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Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germany?

 
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Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germany? - 3/6/2019 2:42:39 AM   
ringoblood


Posts: 438
Joined: 3/10/2018
From: USA
Status: offline 		Howdy all, as many of you know I am recently married and i live in the States and I'm in my early 30. I am also pursuing my PhD. in History and atm I am a Teacher's assistant.

Well know as you know the background. I'm working on my thesis. I am writing on the Church's involvement in Hitlers rise to power in Germany or the Conspiracy theory behind it. I am coming to you all, my family and friends for advice in books for help.

Josh

< Message edited by ringoblood -- 3/6/2019 2:53:19 AM >
Post #: 1
RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 6:18:22 AM   
Zap


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From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ringoblood

Howdy all, as many of you know I am recently married and i live in the States and I'm in my early 30. I am also pursuing my PhD. in History and atm I am a Teacher's assistant.

Well know as you know the background. I'm working on my thesis. I am writing on the Church's involvement in Hitlers rise to power in Germany or the Conspiracy theory behind it. I am coming to you all, my family and friends for advice in books for help.

Josh


If you can get your hands on what the Pope will release concerning Pope Pius XII and world war II. Its best to get what the Pope was doing from documets at that time. A more objective way to investigate the Popes actions.

(in reply to ringoblood)
Post #: 2
RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 7:50:19 AM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone™
Status: offline 		Richard Evans' first book of his trilogy deals with that.

Sorry, second book too IIRC

< Message edited by TulliusDetritus -- 3/6/2019 7:52:13 AM >

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(in reply to Zap)
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RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 12:36:57 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Joined: 4/1/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zap
If you can get your hands on what the Pope will release concerning Pope Pius XII and world war II.


Germany is (or was) more a 50%-50% (actually circa 60% - 40%) protestant - catholic country. You seem to single out the latter, and yet the protestant church more or less supported Hitler.

But there were indeed exceptions, like the pastor Martin Niemöller, the guy of the famous "first they came for the socialists [...]".

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RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 1:07:47 PM   
Lobster


Posts: 5104
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From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline 		Many more or less supported him at first. ;)

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Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity and I’m not sure about the universe-Einstein

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(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 5
RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 2:38:30 PM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus


quote:

ORIGINAL: Zap
If you can get your hands on what the Pope will release concerning Pope Pius XII and world war II.


Germany is (or was) more a 50%-50% (actually circa 60% - 40%) protestant - catholic country. You seem to single out the latter, and yet the protestant church more or less supported Hitler.

But there were indeed exceptions, like the pastor Martin Niemöller, the guy of the famous "first they came for the socialists [...]".



I was only referring to a part of the controversy, as pertains to the, accusations that Pope Pius XII was not helping the Jewish people and not doing enough to condemn Hitler. My comment did not cover other Church denominations and their positions.

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 6
RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 3:45:03 PM   
Poopyhead

 

Posts: 612
Joined: 3/17/2004
Status: offline 		Fascism and the Catholic Church started with Mussolini in the 1920's. So the Pope inherited a fascist Germany long after having to deal with Il Duce. As royalties faded in Europe, on a very basic level political choices were Democracy, Fascism or Communism. Democracies failed to deal with the extremism of the other two choices and were soon to falter under near economic collapse. Communists in Russia demonstrated that religious leaders deserved a place in the death camps, so a pro-fascist Church was almost inevitable. Pardon the binary view of events, but if you don't condemn certain actions, then your silence condones them. Individually, Catholics were trying to change the regimes. The Pope wasn't one of them and this is in the history of being above such events. See Kertzer's work:

https://www.amazon.com/Pope-Mussolini-Secret-History-Fascism/dp/081298367X

The References should be a good start to your research. Good luck!

< Message edited by Poopyhead -- 3/6/2019 4:20:41 PM >

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RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 5:17:35 PM   
Orm


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quote:

Pardon the binary view of events, but if you don't condemn certain actions, then your silence condones them.


No, just no.

And you are pardoned for the binary view of events.

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RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/6/2019 7:48:33 PM   
Zap


Posts: 3639
Joined: 12/6/2004
From: LAS VEGAS TAKE A CHANCE
Status: offline 		Since the OP was just looking for sources that's what I offered him. As for your comments which have gone beyond the scope of the OP's question I'll not comment. Seems it would be just be one another having a discussion that goes nowhere. And would get this discussion blocked. Its best if he could get the information from what the church releases. If at all possible, since it is only being released to scholars not students.

(in reply to Poopyhead)
Post #: 9
RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/7/2019 1:42:24 AM   
Lobster


Posts: 5104
Joined: 8/8/2013
From: Third rock from the Sun.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ringoblood

Howdy all, as many of you know I am recently married and i live in the States and I'm in my early 30. I am also pursuing my PhD. in History and atm I am a Teacher's assistant.

Well know as you know the background. I'm working on my thesis. I am writing on the Church's involvement in Hitlers rise to power in Germany or the Conspiracy theory behind it. I am coming to you all, my family and friends for advice in books for help.

Josh


Do a search for books about the catholic church and hitler's germany. You will get a bunch of hits. As for this forum, any time you ask a question about religion OR politics it can get bad. Combine them and you need a bunker.

https://www.amazon.com/Catholic-Church-Nazi-Germany/dp/0306809311

https://www.amazon.com/Hitler-Vatican-Inside-Secret-Archives/dp/0743245989



_____________________________

http://www.operationbarbarossa.net/

Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity and I’m not sure about the universe-Einstein

Q: What do you call a boomerang that doesn’t come back?
A: A stick.

(in reply to ringoblood)
Post #: 10
RE: Book Help for The Church's Involvement in Nazi Germ... - 3/7/2019 11:59:49 AM   
TulliusDetritus


Posts: 5521
Joined: 4/1/2004
From: The Zone™
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lobster
As for this forum, any time you ask a question about religion OR politics it can get bad. Combine them and you need a bunker.


Maybe it's me but I see a purely historical matter. And he said "the Church's involvement in Hitlers rise to power in Germany", which means (if my amateurish Engrish is correct) we are dealing with events that necessarily happened before 1933...

Given that there are two major religious populations, he will need to deal with both if he wants to find the answer he's looking for. 2 + 2 = 5

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Post #: 11
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