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Ship AAA Upgrades - 7/9/2003 9:20:18 PM   
DJAndrews

 

Posts: 305
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Toronto, ON, CA
Status: offline 		Is there information anywhere concerning AAA upgrade paths and start dates. I've been sending damaged and unneeded ships back to Pearl and have just received the first set of replacements (late September '42). Four Bristol class DDs, 1 Fletcher and a St. Louis class CL came back with upgrade AAA. The Sims, Gridley, Benham and Mahan class DDs and the Leander class CLs came back without upgrades (in most cases they were the same ships I'd sent home for repairs). I wasn't aware that some classes were either not upgradable or that their upgrades occur later on. It would nice to avoid sending ships back if there is no chance that they will be upgraded until after a specific date.

As an additional question, does it matter how long the status of High or Moderate has been maintained when Pearl decides on the release of ships? Can you hold ships in Noumea (as a tactical reserve) and then just send them back en masse without incurring additional delays in release?
Post #: 1
- 7/9/2003 10:26:12 PM   
thantis

 

Posts: 185
Joined: 2/25/2002
From: Cooksville, MD
Status: offline 		I think Mogami came up with a listing for the upgrades for Allied Ships.

As far as the committment level goes, there is a tonnage formula used by the system to determine how likely you are to get additional ships released. It varies by date, by % committment level set at the beginning of the scenario by the player, and whether or not you have enough escorts available.

If you have a HIGH level, the computer will continue to send ships at a fairly rapid pace. As the level decreases, so does the odds of getting additional warships (the transports have been tweaked to allow for great committment regardless).

If you hold a bunch of ships at Noumea and you're still on HIGH you don't need to worry about sending them back unless you want to.

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Never Underestimate the Power of a Small Tactical Nuclear Weapon.....

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 2
- 7/9/2003 11:15:26 PM   
Mr.Frag


Posts: 13410
Joined: 12/18/2002
From: Purgatory
Status: offline 		Anything other then CV's gets any .50" upgraded to 20 mm and 1.1" upgraded to 40 mm the first time back. The second time back, the 20 mm & 40 mm mounts are doubled.

Ships that already have 20 mm & 40 mm will be considered upgraded once already when you send them back.

CV's have hardcoded upgrades which are nice but not quite so spectacular on the second trip back.

Other things such as DC and Torpedoes may get upgraded now and then, but there is no list around of what gets what.

If the ship in question does not have the .5/1.1 or 20/40, it will come back unchanged.

This applies to Allied ships only. Japan ships come back unchanged.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 3
- 7/10/2003 12:05:24 AM   
DJAndrews

 

Posts: 305
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Toronto, ON, CA
Status: offline 		Thanx for the pointers. Although I haven't found Mogami's stuff yet, I have found several other threads that will help, if I don't become more confused in the process. I'll muddle through. I apologize for missing the threads. They occured some time before I purchased the game.

Mr. Frag, my problem seems to have a slightly different twist. All of the DDs sent back returned without AA upgrades even though they are equiped only with the 5 in. Mk 12 DP and 2 sets of 20 mm. Mixed in with the ships that returned were 4 new Bristol class DDs. These had been upgraded as per your description of a first round upgrade (doubling the number of guns and raising the rating from 390 to 560).

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 4
not 5in DP - 7/10/2003 12:16:51 AM   
fcooke

 

Posts: 1156
Joined: 6/18/2002
From: Boston, London, Hoboken, now Warwick, NY
Status: offline 		Mr. Frag was speaking about the .5 inch heavy machine guns and 1.1 inch AA weapons. The .5 gets replaced by 20mm and the 1.1 gets replaced by the 40mm. You'll notice this if you send back the early Farragut class DDs.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 5
- 7/10/2003 12:23:05 AM   
DJAndrews

 

Posts: 305
Joined: 1/26/2003
From: Toronto, ON, CA
Status: offline 		I've figured out the problem. Dumb, dumb, dumb. The scenario starts July 1 and so the DDs start with one round of upgrades complete, in some cases two. The Porter class ships lose their 5 in. Mk 12 DP guns in favour of 5 in. Mk 22 naval guns (actually reducing their AA rating) if you send them back to Pearl.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 6
- 7/10/2003 9:33:12 AM   
estaban

 

Posts: 235
Joined: 9/20/2002
Status: offline 		I kind of noticed that the AA upgrades for U.S. destroyers don't seem to be worth sending them back really. The upgrade from 50 cal to 20 MM AA guns doesn't really add much. A Farragut class that has 4 50 cal AA guns, and these upgrade to 4 20 MM cannon. Both weapons have about the same max altitude and effect.

However, for American cruisers, the AA upgrades are pretty nice.

I haven't played Allies extensively, but the Aussie/Kiwi/Brit ships don't seem to upgrade their AA when you send them back.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 7
- 7/12/2003 4:48:31 AM   
Ron Saueracker


Posts: 12121
Joined: 1/28/2002
From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by DJAndrews
[B]I've figured out the problem. Dumb, dumb, dumb. The scenario starts July 1 and so the DDs start with one round of upgrades complete, in some cases two. The Porter class ships lose their 5 in. Mk 12 DP guns in favour of 5 in. Mk 22 naval guns (actually reducing their AA rating) if you send them back to Pearl. [/B][/QUOTE]

What the hell? The Porters are showing dual Mk 12s? I'll check the database.

Just wait until you see the AA upgrades in WITP. Some ships have up to five separate refits. All historical or projected, for ships which were lost early like Wasp. I'm just getting back to working on the ship database after a forced break.

Porter main armament looks fine to me...show Mk22s.

_____________________________





Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 8
- 7/12/2003 10:17:11 PM   
RalfBHV


Posts: 118
Joined: 7/23/2002
From: Bremerhaven/Germany
Status: offline 		Hi,

at the book "Destroyer of World War Two" from M.J.Whitley the Porter Class arrament was : 8 x 5" L/38 Naval Gun (4x2),
8 x 1,1" (2x4),2 x 0,5" MG, 8 x 21" Torpedo Tubes (2 x 4).
1941 added 5 x 0,8" AA (5 x 1).
1943 removed the 1,1" AA and added 4 x 40mm Bofors (2 x 2)
1944 change to 6 x 5" L/38 Naval gun (3 x 2), 10 x 40mm Bofors (1 x 4, 3 x 2), 6 x 0,8" AA (6 x 1).
The Porter class changes to DP guns end of 1944.
Selfridge & Phelps:
4 x 5" MK38 DP (2 x 4), 1 x 5" Mk30 DP, 8 x 40mm Bofors (1 x 4, 2 x 2), 6 x 0,8" (6 x 1).

Nessaja

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 9
Re: Ship AAA Upgrades - 7/12/2003 10:47:48 PM   
Ron Saueracker


Posts: 12121
Joined: 1/28/2002
From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by DJAndrews
[B]Is there information anywhere concerning AAA upgrade paths and start dates. I've been sending damaged and unneeded ships back to Pearl and have just received the first set of replacements (late September '42). Four Bristol class DDs, 1 Fletcher and a St. Louis class CL came back with upgrade AAA. The Sims, Gridley, Benham and Mahan class DDs and the Leander class CLs came back without upgrades (in most cases they were the same ships I'd sent home for repairs). I wasn't aware that some classes were either not upgradable or that their upgrades occur later on. It would nice to avoid sending ships back if there is no chance that they will be upgraded until after a specific date.

As an additional question, does it matter how long the status of High or Moderate has been maintained when Pearl decides on the release of ships? Can you hold ships in Noumea (as a tactical reserve) and then just send them back en masse without incurring additional delays in release? [/B][/QUOTE]

I'll put one together once all the WITP work is done and game is in post beta. Hopefully the refit mechanism being developed for WITP will be/can be retrofitted to UV and the refit schedules can be used for both releases. Not much point in doing one for UV yet as it may change.

_____________________________





Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 10
- 7/13/2003 12:58:27 AM   
Snigbert

 

Posts: 2956
Joined: 1/27/2002
From: Worcester, MA. USA
Status: offline 		It sucks playing the IJN after being used to playing the USN with their upgrade paths. When you are used to CAs with 1440 for AAA and Battleships around 1900, CVs between 1600 and 2100....then look at your Japanese ships and their values are laughable. You're better off having any given American Heavy Cruiser than the Yamato for air support.

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"Money doesnt talk, it swears. Obscenities, who really cares?" -Bob Dylan

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(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 11
- 7/13/2003 10:17:43 AM   
Ron Saueracker


Posts: 12121
Joined: 1/28/2002
From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by Snigbert
[B]It sucks playing the IJN after being used to playing the USN with their upgrade paths. When you are used to CAs with 1440 for AAA and Battleships around 1900, CVs between 1600 and 2100....then look at your Japanese ships and their values are laughable. You're better off having any given American Heavy Cruiser than the Yamato for air support. [/B][/QUOTE]

What also sucks as IJN is that you can't rely on CAP much either. Even the SBDs and TBFs can bore into a Jap CV group with little fighter escort and manage to get through and attack. Reminds me of the rugby matches between Japan and any of the big boy clubs like the Wallabies, All Blacks or Wales. Undergunned and undersized...little round dudes bouncing about like weebles.:D

_____________________________





Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 12
- 7/13/2003 10:21:11 AM   
Mr.Frag


Posts: 13410
Joined: 12/18/2002
From: Purgatory
Status: offline 		Yep, only solution is to take Noumea and stop any new ships from coming in :D

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 13
- 7/13/2003 11:28:58 AM   
estaban

 

Posts: 235
Joined: 9/20/2002
Status: offline 		I don't know, I've seen Japanese CAP put some serious foot to *** against incoming SBDs, even with fighter escort.

My last game I had the Kaga and the Akago square off against the Enterprise and Hornet. 54 SBDs with about 15 fighters went up aginst about 30 zeros on CAP, and only about 30 SBDs got through, and flak mostly chewed them up.

The result was the Akagi took two bomb hits. The Enterprise took a couple bomb hits from the counterstrike and the Hornet took 3 torpedoes and bomb hits and was finished the next turn.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 14
- 7/13/2003 11:30:00 AM   
estaban

 

Posts: 235
Joined: 9/20/2002
Status: offline 		By the way, how do you tell the AAA rating on a ship? I can't recall having seen this.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 15
- 7/13/2003 11:44:38 AM   
Ron Saueracker


Posts: 12121
Joined: 1/28/2002
From: Ottawa, Canada OR Zakynthos Island, Greece
Status: offline 		[QUOTE]Originally posted by estaban
[B]By the way, how do you tell the AAA rating on a ship? I can't recall having seen this. [/B][/QUOTE]

Right click on ship name and a list of weapon values pops up.

_____________________________





Yammas from The Apo-Tiki Lounge. Future site of WITP AE benders! And then the s--t hit the fan

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 16
- 7/15/2003 11:56:33 AM   
OG_Gleep

 

Posts: 308
Joined: 12/27/2002
Status: offline 		Top right corner, 1st block, last value. Under Manuever.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 17
- 7/15/2003 11:57:59 AM   
OG_Gleep

 

Posts: 308
Joined: 12/27/2002
Status: offline 		Someone had a excel spreadsheet, breaking down all the ships with AA values, and what role they are best suited for. They posted it in December I think, and I can't find it. Anyone know who did it?

I am almost positive it wasn't Mogami.

(in reply to DJAndrews)
Post #: 18
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