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Tough tanker beast - 5/14/2021 1:21:24 PM   
qsmiron


Posts: 107
Joined: 12/4/2019
From: Poland
Status: offline 		Hellow,
it's possible that such a Ship Commercial Commercial Tanker - Large Range 1 [75,000t DWT] (https://cmano-db.com/ship/339/), after being hit with 3-4 MK48 torpedoes and one tomahawk missile, would still sail and not sink?




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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/14/2021 1:47:32 PM   
thewood1

 

Posts: 6529
Joined: 11/27/2005
Status: offline 		Around the time of the "Tanker Wars" in the Persian Gulf, several large tankers hit multiple mines and continued on to their destination. At the time, the USN stated that the mines were powerful enough to break a Perry-class frigate in two. The tankers are very resilient because they are heavily compartmentalized. And if a breach happens, you are basically putting seawater where oil would go anyway. But damaging the keel or engines can eventually kill it.

So I think its plausible.

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/14/2021 3:31:46 PM   
Gunner98

 

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Status: offline 		Remember the SS Ohio on her Operation Pedestal run to Malta in 1942. A much smaller ship, one torpedo and multiple bomb hits and underwater near misses. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Ohio

Tough ships but watch out for fire.






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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/14/2021 4:35:54 PM   
BDukes

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: qsmiron

Hellow,
it's possible that such a Ship Commercial Commercial Tanker - Large Range 1 [75,000t DWT] (https://cmano-db.com/ship/339/), after being hit with 3-4 MK48 torpedoes and one tomahawk missile, would still sail and not sink?





Did you let the flooding and fire cycle play out? Sometimes ships don't go kablooey but take hours dealing with critical fires and flooding. Sometimes the crew saves the ship. Think I had a cruiser that was like 80% or something and damaged control saved it.

Mike

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/14/2021 7:56:37 PM   
kevinkins


Posts: 2257
Joined: 3/8/2006
Status: offline 		I have always found that very large commercial ships are very difficult if not impossible to outright sink. If you really need the ship based on the scenario, simulate a "boarding" operation with "special ops" and helos. You would have to use events, triggers, and actions to pass control to the friendly side and award points to that side for the successful capture. There has been recent talk of arming commercial containers ships and declaring them to be potential combatants. Or not declaring them at all. It's an interesting situation to sandbox and might have relevance in the western Pacific sea lanes.

https://www.usni.org/magazines/proceedings/2019/january/converting-merchant-ships-missile-ships-win

< Message edited by kevinkins -- 5/14/2021 8:14:05 PM >

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/15/2021 12:05:49 AM   
Gunner98

 

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quote:

go kablooey


I like the technical term Mike

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/15/2021 3:22:32 AM   
boogabooga

 

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Status: offline 		Also, those large tankers are usually double-hulled.

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/15/2021 10:31:09 AM   
qsmiron


Posts: 107
Joined: 12/4/2019
From: Poland
Status: offline 		Thank you all for the answer. From what you've said, the big commercial ships are really tough bastards after all. So, in the DB3000, high DP values for these ships are actually real.

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/26/2021 1:12:37 AM   
sirfulcrum

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kevinkins

I have always found that very large commercial ships are very difficult if not impossible to outright sink. If you really need the ship based on the scenario, simulate a "boarding" operation with "special ops" and helos. You would have to use events, triggers, and actions to pass control to the friendly side and award points to that side for the successful capture. There has been recent talk of arming commercial containers ships and declaring them to be potential combatants. Or not declaring them at all. It's an interesting situation to sandbox and might have relevance in the western Pacific sea lanes.



That's no joke. I played 688 Attack Sub 4 scenario, the one where you're tasked with sinking four Libyan tankers. I run out of torpedoes and Harpoons and can't win.

Those were tankers, but I also recently played Seawolf #2, Duckshoot, and a container ship needed 9 Mk48s before it went down. Seriously?

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/26/2021 5:08:03 AM   
Dimitris

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: sirfulcrum
That's no joke. I played 688 Attack Sub 4 scenario, the one where you're tasked with sinking four Libyan tankers. I run out of torpedoes and Harpoons and can't win.

Those were tankers, but I also recently played Seawolf #2, Duckshoot, and a container ship needed 9 Mk48s before it went down. Seriously?


Not surprised. The Russians developed huge 650mm torpedoes primarily to sink US supercarriers but also to attack heavy commercial shipping in the context of WW3. Such a target would certainly warrant a couple of 65-73s.

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/26/2021 7:05:22 PM   
BDukes

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Gunner98

quote:

go kablooey


I like the technical term Mike


Not surprised. Does have an Arty ring to it!

Mike

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/27/2021 12:07:02 AM   
ultradave


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quote:

ORIGINAL: boogabooga

Also, those large tankers are usually double-hulled.


Yeah, this is a key thing. Double hulls as protection against oil spills makes them tough to sink. They are already designed to have that outer hull breached, fill an intermediate compartment with seawater and keep on chugging.

Dave

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/27/2021 5:24:29 PM   
slimatwar

 

Posts: 77
Joined: 1/20/2017
Status: offline 		IMHO, the fact that a ship takes a lot of torps to sink doesn't mean necessarily that it couldn't be sunk with fewer torps. With fewer torps maybe it takes a longer time to sink but eventually it's going to the bottom of the sea for sure. You'll have to wait for flooding to do the job.

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RE: Tough tanker beast - 5/29/2021 2:20:58 PM   
SeaQueen


Posts: 1451
Joined: 4/14/2007
From: Washington D.C.
Status: offline 		It might be a little bit exaggerated, but not necessarily. Mk.48s are pretty big. Even so, tankers are also pretty resilient. They even used and one for a minesweeper during the Gulf War. Every ship can be a minesweeper once, after all.

The thing to remember, though, is that these are civilian crews. They're not necessarily trained to control damage the same way that the crew of a warship is. Therefore it's much more limited what their response can be. During the Tanker Wars, the shipping companies hired PMCs to train civilian crews in damage control techniques and it greatly improved their survivability.

The big threat to a ship like that probably isn't sinking (at least not immediately). It's probably fire. Tons of petroleum in the holds would be a nightmare to put out. A fire like that would spew toxic fumes all over the place and create unimaginable heat.


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