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RE: Notes from a Small Island

 
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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 6:03:20 AM   
adarbrauner

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've been reading an old book on Trees of America, published by the American Forestry Society a long time ago. I enjoy the descriptions of trees, the information about uses of the wood and how much a cubic foot weighs air-dried (live oak, our heaviest wood, is nearly double the weight of spruce and basswood and others). Another thing I enjoy about the book is that the photos seem to have been taken from the '30s to perhaps the '50s - the trees are the focal point but it's interesting to see fences and buildings and farm fields and wide open spaces....and no cell phone towers or wind turbines or McDonalds (stuff like that was present, but not like today).

Another thing I've enjoyed is refreshing my memory about the botanical (scientific) names of trees. So many of them are beautiful: Thuja occidentalis (northern white cedar); Chamaecyparis thyoides (Atlantic white cedar), Diospyros virginiana (persimmon), Liquidambar styraciflua (sweetgum), Lireodendron tulipifera (yellow poplar) and a host of others. There's poetry in the botanical names of trees.


The genus name of the apple is Malus, as Lokasenna is referring to. Apples, pear, plum, rose, hawthorne, prune, blackberry and a zillion other fruiting plants are in the Roseacea (rose) plant family.

I enjoy knowing that, so sitting around reading an old book by the American Forestry Society is time well spent.

Especially when there aren't any Braves games on the radio!



<3

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Post #: 1261
RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 3:46:56 PM   
AcePylut


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BANZAI!!


Oh wait, wrong thread, wrong opponent :)

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 4:52:24 PM   
crsutton


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've been reading an old book on Trees of America, published by the American Forestry Society a long time ago. I enjoy the descriptions of trees, the information about uses of the wood and how much a cubic foot weighs air-dried (live oak, our heaviest wood, is nearly double the weight of spruce and basswood and others). Another thing I enjoy about the book is that the photos seem to have been taken from the '30s to perhaps the '50s - the trees are the focal point but it's interesting to see fences and buildings and farm fields and wide open spaces....and no cell phone towers or wind turbines or McDonalds (stuff like that was present, but not like today).

Another thing I've enjoyed is refreshing my memory about the botanical (scientific) names of trees. So many of them are beautiful: Thuja occidentalis (northern white cedar); Chamaecyparis thyoides (Atlantic white cedar), Diospyros virginiana (persimmon), Liquidambar styraciflua (sweetgum), Lireodendron tulipifera (yellow poplar) and a host of others. There's poetry in the botanical names of trees.


The genus name of the apple is Malus, as Lokasenna is referring to. Apples, pear, plum, rose, hawthorne, prune, blackberry and a zillion other fruiting plants are in the Roseacea (rose) plant family.

I enjoy knowing that, so sitting around reading an old book by the American Forestry Society is time well spent.

Especially when there aren't any Braves games on the radio!



I read the excellent "Six Frigates" last year. One thing I did not know was that the first American frigates were framed with live oak and this is what gave them their amazing resistance to damage-not the white oak planking. So Old Ironsides should have been called Old Ironframe. However, that just does not sound too good. The British has no access to wood like the live Oak. It really gave the American ships a huge tactical edge.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 4:56:41 PM   
Canoerebel


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The joints in some wooden warships were also made from live oak. The joints were cut whole from the massive "knees" where roots joined trunk, so the angles were "real" rather than "cut." The joints were thus much stronger.

Recognizing the importance of live oak to the Navy, the US government first bought about 300 acres of live oak stands in the southeast in the late 1790s. I think alot more acreage was added later.

On a related note, when I worked in the timber industry in the early 1980s, some of the old timers were still telling stories of government purchasing agents meeting with farmers to buy black walnut timber, used in airplane propellers. Even at the time, I thought that was a remarkable step into the past. Now it seems like lore from some vanished civilization.


< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 5/31/2018 4:57:33 PM >

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 1264
RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 5:36:05 PM   
HansBolter


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quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've been reading an old book on Trees of America, published by the American Forestry Society a long time ago. I enjoy the descriptions of trees, the information about uses of the wood and how much a cubic foot weighs air-dried (live oak, our heaviest wood, is nearly double the weight of spruce and basswood and others). Another thing I enjoy about the book is that the photos seem to have been taken from the '30s to perhaps the '50s - the trees are the focal point but it's interesting to see fences and buildings and farm fields and wide open spaces....and no cell phone towers or wind turbines or McDonalds (stuff like that was present, but not like today).

Another thing I've enjoyed is refreshing my memory about the botanical (scientific) names of trees. So many of them are beautiful: Thuja occidentalis (northern white cedar); Chamaecyparis thyoides (Atlantic white cedar), Diospyros virginiana (persimmon), Liquidambar styraciflua (sweetgum), Lireodendron tulipifera (yellow poplar) and a host of others. There's poetry in the botanical names of trees.


The genus name of the apple is Malus, as Lokasenna is referring to. Apples, pear, plum, rose, hawthorne, prune, blackberry and a zillion other fruiting plants are in the Roseacea (rose) plant family.

I enjoy knowing that, so sitting around reading an old book by the American Forestry Society is time well spent.

Especially when there aren't any Braves games on the radio!



I read the excellent "Six Frigates" last year. One thing I did not know was that the first American frigates were framed with live oak and this is what gave them their amazing resistance to damage-not the white oak planking. So Old Ironsides should have been called Old Ironframe. However, that just does not sound too good. The British has no access to wood like the live Oak. It really gave the American ships a huge tactical edge.



Weren't the hulls also double walled with an airspace? Seem to recall that description from Master and Commander as the French frigate he was fighting had been purchased from the US and one of his deck hands had seen one the type under construction.


yea, yea....I recognize the danger of relying on movie quotes for historical accuracy....

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Post #: 1265
RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 5:43:01 PM   
BBfanboy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: HansBolter


quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton


quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I've been reading an old book on Trees of America, published by the American Forestry Society a long time ago. I enjoy the descriptions of trees, the information about uses of the wood and how much a cubic foot weighs air-dried (live oak, our heaviest wood, is nearly double the weight of spruce and basswood and others). Another thing I enjoy about the book is that the photos seem to have been taken from the '30s to perhaps the '50s - the trees are the focal point but it's interesting to see fences and buildings and farm fields and wide open spaces....and no cell phone towers or wind turbines or McDonalds (stuff like that was present, but not like today).

Another thing I've enjoyed is refreshing my memory about the botanical (scientific) names of trees. So many of them are beautiful: Thuja occidentalis (northern white cedar); Chamaecyparis thyoides (Atlantic white cedar), Diospyros virginiana (persimmon), Liquidambar styraciflua (sweetgum), Lireodendron tulipifera (yellow poplar) and a host of others. There's poetry in the botanical names of trees.


The genus name of the apple is Malus, as Lokasenna is referring to. Apples, pear, plum, rose, hawthorne, prune, blackberry and a zillion other fruiting plants are in the Roseacea (rose) plant family.

I enjoy knowing that, so sitting around reading an old book by the American Forestry Society is time well spent.

Especially when there aren't any Braves games on the radio!



I read the excellent "Six Frigates" last year. One thing I did not know was that the first American frigates were framed with live oak and this is what gave them their amazing resistance to damage-not the white oak planking. So Old Ironsides should have been called Old Ironframe. However, that just does not sound too good. The British has no access to wood like the live Oak. It really gave the American ships a huge tactical edge.



Weren't the hulls also double walled with an airspace? Seem to recall that description from Master and Commander as the French frigate he was fighting had been purchased from the US and one of his deck hands had seen one the type under construction.


yea, yea....I recognize the danger of relying on movie quotes for historical accuracy....

Saw a TV show where they test militaria. In that one they built replicas of the wall of a standard British warship and one replicating the US frigate design (which was indeed multi-layered and may have included live oak walls near the waterline). They proceeded to fire a cannon at both replica walls. The shot punched through the British wall sending large numbers of wood splinters from the back as it passed through. The shot that hit the American design cracked the outer wood but could not punch through.

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Post #: 1266
RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 6:06:26 PM   
Lokasenna


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

The joints in some wooden warships were also made from live oak. The joints were cut whole from the massive "knees" where roots joined trunk, so the angles were "real" rather than "cut." The joints were thus much stronger.

Recognizing the importance of live oak to the Navy, the US government first bought about 300 acres of live oak stands in the southeast in the late 1790s. I think alot more acreage was added later.

On a related note, when I worked in the timber industry in the early 1980s, some of the old timers were still telling stories of government purchasing agents meeting with farmers to buy black walnut timber, used in airplane propellers. Even at the time, I thought that was a remarkable step into the past. Now it seems like lore from some vanished civilization.



Ah, I'll have something to do with my walnut tree that's currently in decline, then. I've already been talking about arranging to get it turned into lumber.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 6:10:10 PM   
Canoerebel


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In forestry school circa 1982, I remember a professor telling us that a single black walnut in Illinois had sold for something like $20,000! Probably that would've been in the '70s. Black walnut was (and is) prized for gunstocks, fine cabinetry, etc.

Black walnut has a very sharp-smelling odor from a chemical compound - as a result, tomatoes and oaks will not grow beneath a black walnut (probably plenty of other things won't, either).

The botanical name of black walnut: Juglans nigra. The genus Juglans is in the family Juglandacea. That family includes the hickories (genus Carya) and pecan (also Carya).

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 5/31/2018 7:02:48 PM   
Canoerebel


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I did a quick internet search, trying to verify that a black walnut sold for about $20,000, circa '70s. I came across this info on a website, making in seem plausible. If premium black walnuts are selling for that amount today, I suppose it's possible that a superior specimen might have done so in the '70s.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 12:31:45 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Erik positions I-38 in the hex Death Star is heading to. A small TF of Dutch DDs, fresh in from Shikuka, tangles with the sub, scoring one hit.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 12:37:29 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Erik continues giving attention to Allied subs off Hokkaido. Three E-class have been sunk, including this one, while one sub has been sunk.

I continue to wonder if this new interest is indicative of something more than "general warfare."




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 12:46:33 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: The Empties Herd breaks from Death Star and begins the long journey home.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 12:51:45 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: All available Allied LBA bombers target Ketoi, both airfield and ground troops. Damage isn't remarkable but is decent. Ketoi isn't going to be a coup-de-main battle. More like Iwo or Okinawa, I think.

I'm glad to see carrier fighters providing LRCAP, as ordered. This is partly to interdict enemy air transport missions. That's any iffy undertaking. Any suggestions from Ye Experts?



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< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 6/1/2018 12:52:46 AM >

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 12:55:32 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Strike vs. LST riff-raff at Uruppu. A second strike a bit later finishes off more of them.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:01:40 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Allied fighters intercept enemy transports over Ketoi. Well, that's good.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:05:32 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

10/16/44: Opening Allied bombardment. The results are rather encouraging. Usually, bombardments focus on the support units (engineers) before "getting through" to the infantry.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:11:50 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Bombardment results inconclusive.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:21:28 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Well I'll be dogged. Enemy carriers in the Pacific, after all.

Should I send Death Star to protect the Empties Herd? Would Erik even take a chance that I'd so so?

Maybe, after all, had DS continued SW today, we'd have had a carrier clash.

Or was he trying to provoke a reaction?

Too many possibilties. Too many permutations.

I have a headache.





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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:23:33 AM   
Lokasenna


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I looked up black walnuts vs. other types, as I didn't think mine was a black walnut (for starters, it's not a very large tree - 50 feet at most).

Yep, it's a butternut. Softer wood but still desirable for home goods applications. Not that I want the tree to go, but when it does I hope I'm able to get a ton of wood out of it. Maybe I'll redo the door and window casings in my house with some of it, or something of that sort.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:27:18 AM   
Canoerebel


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If memory serves, butternut is where southerners got the die used for many Confederate uniforms, especially in the western armies. That's the origin of the nickname "Butternuts" applied to Confederates, the equivalent of "Bluebellies" for the Yankees.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 1:55:56 AM   
Canoerebel


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There is no earthly way Erik would send a carrier force after my empties, right? with Death Star right there on the periphery, able to easily place itself between KB and The Herd, he'd be crazy. I'm nearly certain I can count on him not being crazy. But the possiblity that he would be willing to take a crazy gamble can't be entirely discounted.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 2:44:05 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Modest 1:1 losses in the air today. The Mavis transports intercepted at Ketoi are the most significant casualty.




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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 3:04:56 AM   
Canoerebel


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Like the Grinch, I'm "puzzling and puzzling, until my puzzler was sore."

I do not have a solid hunch about what Erik's doing with KB. I can come up with plausible scenarios, but each one of them has weaknesses. The one that doesn't is that he was intentionally seeking a carrier battle, through reaction. But the flaws with that theory is he'd be pretty crazy to go up against full Death Star (wouldn't he?). Besides that, if his plan was to provoke a rection and battle, I'd have expected him to load up his airfields so that he bombers could hit Allies landing at Ketoi while DS was far away. So no theory is sensible. Except the right one, whatever that is.

But my spidey senses were right. I was connecting the dots right. Erik did send a carrier or carriers into the Pacific.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 3:42:22 AM   
Canoerebel


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10/16/44

Ketoi: Taking a chance tomorrow, though I don't think it's a big one.

The opening deliberate attack will take place at Ketoi. It's critical to open the day with strong bombardments. In order to riks the big ships, DS needs to remain on station here rather than sprinting south to protect the herd of empties.

So the herd will scatter and sprint and hope that I'm right in my deductions.





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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 3:48:28 AM   
BBfanboy


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That CV TF is only 8 hexes from Kushiro. Makes me think he is trying to lure you into a KB/LBA trap.

Either that or he is going hunting for your carriers that initially supported the Marcus raid.

EDIT to add: Third notion - I don't see many of his subs up around the Kuriles any more. Perhaps he moved them down between DS and his CV TF to get away from most of your ASW while being in position to hit DS if it reacts?

< Message edited by BBfanboy -- 6/1/2018 3:53:13 AM >


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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 4:07:32 AM   
Canoerebel


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Could be. Perhaps he has his main carrier force midway between that one carrier and Kurshiro. Then he could uber CAP that one carrier from KB, while KB drew LRCAP from land. Or something like that?


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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 6:18:31 AM   
palioboy2

 

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Or he has a bead on the empties leaving and plans on paralleling their course. If I was him I would move my CVs in a direction that would leave them within striking distance of the transports but out of range of a DS dash. This would effectively fork you. You would have to decide to either

A) flank south with DS through waters that possibly have enemy subs. And end the turn protecting the herd but not within range to attack KB. This would leave your heavy bombardments exposed and would delay attacks while he flies in troops.

B) turn the herd around so everything is protected by slows your operational pace by trapping he empties inside the Kuriles.

C) Leave DS to protect the bombardment forces but expose the herd. Which will eventually move out of range of a DS Sprint and allow him to attack.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 6:28:50 AM   
Barb


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Or the TF you have detected could be the same ASW TF your subs are tangling with. And the CV reported is just a fog of war report on an E.

But if you think there are carriers - you should postpone your Ketoi-jima bombardment for a turn while sending Death Star to the South-East for 4-8 hexes for a turn to get your merchants another day - or to interpose it between Kido Butai and your merchants. If the threat fails to materialize, you can just simply move back to Ketoi-jima next turn with your herd safe. Even if his TF sprints at full speed directly east, it will probably end up somewhere around your Death Star - away from his bases. But do not leave any meaningful ships around Ketoi-jima - either send them to Shikuka or take them with Death Star.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 11:16:27 AM   
zuluhour


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reading both sides, love the epic struggle here.

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RE: Notes from a Small Island - 6/1/2018 11:20:26 AM   
HansBolter


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

10/16/44

Ketoi: Bombardment results inconclusive.






What is the stacking limit and how over stacked are you?

I'm not looking to criticize the over stack as you know I am a proponent of temporary over stacking fro the task of taking an objective.

I've learned that when heavily over stacked and in need of rest it is best to rest without bombarding.

Yes, it gives your opponent a rest as well from morale and disruption that daily bombardments serve to keep high, but when heavily over stacked, even with significant advantage in number of guns you will find yourself on eth losing end of the bombardments.

This is one of the downsides to heavy over stacking. Troops really packed in take heavy casualties under bombardment.

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