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Starting Guadalcanal - 3/2/2019 11:35:06 PM   
USN88

 

Posts: 2
Joined: 1/30/2014
Status: offline 		Good evening to all. Great site, the wealth of information is amazing, as is the experience. Like Hans posted once, I started with UV, went to WITP, and have ended up here! I have literally only played one scenario in each version (you guessed it - Guadalcanal). Went to WITP simply because it seemed a lot more complex, then one day it suffered a late game crash so I gave up on it. Went to AE after reading all these posts, and have met with a lot of frustration. Two problems as I see it. 1) My limited exposure with each of the games. 2) My ignorance in how it works. As many of you note, you have to stay with it. In WITP, my supplies and fuel started in Brisbane and Noumea. I got REALLY used to that, so that's what I know. Now in AE, Both Brisbane and Noumea have red '!' and will/or already have run out of supplies/fuel. Do I have something set up wrong? Is there a 'mechanic' that I'm not understanding? Do I have my assets improperly placed/set-up so that all my fuel/supplies are being used? It boggles my mind that for the most part I can figure a lot of it out, but that I can't start a game correctly! Everyone take care.
Post #: 1
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 4:07:18 AM   
Alfred

 

Posts: 6685
Joined: 9/28/2006
Status: offline 		It is impossible to diagnose your problem without data.  Suffice to say that both Brisbane and Noumea do not start off in the Guadalcanal scenario with a red "!".  That they currently do display it means the situation has developed as a result of your actions or inactions.

There is no way the mechanics of this game can be mastered without reading the manual.  In this instance a short term substitute is found in reading the Logistics 101 Guide found here:

http://www.matrixgames.com/forums/tm.asp?m=2878790&mpage=1&key=supply&#2878790

There are only two circumstances which result in a red "!".  Either a base garrison requirement has not been met (not applicable in this instance) or supplies on hand have dropped below the estimated future needs.  The Logistics 101 Guide discloses how supplies are consumed and from where they are obtainable.

In AE, unless proper attention is paid to logistics any base can quickly move into a supply deficit.

Alfred

(in reply to USN88)
Post #: 2
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 7:23:11 AM   
Leandros


Posts: 1740
Joined: 3/5/2015
Status: offline
To put it simply - you need to establish regular support feeder lines (ships) between some major bases in the game and the frontline bases. Examples are - Sydney, Pearl Harbor, San Francisco, Cape town, Aden. Abadan.

Fred

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(in reply to Alfred)
Post #: 3
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 8:57:22 AM   
JeffroK


Posts: 6391
Joined: 1/26/2005
Status: offline 		Be patient, it was called Operation Shoestring for a reason.

Noumea & Brisbane both start with 15000 supply, there could be supply drained up the line to Townsville, Cairns, Koumac etc. The B17 at Noumea will also draw on your supply. Sydney has 40000 and may replenish Brisbane, I believe Noumea gets a daily supply drop (not very big) so shipping a bit in from Australia will help.

This helps to limit Allied operations, just as the japanese wait for supply to build up at Truk before sending it forward.

You Marines have enough to take Lunga & Tulagi and depending on the supply you land last for some time.

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(in reply to Leandros)
Post #: 4
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 1:06:15 PM   
m10bob


Posts: 8622
Joined: 11/3/2002
From: Dismal Seepage Indiana
Status: offline 		As it really happened, there are important places which will be running short of supplies till you can organize convoys and send stuff from the U.S. West Coast to the ports of the theater.
Find places with refineries and send them oil and resources..They will slowly start churning out fuel like crazy, eventually.

_____________________________




(in reply to JeffroK)
Post #: 5
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 3:32:15 PM   
HansBolter


Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline 		Supply logistics are the heart of the game.

When starting a campaign scenario for the first time, before issuing any orders take a step back and assess what locations are producing supplies and fuel and where it needs to go.

The east and west coasts of the US are the principal supply and fuel sources for the entire map. Yes, some of each get produced in disparate locales, but to sustain your forces, the US is the main source of all things.

The shipping necessary to accomplish this distribution is spread all over the map at game start. One of the first tasks is combing through every port and getting the xAKs (and xAPs for troop distribution) headed back to the sources.

However, before organizing any TFs, examine each and every xAK for conversion potential. Many of your available and very valuable AKVs, AEs, AKEs and AGs start the game as xAKs. Don't get these important and valuable ship types bogged down in supply convoys. Get them started converting ASAP.

As for distributing supply, most experienced players eschew the Auto Convoy system and instead rely on Continuous Supply TFs.
CS TFs are set up by toggling the Player Control/Computer Control/Continuous Supply yellow text in the TF interface.

As for where to send them, this will vary over time, but to address your questions concerning Australia, New Zealand and South Pac in general, choose a base like Pago Pago (my personal favorite) or Auckland and establish it as a regional hub with your CS TFs coming from the West Coast to that hub and shorter legged xAKs and xAKLs used for distribution within the region.

Cape Town will also need both supply and fuel sent from the East Coast. Aden will need supply from the EC once the MED route opens. Cape Town and Aden can be established as regional hubs for distribution onto the map, but need to be fed from the US.

I've had CS TFs running to Pearl from the game start and in August '45 Pearl has 11 million supply and 4.7 million fuel. It's now a forward hub for shuttling supply to the Marianas.

I'm even finding that in August '45 my Soviet armies are starved for supply and am now making runs from Seattle to Komsolmolsk.





_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to m10bob)
Post #: 6
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 3:48:44 PM   
GetAssista

 

Posts: 2732
Joined: 9/19/2009
Status: offline 		Folks, OP is starting Guadalcanal scenario. Why all that talk about off map bases and US supply routes?

OP, go through your bases and note where supply is generated. Should be written in the base window as /X after the supply stock, meaning X units of supply per turn arrive on this base (out of thin air). Off the top of my head should be Noumea and Brisbane. Use this supply wisely

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 7
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 3:54:58 PM   
HansBolter


Posts: 7704
Joined: 7/6/2006
From: United States
Status: offline 		I took his post to imply that since he only had experience with where supply originates in his limited experience with the Guadalcanal scenario that he had no idea where to start in dealing with supply in a campaign game where it doesn't originate in the locales he is used to.

Unlike in a Guadalcanal scenario, in a campaign game Brisbane and Noumea are going to run dry very quickly if supply TFs from the WC haven't been established.

_____________________________

Hans


(in reply to GetAssista)
Post #: 8
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 8:01:14 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

In WITP, my supplies and fuel started in


Don't assume that anything in WitP transfers to this game. This is WitP-AE a totally different entity. A whole new animal. IOW they are not the same game.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to HansBolter)
Post #: 9
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/3/2019 9:06:02 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline
quote:

Don't assume that anything in WitP transfers to this game. This is WitP-AE a totally different entity. A whole new animal. IOW they are not the same game.


Just like people. Don't ever presume that girl friend #2 is like girlfriend #1, that wife #2 is like wife #1 . . .

< Message edited by RangerJoe -- 3/3/2019 9:07:23 PM >

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 10
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/4/2019 6:51:34 PM   
Uncivil Engineer

 

Posts: 1014
Joined: 2/22/2012
From: Florida, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: USN88

Good evening to all. Great site, the wealth of information is amazing, as is the experience. Like Hans posted once, I started with UV, went to WITP, and have ended up here! I have literally only played one scenario in each version (you guessed it - Guadalcanal). Went to WITP simply because it seemed a lot more complex, then one day it suffered a late game crash so I gave up on it. Went to AE after reading all these posts, and have met with a lot of frustration. Two problems as I see it. 1) My limited exposure with each of the games. 2) My ignorance in how it works. As many of you note, you have to stay with it. In WITP, my supplies and fuel started in Brisbane and Noumea. I got REALLY used to that, so that's what I know. Now in AE, Both Brisbane and Noumea have red '!' and will/or already have run out of supplies/fuel. Do I have something set up wrong? Is there a 'mechanic' that I'm not understanding? Do I have my assets improperly placed/set-up so that all my fuel/supplies are being used? It boggles my mind that for the most part I can figure a lot of it out, but that I can't start a game correctly! Everyone take care.


The small scenarios are very limited in supply and fuel and it's very easy to run short. If you think you've got it bad playing the Allies, try Japan! Only 2000 fuel per day at Truk and just about the entire Combined Fleet to refuel.

After the initial capture of Lunga and Tulagi, husband your resources so you can react to the Japanese counterattack. Only 4 bases mean anything point-wise - Port Moresby, Milne Bay, Lunga, and Tulagi. Japan gets 2 or 3 divisions of Army reinforcements (in regiment-sized chunks), and it's your job to make it as difficult as possible for him to get them from Truk to any of those 4 bases. Unless you suffer a major naval defeat, he can realistically go for only one of them (which won't be enough for Japan to win the scenario).

And, to answer your question, no, you don't have anything set up wrong - your Op Tempo is too fast for the situation; slow down.

(in reply to USN88)
Post #: 11
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/4/2019 11:49:44 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

that wife #2 is like wife #1 . . .


One wife was quite enough thank you.

_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to Uncivil Engineer)
Post #: 12
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/4/2019 11:51:38 PM   
BillBrown


Posts: 2335
Joined: 6/15/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

quote:

Don't assume that anything in WitP transfers to this game. This is WitP-AE a totally different entity. A whole new animal. IOW they are not the same game.


Just like people. Don't ever presume that girl friend #2 is like girlfriend #1, that wife #2 is like wife #1 . . .


Wife #1 and wife #2 were very similar, wife #3 was very different.

(in reply to RangerJoe)
Post #: 13
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/4/2019 11:56:05 PM   
rustysi


Posts: 7472
Joined: 2/21/2012
From: LI, NY
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BillBrown


quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

quote:

Don't assume that anything in WitP transfers to this game. This is WitP-AE a totally different entity. A whole new animal. IOW they are not the same game.


Just like people. Don't ever presume that girl friend #2 is like girlfriend #1, that wife #2 is like wife #1 . . .


Wife #1 and wife #2 were very similar, wife #3 was very different.


Tough learning curve.


_____________________________

It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once. Hume

In every party there is one member who by his all-too-devout pronouncement of the party principles provokes the others to apostasy. Nietzsche

Cave ab homine unius libri. Ltn Prvb

(in reply to BillBrown)
Post #: 14
RE: Starting Guadalcanal - 3/5/2019 7:26:09 AM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline 		Well, did you guys ever hear about the man who had been happily living with the same woman for 25 years? He just hoped like hell that his wife never found out . . .

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
― Julia Child


(in reply to rustysi)
Post #: 15
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