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RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips

 
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RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/6/2021 4:10:10 AM   
56ajax


Posts: 1950
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Carnegie, Australia
Status: offline 		There was some minor tweaking. This was done on 3k sorties. The challenge is now is to reduce the number of sorties and up the kills with additional ADs.




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< Message edited by 56ajax -- 11/6/2021 4:11:02 AM >

_____________________________

Molotov : This we did not deserve.

Foch : This is not peace. This is a 20 year armistice.

C'est la guerre aérienne

(in reply to 56ajax)
Post #: 181
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/7/2021 2:06:53 AM   
56ajax


Posts: 1950
Joined: 12/3/2007
From: Carnegie, Australia
Status: offline 		This is my best result so far. At the moment I dont think I will do much more until the bug that causes flak damage as listed as operational losses is corrected.




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by 56ajax -- 11/7/2021 2:07:57 AM >

_____________________________

Molotov : This we did not deserve.

Foch : This is not peace. This is a 20 year armistice.

C'est la guerre aérienne

(in reply to 56ajax)
Post #: 182
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/15/2021 3:04:17 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		I have 'codified' and modified jubjub's and metaphore's AD ideas. You can still use there settings using this guide if you like (metaphore generally used 40(10) and jubjub used generally 30(10)) and they used a few different priorities then I did.

I created it in Word but it's 92 megs and it won't zip, but I kind of created it as a PDF.

Any feedback is welcomed.

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
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(in reply to 56ajax)
Post #: 183
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/15/2021 3:09:27 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		Well the zip file was too big.

Hopefully this works:



< Message edited by Zovs -- 11/15/2021 7:17:38 PM >

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
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SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

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Post #: 184
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/15/2021 7:17:16 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		There is a screw up by yours truly on the very first AD (Luft 1) I'll need to correct the document and repost.

Sorry.

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
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Post #: 185
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/28/2021 2:35:05 PM   
PeteJC

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 4/4/2021
Status: offline 		Zovs thanks so much for doing this and thanks to those of you who have been doing testing and adding your comments and results. This not only helps me (and others) maximize our first turn results but is an excellent learning tool for understanding the air mechanics in general.

Is the version 1.2 document at the beginning of the post still the most up to date?

(in reply to Zovs)
Post #: 186
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/28/2021 9:12:08 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		Yes the latest is in the first post. 1.2 sounds right but I am away from PC till next week to check.

Oh, YW, thanks for the kind words.

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
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SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

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Post #: 187
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 11/28/2021 9:15:49 PM   
PeteJC

 

Posts: 105
Joined: 4/4/2021
Status: offline 		Thanks Zovs and also apologies for asking this in the wrong post. Should have been yours. But I can use this time to thanks Metaphore for starting this excellent post in the first place.

(in reply to Zovs)
Post #: 188
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/2/2021 4:31:29 PM   
supersixfour

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 3/12/2014
Status: offline 		So whats the current record for 1st turn inflicted vs own losses?

(in reply to PeteJC)
Post #: 189
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/2/2021 5:23:43 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: supersixfour

So whats the current record for 1st turn inflicted vs own losses?

quote:

quote


The least Axis Losses to the most Soviet Losses? Is that the question?

(in reply to supersixfour)
Post #: 190
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/3/2021 1:59:03 PM   
supersixfour

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 3/12/2014
Status: offline 		I guess kill ratio would be the best stat, but with added condition that atleast 3000 enemy were destroyed?
Then again what would be the best result when calculating the impact on the whole campaign?

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 191
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/3/2021 2:52:11 PM   
Zovs


Posts: 6668
Joined: 2/23/2009
From: United States
Status: offline 		If you look on my thread and use the document I created you should get a good result return. I just started a MP game and after the turn Axis Air Execution Phase I lost 149 air frames with 74 pilots KIA vs the Soviets 4,014 lost airframes with 685 pilots KIA.

I think my first turn is pretty optimized, I am sure it could be improved.

_____________________________


Beta Tester for:
Flashpoint Campaigns: Sudden Storm
War in the East 1 & 2
WarPlan & WarPlan Pacific
Valor & Victory
DG CWIE 2
SPWW2 & SPMBT scenario creator

(in reply to supersixfour)
Post #: 192
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/3/2021 7:24:10 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: supersixfour

I guess kill ratio would be the best stat, but with added condition that atleast 3000 enemy were destroyed?
Then again what would be the best result when calculating the impact on the whole campaign?


I asked for a thread to be created based off of my game and this is the thread.

In the game that this thread was created from my stats were

41 German aircraft (15 pilots lost) for 3998 Soviet Aircraft (1270 pilots lost)

I am sure there are others out there that have done better than that and can chime in with their numbers.

(in reply to supersixfour)
Post #: 193
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/3/2021 7:28:02 PM   
HardLuckYetAgain


Posts: 6987
Joined: 2/5/2016
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: HardLuckYetAgain


quote:

ORIGINAL: supersixfour

I guess kill ratio would be the best stat, but with added condition that atleast 3000 enemy were destroyed?
Then again what would be the best result when calculating the impact on the whole campaign?


I asked for a thread to be created based off of my game and this is the thread.

In the game that this thread was created from my stats were

41 German aircraft (15 pilots lost) for 3998 Soviet Aircraft (1270 pilots lost)

I am sure there are others out there that have done better than that and can chime in with their numbers.


The first turn numbers are nice but the impact on the whole campaign is negligible at best in my opinion.

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 194
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/9/2021 9:01:40 AM   
ImperatorAugustus

 

Posts: 100
Joined: 12/9/2021
Status: offline 		Could someone post the save files for the AD? Seems much better than redoing them.

(in reply to HardLuckYetAgain)
Post #: 195
RE: Luftwaffe vs VVS - GC41 - First Turn Bombing Tips - 12/13/2021 6:03:18 AM   
ImperatorAugustus

 

Posts: 100
Joined: 12/9/2021
Status: offline 		Hey newer player here. Used the info here and optimized it further. 2741 Sorties, 96 losses, 4062 Soviets destroyed. Pre Ground phase.

I cannot post links yet so I can give you my discord for a link if you want.

I do feel as though some of the long range strikes that are suggested above are high risk of interception near Riga, Daugapvpils, Odessa, and some others on occasion and would not recommend them on a one and done run as you can lose 100 bombers. Which is rather silly imo given soviet capabilities.

It may be worth hitting the TB3s near Kiev but I didnt test and is a long haul.

Crimea is unsuspectingly safe, but puts a lot of miles on the planes.

Key: Close - Near border, Mid range - Near of full escort

In my opinion the strategic priority ranking should be as follows: (This test was based on Zovs guide and not this list)
1. Destruction or damage to all nearby modern fighters
2. Destruction or damage to all nearby fighters
3. Minimizing German fighter casualties
4. Complete Destruction of all modern fighters in South Western Front (You wont overrun these before they can run so you want to be sure to blow them all up)
5. Complete Destruction of all fighters in South Western Front (You wont overrun these before they can run so you want to be sure to blow them all up)
6. Complete Destruction of all recon, modern attackers, and TB3s in South Western Front (You wont overrun these before they can run so you want to be sure to blow them all up)
7. Mid range strikes on targets as listed on 1/2
8. Destruction or damage to nearby recon, modern attackers, and TB3s
9. Destruction or damage to mid range recon, modern attackers, and TB3s
10. Crimea Deep strikes
11. Destruction of obsolete planes
12. Minimize German bomber losses
13. Minimize Sorties
14. Other deep strikes in same focus order as above

(in reply to ImperatorAugustus)
Post #: 196
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