Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: Courtenay

How many Italian units were in Italy (and destroyed) at the time of the surrender? From the picture, I can see 2 INFs, a CAV, a GAR, and an Me-109, but there are several units that were underneath units that seem to have disappeared, and I am wondering how many of them were Italians that died. Also, the toe of Italy is not in the pictures, and something may have been there.

One other comment: Next turn, Italy will by liberated by Germany (assuming that Rome is not captured by the Allies). If the Allies ever take Rome after that, all Italian owned units will be removed from the game. (The ships that just changed hands are no longer Italian owned, and will be unaffected.) So, while attacking up Italy is hard, Rome is actually important.

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ORIGINAL: rkr1958

Turn 20. Nov/Dec 1942.

(Pre) Initiative. The Middle East. While this region isn't critical to who wins the up-coming initiative and goes first, it is critical the allies believe as a way to beat Germany. And that is by knocking out their oil and a source of 1 oil point they get per turn is from Iraq. Also, this region if cleared out of Vichy Syria and Iraq would give the allies a secure and stable way to get Lend Lease to the Soviets.

So, while establishing a stable line in Italy is critical, Italy is not the soft underbelly of the axis but a tough old gut. Therefore, long term allied strategy is now to shift to the Middle East and this requires taking care of Vichy France in Syria and North Africa.

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ORIGINAL: brian brian

quote:

ORIGINAL: rkr1958

Turn 20. Nov/Dec 1942.

(Pre) Initiative. The Middle East. While this region isn't critical to who wins the up-coming initiative and goes first, it is critical the allies believe as a way to beat Germany. And that is by knocking out their oil and a source of 1 oil point they get per turn is from Iraq. Also, this region if cleared out of Vichy Syria and Iraq would give the allies a secure and stable way to get Lend Lease to the Soviets.

So, while establishing a stable line in Italy is critical, Italy is not the soft underbelly of the axis but a tough old gut. Therefore, long term allied strategy is now to shift to the Middle East and this requires taking care of Vichy France in Syria and North Africa.

While the low hanging fruit of Syria would offer a tiny bump in aiding the USSR, the Allies should just land American troops directly in to Metro Vichy immediately. Italy will no longer pull German units and air missions from the eastern front. A squadron of Iowa class BBs can’t save the Russians. The US Army should get in contact with German units ASAP and attack like FDR doesn’t have another election.

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ORIGINAL: composer99

Other thing to note: Germany is not obliged to liberate Italy at the end of the turn, although they certainly may, and may well decide it's worth it. But it isn't mandatory by any means.

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13.7.5. LIBERATION
[...]

You can choose not to liberate a country that could be liberated. If you do that, the country suffers the effects of partisans as if it were marked in red on the Partisan table, until it is liberated (see 13.1, Option 46).

[...]

LIBERATION EFFECTS
[...]

A liberated major power or minor country gets back control of all hexes it controlled at the start of the 1939 campaign game that are now controlled by the liberating major power. Other major powers on its side may give back such territory that they control. Clarification: If a country is liberated but another major power decides not to give back territory, there are no adverse effects.

The liberated country also gains control of all its home country enemy controlled hexes not occupied by an enemy land or aircraft unit(s) nor in the uncontested (by the liberating side) ZOC of an enemy land unit(s). If you liberate the original home country of a conquered major power or minor country, it again becomes the home country for its units, replacing any alternative home country.

A liberated major power can co-operate (see 18.0) with any major power that returns all eligible territory to it. If they could return territory but don’t, they can never co-operate with the liberated major power. [...]