar results

Anyway, the worst is behind you here, so it can only get better with time

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 4:05:33 PM

Canoerebel

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8/9/45 to 8/12/45

DEI & Singapore: An enemy carrier force was sighted in the DEI some weeks back, with rather sketchy info at the time. More info today - this force is strong enough to handle Allied shipping in the Timor Sea, so I'll have to be careful as long as this KB is down here.

Over at Singers, the Allies are well into the recover stages from the bloody shock attack. Lots of good troops are inbound - some at Madras and some from Aden. When they arrive in about 3-4 weeks, the Allied army should be able to try the second attack.

Erik's army is sparse down here, but his carriers and air power are sufficient to keep the Allies cautious for now. I'd rather devote the bulk of my offensive power to the East China Sea region for now. Eventually the Allies will move in force to take the high-value bases in the DEI. Until then, small ops involving paratroops or fast transport will be relied on to take vacant bases.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 4:16:18 PM

Canoerebel

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8/12/45

Death Star & China: DS & The Herd (carrying a large army) are inbound to China from Haiphong.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 4:29:52 PM

Canoerebel

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8/9/45 to 8/12/45

Russia: For the most part, Erik has been laying low in Russia, knowing that it take time for the Russians to advance far enough to threaten important territory. Now the Russians are nearing those points in several locations, and I'm beginning to see movement dots, aircraft concentrations, etc. Erik will strike soon. When the Russians take a decent airfield in the "heart of things," they'll "cede it" to the Western Allies (paying the PP to swap HQ assignments) so that Western fighters and bombers can lend a hand. I think all of this is par for the course when Russia activates, but having Sikhalin (and Wakkanai) is a help.

Overall Situation: Allied forces are in position now to squeeze from every direction and the squeezing is underway. I think things are on target to handle things until the end game occurs. Erik will delay things by selectively striking.

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< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 6/17/2019 4:43:34 PM >

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 4:35:57 PM

Canoerebel

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8/9/12 to 8/12/12

Tokyo: The first atomic bomb attack is scheduled for Tokyo tomorrow. Weather over the target and the originating base, Shikuka, forecast as partly cloudy.

The squadron will come in at 30k, set to hit Manpower. I don't think atomic bombs affect airfields or ports, but I sure wish it would whack the fighters concentrated at this base.

The Allies lead at the moment, 92,324 to 83,250.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 4:51:58 PM

HansBolter

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If the unoccupied bases in the PI you are scooping up with paratroopers are coastal bases they don't need an airfield to be able to pick the troops up if you use flying boats.

Coronados and Mariners are great for this.

Been using this technique to flip even dot base hexes.

< Message edited by HansBolter -- 6/17/2019 4:56:49 PM >

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 4:57:27 PM

Canoerebel

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All my patrol squadrons are occupied with patrolling. That's a much higher priority - trying to keep track of everything. I've used and abused my patrols and recon (especially the latter), but I have plenty of transport aircraft. :)

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 7:51:17 PM

HansBolter

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I guess we fundamentally disagree on what constitutes a patrol aircraft.

I just don't view the Coronados and Mariners as patrol planes.

I look at their huge capacities and see nothing but a transport plane and am loathe to 'waste' that capacity flying patrol.

Might also have a bit to do with the fact that I have far less territory to cover with patrol planes than you.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/17/2019 8:15:09 PM

T Rav

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"Oh No! There goes Tokyo, Oh No, Godzilla!" (Blue Oyster Cult) Or A-bombs. Whatever works best.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/18/2019 11:50:06 AM

WingCmdr

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King of the Monsters

"Oh no, There goes TOE K O.."

Godzilla

Long Islands First Famous Rock and Roll Band.
(Sorry, but Twisted Sister was next after Eddie Money)

As Long as this is relevant to the discussion below. This is how much of the world views nuclear weapons.

(The second bomb shows how scared the Military and Civilian Leadership was of the Kamikaze.
They didn't bomb a military target, again) (That's why the world is scared of us, not N. Korea, those crazy americans)

Then I thought about this. After what happened in China and Manchukuo THEY DESERVED IT!! Same with the Germans!

Enola Gay

Enola Gay
Orchestral Manoeuvres in the Dark

Enola Gay, you should have stayed at home yesterday
We got your message on the radio, conditions normal and you're coming home
These games you play, they're gonna end in more than tears someday
Uh huh Enola Gay, it shouldn't ever have to end this way

It's 8:15, that's the time that it's always been
We got your message on the radio, conditions normal and you're coming home

Enola Gay, is mother proud of little boy today
Uh huh, this kiss you give, it's never ever gonna fade away

Enola Gay, you should have stayed at home yesterday
We got your message on the radio, conditions normal and you're coming home
These games you play, they're gonna end in more than tears someday
Uh huh Enola Gay, it shouldn't ever have to end this way

It's 8:15, that's the time that it's always been
Uh huh, this kiss you give, it's never ever gonna fade away

Songwriters: Andrew McCluskey

Enola Gay lyrics � EMI Music Publishing, BMG Rights Management

< Message edited by WingCmdr -- 6/19/2019 2:50:08 PM >

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/18/2019 2:55:41 PM

Bif1961

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Tokyo was the 3rd city targted for an A-Bomb, fortunately the Emperor threw in the towel.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/18/2019 5:43:28 PM

Canoerebel

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The atomic bomb is the only aspect of the game that sometimes makes me sit up and think, "Real war - terrible."

There's some illogic in that. Logically, I understand that the firebombing of Tokyo in July 1945 resulted in approximately half the number of deaths (80,000 to 130,000) that the two a-bombs caused. In other words the atomic bomb, measured purely by numbers, wasn't any more lethal to the Japanese than were the great incendiary raids. I don't think it makes much of a difference to the dead whether they died one way or another.

In the early 1980s, when I was at the University of Georgia, a few student protestors would mark the anniversary of Hiroshima and Nagasaki by laying on a busy campus road and outlining their bodies with chalk to commemorate those who had died. I wondered why they didn't do the same for the incendiary raids or, for that matter, Pearl Harbor. It took me a long time to realize they weren't really stirred by the past but rather by the future.

Looking ahead, the atomic bomb is a different animal because it inflicts casualties so efficiently - not nearly as many assets risked for the same or perhaps a much great rate of return. There is reason to behold the a-bomb with particular awe and fear.

The use of the bomb made sense to end the war as quickly as possible at the lowest cost to the Allies as possible. It also instilled an awe and fear in humanity that seriously decreased the possibility of it being used in the years and decades that followed.

Those are the kinds of thoughts I mulled over as I issued the orders to the use the bomb. It's just a game but it makes me (us) think. We learn - geography, logistics, combined use of arms, and that it usually takes a long time to end a war that begins abruptly.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/18/2019 6:56:39 PM

T Rav

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I read your stuff, for a variety of reasons. Not the least of which is your humanity. Thank you.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/18/2019 6:57:57 PM

T Rav

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The Godzilla quote was inappropriate on my part.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/18/2019 7:02:00 PM

Canoerebel

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No, no! Your Godzilla quote was perfectly fine. This is a game that we enjoy, partly for the challenge, partly for the community, and partly to reflect on something we all hold dearly. None of us forgets, even as we play and enjoy and interact and laugh, that there was a cost involved in the war. In a way, our enjoyment of the game is a tribute to the those who served.

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