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RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/12/2018 5:24:15 PM   
Navaronegun


Posts: 26
Joined: 1/4/2005
Status: offline 		pzgndr, one more Variant tweak/fix I'd recommend is to the German Airborne expansion capability. Currently, the unit is granted, but I'd recommend that the force limit be increased to 3 Corps as well. I only discovered it after building Airborne to the Maximum after the Variant fired. I had three, but when one was eliminated, it couldn't be rebuilt. I am playing Panzeh (who made the Cyprus suggestion) in a seemingly endless loop of Mirror games PvP.

By the way, the Variants you are using from the original A3R are fantastic and really make this Mod not only a delight but endlessly replayable.

By the way, we think very hghly of your mod at Quarter to Three. See various threads at Forum dot QuartertoThree dot com

Thanks for the Game!!!





< Message edited by Navaronegun -- 8/12/2018 6:00:31 PM >

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 31
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/12/2018 6:40:53 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Navaronegun
pzgndr, one more Variant tweak/fix I'd recommend is to the German Airborne expansion capability. Currently, the unit is granted, but I'd recommend that the force limit be increased to 3 Corps as well. I only discovered it after building Airborne to the Maximum after the Variant fired. I had three, but when one was eliminated, it couldn't be rebuilt. I am playing Panzeh (who made the Cyprus suggestion) in a seemingly endless loop of Mirror games PvP.


The problem with doing that is that it makes the additional variant units standard; i.e., anybody could build extra. In a couple of cases I did use extra unit slots for variant units, such as the additional 2 US fleets from the Pacific. But in general the freebie units are only good until destroyed and then you're back to the standard build limits. Probably best to keep it that way.

(in reply to Navaronegun)
Post #: 32
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/12/2018 6:44:48 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: sPzAbt653
I suggest you be given the first 'SC3 Excellence in Mod Design' award!


Thanks Steve! This has been a work-in-progress for over 10 years with a lot of changes and adjustments along the way as SC has evolved. It's been fun!

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 33
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/12/2018 7:48:38 PM   
Navaronegun


Posts: 26
Joined: 1/4/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pzgndr

The problem with doing that is that it makes the additional variant units standard; i.e., anybody could build extra. In a couple of cases I did use extra unit slots for variant units, such as the additional 2 US fleets from the Pacific. But in general the freebie units are only good until destroyed and then you're back to the standard build limits. Probably best to keep it that way.



So there is no way to add the unit and add-to the Force Pool in a script. Got it. Fantastic mod.


< Message edited by Navaronegun -- 8/12/2018 7:49:17 PM >

_____________________________

You people are telling me what you think I want to know. I want to know what is actually happening.
General Creighton Abrams

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 34
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/14/2018 3:09:40 AM   
Navaronegun


Posts: 26
Joined: 1/4/2005
Status: offline 		When do you approximate release of v1.2, pzgndr?

_____________________________

You people are telling me what you think I want to know. I want to know what is actually happening.
General Creighton Abrams

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 35
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/14/2018 1:18:44 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Navaronegun
When do you approximate release of v1.2, pzgndr?


Well, I was thinking about wrapping it up in a couple of weeks. But you and panzeh have given me some good feedback, and I'm going to make some additional adjustments. It will take a bit longer for additional playtesting. So, I don't know, maybe September sometime.

(in reply to Navaronegun)
Post #: 36
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/14/2018 5:11:12 PM   
Navaronegun


Posts: 26
Joined: 1/4/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: pzgndr

Well, I was thinking about wrapping it up in a couple of weeks. But you and panzeh have given me some good feedback, and I'm going to make some additional adjustments. It will take a bit longer for additional playtesting. So, I don't know, maybe September sometime.




OK, sounds good. I'll plan the kickoff of the Quarter to Three Tournament accordingly.


_____________________________

You people are telling me what you think I want to know. I want to know what is actually happening.
General Creighton Abrams

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 37
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 8/25/2018 12:00:09 AM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		FYI. I have gotten to a point where v1.2 is looking pretty good now. I provided a copy to Navaronegun and panzeh for some head-to-head playtesting. I've made a few more AI tweaks and will run another AI-AI playtest tonight.

If anyone would like a copy of the v1.2 beta to playtest over the next couple of weeks, shoot me a PM or email. I'd like to get in a couple of playtest games myself against the AI at veteran (+1) difficulty to see how the AI playbalance looks. Additional feedback and comments from a few others would be helpful before I wrap this up and release v1.2.

Here's the latest VERSION NOTES:
quote:


=================================================================
Advanced Third Reich for Strategic Command WWII: War In Europe, v1.2
=================================================================

DATA CHANGES
- reduced Russia initial mobilization from 30% to 25%
- slightly reduced chances by 5-10% for sandstorms in Africa and Middle East, snow in Europe during winter, and significant reductions in frozen weather (to permit more effective combats)
- doubled initial BRPs to help jumpstart spending options
- made significant revisions to economics to get back to boardgame originals:
-- all industrial areas now 20 BRPs and all oil now 30 BRPs
-- Britain (was getting about 80/turn and should have been getting 125/turn)
- Hamilton added as Canadian industrial area
- one Canadian oil for variant and one for total war increase if London occupied by Axis
-- France (was getting about 70/turn and should have been getting 80/turn)
- changed Sedan to major city (this also helps Germany)
-- United States (production should now approach 400 BRPs by 1944)
- changed Syracuse, Rochester, and Pittsburgh to industrial areas
- deleted Charlotte
- total of seven oil; one increase each year 1940-45, plus one increase upon DOW
-- Russia (production should now approach 180 by 1944)
- changed Yaroslavl, Voronezh, Dnepropetrovsk, and Kuibyshev to minor cities
- total of three oil; two increases in 1941 at war, one in 1942
- three additional oil; two for increase if Leningrad/Moscow occupied by Axis, one for variant
-- Germany
- Ploesti oil increase in 1943 for total war production
- no change to Leuna oil variant, but value is now greater
-- Italy
- no changes
- deleted Palestine and Trans-Jordan as separate minor countries and made whole area Egypt (now all 15 BRPs subject to convoy losses)
- increased Germany max research of Industrial Technology to 2 chits, to allow it to reach level 5
- added strength 5 fleets to the P/Q: Britain, Jan 1940; Italy, May 1940; Germany, July 1940.
- made adjustments to Strategic Warfare to increase economic losses
-- increased U-Boat raid multiplier from 10 to 15
-- increased Strategic Bomber resource attack from 4 to 5
- fixed CTV data for Vichy France armor
- changed air op restrictions for Spain/Turkey/Yugoslavia to Home/Controlled
- changed CTV data for Partisans to allow only soft defense 1
- restricted United States infantry and armor builds until September 1941

SCRIPT CHANGES
- adjusted OFFENSIVE scripts for Germany attacking Yugoslavia and Russia
- adjusted GUARD scripts for Germany garrison of Poland/Eastern Front and British garrison of Palestine/Trans-Jordan
- adjusted GUARD scripts for Italy garrison to include Naples with Rome/Taranto/Messina as default defense
- adjusted GUARD scripts for Germany garrison of Albania and Greece prior to Italy surrender
- adjusted STRENGTH scripts to slightly reduce effects of supply shortages, generally from 2-4 to 1-3
- fixed STRENGTH scripts for Axis AI games for Allied supply shortages, now requiring United States not yet at war
- added STRENGTH scripts for excessive German units (5+) in the Tobruk-Alexandria corridor
- adjusted RESOURCE scripts for Russian BRPs, loss of Smolensk OR Kiev triggers Urals Industry Transfer, failsafe 1943
- adjusted RESOURCE scripts for economics changes discussed above
- adjusted UNIT scripts to change failsafe date of Russian 3-3 infantry to 1942 and Siberian Transfer to 1947
-- changes require loss of Smolensk OR Kiev to trigger 3-3 infantry
-- changes require United States war entry to trigger Siberian Transfer
- adjusted UNIT scripts for arrival of extra fleets (British AI 1942 to 1941, United States AI 1942)
- adjusted UNIT scripts to reduce additional unit variants from 10% to 5%
- added UNIT script for de Gaulle HQ and Free French unit arrivals upon liberation of France
- fixed unit script error for Free French unit in Syria
- fixed CONVOY scripts bug to reduce Lend Lease and Murmansk convoys based on Russian advances
- adjusted CONVOY scripts to reduce convoy seasonal reductions, except for Murmansk Convoys (U-Boats will have to inflict losses)
- adjusted CONVOY scripts to slightly reduce Lend Lease and Murmansk Convoy percentages
- adjusted SURRENDER_2 scripts for Italy surrender, more consistent with A3R rules
-- surrender requires Axis has no units in North Africa and Sicily
-- surrender requires Allies have a unit (single) on mainland Italy in range of Taranto or Rome
- adjusted AMPHIBIOUS and AMPHIBIOUS_MINOR scripts for improved Allied invasions of Sicily and Italy
- added new FREE_UNIT script for Romanian units transferred to Russian control (75% chance) when Romania surrenders
- adjusted US MOBILIZATION_2 scripts to reduce range from 6 to 5 for Italian fleets approaching Alexandria/Gibraltar
- added SURRENDER_2 scripts for Allied invasion of Vichy Syria and Lebanon o/a 1941/06/08
- PARTISAN scripts should now work with #ADD_UNIT= 2 force pool limits in v1.15
- revised WAR_ENTRY scripts for Iraq, now variable pro-Axis coup (10%) or pro-Allied coup (40%) o/a 1941/04/01
- changed WAR_ENTRY scripts to MOBILIZATION_3 scripts for pro-Allied events for Axis-aligned minors
-- pro-Allied coups for Spain, Sweden, and Yugoslavia
-- Free French variant activations for Algeria, Morocco, Syria, and Tunisia


UPDATE. Results of my overnight AI-AI playtest:
- France surrenders Aug 40
- Pro-Allied coup Yugoslavia Mar 41 (Axis AI took until Aug 41 to conquer, made some script adjustments)
- Pro-Axis coup Iraq Mar 41 (Allied AI took until Sep 42 to conquer, see Syria variant below)
- Germany DOW Russia Sept 41 (due to Yugoslavia delays)
- VARIANTS Vichy France and Vichy Syria join Axis Sept 41
- US enters Jan 42
- Urals Industry event Oct 42
- Allies invade Syria Aug 42 (unintended since Syria already active, made script adjustments)
- Italy surrenders Oct 43
- Convoy reduction event Feb 44 (Russia retakes Smolensk and Kiev)
- France surrenders Aug 44
- Germany surrenders Apr 45
So, except for a couple of minor issues, this was a very good AI-AI playtest. I will proceed with my Axis and Allied playtests against my nefarious computer opponent and see how it goes. Again, anyone interested in playtesting this v1.2 beta over the next couple of weeks and providing feedback is welcome to have some fun with this. -Bill


< Message edited by pzgndr -- 8/25/2018 2:48:34 PM >

(in reply to Navaronegun)
Post #: 38
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 9/4/2018 2:45:51 PM   
TangSooDo

 

Posts: 54
Joined: 4/1/2008
Status: offline 		I have played v1.2 now. As Axis with AI set on Veteran, all proceeded normally through 1940. I did forget that in Bill's mod you have to actually invade Denmark and Norway, so they fell a little later than normal -- Norway surrendered in September. The British had sent an armored corps to Bergen which advanced on the German forces besieging Oslo, but it quickly retreated once Oslo fell, then due to the Leeb HQ and supply from Oslo, the Germans were able to eliminate it. The conquest of France was achieved at the end of July 1940. The Axis did very well in North Africa, actually occupying Cairo in early 1942, but that was short lived as the AI bolstered the Brits with US forces, presumably by transporting units through the Red Sea and recaptured Cairo. The exhausted Axis was pushed back from there. Barbarossa was launched in May 1941 and at first the advance of Axis forces was swift. However, as soon as winter struck the tide turned, and the Axis never were able to threaten the conquest of Russia after that. By mid-1942 it was clear that Russia would not only survive but push the Axis back fairly quickly. At that point I quit because my purpose was to let Bill know if I thought the AI was too strong, and I do, but maybe not by much. Small tweaks can have big ramifications I think.

(in reply to sPzAbt653)
Post #: 39
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 9/4/2018 5:58:36 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		I also completed a playtest game as Axis, on Veteran +1. I managed to take Moscow and Leningrad in 1941, and in the process discovered the Siberian Transfer script doesn't work if Axis occupies Moscow. Plus I got Better Winter Preparations variant. Those two hurt the Allied AI, so in this case it wasn't strong enough. So I ended up taking Gorki and Stalingrad in 1942, Grozny and Astrahkan in 1943, and then started falling back in 1944. My Med strategy was to defend Libya, and the Allies took it and then took Sicily and got Italy to surrender, but I held Rome. D-Day was OK in 1944 and I held Paris into 1945, then quit the game.

I then completed another playtest game as Allies, on Veteran +1. Axis took Leningrad and we had tough battles into 1942, Axis taking Rostov and Maikop. But Allies were ripping up North Africa by 1942 (Algeria was Free French variant), Italy wiped out in 1943, and Allies launched D-Day in late summer 1943. I didn't bother with 1944. Interesting variant was pro-Allied coup in Sweden, so I used that to send a rebuilt Wavell HQ and a couple corps to invade Trondheim and push south to Bergan and Oslo. Interesting little side campaign!

Perhaps Allies do have a slight edge, or maybe not. Barbarossa is better now in 1941 with Axis able to drive deeper, but Russian Winter and Siberian Transfer seem to be real wildcards to make or break the Axis advance. Very tricky balance! I need to rework the Siberian Transfer event, and perhaps make it easier to trigger for the Allied AI and harder for a human Allied player. I am also inclined to think that the AI really needs to be played on the Expert +2 difficulty level for any serious challenge.

FYI, I now have a couple dozen notes from my two playtest games, plus a couple more comments from others. There are several other playtesters I have not heard from yet. Comments this week would be helpful, as I am about to start making some edits.

(in reply to TangSooDo)
Post #: 40
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 10/12/2018 10:52:16 AM   
Kossatx

 

Posts: 97
Joined: 8/16/2015
From: Spain
Status: offline 		I like your mod very much, the map is great, not as the official with the problem of mercator projection. I have a question, If the spirit of your mod is to simulate the Advanced Third Reich boardgame, why did you have included bomber counters?

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 41
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 10/15/2018 11:47:29 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kossatx
I like your mod very much, the map is great, not as the official with the problem of mercator projection. I have a question, If the spirit of your mod is to simulate the Advanced Third Reich boardgame, why did you have included bomber counters?


Thank you. The map is an adaptation of the World in Flames map scaled to Third Reich, with the idea that the nation borders and terrain features are more accurate. For air units, I did experiment in previous versions with having only generic 5-4 air fleets but found the limited number did not provide the player with sufficient flexibility to break down and perform different missions. It was either very intense air combat or ground support. Just didn't feel right at this scale? Here, players have flexibility.


(in reply to Kossatx)
Post #: 42
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 10/15/2018 11:55:07 PM   
pzgndr

 

Posts: 3170
Joined: 3/18/2004
From: Maryland
Status: offline 		While I'm here, here's an update on v1.2. I have wrapped up my playtesting and sent files to Hubert. Stand by for some news about release. Here's the version notes:

quote:


=================================================================
Advanced Third Reich for Strategic Command WWII: War In Europe, v1.2
=================================================================

DATA CHANGES
- reduced Russia initial mobilization from 30% to 25%
- slightly reduced chances by 5-10% for sandstorms in Africa and Middle East, snow in Europe during winter, and significant reductions in frozen weather (to permit more effective combats)
- doubled initial BRPs to help jumpstart spending options
- made significant revisions to economics to get back to boardgame originals:
-- all industrial areas now 20 BRPs and all oil now 30 BRPs
-- Britain (was getting about 80/turn and should have been getting 125/turn)
- Hamilton added as Canadian industrial area
- one Canadian oil for variant and one for total war increase if London occupied by Axis
-- France (was getting about 70/turn and should have been getting 80/turn)
- changed Sedan to major city (this also helps Germany)
-- United States (production should now approach 400 BRPs by 1944)
- changed Syracuse, Rochester, and Pittsburgh to industrial areas
- deleted Charlotte
- total of seven oil; one increase each year 1940-45, plus one increase upon DOW
-- Russia (production should now approach 180 by 1944)
- changed Yaroslavl, Voronezh, Dnepropetrovsk, and Kuibyshev to minor cities
- total of three oil; two increases in 1941 at war, one in 1942
- three additional oil; two for increase if Leningrad/Moscow occupied by Axis, one for variant
-- Germany
- Ploesti oil increase in 1943 for total war production
- no change to Leuna oil variant, but value is now greater
-- Italy
- no changes
- deleted Palestine and Trans-Jordan as separate minor countries and made whole area Egypt (now all 15 BRPs subject to convoy losses)
- increased Germany max research of Industrial Technology to 2 chits, to allow it to reach level 5
- added strength 5 fleets to the P/Q: Britain, Jan 1940; Italy, May 1940; Germany, July 1940.
- made adjustments to Strategic Warfare to increase economic losses
-- increased U-Boat raid multiplier from 10 to 15
-- increased Strategic Bomber resource attack from 4 to 5
- fixed CTV data for Vichy France armor
- changed air op restrictions for Spain/Turkey/Yugoslavia to Home/Controlled
- changed CTV data for Partisans to allow only soft defense 1
- restricted United States infantry and armor builds until September 1941
- added jet_interceptor custom sound for anti_air_attack Interceptors
- reduced Rockets attack/defense values except for strategic attack and soft defense

SCRIPT CHANGES
- adjusted OFFENSIVE scripts for Germany attacking Yugoslavia and Russia
- adjusted GUARD scripts for Germany garrison of Poland/Eastern Front and British garrison of Palestine/Trans-Jordan
- adjusted GUARD scripts for Italy garrison to include Naples with Rome/Taranto/Messina as default defense
- adjusted GUARD scripts for Germany garrison of Albania and Greece prior to Italy surrender
- adjusted STRENGTH scripts to slightly reduce effects of supply shortages, generally from 2-4 to 1-3
- fixed STRENGTH scripts for Axis AI games for Allied supply shortages, now requiring United States not yet at war
- added STRENGTH scripts for excessive German units (5+) in the Tobruk-Alexandria corridor
- adjusted RESOURCE scripts for Russian BRPs, loss of Smolensk OR Kiev triggers Urals Industry Transfer, failsafe 1943
- adjusted RESOURCE scripts for economics changes discussed above
- adjusted UNIT scripts to change failsafe date of Russian 3-3 infantry to 1942 and Siberian Transfer to 1947
-- changes require loss of Smolensk OR Kiev to trigger 3-3 infantry
-- changes require United States war entry to trigger Siberian Transfer
- adjusted UNIT scripts for arrival of extra fleets (British AI 1942 to 1941, United States AI 1942)
- adjusted UNIT scripts to reduce additional unit variants from 10% to 5%
- added UNIT script for de Gaulle HQ and Free French unit arrivals upon liberation of France
- fixed unit script error for Free French unit in Syria
- fixed CONVOY scripts bug to reduce Lend Lease and Murmansk convoys based on Russian advances
- adjusted CONVOY scripts to reduce convoy seasonal reductions, except for Murmansk Convoys (U-Boats will have to inflict losses)
- adjusted CONVOY scripts to slightly reduce Lend Lease and Murmansk Convoy percentages
- adjusted SURRENDER_2 scripts for Italy surrender, more consistent with A3R rules
-- surrender requires Axis has no units in North Africa and Sicily
-- surrender requires Allies have a unit (single) on mainland Italy in range of Taranto or Rome
- adjusted AMPHIBIOUS and AMPHIBIOUS_MINOR scripts for improved Allied invasions of Sicily and Italy
- added new FREE_UNIT script for Romanian units transferred to Russian control (75% chance) when Romania surrenders
- adjusted US MOBILIZATION_2 scripts to reduce range from 6 to 5 for Italian fleets approaching Alexandria/Gibraltar
- added SURRENDER_2 scripts for Allied invasion of Vichy Syria and Lebanon around 1941/06/08
- PARTISAN scripts should now work with #ADD_UNIT= 2 force pool limits in v1.15
- revised WAR_ENTRY scripts for Iraq, now variable pro-Axis coup (10%) or pro-Allied coup (40%) o/a 1941/04/01
- changed WAR_ENTRY scripts to MOBILIZATION_3 scripts for pro-Allied events for Axis-aligned minors
-- pro-Allied coups for Spain, Sweden, and Yugoslavia
-- Free French variant activations for Algeria, Morocco, Syria, and Tunisia


Personally, while I recommend playing the AI at least at the Veteran +1 difficulty level, I found that I need the Expert +2 level for a decent challenge. +2 Unit Experience is sometimes pretty tough to beat, though. Hubert's fuzzy logic generic AI is really very good, but it does have its weaknesses so players need to give it some extra help. I will have some more to say about my playtesting observations when we get to release.

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 43
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 10/17/2018 2:13:43 PM   
Kossatx

 

Posts: 97
Joined: 8/16/2015
From: Spain
Status: offline 		Great! Where can we download the v1.2.?

(in reply to pzgndr)
Post #: 44
RE: Advanced Third Reich Mod v1.1 - 10/20/2018 8:14:30 PM   
Batavian

 

Posts: 43
Joined: 7/19/2004
Status: offline 		Thank you for all your hard work Bill.

(in reply to Kossatx)
Post #: 45
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