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September Monthly Report? - 9/13/2018 9:24:44 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

I'm hoping to see the new September Monthly Report soon even if it doesn't have much new to say. You see Shannon, there are those of us who regularly read your monthly reports.

Could you give us some kind of rough idea when you might be able to introduce some new elements to the game? I'm so looking forward to oilers to make the convoy system less frustrating. Just would like some kind of rough idea when we might be able to look forward to those new elements for planning purposes, since we've been waiting 5 years it's not like we'll hold you to a strict schedule.

Post #: 1

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/13/2018 9:44:43 PM

davidachamberlain

Posts: 326
Joined: 1/21/2014
Status: offline

Definitely the latest day of the month I have seen in a couple years.

I suspect that Steve if grinding away to get the Public Beta and Production versions ready to go so that he can get started on his priorities for enhancements on a stable platform.

You might want to visit that priority list on this thread:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=4388273

That should give you a sense on what happens after the Production version is released.

Expect that trying to make the changes and address side effects that break the existing code will happen and will take longer than planned for to address.

Dave

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 2

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/14/2018 4:39:38 AM

Shannon V. OKeets

Posts: 22095
Joined: 5/19/2005
From: Honolulu, Hawaii
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Omnius

I'm hoping to see the new September Monthly Report soon even if it doesn't have much new to say. You see Shannon, there are those of us who regularly read your monthly reports.

Could you give us some kind of rough idea when you might be able to introduce some new elements to the game? I'm so looking forward to oilers to make the convoy system less frustrating. Just would like some kind of rough idea when we might be able to look forward to those new elements for planning purposes, since we've been waiting 5 years it's not like we'll hold you to a strict schedule.

Once NetPlay is off my desk, I want to go through the long list of bug reports I have accumulated and pass judgment on whether they are worth more of my time.

But the missing optional rules and scenarios are next up - as new and exciting adventures in MWIF coding.

_____________________________

Steve

Perfection is an elusive goal.

(in reply to Omnius)

Post #: 3

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/14/2018 7:06:58 AM

Joseignacio

Posts: 2449
Joined: 5/8/2009
From: Madrid, Spain
Status: offline

Yeeeeha!

Finally it comes to what some of us suggested, once solitaire is running NetPlay is the following, If we keep on and on patching any minor new bug in solitaire with the updates, this will have Steven in a loop and there will never be a NetPlay.

Of course, the Production issues and the low speed will need attention, I am not denying that (they are not minor)...

If there is a working version for solitaire, solitaire players should use that one, since it's stable; and when afterwards there is a working NetPlay Steve can see if they need to upgrade and the version be adapted.

Hurrah for you, Steven.

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 4

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/14/2018 8:06:35 PM

Centuur

Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
Status: offline

Well, there are still problems in Netplay. We've again stumbled on issues with naval combat unfortunately. Having said that, netplay in general has improved a lot, but I believe it would really help if a lot of people would start it up playing eachother...

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Peter

(in reply to Joseignacio)

Post #: 5

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/18/2018 3:58:30 PM

Omnius

Posts: 833
Joined: 6/22/2012
From: Salinas, CA
Status: offline

Shannon V. OKeets,
Thanks for the update. I'm sure finding and squashing the remaining bugs in NetPlay and solitaire is still a major hassle that seems to never end. I'm so looking forward to seeing the oilers activated, it's always been my contention since ADG's first computer version of WiF that that will really help us out in our shipping conundrums when we try to switch to a new path for trading oil, like to China from the CW. Thanks for keeping at it!

(in reply to Shannon V. OKeets)

Post #: 6

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/18/2018 6:47:45 PM

davidachamberlain

Posts: 326
Joined: 1/21/2014
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Well, there are still problems in Netplay. We've again stumbled on issues with naval combat unfortunately. Having said that, netplay in general has improved a lot, but I believe it would really help if a lot of people would start it up playing eachother...

Well, there are a few of us out there hammering away.

However, it takes more logistics to get and keep a game going with several players.

Trying to schedule 4 players sharing 2 TeamViewer sessions over an extended period of time (coming on 2 years, now) with about 4 hours per session for about 2 weeks out of 4, it is taking some time - just 3 years into. The war was quicker.

However, we are doing this across 2 countries and 4 locations, so at least we can play. Back when we were all in the same city and single, we were able to get through it faster on the board game.

Dave

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 7

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/18/2018 9:38:42 PM

Centuur

Posts: 8802
Joined: 6/3/2011
From: Hoorn (NED).
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: davidachamberlain

quote:

ORIGINAL: Centuur

Well, there are still problems in Netplay. We've again stumbled on issues with naval combat unfortunately. Having said that, netplay in general has improved a lot, but I believe it would really help if a lot of people would start it up playing eachother...

Well, there are a few of us out there hammering away.

However, it takes more logistics to get and keep a game going with several players.

Trying to schedule 4 players sharing 2 TeamViewer sessions over an extended period of time (coming on 2 years, now) with about 4 hours per session for about 2 weeks out of 4, it is taking some time - just 3 years into. The war was quicker.

However, we are doing this across 2 countries and 4 locations, so at least we can play. Back when we were all in the same city and single, we were able to get through it faster on the board game.

Dave

I know. I just concluded that my first netplay game with Gerry started in march 2017 and is still not proceding due to problems with unlimited breakdown. The second game with Gerry is a lot faster going. We've started in february this year and are currently in M/A 1942. Now that's progress, because we had also some downtime due to bugs. We have 3 hour sessions twice a week if possible. MWIF is slowly improving...

< Message edited by Centuur -- 9/18/2018 9:39:56 PM >

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Peter

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Post #: 8

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/18/2018 10:01:16 PM

davidachamberlain

Posts: 326
Joined: 1/21/2014
Status: offline

Part of the problem is that with the current design, only 1 person can play at a time.

That is one reason I would really like to see the ability to support more than 2 players.

For each impulse, for each side, all of the major powers are serialized, such that only 1 player can do their actions for any particular impulse at a time.

One can understand the impact for Allies vs Axis, but even within one side, everything gets done one person at a time. That easily doubles the game length.

Our 4 hour sessions usually get us through just one or two impulses for each side. I remember with the board game, being able to get through a turn in an hour or two. Not so, now.

Dave

(in reply to Centuur)

Post #: 9

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/19/2018 6:42:43 AM

juntoalmar

Posts: 601
Joined: 9/29/2013
From: Valencia
Status: offline

Personally, I can only see myself playing a multiplayer game if most of the impulse is played by players individually (without the need of the other players to be online) and then all going online only for the interactive subphases (like combat, interceptions, etc). I know that WiF design is not suitable for this, but some workarounds (implemented in the game, or unofficial) could be implemented.

Not having myself a lot of time to spend playing and being difficult to agree with other people to be online at the same time, I don't want to waste it waiting for someone deciding their production lines, moving all their counters around or deciding what units to build at the end of a turn.

Similarly, when I play a wargame, I like to think of the different possibilities of a turn, study them, calculate success chances, review the game manual... before I go with my movement. And this takes time (sometimes a lot). I know I will not do that (out of politeness) if someone is waiting for me online on "the other side of the screen". So, the "online only" game mode, reduces my enjoyment of the game too.

In my opinion, PBEM (or a mix of PBEM and online interaction) is the perfect design for a game. I remember this could be accomplished with AH Rise and decline of the third reich on its PC version. AI could be switched on and off for each player at any moment, thus allowing an offline player to move forward, with the AI taking the interceptions decisions of his opponent. I know, that was a much simpler game, but that happened almost 30 years ago...

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(in reply to davidachamberlain)

Post #: 10

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/19/2018 10:14:21 PM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

That was why a game hosted on a spare PC (or server) with Teamviewer access worked so well for us. You could take all the time you wanted on a move and then instant message the others to join for the combats (or arrange a future time do so).

Often we downloaded a game save and made any lengthy moves on our own PC and then uploaded the game save.

The only thing you could not do was have two allies both moving at once like you can on FREX Vassal.

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Paul

(in reply to juntoalmar)

Post #: 11

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/20/2018 11:43:55 AM

Tjalfe

Posts: 39
Joined: 3/20/2005
Status: offline

Yep. Like Paul said.

It worked out great. At first we used a virtual machine from amazon for free.
That ended when amazon decided we were a business and charged for the service.

Paul then did the hosting with some custom workarounds to keep the PC from going to sleep.
It was a great game. Sometimes we had a great deal of lag though. But great fun all the way.

Cheers
Michael

(in reply to paulderynck)

Post #: 12

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/20/2018 12:51:12 PM

juntoalmar

Posts: 601
Joined: 9/29/2013
From: Valencia
Status: offline

Thanks for sharing your experience. But isn't it kind of environmentally unfriendly to have a PC 24/7 just for this? (unless you have a server already running for something else)

It sucks that amazon killed the VM option, because it seems like a great solution.

The game that we played 4 players worked like this:
- we shared a folder in Dropbox where the gamefiles were saved
- we played offline (PBEM style)
- for quick interactions we sent a screen capture through whatsapp asking the opponent what to do
- for naval combat, we were lucky that two of the players knew each other and could be online at the same time, so we assigned the naval powers to both of them.

_____________________________

(my humble blog about wargames, in spanish) http://cabezadepuente.blogspot.com.es/

(in reply to Tjalfe)

Post #: 13

RE: September Monthly Report? - 9/20/2018 10:29:19 PM

paulderynck

Posts: 8201
Joined: 3/24/2007
From: Canada
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: juntoalmar

Thanks for sharing your experience. But isn't it kind of environmentally unfriendly to have a PC 24/7 just for this? (unless you have a server already running for something else)

Compared to bitcoin mining it was mice nuts.

_____________________________

Paul

(in reply to juntoalmar)

Post #: 14