Slitherine

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

I very much see the benefit of operations targeting Allied industry in Australia. I can't pursue such a strategy in this campaign however as our house rules preclude strategic bombing until June 1943.

quote:

ORIGINAL: mind_messing

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

I very much see the benefit of operations targeting Allied industry in Australia. I can't pursue such a strategy in this campaign however as our house rules preclude strategic bombing until June 1943.

Well, there's a lesson in here about the comparative merits of house rules

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

I very much see the benefit of operations targeting Allied industry in Australia. I can't pursue such a strategy in this campaign however as our house rules preclude strategic bombing until June 1943.

You can try naval bombardment and if you are very, very, very lucky ....

Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

But when they come back, there is not enough artillery devices for them.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

It is March 18, 1942 and Chungking has 0 forts. You have done it about as fast as humanly possible.

What is far worse is destroying the isolated Chinese units with no valid retreat paths.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Do you have any minesweeper to sweep Calcutta? If not, it might be a good idea.

quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

Then keep the range from the base to around 15,000 and include the minesweepers in your force.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

That decisive victory at Jessore is the equivalent of Saladin's victory at Hattin.  A much more promising exploitation is now open to Japan.

Forget Calcutta.  Instead go to capture all of India.  Just leave enough force in Calcutta to prevent being ejected.

1.  Based on the data disclosed to date, I very much doubt there is much of an Allied field army left in the rest of India.

2.  Most Indian bases have no garrison requirements.  Those that do usually have a garrison requirement of 40 or less.  Other than a very few bases, like Bombay, Madras, Delhi and Karachi, the garrisons will be quite vulnerable to even small Japanese attacks.

3.  A couple of Japanese armour units can quickly capture a large number of Indian bases.  The impact on the capacity of Indian industry to produce local supply to feed the in theatre forces will be devastated.  Commensurately the benefit to Japan will be very significant.

4.  Substantial importation of supply will need to be undertaken by the Allies to both feed and reequip the shattered units from Jessore.  This importation will be very vulnerable to the MKB and some Netties.  Easy VPs to Japan.  When combined with the relatively low Allied device production rates, there ain't gonna be a new Allied field army in India soon.

5.  Faced with a rampaging and unopposed IJA in the countryside, the Allied commander then has to decide whether a retreat from Calcutta is in order.  Consequently going on an India wide conquest operation will probably make the capture of Calcutta much easier as the devastated Allied units move out.

Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

That decisive victory at Jessore is the equivalent of Saladin's victory at Hattin.  A much more promising exploitation is now open to Japan.

Forget Calcutta.  Instead go to capture all of India.  Just leave enough force in Calcutta to prevent being ejected.

1.  Based on the data disclosed to date, I very much doubt there is much of an Allied field army left in the rest of India.

2.  Most Indian bases have no garrison requirements.  Those that do usually have a garrison requirement of 40 or less.  Other than a very few bases, like Bombay, Madras, Delhi and Karachi, the garrisons will be quite vulnerable to even small Japanese attacks.

3.  A couple of Japanese armour units can quickly capture a large number of Indian bases.  The impact on the capacity of Indian industry to produce local supply to feed the in theatre forces will be devastated.  Commensurately the benefit to Japan will be very significant.

4.  Substantial importation of supply will need to be undertaken by the Allies to both feed and reequip the shattered units from Jessore.  This importation will be very vulnerable to the MKB and some Netties.  Easy VPs to Japan.  When combined with the relatively low Allied device production rates, there ain't gonna be a new Allied field army in India soon.

5.  Faced with a rampaging and unopposed IJA in the countryside, the Allied commander then has to decide whether a retreat from Calcutta is in order.  Consequently going on an India wide conquest operation will probably make the capture of Calcutta much easier as the devastated Allied units move out.

Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alamander

I agree with Alfred as well. The allies are crushed. You may as well finish them. I don't see any hope for the allied player avoiding auto-victory on January 1, 1943 in this game if you pursue the path that Alfred suggests. In fact, with the loss of his CVs and China so early, the only hope that the allied player has is if you waste substantial time and deplete several key units at Calcutta.

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

That decisive victory at Jessore is the equivalent of Saladin's victory at Hattin.  A much more promising exploitation is now open to Japan.

Forget Calcutta.  Instead go to capture all of India.  Just leave enough force in Calcutta to prevent being ejected.

1.  Based on the data disclosed to date, I very much doubt there is much of an Allied field army left in the rest of India.

2.  Most Indian bases have no garrison requirements.  Those that do usually have a garrison requirement of 40 or less.  Other than a very few bases, like Bombay, Madras, Delhi and Karachi, the garrisons will be quite vulnerable to even small Japanese attacks.

3.  A couple of Japanese armour units can quickly capture a large number of Indian bases.  The impact on the capacity of Indian industry to produce local supply to feed the in theatre forces will be devastated.  Commensurately the benefit to Japan will be very significant.

4.  Substantial importation of supply will need to be undertaken by the Allies to both feed and reequip the shattered units from Jessore.  This importation will be very vulnerable to the MKB and some Netties.  Easy VPs to Japan.  When combined with the relatively low Allied device production rates, there ain't gonna be a new Allied field army in India soon.

5.  Faced with a rampaging and unopposed IJA in the countryside, the Allied commander then has to decide whether a retreat from Calcutta is in order.  Consequently going on an India wide conquest operation will probably make the capture of Calcutta much easier as the devastated Allied units move out.

Alfred

Solid and logical advice Alfred. I also very much doubt that the Allies have many forces in the rest of India right now as well. The Australian divisions, the British 18th, and a huge number of Indian forces have already either been sighted or engaged here. Many of these came as reinforcements from the rest of the subcontinent recently when it became apparent to my opponent that my main effort was here. There are also some substantial forces to the east in Assam as well. The biggest question in my mind is when the American divisions/units will be arriving in the wider theater.

I have seven infantry divisions in the Calcutta area right now. In the aftermath of the battle my plan now is to keep three with significant artillery support around Calcutta to bottle up the still very large albeit battered Allied forces there (intel reports 118,000 troops!). One division will head towards Ledo and start clearing Assam. Another will head towards Chittagong and connect with the Japanese forces advancing up from Akyab there (securing my overland communications and potential overland retreat path. And two will follow up the armored drive deeper into India. These can eventually be reinforced as more assets arrive.

My biggest regret, and a mistake linked to my inexperience with the game, is my failure to allocate enough paratrooper units to the Indian adventure. The one unit I did allocate is currently rebuilding at Rangoon from the battering it took with its early commitment at Akyab. This would have greatly facilitated my advance deeper into India, but now I have to mostly advance at the pace of my tank regiments. Any ideas how long I have before the American units start arriving in large numbers?

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alamander

I agree with Alfred as well. The allies are crushed. You may as well finish them. I don't see any hope for the allied player avoiding auto-victory on January 1, 1943 in this game if you pursue the path that Alfred suggests. In fact, with the loss of his CVs and China so early, the only hope that the allied player has is if you waste substantial time and deplete several key units at Calcutta.

I am currently in talks with my opponent about the status of the game. After the last turn, he congratulated me on my victories and said that he is thinking of surrendering. I in turn assured him that I did not really care about autovictory and was planning to play on to 1945 even if I get it (I am already past the 4 to 1 victory ratio right now). Given this is my first time playing Japan and my second AE campaign overall, I really want it to continue to see what the later years look like so I hope he takes heart from all the goodies that the Allies get in 1943 and beyond.

I should also be clear that I am still very much in danger in the South Pacific. The KB is right next to many powerful Allied surface warships and extricating it intact could be quite tricky. Not to forget that the Kaga is also heavily damaged.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: DesertWolf101

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

That decisive victory at Jessore is the equivalent of Saladin's victory at Hattin.  A much more promising exploitation is now open to Japan.

Forget Calcutta.  Instead go to capture all of India.  Just leave enough force in Calcutta to prevent being ejected.

1.  Based on the data disclosed to date, I very much doubt there is much of an Allied field army left in the rest of India.

2.  Most Indian bases have no garrison requirements.  Those that do usually have a garrison requirement of 40 or less.  Other than a very few bases, like Bombay, Madras, Delhi and Karachi, the garrisons will be quite vulnerable to even small Japanese attacks.

3.  A couple of Japanese armour units can quickly capture a large number of Indian bases.  The impact on the capacity of Indian industry to produce local supply to feed the in theatre forces will be devastated.  Commensurately the benefit to Japan will be very significant.

4.  Substantial importation of supply will need to be undertaken by the Allies to both feed and reequip the shattered units from Jessore.  This importation will be very vulnerable to the MKB and some Netties.  Easy VPs to Japan.  When combined with the relatively low Allied device production rates, there ain't gonna be a new Allied field army in India soon.

5.  Faced with a rampaging and unopposed IJA in the countryside, the Allied commander then has to decide whether a retreat from Calcutta is in order.  Consequently going on an India wide conquest operation will probably make the capture of Calcutta much easier as the devastated Allied units move out.

Alfred

Solid and logical advice Alfred. I also very much doubt that the Allies have many forces in the rest of India right now as well. The Australian divisions, the British 18th, and a huge number of Indian forces have already either been sighted or engaged here. Many of these came as reinforcements from the rest of the subcontinent recently when it became apparent to my opponent that my main effort was here. There are also some substantial forces to the east in Assam as well. The biggest question in my mind is when the American divisions/units will be arriving in the wider theater.

I have seven infantry divisions in the Calcutta area right now. In the aftermath of the battle my plan now is to keep three with significant artillery support around Calcutta to bottle up the still very large albeit battered Allied forces there (intel reports 118,000 troops!). One division will head towards Ledo and start clearing Assam. Another will head towards Chittagong and connect with the Japanese forces advancing up from Akyab there (securing my overland communications and potential overland retreat path. And two will follow up the armored drive deeper into India. These can eventually be reinforced as more assets arrive.

My biggest regret, and a mistake linked to my inexperience with the game, is my failure to allocate enough paratrooper units to the Indian adventure. The one unit I did allocate is currently rebuilding at Rangoon from the battering it took with its early commitment at Akyab. This would have greatly facilitated my advance deeper into India, but now I have to mostly advance at the pace of my tank regiments. Any ideas how long I have before the American units start arriving in large numbers?

Approximately 9 weeks from the time your opponent realised that Alpine Dingo was essentially a feint and West Coast units should be sent to India.

The timing is approximate as it depends on several factors but in simplified terms:

3 days to pack into strategic mode
4 days to reach the East Coast
38 days East Coast to Capetown
1 day to load at Capetown
10 days to arrive on map
5 days to cross the Indian Ocean and arrive at an Indian port
1 day to unload

There is your approximate 9 weeks.

Considering that Alpine Dingo appears to have fooled your opponent, he is probably still about 3 weeks out from Capetown. Quite possibly the bulk of the transfers are still 5 weeks from reaching Capetwon.

Of course your opponent could simply have redirected units already en route to, or already arrived, in Australia. Transit from Australia to India will be much quicker, somewhere in the vicinity of about 3 weeks from today but, and it is a very big but, the trip will be extremely dangerous. As a general rule, in AE Allied west - east passage of the Indian Ocean is relatively (emphasis on the word relatively) safe but south - north passage is very dangerous and not to be attempted without forming a very strongly protected convoy. Your opponent does not have the assets to safely transit south to north as his carriers are either sunk or heavily damaged in the eastern Pacific.

When I said there ain't gonna be an Allied field army soon in India, I already had in mind what American forces could be spared/reattached to unrestricted HQs and their transit time to India.

As to your concerns about the KB, they are largely misplaced. It is very rare for any Surface Combat TF, of either side, to deliver any meaningful blows to enemy fleet carriers. On almost every one of those rare occasions where surface and carrier TFs meet, the fleet carriers are usually able to disengage before any shots are fired at all.

Basically, you should encounter no serious resistance in Indian until your reach the Line of Death. At that point you can reassess whether crossing the Line of Death is warranted. Be aware that the Emergency Reinforcements triggered are most beneficial to the Allies, not in the form of the additional LCUs received off map, but in the dumping into the pools of important Allied devices and the early arrival of advanced Spitfires which if handled well, can seriously win control of the airspace to the Allies.

Alfred

quote:

ORIGINAL: Alamander

Of course you should play on if you wish, but, if you take into account how much enjoyment you and your opponent will receive from playing on, I think you might be better off accepting surrender. You will, most likely, rout the allies from India by the end of summer. The Indian supply generation, coupled with the quick fall of China, which will reduce dramatically the drain on your supplies, will leave you with a massive stockpile.

With the losses that he has sustained and the lack of a western front, it will very difficult for him to begin his counter offensive until late 1943. You will go through a year or so, I would think, without much action. The game probably will not be competitive again until early 1944.

In my opinion, you would likely be better off starting a new game that will be more competitive from the beginning. There is reason the VP system is setup as it is, and in some cases, it would seem, auto-victory really does reflect an "end of game" situation. Not always, but in this case, it seems to.

I have a chance, certainly no better than 50/50 (and probably worse), to get to auto-victory in my game with Mike, but that is a much different situation. Mike has not lost many assets and is assembling forces within a reasonable distance of important objectives to begin a counter-offensive in earnest soon. He is not going to have to invade India from Aden, for example. In our case, an auto-victory would not signify the end of (or a long hiatus in) the competitive portion game, and we should both continue to derive a good deal of enjoyment from the time we spend playing until the inevitable collapse of Japan.