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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A))

 
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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 12:35:24 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Thanks everyone. By following BB tactics and using the in game database I am able to make much better sense of the upgrade paths. The problem with tracker is I don't use the game screens enough. If only there was some kind of persistency in them for economic use...

Seems like I never really get enough Vickers or Valentines.

I didn't realize this, but the improvised AFVs have a range of 2....making them a very solid early anti infantry force I think on defense, perhaps more than what I have been using them for. They certainly did stand up very nicely in the fighting around Maryborough...although now I am pulling them out of the front lines there.

Will keep reinforcements on for the Indian and British impAFVs in India, turn them off for the two Armor units heading for China...and stockpile the Stuart Is until they can be sent to those two Chinese units.

Now, figuring out how to prioritize the 25# artillery...I think all to Australia for now...maybe to the Burma 1st Div depending upon what happens.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 1141
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 1:30:49 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Eastern Oz...a disturbing discovery.






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Post #: 1142
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 2:27:01 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Screwed up my turn in Burma, and I am too lazy to reenter the last hours work...hope it doesn't hurt too much.

I saved too soon. I know better.


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Post #: 1143
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 3:35:04 PM   
Ambassador

 

Posts: 1674
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Brussels, Belgium
Status: offline 		Improvised AFV may have a range of 2, but their armor and anti-soft values are very low. I prefer Matildas and Valentines’ heavy armor.

Vickers Tankettes are the reason why managing Commonwealth’s armored units is tricky.

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Post #: 1144
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 5:07:31 PM   
Lowpe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ambassador

Improvised AFV may have a range of 2, but their armor and anti-soft values are very low. I prefer Matildas and Valentines’ heavy armor.

Vickers Tankettes are the reason why managing Commonwealth’s armored units is tricky.


In a pinch, you use what you can...and when you find they are a bit better than you thought, well...that is gravy!

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Post #: 1145
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 5:09:05 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Some insight into Japan's state of mind:

I could imagine the chaotic scenes in the Imperial Guards Command Post as the OPSO continually screams that the 18th Division and 7th Hussars should not be there. Only routed Indian formations ! :-)

Fairly comprehensive summary below from Alfred. I prefer the flexibility for the Empire using broken down Infantry regiments rather than combined divisions. I think early war an IJA regt is more than a match for an Indian brigade or division though you may prove me wrong on that point.

Thanks for the info.

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Post #: 1146
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 5:18:26 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Spent some time just now fully understanding the Chinese auto spawn of destroyed infantry...as I have several units that need to be destroyed fully in the Changsha pocket.

It is a pretty powerful game mechanic, and I don't think I ever played against an AFB that really used it.


(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 1147
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 5:34:51 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Thanks everyone. By following BB tactics and using the in game database I am able to make much better sense of the upgrade paths. The problem with tracker is I don't use the game screens enough. If only there was some kind of persistency in them for economic use...

Seems like I never really get enough Vickers or Valentines.

I didn't realize this, but the improvised AFVs have a range of 2....making them a very solid early anti infantry force I think on defense, perhaps more than what I have been using them for. They certainly did stand up very nicely in the fighting around Maryborough...although now I am pulling them out of the front lines there.

Will keep reinforcements on for the Indian and British impAFVs in India, turn them off for the two Armor units heading for China...and stockpile the Stuart Is until they can be sent to those two Chinese units.

Now, figuring out how to prioritize the 25# artillery...I think all to Australia for now...maybe to the Burma 1st Div depending upon what happens.


In stock one of my Vickers Tankette units upgraded to Humbers (IIRC) which freed up enough tankettes to help the other units using them. But now the Humber Is are in great demand and until the Humber IV is available to free up some Humber Is, some Aussie units are going short.

I never had a problem with lack of Valentine IIIs in stock because the Grant/Lee arrived in enough numbers to replace most of them. I can't recall when the TOE upgrade took place - spring or early summer I think.

When the Desert Rats show up one of their vehicles is the RRAC - Rolls Royce Armoured Car!. MGs only, but according to the documentary I watched the Rats loved it for its reliability and decent armour. Not sure if the game models reliability in any way.

Looks like NE Oz is his primary mission right now and you are concentrating in the right places. A few more fighter squadrons and B-17s should put the kibosh on his strat bombing plans. I like the Hudson III(LR)s [11/14 range] for bombing in the back country to slow down movement and ID opposition. Usually there is no air cover for units well back of the action.

_____________________________

No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

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Post #: 1148
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 6:26:10 PM   
Ambassador

 

Posts: 1674
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Brussels, Belgium
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe


quote:

ORIGINAL: Ambassador

Improvised AFV may have a range of 2, but their armor and anti-soft values are very low. I prefer Matildas and Valentines’ heavy armor.

Vickers Tankettes are the reason why managing Commonwealth’s armored units is tricky.


In a pinch, you use what you can...and when you find they are a bit better than you thought, well...that is gravy!


Indeed. At least, an AFV destroyed while fighting the enemy has served better than simply sitting forever in the pools after all units upgraded.

The interesting thing about the Improv AFV is also that they have a value in the ceiling field. I never tested, but I wonder if they would fire on strafing planes...

(in reply to Lowpe)
Post #: 1149
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/15/2021 11:16:55 PM   
PaxMondo


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Spent some time just now fully understanding the Chinese auto spawn of destroyed infantry...as I have several units that need to be destroyed fully in the Changsha pocket.

It is a pretty powerful game mechanic, and I don't think I ever played against an AFB that really used it.



Maybe not, but yes, really powerful if fully utilized ... which is why taking out CHI early is such a good idea as IJ ...

_____________________________

Pax

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Post #: 1150
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 1:54:47 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Spent some time just now fully understanding the Chinese auto spawn of destroyed infantry...as I have several units that need to be destroyed fully in the Changsha pocket.

It is a pretty powerful game mechanic, and I don't think I ever played against an AFB that really used it.



Maybe not, but yes, really powerful if fully utilized ... which is why taking out CHI early is such a good idea as IJ ...


One of the reasons why I've never advocated for the generic withdrawal of Chinese units back towards Chungking. You need the space and time afforded by defending Changsha et al to reap the benefit of the auto resurrection.

Alfred

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Post #: 1151
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 6:57:24 AM   
PaxMondo


Posts: 9750
Joined: 6/6/2008
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Spent some time just now fully understanding the Chinese auto spawn of destroyed infantry...as I have several units that need to be destroyed fully in the Changsha pocket.

It is a pretty powerful game mechanic, and I don't think I ever played against an AFB that really used it.



Maybe not, but yes, really powerful if fully utilized ... which is why taking out CHI early is such a good idea as IJ ...


One of the reasons why I've never advocated for the generic withdrawal of Chinese units back towards Chungking. You need the space and time afforded by defending Changsha et al to reap the benefit of the auto resurrection.

Alfred

The AI actually tends to make better use of this than many players, because it will defend in depth, allowing a lot of units to be respawned. Now, of course, a player can out maneuver the AI, but the AI's fundamental defense in china is sound.

_____________________________

Pax

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Post #: 1152
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 7:43:13 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


The AI actually tends to make better use of this than many players, because it will defend in depth, allowing a lot of units to be respawned. Now, of course, a player can out maneuver the AI, but the AI's fundamental defense in china is sound.


Careful there PaxMondo, such a statement is heresy to the zealots that look down upon players who don't play PBEM. You risk being deplatformed if you carry on with the heresy that the AI can be a worthwhile opponent.

Alfred

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Post #: 1153
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 8:50:40 AM   
821Bobo


Posts: 2311
Joined: 2/8/2011
From: Slovakia
Status: offline 		But IJA player needs somehow to assist and destroy those Chinese units. In my PBEM game, empire did few "POW" camps and ignored all the trashed units, attacking them only if suicide missions behind the lines interrupted with supply lines.

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Post #: 1154
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 9:11:41 AM   
Alfred

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo

But IJA player needs somehow to assist and destroy those Chinese units. In my PBEM game, empire did few "POW" camps and ignored all the trashed units, attacking them only if suicide missions behind the lines interrupted with supply lines.


Which allows in time the Chinese to:

(a) recover their strength
(b) deprive important infrastructure to Japan
(c) impose an opportunity cost on Japan which has to maintain substantial assets as prison guards, assets which can't be used elsewhere

Alfred

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Post #: 1155
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 9:15:49 AM   
GetAssista

 

Posts: 2732
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quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo
But IJA player needs somehow to assist and destroy those Chinese units. In my PBEM game, empire did few "POW" camps and ignored all the trashed units, attacking them only if suicide missions behind the lines interrupted with supply lines.

Yup, good Japanese player should take great care in organizing POW camps for China where possible. Also you cannot attack at all if your AV is zero, so banzai (or what's that word in Chinese) charges won't help much either, and when a unit is out of infantry squads it is a peaceful husk.

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Post #: 1156
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 10:08:31 AM   
821Bobo


Posts: 2311
Joined: 2/8/2011
From: Slovakia
Status: offline 		I am not arguing that defending in China is wrong, I agree with it and when done properly China can be saved. Just saying that empire have tools, to some degree, to prevent respawning Chinese units.

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Post #: 1157
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 10:27:08 AM   
Ambassador

 

Posts: 1674
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Brussels, Belgium
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred


quote:

ORIGINAL: PaxMondo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Lowpe

Spent some time just now fully understanding the Chinese auto spawn of destroyed infantry...as I have several units that need to be destroyed fully in the Changsha pocket.

It is a pretty powerful game mechanic, and I don't think I ever played against an AFB that really used it.



Maybe not, but yes, really powerful if fully utilized ... which is why taking out CHI early is such a good idea as IJ ...


One of the reasons why I've never advocated for the generic withdrawal of Chinese units back towards Chungking. You need the space and time afforded by defending Changsha et al to reap the benefit of the auto resurrection.

Alfred

I’m not sure NJP’s immediate goal in China is to attack Changsha. The double pincer move appearing from Lowpe’s last map (post #1133) might serve to open the road to Chungking before having established a PoW camp in Changsha. His armor in the plains would prevent most of the northern reinforcements from arriving to the city. The sooner he invests Chungking, the sooner its industry ceases to create supply (this is less important if he takes Lanchow, like he is poised to do, now that Sian is conquered). But isolating Chungking will also ensure the 400 free daily supply is not sent elsewhere in China.

NJP appears to be moving fast and deep in every area (maybe too fast, too deep), a bold move in China would be consistent with his overall strategy so far. Doubly so if he has understood Lowpe’s habit of defending forward, which is probable (he would be a fool if he hasn’t, but I don’t read his AAR). He may bet on the fact that Lowpe hasn’t had the time to reinforce Chungking yet.
And triply so if he has learned Lowpe was moving tank units to China from Burma.

I would guess that, if his artillery and tanks appear in Changteh, it would indicate he’s going to push forward.
On the other hand, if only infantry assaults Changteh, like Hengyang, then we can be sure he’s attacking Changsha next, with the artillery & tanks coming from Wuchang.

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Post #: 1158
RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:11:17 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Jan 24, 1942

One of these days, Japan will show up with a strong heavy cruiser force or a battleship...most likely heavy cruisers.






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:15:59 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Surprise...






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:16:56 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Ah well.






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:18:24 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		2nd Wave....nope.






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:21:20 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Perseus dodges the torpedo attack, forces the I-23 to surface and promptly takes two big hits, but manages to sink the Iboat...can she be saved?




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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:24:02 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Nope, she sinks promptly after the fight...the Commander goes down with his ship. Pity.

Can we hold?




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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:25:41 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		15th Div is shattered on the crossing, the 13th reinforces and is taking heavy disruptions...but is it enough?






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:27:55 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Rejected...the power of x2 terrain, forts 3 (remain untouched). I think the IJA tank spearhead is headed here, just a hunch as I haven't spotted them.






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< Message edited by Lowpe -- 1/16/2021 12:28:29 PM >

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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:33:22 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Anything to gain experience and buy time.




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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 12:37:36 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
Joined: 2/25/2013
Status: offline 		Another day of impressive AV growth, and forts make level 2.






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 1:13:23 PM   
Lowpe


Posts: 22133
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Status: offline 		Good Intel






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RE: Spanking Lowpe (NJP72 vs Lowpe (A)) - 1/16/2021 1:19:14 PM   
Ambassador

 

Posts: 1674
Joined: 1/11/2008
From: Brussels, Belgium
Status: offline 		Lots of disabled squads, not a lot of destroyed ones. Given the end numbers, the 15th Div is the only one which will need a lot of time to be combat worthy, the other three should be able to renew an attack soon.

Small question : in stock, Changsha is Urban Light and starts with an existing fort level (4, if memory serves), but with your screenshot I’m not sure for this mod. Is it the same ?

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