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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> RE: The Darwin Flying Circus

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RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 12/31/2020 7:18:06 PM

BBfanboy

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Randy Stead

I found the link containing advice for newbs playing the Coral Sea and Guadalcanal scenarios. I feel like giving myself a "Participant" trophy for finding it again before somebody else went and did the work for me. Anyway, for those like myself who could use the advice, here it is:

CS & G scenarios advice for newbs

I didn't see mentioned in the CS and G walkthroughs that Detection Level is very important in avoiding disaster for your side and inflicting disaster on the enemy.
The Allies have true patrol aircraft with their Catalinas but must expect to lose any that fly near the Japanese carriers. It is worth it to know where they are - that will make your strikes more effective. If you have any 2E bombers that can get to PM but cannot carry a full load of bombs because of the airfield size, it might be best to use them on search or night search. Locating subs is important too - that will decrease their effectiveness.

The Japanese have long range Netties that can do search but they do not have cameras AFAIK, and any used for search will not be carrying a full load of bombs or a torp to attack Allied ships. I don't know if the numerous IJN subs have aircraft to scout for them, but if so that would help locate Allied carriers.

In the CS scenario the Japanese are just starting to establish a seaplane (Mavis) base at Guadalcanal and have AVs and aircraft there. Per historic moves I used Yorktown to attack the base first turn but Lexington could not get in position in time. I stayed one more turn to take out the AVs and the Japanese carriers arrived and smacked me down. Best to keep moving to make your MDL small.

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Post #: 31

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 12/31/2020 7:50:43 PM

Alpha77

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6 / 43 vs. AI - at this point it seems pointless to play on, the PO (programmed oppenent) offers not much resistance also my combat ship losses were laughable

For what do I get those P47s etc. when old P40 do the job (on the defense at least)

Attachment (1)

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RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 12/31/2020 8:18:58 PM

Randy Stead

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You could use those pilots to form an Allied version of "JV-44" when the jet fighters show up to have your own "squadron of experts" flying the cutting edge fighters.

JV-44

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Post #: 33

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 12/31/2020 8:27:44 PM

Alpha77

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Randy Stead

You could use those pilots to form an Allied version of "JV-44" when the jet fighters show up to have your own "squadron of experts" flying the cutting edge fighters.

JV-44

For what? IJA planes are wiped out already by the modells I have now

This game seems to be only 70-80% logistics right now (vs. the "AI" I mean PBM is quite different). IJN does a bit better with Georges, but also no real danger..they lost almost 4000 Betties.

I just looked it is early July 43, I have lost ca. a dozen DDs/DMs/DMSs and 1(!) cruiser. Plus 2 BBs at Pearl, but also the IJN only lost ca. 21-23 DDs I just noted. They lost 6 CVs, 2 CVLs, 1 BB and 15 cruisers.
The Chinese are besieging Shanghai and have retaken Canton, the AI moves in China were just weak from the very beginning...

I started another Allied game using another scen2 this time which I think has some updated AI (?) but I am now in Jan 42 and the IJA does also NOT represent a threat in China already and is quite slow and weak on the phillipines too. 1st assault of them at Clark Field failed already, so not sure it is really updated AI. There are so many scens available now one does not know which is the latest or best.

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 12/31/2020 8:33:21 PM >

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Post #: 34

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 12/31/2020 8:54:39 PM

Randy Stead

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I guess I should have noted my suggestion to form an Allied JV-44 was tongue in cheek. Your lower end single engine fighters are doing the job just fine. Imagine those same pilots of yours in Spits and P-51s?

I'm gearing up for my first game play. At the suggestion of forum members I am going to start with Coral Sea as the Allies, vs AI. I know if I stick at I will develop to the point where I have a hankering for a human opponent. But for now, the AI will be my kindergarten teacher. I'm hoping to get my brother going in this game; I bought him a copy for Christmas. But unlike me in this shutdown society, he is working a full time job and does not have as many leisure hours as I do. The plan is I learn the game, then teach him and perhaps we try head to head with each other.

Just out of curiosity, once I get playing long campaign from 12-8-41, what does the AI do with Kido Butai? I know from reading other member posts that they try to keep it together for as long as practical.

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Post #: 35

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/1/2021 4:47:48 AM

RangerJoe

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Well, in July 1942, I am unloading over 200k of supply in Chinese Hong Kong. I believe that 13 Japanese carriers have sunk, as well as 4 or 5 BBs. Lots of cruisers and destroyers lost by Japan as well but only one big sub. I have lost the Saratoga, a few cruisers and destroyers, one Dutch sub and maybe another sub as well. I don't have my game open right now.

I have destroyed at least 6 IJA divisions, plus other ground units. Now I am working on Wuchang and Hankow. They are surrounded by land and I have at least 2k AV ready to move at each place. Hankow has 6 units and Wuchang only has 2 units. Clark has 4 IJA divisions surrounded and weak along with numerous artillery and a couple of armor units. Manila has one division surrounded and being degraded. Two of the divisions on Luzon are the big divisions that had at least 900 AV.

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Post #: 36

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/1/2021 4:02:06 PM

Alpha77

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Randy Stead

I guess I should have noted my suggestion to form an Allied JV-44 was tongue in cheek. Your lower end single engine fighters are doing the job just fine. Imagine those same pilots of yours in Spits and P-51s?

Yeah I knew you were ironic in a way, however this JV was an effort of an already mostly beaten force against an overhelming enemy. While Luftwaffe was still a serious foe up to mid 44 then mostly 3 factors made it more and more impotent.

a) Lack of oil -> avgas
b) Long range Allied fighters mainly P51+P47 which also were on par with 109 + 190s or even better in some cases (like the 109G in air combat vs. fighters was underwhelming it had however better guns vs. bombers)
c) Allied bombing

Contributing factors:
- Bad upper leadership of LW (G�ring mainly)
- Experienced pilots got rare, also training flying hours of new pilots were lower and lower mainly due to factor a) but also because pilots were desperatly needed so veterans fought until unable to fly (due to death, wounds and fatigue). Some of them however should be used to train newbies.
- Russians also got better and attrition in the east got higher

Contrary to popular opinion lack of airframes was not a deciding factor, there were more planes then there was fuel or pilots for them. Most Allied bomber personell stated from 7/8 of 44 they feared Flak more then fighters.

Which are pretty much the same for the Japanese, plus they also suffered from early on unprotected planes, German planes were more sturdy like the 190 or Ju88. Early German bombers also suffered from this like the He111 or Do17.

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 1/1/2021 4:10:14 PM >

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Post #: 37

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/1/2021 4:42:11 PM

Alpha77

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quote:

Just out of curiosity, once I get playing long campaign from 12-8-41, what does the AI do with Kido Butai? I know from reading other member posts that they try to keep it together for as long as practical.

I played 3 campaigns as Allied vs. the AI one up to mid 44, this one (game from which the screenshot is) I have now ended and started a new one with perhaps better AI? This one was a "da babes" scen which has some sensible improvements, also some IJ fighters have better speed. But it seems the AI could not handle it, so I guess a stock scen with the last AI should be better (I hope in the last beta patch the latest AI was already included).

I do not like the "Ironman" scens just too phantastic / unrealistic imho.

As for the KB I found it may hang around PH 1-2 turns, so direct ships away from this area esp. you CVs. Then I see lots of unimportant places bombed by carrier planes like Guam or bases in the Philipines. Then KB goes dark it re-appears often for the Java campaign. It may raid your shippping lines plus later in MOST cases will go in the direction of Fiji (Luganville/Nadi/Suva). Here is a danger because this is often the main staging point of the US (for me at least). But it also presents the opportunity to sink some CVs when you have lots of air (mainly fighters) assembled at Fiji. Throw everything you have at them use LR CAP from land, I managed to sink 2 or 3 CV there without any major combat ship loss for the Allies, we lost around 100 planes tho.

I believe the AI keeps at least 3-4 CVs together and the others are smaller with 1-2 CV(L)s. The AI makes the mistake sending CVs too close to major enemy land bases imo. This is not a problem up to 3/4 of 42 as the Allies just have not enough air to be a serious danger, but it already changes from 5/42 at which point you can have strong bases with lots of air. 5 P40/39 units can also shred IJN CV raids

When most of their bombers gone it is toothless

Of course it can also shred a lot of your own bombers if you have them at nav attack. I do mostly fly search and have them not on attack when I know IJ CV fleet is still active/not sunk mostly..

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Post #: 38

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/1/2021 10:08:07 PM

RangerJoe

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

quote:

Just out of curiosity, once I get playing long campaign from 12-8-41, what does the AI do with Kido Butai? I know from reading other member posts that they try to keep it together for as long as practical.

I played 3 campaigns as Allied vs. the AI one up to mid 44, this one (game from which the screenshot is) I have now ended and started a new one with perhaps better AI? This one was a "da babes" scen which has some sensible improvements, also some IJ fighters have better speed. But it seems the AI could not handle it, so I guess a stock scen with the last AI should be better (I hope in the last beta patch the latest AI was already included).

I do not like the "Ironman" scens just too phantastic / unrealistic imho.

As for the KB I found it may hang around PH 1-2 turns, so direct ships away from this area esp. you CVs. Then I see lots of unimportant places bombed by carrier planes like Guam or bases in the Philipines. Then KB goes dark it re-appears often for the Java campaign. It may raid your shippping lines plus later in MOST cases will go in the direction of Fiji (Luganville/Nadi/Suva). Here is a danger because this is often the main staging point of the US (for me at least). But it also presents the opportunity to sink some CVs when you have lots of air (mainly fighters) assembled at Fiji. Throw everything you have at them use LR CAP from land, I managed to sink 2 or 3 CV there without any major combat ship loss for the Allies, we lost around 100 planes tho.

I believe the AI keeps at least 3-4 CVs together and the others are smaller with 1-2 CV(L)s. The AI makes the mistake sending CVs too close to major enemy land bases imo. This is not a problem up to 3/4 of 42 as the Allies just have not enough air to be a serious danger, but it already changes from 5/42 at which point you can have strong bases with lots of air. 5 P40/39 units can also shred IJN CV raids When most of their bombers gone it is toothless

Of course it can also shred a lot of your own bombers if you have them at nav attack. I do mostly fly search and have them not on attack when I know IJ CV fleet is still active/not sunk mostly..

Sunk ships, no FOW, 17 April 1942:

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

�Illegitemus non carborundum est (�Don�t let the bastards grind you down�).�
― Julia Child

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Post #: 39

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/1/2021 10:09:57 PM

RangerJoe

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As you can see from my picture, those CVs do tend to stay together!

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

�Illegitemus non carborundum est (�Don�t let the bastards grind you down�).�
― Julia Child

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Post #: 40

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/1/2021 11:19:24 PM

Ambassador

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The AI will usually only group at most 3 CVs together. After PH strike, KB will return to Japan, disband, and never be reformed. If you stick your four US CVs (once Yorktown arrives), it�s possible to defeat KB in detail very easily, especially once you�ve identified the recurring routings. That�s why an interesting AI game requires you some self-imposed rules...

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Post #: 41

RE: The Darwin Flying Circus - 1/2/2021 1:13:20 AM

RangerJoe

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For me, the AI put the Akagi, the Kaga, and those two CVLs in the same TF. Even with LBA it was too much for the Saratoga. But the LBA and then the next day the LBA and the surface forces finished the final two off.

The next group that came in, the Enterprise and the Yorktown along with the LBA and surface forces were there to greet them.

But the Soryu as POWed first of the Japanese carriers.

_____________________________

Seek peace but keep your gun handy.

I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

�Illegitemus non carborundum est (�Don�t let the bastards grind you down�).�
― Julia Child

(in reply to Ambassador)

Post #: 42