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RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/1/2019 9:07:40 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Lots of tweaks and corrections that have been sent in as well over the last couple of years - I am sure I have missed a few so feel free to let me know of any errors in the thread below.


There's a number of small problems affecting Japanese Air Units:

1) The three air units arriving with CV Katsuragi (IDs 555, 556 & 557) all have the same unit name: "Katsuragi-1". Numbers 556 & 557 should change to "Katsuragi-2" and "Katsuragi-3"

2) Seven air units that arrive in the SRA during 1943-44 are assigned to the 13th Air Flotilla, which is a restricted Homeland Air HQ. They should be assigned to the 13th Air Fleet, which is a Southern Army-linked Air HQ that arrives in Saigon in September 1943, just prior to the arrival of the first of these air units:
ID 202: 153 Ku T-1 (J1N1-C Irving)
ID 223: 254 Ku S-1 (A6M2 Zero)
ID 263: 381 Ku S-1 (A6M2 Zero)
ID 303: 732 Ku K-1 (G4M2 Betty)
ID 347: K-253 Hikotai (B6N2 Jill)
ID 370: S-311 Hikotai (A6M5 Zero)
ID 379: S-902 Hikotai (J1N1-S Irving)

3) Tokoshima Ku K-1 (ID 125) does not have an arrival location in the database

4) Two air units (ID 146 and 147) have the same name (Yamato Ku K-1). The second unit should be renamed to Yamato Ku K-2.

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(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 61
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/1/2019 9:28:12 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Scen 1 or 2 or both ??

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 62
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/1/2019 9:38:06 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline 		Both, but also Scen 102 Ironman and I suspect most of the rest, too.

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Post #: 63
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 6:02:51 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline 		Hi Andy - Without diving into OOBs, there is one area of the database which should be addressed because the current set-up ignores a very important historical reality, specifically the organization, force structure, and locations of the Red Chinese units, to include some truly egregious co-locations with Kuomintang units. Obviously there's nothing to prevent the player from combining these forces over the course of a campaign, but AE should at least ensure that the opening set-up is historically accurate as-of December 1941.

I conducted a detailed look at this a few years ago, to include citing sources, so you can easily see the rationale behind the list of recommendations below. Fortunately the solution is fairly simple and should have little-to-no impact on anything, to include the AI. Among other things, it ensures that all communist forces and HQs report ultimately to the Red Army HQ (whereas currently, for example, all the Red Army divisions bypass Mao completely) and ensures that the communists (who didn't field an air force until 1949) no longer have any Base Forces (which otherwise means that the Kuomintang can run air ops out of Yenan, which should be anathema)

Recommended changes (by location & unit):

1) Units in Sian:
- Red Chinese Army - Move to Yenan
- 15th Chinese Base Force - Change HQ to 2nd War Area (all Chinese BFs report to WA level HQs or above)
- No change for the other 4 units in Sian

2) Units in Yenan:
- 2 War Area HQ - Move to Sian
- 18th Group Army HQ - Change HQ to Red Chinese Army
- 42 Chinese Corps - Move to Sian and change HQ to 2nd War Area
- 4th Chinese Cavalry Corps - Move to Sian
- 12th Chinese Base Force - Move to Sian and change HQ to 2nd War Area
- 1st Const Rgt - Change HQ to Red Chinese Army (as with BFs, all Chinese construction regiments report to WA level HQs or above)
- 2nd Const Rgt - Change HQ to Red Chinese Army
- 115 Red Chinese Division - No change
- 120 Red Chinese Division - No change
- 129 Red Chinese Division - No change

3) NE of Yenan (90,36)
- 22 Chinese Corps - Change HQ to 7th Army Group

As for which scenarios are affected, well, unfortunately all of them.

_____________________________

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Japan Air-Engine Plan

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 64
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 6:43:32 PM   
awaw

 

Posts: 127
Joined: 1/11/2010
Status: offline 		Thank you Andy for these updates.

I was wondering if you will consider also, including in this update, allowing device 1467 upgrade to 1468.
Device 1467 is Japan Sound Detector that will otherwise remain un-upgradable throughout the war, while the entire upgrade chain from device 1468 onwards are unused.


Thanks again.

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 65
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 6:43:41 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Air I agree and will do
Land HQ changes I will do not moving locations of units as it will mess with AI scripts and fixing it is too hard

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 66
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 6:44:58 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		awaw not sure which scenario version y7ou are using but that was fixed years ago ??

(unless its a dec 8th start or quiet china which to be blunt I never update its hard enough with the main scens !!)

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 67
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 7:00:28 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Air I agree and will do
Land HQ changes I will do not moving locations of units as it will mess with AI scripts and fixing it is too hard


Thanks for the air fixes, and "no prob" on the Chinese units. That would have been nice, but there's minimal effect on gameplay.

_____________________________

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Japan Air-Engine Plan

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 68
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 7:01:09 PM   
awaw

 

Posts: 127
Joined: 1/11/2010
Status: offline 		Forgive me, I unzipped your updates into the main folder and not the SCEN folder. I see this upgrade path now. Thanks again.

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 69
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 7:03:44 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Important point I DO NOT update Dec 8th Starts or Quiet China Scens as cannot be bothered and have not been for 8 years !!!

Fair warning

(in reply to awaw)
Post #: 70
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/2/2019 11:13:38 PM   
Moltrey


Posts: 297
Joined: 4/11/2010
From: Virginia
Status: offline 		It's all good Andy. I think that most of us here are just giddy that someone is actually making concrete improvements to a game as old as WITP:AE. I don't expect you to spend ALL your free time, just some of it!

< Message edited by Moltrey -- 10/2/2019 11:14:23 PM >

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 71
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 10:46:07 AM   
Yaab


Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline 		Andy, I loaded the updated scen 001 to see the amendmends. There is still one database error.

Boomerang C-12 has 2 x 500lb bombs in Normal load instead of 2 x 250lb bombs. Its load capacity is only 500. Its next variant, Boomerange C-19 has the correct load of 2 x 250lb bombs matching its 500 capacity load.

Here is the screenie of C-12 with oversized bombs.

EDIT: I guess you also need to downgrade its Reduced load to 2 x 100lb bombs.



< Message edited by Yaab -- 10/3/2019 11:00:56 AM >

(in reply to Moltrey)
Post #: 72
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 11:00:58 AM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		Ok will fix tonight

(in reply to Yaab)
Post #: 73
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 11:33:11 AM   
Trugrit


Posts: 947
Joined: 7/14/2014
From: North Carolina
Status: offline
Thanks Andy,

You are moving so fast it is hard for me to keep up.

So, I’m creating a separate install just for your updates.

I made a load screen for it and have attached it in case others may be interested.
It will overwrite.



Attachment (1)

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 74
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 3:46:55 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline 		Hi Andy - Thanks for the HQ and air unit fixes. I looked at the latest versions for Scen 1 and 2, and there's still a few that didn't get implemented. Largely cosmetic, but if you get the chance:

- All the CV Katsuragi air units still have the same unit name: "Katsuragi-1". Numbers 556 & 557 should change to "Katsuragi-2" and "Katsuragi-3"
- Three of the Chinese units should have their HQs changed to 2nd War Area: 15th Chinese Base Force (Sian), 12th Chinese Base Force (Yenan), and 42 Chinese Corps (Yenan)

Also, did you ever resolve the Soviet Activation problem? If it would be helpful, I can run another computer-v-computer game into March '42 (this time using the latest Scen 2)

_____________________________

AE-Japan Setup

AE-Allied Setup

Japan Air-Engine Plan

(in reply to Trugrit)
Post #: 75
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 6:53:13 PM   
AlessandroW


Posts: 50
Joined: 9/12/2019
Status: offline 		Great support, thanks guys.

@Trugrit, nice and thanks.

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 76
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 7:41:42 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Bases - Lots of new bases in NZ/Aus/China/Burma/Malaya some are to make the AI perform better some are purely because it offended me to have railway lines on the map that couldn't be used bases are in the 1600 - 1720 range if you want to look at them - some of the names may be slightly out especially in China.


Not sure if this will help, but here's a link to a large map of China (and upper Burma) prepared by the OSS and dated 3-24-1944.

Edit: And even more detail in this June 1945 National Geographic map of the same region

< Message edited by Kull -- 10/3/2019 7:46:56 PM >

_____________________________

AE-Japan Setup

AE-Allied Setup

Japan Air-Engine Plan

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 77
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 7:49:56 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		updated

(in reply to Moltrey)
Post #: 78
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 7:50:55 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		I think the names are approximately right its less about moving the bases the bases are where I need them its more do the names make broad sense

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 79
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/3/2019 8:11:10 PM   
Gridley380


Posts: 464
Joined: 12/20/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kull

Recommended changes (by location & unit):

1) Units in Sian:
- Red Chinese Army - Move to Yenan
- 15th Chinese Base Force - Change HQ to 2nd War Area (all Chinese BFs report to WA level HQs or above)
- No change for the other 4 units in Sian

2) Units in Yenan:
- 2 War Area HQ - Move to Sian
- 18th Group Army HQ - Change HQ to Red Chinese Army
- 42 Chinese Corps - Move to Sian and change HQ to 2nd War Area
- 4th Chinese Cavalry Corps - Move to Sian
- 12th Chinese Base Force - Move to Sian and change HQ to 2nd War Area
- 1st Const Rgt - Change HQ to Red Chinese Army (as with BFs, all Chinese construction regiments report to WA level HQs or above)
- 2nd Const Rgt - Change HQ to Red Chinese Army
- 115 Red Chinese Division - No change
- 120 Red Chinese Division - No change
- 129 Red Chinese Division - No change

3) NE of Yenan (90,36)
- 22 Chinese Corps - Change HQ to 7th Army Group

As for which scenarios are affected, well, unfortunately all of them.


Thanks for posting that - I'd spotted problems with the 8th Route Army but only done a partial fix.

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 80
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 8:04:51 AM   
Yaab


Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline 		Andy, thanks for the Boomerang fix. And it seems you really like Burma...

(in reply to Gridley380)
Post #: 81
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 9:08:37 AM   
LargeSlowTarget


Posts: 4443
Joined: 9/23/2000
From: Hessen, Germany - now living in France
Status: offline 		@Kull Thx for the info about the airgroup errors - they are also present in the DBB scenarios. I have just corrected them in my mod.

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AE Mod "Bottlenecks" UPDATED 01/2022

(in reply to Yaab)
Post #: 82
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 12:06:26 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		?? What’s up did I miss something in Burna
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

Andy, thanks for the Boomerang fix. And it seems you really like Burma...


(in reply to Yaab)
Post #: 83
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 12:29:06 PM   
Yaab


Posts: 4552
Joined: 11/8/2011
From: Poland
Status: offline 		In scen 100 you added new bases in Burma, and added several new bases there now. I reckon Burma is your pet project of sorts.

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 84
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 1:39:25 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

In scen 100 you added new bases in Burma, and added several new bases there now. I reckon Burma is your pet project of sorts.


In the past, the AI didn't do so well in Burma. That's no longer true. The Allied player wants to make a stand there now? <snicker>)

_____________________________

AE-Japan Setup

AE-Allied Setup

Japan Air-Engine Plan

(in reply to Yaab)
Post #: 85
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 2:25:53 PM   
btd64


Posts: 9973
Joined: 1/23/2010
From: Mass. USA. now in Lancaster, OHIO
Status: offline 		The extra bases help the AI move thru Burma....GP

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(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 86
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 3:15:16 PM   
Gridley380


Posts: 464
Joined: 12/20/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kull


quote:

ORIGINAL: Yaab

In scen 100 you added new bases in Burma, and added several new bases there now. I reckon Burma is your pet project of sorts.


In the past, the AI didn't do so well in Burma. That's no longer true. The Allied player wants to make a stand there now? <snicker>)


Good to hear! I look forward to a tougher fight in Burma. Will this also help the AI defend when the Allies counter-attack into Burma later in the game?

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 87
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 6:03:48 PM   
ckk

 

Posts: 1268
Joined: 10/18/2000
From: Pensacola Beach FL
Status: offline 		Andy
1. Great to have you back

2. Been running scenario 22 AI vs. AI and Soviet activation occurs on 15 Feb 1942. The intelligence report says Soviet Activation:Manchuko Garrison.

Hope this is helpful

(in reply to Andy Mac)
Post #: 88
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 7:07:43 PM   
Kull


Posts: 2625
Joined: 7/3/2007
From: El Paso, TX
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ckk

Andy
1. Great to have you back

2. Been running scenario 22 AI vs. AI and Soviet activation occurs on 15 Feb 1942. The intelligence report says Soviet Activation:Manchuko Garrison.

Hope this is helpful


He'll probably want "before and after" save games, so it would be helpful if you could post those.

_____________________________

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Japan Air-Engine Plan

(in reply to ckk)
Post #: 89
RE: Updated Scen 1 and 2 - 10/4/2019 7:47:19 PM   
Andy Mac

 

Posts: 15222
Joined: 5/12/2004
From: Alexandria, Scotland
Status: offline 		thanks ckk its probably an LCU pathing over the border will try to find it if you have a save a.mcphie@btinternet.com

will save me some time if not n o worries I will track it down

(in reply to Kull)
Post #: 90
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