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RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A)

 
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RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 5:03:37 PM   
821Bobo


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Joined: 2/8/2011
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace
...



I did hope finally will someone teach DesertWolf a lesson. No offense, but so far it looks it ain't be this game.

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 151
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 5:38:28 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace
...



I did hope finally will someone teach DesertWolf a lesson. No offense, but so far it looks it ain't be this game.


Hah, no offense taken. He is very skillful. There are few if any easy victories against him. He uses terrain well, makes excellent use of navsearch and employs mass. Normally I would try to draw his carriers into an early action, but I have yet to be able to create an opportunity where he could be surprised.

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Post #: 152
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 7:07:56 PM   
castor troy


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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy


quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo

And what's the purpose of bombing LI in Australia? Supply source for Oz are ports of Sydney, Melbourne and Perth.


His only purpose is gaining strategic victory points.

This is indeed a primary purpose, though making Australia a liability as far as supply reduces its usefulness as a jumping-off point for the Allied offensive.



If Australia is going to be used as a springboard for offensives then there will be a couple of million tons of supply there, easily brought from Cape Town and the US West Coast. I would rather bomb the few refineries in Australia so they wouldn't produce fuel as fuel is the limiting factor in Australia, always a big one for me even if all tankers on the map haul it to OZ. And if your enemy repairs the refineries, using supply, he used way more supply than the damaged LI would be able to produce.

Literally all Allied players turn off HI in Australia as not to burn fuel.

< Message edited by castor troy -- 11/30/2021 7:09:04 PM >


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Post #: 153
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 7:14:03 PM   
castor troy


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Joined: 8/23/2004
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace
...



I did hope finally will someone teach DesertWolf a lesson. No offense, but so far it looks it ain't be this game.


Hah, no offense taken. He is very skillful. There are few if any easy victories against him. He uses terrain well, makes excellent use of navsearch and employs mass. Normally I would try to draw his carriers into an early action, but I have yet to be able to create an opportunity where he could be surprised.



Wait until mid 42 and it could get tricky. By then he will have 600+ carrier based ac (as soon as Wasp arrives and without the use of CVL Hermes) and all will be 70/70 skill, plus F4F-4 and all SBD-3 and Avengers. No matter how KB would look like, it usually doesn't survive an alpha strike that isn't completely f*cked up. What you don't want to do is fight the enemy piecemeal with your carriers, either side. If he keeps the British carriers separated it would mean 550 USN ac.

< Message edited by castor troy -- 11/30/2021 7:16:37 PM >


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Post #: 154
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 7:19:01 PM   
821Bobo


Posts: 2311
Joined: 2/8/2011
From: Slovakia
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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

If Australia is going to be used as a springboard for offensives then there will be a couple of million tons of supply there, easily brought from Cape Town and the US West Coast. I would rather bomb the few refineries in Australia so they wouldn't produce fuel as fuel is the limiting factor in Australia, always a big one for me even if all tankers on the map haul it to OZ. And if your enemy repairs the refineries, using supply, he used way more supply than the damaged LI would be able to produce.

Literally all Allied players turn off HI in Australia as not to burn fuel.


Australia is lacking oil for refineries, unless Allied player is shipping some they won't produce anyway. And because you have literally infinite fuel in WC and Aden why wasting tankers on shipping oil if they can ship fuel.

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Post #: 155
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 7:22:46 PM   
castor troy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

If Australia is going to be used as a springboard for offensives then there will be a couple of million tons of supply there, easily brought from Cape Town and the US West Coast. I would rather bomb the few refineries in Australia so they wouldn't produce fuel as fuel is the limiting factor in Australia, always a big one for me even if all tankers on the map haul it to OZ. And if your enemy repairs the refineries, using supply, he used way more supply than the damaged LI would be able to produce.

Literally all Allied players turn off HI in Australia as not to burn fuel.


Australia is lacking oil for refineries, unless Allied player is shipping some they won't produce anyway. And because you have literally infinite fuel in WC and Aden why wasting tankers on shipping oil if they can ship fuel.


Australia has oil, just not 100% for the refineries. And I never proposed shipping in oil even though I had more than a couple of games where I brought as much oil from Java, Babo, Bolea to Australia in the first months with the tankers fleeing form there that Australia's refineries were swimming in excess oil.


< Message edited by castor troy -- 11/30/2021 7:24:02 PM >


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Post #: 156
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 8:38:57 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


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From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Wait until mid 42 and it could get tricky. By then he will have 600+ carrier based ac (as soon as Wasp arrives and without the use of CVL Hermes) and all will be 70/70 skill, plus F4F-4 and all SBD-3 and Avengers. No matter how KB would look like, it usually doesn't survive an alpha strike that isn't completely f*cked up. What you don't want to do is fight the enemy piecemeal with your carriers, either side. If he keeps the British carriers separated it would mean 550 USN ac.

Thanks, and I completely agree. There may be an opportunity coming up in the middle of February for a fight on favorable terms off Burma/India. If not, I will retain the KB as a fleet-in-being as long as I am able. The issue will soon become how to protect the oil on Sumatra and Java from strikes by his CVs.

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Post #: 157
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 8:40:52 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


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From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Literally all Allied players turn off HI in Australia as not to burn fuel.

Makes sense. I have only played the Allies briefly, and that was a decade ago.

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Post #: 158
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 8:42:16 PM   
RangerJoe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Wait until mid 42 and it could get tricky. By then he will have 600+ carrier based ac (as soon as Wasp arrives and without the use of CVL Hermes) and all will be 70/70 skill, plus F4F-4 and all SBD-3 and Avengers. No matter how KB would look like, it usually doesn't survive an alpha strike that isn't completely f*cked up. What you don't want to do is fight the enemy piecemeal with your carriers, either side. If he keeps the British carriers separated it would mean 550 USN ac.

Thanks, and I completely agree. There may be an opportunity coming up in the middle of February for a fight on favorable terms off Burma/India. If not, I will retain the KB as a fleet-in-being as long as I am able. The issue will soon become how to protect the oil on Sumatra and Java from strikes by his CVs.


I would suggest that if you have not done so, those two Islands in the IO near the DEI would be very useful if captured, built up, and provided with Long Range naval search. Parts of Northern and Western Australia would also be useful as well.

< Message edited by RangerJoe -- 11/30/2021 9:31:36 PM >


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Post #: 159
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 11/30/2021 9:01:58 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

If Australia is going to be used as a springboard for offensives then there will be a couple of million tons of supply there, easily brought from Cape Town and the US West Coast. I would rather bomb the few refineries in Australia so they wouldn't produce fuel as fuel is the limiting factor in Australia, always a big one for me even if all tankers on the map haul it to OZ. And if your enemy repairs the refineries, using supply, he used way more supply than the damaged LI would be able to produce.

Literally all Allied players turn off HI in Australia as not to burn fuel.


Australia is lacking oil for refineries, unless Allied player is shipping some they won't produce anyway. And because you have literally infinite fuel in WC and Aden why wasting tankers on shipping oil if they can ship fuel.


Australia has oil, just not 100% for the refineries. And I never proposed shipping in oil even though I had more than a couple of games where I brought as much oil from Java, Babo, Bolea to Australia in the first months with the tankers fleeing form there that Australia's refineries were swimming in excess oil.


I think in the end, tankers are the only potential constraint to the pace of Allied operations. I know he is shipping fuel to Pearl at the moment, and will continue to mass my submarines along those convoy routes. He is almost certainly shipping fuel to Perth or one of the other Australian ports on the southwest coast. I will have a more submarines there in a few weeks. Japan starts off with all the long-legged boats in the Pacific. Once Surabaya falls, which will be soon, I can slip the KB into the Indian Ocean undetected for a raid, though he will likely have pickets. A Dutch CL squadron is operating west of Perth, so AMC raiders are not an option. I lost two a few weeks ago.

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Post #: 160
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/1/2021 6:09:14 PM   
castor troy


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

quote:

ORIGINAL: 821Bobo


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

If Australia is going to be used as a springboard for offensives then there will be a couple of million tons of supply there, easily brought from Cape Town and the US West Coast. I would rather bomb the few refineries in Australia so they wouldn't produce fuel as fuel is the limiting factor in Australia, always a big one for me even if all tankers on the map haul it to OZ. And if your enemy repairs the refineries, using supply, he used way more supply than the damaged LI would be able to produce.

Literally all Allied players turn off HI in Australia as not to burn fuel.


Australia is lacking oil for refineries, unless Allied player is shipping some they won't produce anyway. And because you have literally infinite fuel in WC and Aden why wasting tankers on shipping oil if they can ship fuel.


Australia has oil, just not 100% for the refineries. And I never proposed shipping in oil even though I had more than a couple of games where I brought as much oil from Java, Babo, Bolea to Australia in the first months with the tankers fleeing form there that Australia's refineries were swimming in excess oil.


I think in the end, tankers are the only potential constraint to the pace of Allied operations. I know he is shipping fuel to Pearl at the moment, and will continue to mass my submarines along those convoy routes. He is almost certainly shipping fuel to Perth or one of the other Australian ports on the southwest coast. I will have a more submarines there in a few weeks. Japan starts off with all the long-legged boats in the Pacific. Once Surabaya falls, which will be soon, I can slip the KB into the Indian Ocean undetected for a raid, though he will likely have pickets. A Dutch CL squadron is operating west of Perth, so AMC raiders are not an option. I lost two a few weeks ago.


Absolutely true. If you can kill a tanker convoy it usually does way more harm to the Allied than sinking a carrier even though it's not as spectacular. It greatly depends on the Allied strategy though, if one uses Australia as the primary springboard for offensives fuel is a constraint due to the distance to Cape Town and the US West Coast but if one uses Hawaii to go North or directly through the Central Pacific then fuel is no constraint at all as Hawaii will have several million tons of fuel as the big tanker convoys have only a short round trip to the West Coast and not weeks to Australia.

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RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/1/2021 6:18:18 PM   
RangerJoe


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When it is safe to do so, I always stock up Oahu with supplies and fuel since I know that it will be used later. Those smaller and shorter ranged tankers and xAKs are very good for this job.

_____________________________

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I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are missing!

“Illegitemus non carborundum est (“Don’t let the bastards grind you down”).”
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(in reply to castor troy)
Post #: 162
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/1/2021 11:16:47 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: RangerJoe

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Wait until mid 42 and it could get tricky. By then he will have 600+ carrier based ac (as soon as Wasp arrives and without the use of CVL Hermes) and all will be 70/70 skill, plus F4F-4 and all SBD-3 and Avengers. No matter how KB would look like, it usually doesn't survive an alpha strike that isn't completely f*cked up. What you don't want to do is fight the enemy piecemeal with your carriers, either side. If he keeps the British carriers separated it would mean 550 USN ac.

Thanks, and I completely agree. There may be an opportunity coming up in the middle of February for a fight on favorable terms off Burma/India. If not, I will retain the KB as a fleet-in-being as long as I am able. The issue will soon become how to protect the oil on Sumatra and Java from strikes by his CVs.


I would suggest that if you have not done so, those two Islands in the IO near the DEI would be very useful if captured, built up, and provided with Long Range naval search. Parts of Northern and Western Australia would also be useful as well.


Agreed. I have not yet, though they are undefended.

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Post #: 163
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/3/2021 2:08:50 AM   
Wirraway_Ace


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From: Austin / Brisbane
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28-29 Jan 42

Interesting couple of turns. The enemy puts 150 P40Es on CAP over Brisbane, and they get the better of the Kido Butai sweeps and escorts, though the Kates and Vals wreck the remaining industry. We lose 15 Zeros, 10 Kates, and 2 Vals for 18 P40Es. The strike destroys 65 resources (130 VPs). These are the first loses of any significance to the KB airgroups, that is not the concern. That the enemy has 150 P40Es in Australia at the end of January is the concern. We only have about 50 Zeros, other than the carrier-based airgroups, in the theater.

Also, a bombardment attack at Port Moresby reveals the extent of the enemy commitment.
quote:

Ground combat at Port Moresby (98,130)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13183 troops, 114 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 458

Defending force 15328 troops, 220 guns, 173 vehicles, Assault Value = 520

Japanese ground losses:
71 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied ground losses:
6 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
4th Division

Defending units:
8th Australian Division
17th MG Battalion
19th MG Battalion
Torres Strait Battalion
30th Australian Brigade
2/1st Ind Coy
2/4th Ind Coy
2/3rd Ind Coy
2/2nd Ind Coy
2/4 MG Battalion
Port Moresby Brigade
15th RAAF Base Force
Eastern Command
147th Field Artillery Regiment
131st Field Artillery Battalion
148th Field Artillery Battalion
Rabaul Det. Base Force

We have another division currently unloading at Buna, a medium artillery regiment with 15cm guns and a corps HQs. There are five SNLFs and the 144th Inf Rgt also immediately available which would get us to about 1,500AV. We will probably need more. We also have three cruiser squadrons and a battleship division for bombardment. The cruisers have been hitting the base every few days. It looks like committing the battleships, with the corresponding fuel usage, will be worth it.

On Sumatra, the enemy sent a US destroyer squadron to raid our transports. They missed the troops, but sank two xAKs with supplies. Then our Vals and Mabels that had been training-up new pilots in the area over the past month caught them, proving 62% naval bombing skill is adequate...

quote:

Morning Air attack on TF, near Sabang at 44,70

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 19,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes

Japanese aircraft
D3A1 Val x 24

No Japanese losses

Allied Ships
DD Sims, Bomb hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Hammann, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage
DD Hughes, Bomb hits 3, heavy fires, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
17 x D3A1 Val releasing from 2000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb
7 x D3A1 Val releasing from 3000' *
Naval Attack: 2 x 60 kg GP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring DD Sims
Massive explosion on DD Hammann
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring DD Hammann


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Sabang at 44,70

Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 35 NM, estimated altitude 5,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
B5M1 Mabel x 8

No Japanese losses

Allied Ships
DD Anderson
DD Sims, Bomb hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B5M1 Mabel bombing from 4000 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 250 kg SAP Bomb
5 x B5M1 Mabel bombing from 4000 feet
Naval Attack: 2 x 250 kg SAP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring DD Sims


However, the presences of DD Sims in the Indian Ocean suggests his CVs are there too. He has used this technique before, of detaching his DD escorts to raid. I intend to invade Burma within the next two weeks, and would like to do it by sea, but it will be difficult without the KB if his CVs are in the Indian Ocean. It looks like the KB needs to stay to ensure the isolation and defeat of Port Moresby, and that will be a protracted fight. I can change plans and conduct the invasion of Burma by land. I think I will prepare for that possibility while testing his response to an amphibious assault with a move on the islands off the coast of Thailand in the Indian Ocean. Meanwhile, I have two veteran divisions not committed to any operation that I can send to the Port Moresby fight. When the Burma operation kicks off in earnest, that will leave me only a single division in reserve. I have been saving PPs, so it is time to start buying out another veteran division from Manchukuo.

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Post #: 164
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/3/2021 12:46:29 PM   
castor troy


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150 P-40 in one place means there aren't all that many left for other places. I think massing overall limited assets in one area is better than dispersing them all over the map. Wrecking a single P-40 squadron isn't all that hard, six of them is another story even though his pilots will only be in the high 50s low 60s at this date.

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Post #: 165
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/3/2021 5:49:15 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


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From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

150 P-40 in one place means there aren't all that many left for other places. I think massing overall limited assets in one area is better than dispersing them all over the map. Wrecking a single P-40 squadron isn't all that hard, six of them is another story even though his pilots will only be in the high 50s low 60s at this date.

I agree that massing them is a good strategy. I can, in turn, mass against them or use the white space that concentration creates as freedom of action.

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Post #: 166
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/6/2021 2:33:30 AM   
Wirraway_Ace


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From: Austin / Brisbane
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1Feb 42

S-170 puts a torpedo into an AVD trying to set up a seaplane base at Baker Island.


In China, we catch all three squadrons of the AVG on the ground at a level 1 airfield deep within the enemy's operational area. Recon had picked up this situation a few days before so we brought in some naval bombers with enough range to make a strike. He had some Chinese fighters conducting training as the pseudo CAP. The Zero escorts stayed at home, though it did not make much difference. We will wash and repeat over the next few days to see how many of the damaged aircraft can be destroyed. There is no rail line to Chengtu.
quote:

Morning Air attack on Chengtu , at 75,41

Weather in hex: Thunderstorms

Raid spotted at 35 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
G3M2 Nell x 29

Allied aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
G3M2 Nell: 2 destroyed, 4 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
H81-A3: 26 damaged
H81-A3: 2 destroyed on ground

Airbase hits 1
Airbase supply hits 4
Runway hits 26

Aircraft Attacking:
26 x G3M2 Nell bombing from 4000 feet
Airfield Attack: 2 x 250 kg GP Bomb, 4 x 60 kg GP Bomb

CAP engaged:
5th FG/29th FS CAF with I-15-III (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead
11th FG/41st FS CAF with I-16-III (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 10000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 10000.
Raid is overhead

Training flight from 5th FG/29th FS CAF has been caught up in attack
Training flight from 11th FG/41st FS CAF has been caught up in attack


In one of the stranger outcomes I have seen in ground combat, our shock attack against his weakened troops south of Sian forces 12 units to retreat, but four units (the last four in the combat report) stay in the hex. I am pretty sure they arrived in the hex this turn. They are a HQs and 3 arty units. I have not seen ground units, even those newly arrived, avoid combat before.

quote:

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 28552 troops, 289 guns, 705 vehicles, Assault Value = 1071

Defending force 24899 troops, 315 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 279

Japanese adjusted assault: 1133

Allied adjusted defense: 526

Japanese assault odds: 2 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Japanese ground losses:
1329 casualties reported
Squads: 8 destroyed, 128 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 32 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 9 disabled
Vehicles lost 77 (5 destroyed, 72 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
3426 casualties reported
Squads: 186 destroyed, 49 disabled
Non Combat: 276 destroyed, 43 disabled
Engineers: 4 destroyed, 9 disabled
Guns lost 40 (25 destroyed, 15 disabled)
Units retreated 12

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
4th Tank Regiment
6th/C Division
15th/B Division
8th Tank Regiment
13th Tank Regiment
2nd Tank Regiment
12th Tank Regiment
6th/B Division
15th Tank Regiment
15th/A Division
6th/A Division
15th/C Division
14th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
11th Army
15th Ind.Medium Field Artillery Regiment
1st Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
16th Chinese Corps
90th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps
20th Artillery Regiment
7th Artillery Regiment
18th Artillery Regiment
57th AT Gun Regiment
1st Artillery Regiment
4th Heavy Mortar Regiment
2nd Group Army
31st Group Army
5th War Area
3rd Heavy Mortar Regiment
22nd Group Army
22nd Artillery Regiment
56th AT Gun Regiment



(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 167
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/6/2021 5:48:12 PM   
castor troy


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From: Austria
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Happened to me quite often that some units stayed in the hex not retreating. And no, not because the adjusted av wasn't high enough to overcome the forts. Even had lonely arty units stay back after a whole army retreated.

Nice strike on Chengtu, not having real CAP there was careless.

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Post #: 168
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/7/2021 3:54:23 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


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From: Austin / Brisbane
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quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Happened to me quite often that some units stayed in the hex not retreating. And no, not because the adjusted av wasn't high enough to overcome the forts. Even had lonely arty units stay back after a whole army retreated.

Nice strike on Chengtu, not having real CAP there was careless.

Ah, thanks. I thought it odd, but sounds like it is not that unusual. It turned out to be two corps with about 60AV between them and two mortar regiments.

(in reply to castor troy)
Post #: 169
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/7/2021 6:43:21 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Happened to me quite often that some units stayed in the hex not retreating. And no, not because the adjusted av wasn't high enough to overcome the forts. Even had lonely arty units stay back after a whole army retreated.

Nice strike on Chengtu, not having real CAP there was careless.

Ah, thanks. I thought it odd, but sounds like it is not that unusual. It turned out to be two corps with about 60AV between them and two mortar regiments.



I'm not sure it's WAD though, I'd rather say it's a bug/glitch if it happens.

_____________________________


(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 170
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/7/2021 11:24:48 PM   
BBfanboy


Posts: 18046
Joined: 8/4/2010
From: Winnipeg, MB
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Happened to me quite often that some units stayed in the hex not retreating. And no, not because the adjusted av wasn't high enough to overcome the forts. Even had lonely arty units stay back after a whole army retreated.

Nice strike on Chengtu, not having real CAP there was careless.

Ah, thanks. I thought it odd, but sounds like it is not that unusual. It turned out to be two corps with about 60AV between them and two mortar regiments.



I'm not sure it's WAD though, I'd rather say it's a bug/glitch if it happens.

I'm not so sure it's a bug. IRL, it is not uncommon for some units to be cut off when the enemy breaks through. That might have been modeled as a chance of being unable to retreat.

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No matter how bad a situation is, you can always make it worse. - Chris Hadfield : An Astronaut's Guide To Life On Earth

(in reply to castor troy)
Post #: 171
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/7/2021 11:53:34 PM   
RangerJoe


Posts: 13450
Joined: 11/16/2015
From: My Mother, although my Father had some small part.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Happened to me quite often that some units stayed in the hex not retreating. And no, not because the adjusted av wasn't high enough to overcome the forts. Even had lonely arty units stay back after a whole army retreated.

Nice strike on Chengtu, not having real CAP there was careless.

Ah, thanks. I thought it odd, but sounds like it is not that unusual. It turned out to be two corps with about 60AV between them and two mortar regiments.



I'm not sure it's WAD though, I'd rather say it's a bug/glitch if it happens.

I'm not so sure it's a bug. IRL, it is not uncommon for some units to be cut off when the enemy breaks through. That might have been modeled as a chance of being unable to retreat.


Or they could be acting as a rear guard.

< Message edited by RangerJoe -- 12/8/2021 1:08:06 AM >


_____________________________

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(in reply to BBfanboy)
Post #: 172
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/8/2021 12:54:38 PM   
castor troy


Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: BBfanboy


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy


quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace


quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy

Happened to me quite often that some units stayed in the hex not retreating. And no, not because the adjusted av wasn't high enough to overcome the forts. Even had lonely arty units stay back after a whole army retreated.

Nice strike on Chengtu, not having real CAP there was careless.

Ah, thanks. I thought it odd, but sounds like it is not that unusual. It turned out to be two corps with about 60AV between them and two mortar regiments.



I'm not sure it's WAD though, I'd rather say it's a bug/glitch if it happens.

I'm not so sure it's a bug. IRL, it is not uncommon for some units to be cut off when the enemy breaks through. That might have been modeled as a chance of being unable to retreat.



I doubt that this is modelled, as it's not mentioned in the manual (doesn't mean much though) nor was it ever mentioned to work like this. In 99.9% units retreat if the adjusted av of the attacker is +1 higher than the forts of the defender. Then there are these rare cases where it doesn't work like 99.9% of the time.

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Post #: 173
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/11/2021 8:44:20 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline
2 - 3 Feb 42

East of Sian, we continue to wreck his units as he feeds them in one at a time. Of the six corps in the hex, only one has an AV now over 50. I am not sure why he has so many HQs units in the mix. Almost one-to-one. We have 6 tank regiments and four divisions. Stacking limits mean we rotate the four divisions into the hex, two at a time.

quote:

Ground combat at 87,41 (near Tsiaotso)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 29131 troops, 247 guns, 790 vehicles, Assault Value = 1227

Defending force 34286 troops, 230 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 593

Japanese adjusted assault: 405

Allied adjusted defense: 1111

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
537 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 54 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 9 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Vehicles lost 43 (1 destroyed, 42 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
3522 casualties reported
Squads: 55 destroyed, 77 disabled
Non Combat: 5 destroyed, 85 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 14 disabled
Guns lost 37 (1 destroyed, 36 disabled)

Assaulting units:
27th Electric Engineer Regiment
41st Division
3rd Tank Regiment
10th Tank Regiment
23rd Tank Regiment
110th Division
9th Tank Regiment
5th Tank Regiment
11th Tank Regiment
6th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
27th Fld AA Gun Co
15th AA Regiment
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment
1st Army
16th Field AA Machinecannon Company

Defending units:
8th Route Army
42nd Chinese Corps
96th Chinese Corps
76th Chinese Corps
93rd Chinese Corps
2nd Chinese Cavalry Corps
36th Group Army
18th Group Army
15th Group Army
8th Group Army
43rd Chinese Corps


South of Sian, those two corps that refused to retreat, along with the suicidal heavy mortar regiments hang on against our tired tanks and troops. Check out their adjusted AV! There is nothing left in those units, but the generate almost 4 times their unadjusted AV. That said, I don't want to shock attack and destroy them, only force them to retreat.

quote:

Ground combat at 84,43 (near Sian)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 27827 troops, 289 guns, 703 vehicles, Assault Value = 968

Defending force 13564 troops, 159 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 62

Japanese adjusted assault: 380

Allied adjusted defense: 223

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), disruption(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
108 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 10 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Vehicles lost 9 (1 destroyed, 8 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
402 casualties reported
Squads: 63 destroyed, 14 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 9 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 3 disabled
Guns lost 42 (27 destroyed, 15 disabled)

Assaulting units:
4th Tank Regiment
6th/B Division
15th Tank Regiment
13th Tank Regiment
15th/B Division
15th/A Division
2nd Tank Regiment
6th/A Division
8th Tank Regiment
6th/C Division
12th Tank Regiment
15th/C Division
25th Field AA Machinecannon Company
15th Ind.Medium Field Artillery Regiment
14th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
11th Army
1st Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
90th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps
3rd Heavy Mortar Regiment
4th Heavy Mortar Regiment


Elsewhere, our troops are on the outskirts of Sorabaya. He apparently had the Dutch cruiser CL Sumatra at the base, which he sorted into Java sea. It sank an empty xAKL on the night of the 2nd. It then retreated back to port on the third, as expected. Also as expected, he threw up his last remaining fighters on Java to fly CAP over the ship. We sent in Zeros and Oscars to sweep the base and they downed half of the 9 B-339Ds. Betty's did not fly. We will try hitting the port tomorrow. Further north, I accidently ordered a regiment to attack the Dutch in the mountains with an errant click of my finger. It did not go well. The enemy, seeing what he thought was an opening, ordered his troops to shock attack the next turn. That did not go well for the attacker either.

Our convoys with three divisions have left Singapore on there way to Burma. We have 4 BBs, 8 CAs, 4 CLs and 20 DDs along with 8 SS. The 11 Air Fleet has 150 Oscars and 45 Zeros along with 60 Nells, 27 Vals, and 9 Mabels. The RN is likely to have 1 BC (the R's should not yet be in Theater), 10 CLs, 10 DDs, 1 CV, 1 CVL and potentially 2-3 USN CVs and their escorts. They also have 4 British and Dutch submarines operating off the Malaya coast. There are currently no fighters or bombers in Burma, though they can be easily flown in from India.

We will conduct a preparatory invasion of Port Blair tonight with an amphibious convoy that is not yet sighted. The enemy appears to have belatedly decided to base float planes at Port Blair. Nells on navsearch sighted an AVP approaching Port Blair. If it continues, it will arrive to find IJN DDs patrolling the port and the nearby islands.

At Port Moresby, we continue to build up our forces and isolate the base. By midmonth we will have four divisions for the the attack.



(in reply to castor troy)
Post #: 174
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/14/2021 11:06:32 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline
6 Feb 42

The enemy is pulling out of southern Burma, railing most of his troops to Lashio and Myitkyina. Our invasion task forces are about three days out. The plan is to land at Pegu and use three paratroop battalions throughout his operational depth. Dinahs operating out of Port Blair have spotted three enemy ships in the Bay of Bengal about 240nm NW of the Andaman Islands. Our assessment is these are likely to be a destroyer squadron testing our air coverage. The rest of his fleet is probably loitering further out of air search range.

500nm northeast of Pearl Harbor, one of submarines patrolling the San Fran - Pearl Harbor route runs across eleven destroyers. Neither side scores. Intelligence believes this taskforce is probably running interference for a convoy of tankers. The rest of the wolfpack will close-in.

On Java, we find out what he has left to defend Soerabaja.
quote:

Ground combat at Soerabaja (56,104)

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13216 troops, 118 guns, 42 vehicles, Assault Value = 978

Defending force 8727 troops, 60 guns, 4 vehicles, Assault Value = 166

Assaulting units:
38th Division
18th Division
6th Tank Regiment
35th Field AA Battalion

Defending units:
Artilleriecommando Coastal Gun Battalion
2nd KNIL Landstorm Battalion
3rd KNIL Landstorm Battalion
MLD
South Java Base Force
Commandement Marine
Soerabaja Base Force


In China, we finally break his defenses south of Sian.
quote:

Ground combat at 84,43 (near Sian)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 25833 troops, 289 guns, 289 vehicles, Assault Value = 1060

Defending force 12621 troops, 72 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 43

Japanese adjusted assault: 596

Allied adjusted defense: 172

Japanese assault odds: 3 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), morale(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
66 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 5 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled

Allied ground losses:
3959 casualties reported
Squads: 314 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 214 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 8 destroyed, 13 disabled
Guns lost 9 (4 destroyed, 5 disabled)
Units retreated 2

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

Assaulting units:
15th/A Division
8th Tank Regiment
6th/B Division
15th Tank Regiment
12th Tank Regiment
4th Tank Regiment
15th/B Division
13th Tank Regiment
6th/A Division
2nd Tank Regiment
6th/C Division
15th/C Division
11th Army
25th Field AA Machinecannon Company
14th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
15th Ind.Medium Field Artillery Regiment
1st Medium Field Artillery Regiment

Defending units:
90th Chinese Corps
92nd Chinese Corps


And in the mountains east of Sian, the end is also near. Good to see he is low on supply too.
quote:

Ground combat at 87,41 (near Tsiaotso)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 29764 troops, 250 guns, 842 vehicles, Assault Value = 1209

Defending force 23586 troops, 162 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 394

Japanese adjusted assault: 556

Allied adjusted defense: 307

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), fatigue(-), experience(-), supply(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1162 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 110 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 20 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 17 disabled
Vehicles lost 27 (3 destroyed, 24 disabled)

Allied ground losses:
2748 casualties reported
Squads: 128 destroyed, 185 disabled
Non Combat: 20 destroyed, 157 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 10 disabled
Guns lost 28 (5 destroyed, 23 disabled)

Assaulting units:
110th Division
27th Electric Engineer Regiment
41st Division
3rd Tank Regiment
9th Tank Regiment
10th Tank Regiment
5th Tank Regiment
23rd Tank Regiment
11th Tank Regiment
Botanko Hvy Gun Regiment
6th Medium Field Artillery Regiment
1st Army
27th Fld AA Gun Co
15th AA Regiment
16th Field AA Machinecannon Company

Defending units:
76th Chinese Corps
42nd Chinese Corps
8th Route Army
2nd Chinese Cavalry Corps
15th Group Army
36th Group Army
18th Group Army
8th Group Army
43rd Chinese Corps







< Message edited by Wirraway_Ace -- 12/14/2021 11:07:08 PM >

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 175
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/15/2021 12:47:03 AM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline
The enemy also appears to be trying to supply the 28,000 Australian troops he has at Port Moresby by submarine. He has at least three submarines making turns from Cairns. If he is low on supply it makes one of his earlier moves more sensical. When the Kido Butai first appeared off Papua New Guinea, I was surprised by DesertWolf leaving transports offloading with enemy carriers in the vicinity. It was an obvious risk, and he does not appear to take those. I now guess he was trying to get a bit more supply into the base, and was willing to take the losses. However, I may be misreading this. Is short supply, or just using every tool available anticipating a time when he will be?

< Message edited by Wirraway_Ace -- 12/15/2021 2:12:24 AM >

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 176
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/23/2021 7:24:54 PM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline
7-8 Feb 42

Slow turns on my part due to financial year-end, employee bonuses, partner bonuses etc. at work.

In China, our armor pincers (really more like battering rams) are closing in on Sian from the East and South. Our bombers have switched from close support to attacking enemy reserves.

No surprise, Wenchow is going to be a grind.
quote:

Ground combat at Wenchow (89,58)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 39066 troops, 367 guns, 318 vehicles, Assault Value = 1429

Defending force 24975 troops, 118 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 761

Japanese adjusted assault: 2058

Allied adjusted defense: 2527

Japanese assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 2)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
1986 casualties reported
Squads: 7 destroyed, 255 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 14 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 30 disabled

Allied ground losses:
870 casualties reported
Squads: 4 destroyed, 71 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 33 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled

Assaulting units:
17th Division
22nd Division
39th Division
7th Tank Regiment
3rd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
1st Hvy.Artillery Regiment
13th Army
2nd Ind.Hvy.Art. Battalion
10th Ind. Mountain Gun Regiment

Defending units:
100th Chinese Corps
28th Chinese Corps
88th Chinese Corps
16th Construction Regiment
10th Group Army
25th Group Army
3rd War Area
14th Chinese Base Force

On Java, Soerabaja falls
quote:

Ground combat at Soerabaja (56,104)

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 13881 troops, 118 guns, 144 vehicles, Assault Value = 979

Defending force 8726 troops, 60 guns, 4 vehicles, Assault Value = 166

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 2

Japanese adjusted assault: 392

Allied adjusted defense: 81

Japanese assault odds: 4 to 1 (fort level 2)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Soerabaja !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: forts(+), experience(-)
Attacker:

Japanese ground losses:
218 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 18 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied ground losses:
8987 casualties reported
Squads: 219 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 1000 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 68 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 75 (75 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 5 (5 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units destroyed 7

Assaulting units:
18th Division
38th Division
6th Tank Regiment
35th Field AA Battalion
35th Fld AA Gun Co

Defending units:
2nd KNIL Landstorm Battalion
Artilleriecommando Coastal Gun Battalion
3rd KNIL Landstorm Battalion
South Java Base Force
MLD
Commandement Marine
Soerabaja Base Force


At Port Moresby, the enemy is not low on supply...
quote:

Ground combat at Port Moresby (98,130)

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 12695 troops, 194 guns, 167 vehicles, Assault Value = 524

Defending force 14117 troops, 131 guns, 2 vehicles, Assault Value = 478

Japanese ground losses:
571 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 29 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 3 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Assaulting units:
2/1st Ind Coy
30th Australian Brigade
2/3rd Ind Coy
2/4th Ind Coy
2/2nd Ind Coy
17th MG Battalion
19th MG Battalion
8th Australian Division
2/4 MG Battalion
Torres Strait Battalion
Port Moresby Brigade
Eastern Command
15th RAAF Base Force
131st Field Artillery Battalion
148th Field Artillery Battalion
147th Field Artillery Regiment
Rabaul Det. Base Force

Defending units:
4th/B Division
4th/A Division
Maizuru 1st SNLF
4th/C Division


I have three more divisions and corps artillery closing in, but those US artillery battalions are going to kill a lot of Japanese soldiers.

Burma Theatre

All the Allied submarines in theatre are patrolling in deep water hexes off the southwest coast of Malaya near Phuket, hoping to intercept convoys headed to Burma. There aren't any within hundreds of miles of there. Dinahs operating from Port Blair have identified 12 RN cruisers loitering 16 hexes away from Rangoon and he moved 30 fighters into southern Burma. His plan appears to be to run all his quick shooting 6" CLs in at full speed against my amphibious TFs. He will probably send in DDs in separate 4 ship divisions while CAPing his ships, hoping to catch unescorted Vals, Nells, or Bettys. His CVs are also likely nearby. He does not have good air search of the area, though, which is unusual for him. He is currently blind to my movements.

This is an interesting tactical naval problem. The enemy likes to use all his CLs in a large TF with no destroyers, or just one or two. These cruisers will eat up my excellent destroyers in a day action at the end of their long run in. So, I think I will organize my covering forces into one TF with the two Kongos, 4 Nachis and 4 Mogamis commanded by Tanaka, and another made up of smaller DDs that will provide close cover, leaving the two Nagatos and all the big DDs in reserve nearby. It doesn't look like there is any role for the Kitakamis in this fight. They will wait for the arrival of the R class BBs, targets more to their liking. Our submarine wolfpack is positioned to have shots at his ships as they rush in. These are low percentage shots at ships making flank speed, but they will also have some potential chances with damage ships trying to get back to India or Ceylon.

I have 150 Oscars, 45 zeros and 15 Nates for air cover/escort and 72 Nells and 27 Vals for naval attack.

< Message edited by Wirraway_Ace -- 12/23/2021 7:28:53 PM >

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 177
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/29/2021 1:01:44 AM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline
10 Feb 42
Our transports carrying three divisions, armor and artillery sprint in unimpeded towards Pegu. Numerous enemy submarines are observed racing north from their patrol locations near Phuket and 12 surface ships are in the middle of the Bay of Bengal. However, if the RN was caught out of position, not so for the RAF, FAA and USAAF.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 10 NM, estimated altitude 15,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 18
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 8

Allied aircraft
Albacore I x 2
Hurricane IIb Trop x 43
Swordfish I x 7

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 4 destroyed
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 4 destroyed
Hurricanes on LRCAP from the adjacent Rangoon whip our outnumbered Zeros and Oscars on LRCAP from bases 5 hexes away. The rest of the CAP fighters are above the heavy covering force one hex further south. The enemy ignores the combat ships.

Allied aircraft losses
Albacore I: 1 destroyed, 1 damaged
Hurricane IIb Trop: 2 destroyed
Swordfish I: 1 destroyed, 2 damaged

Japanese Ships
xAP Ussuri Maru
xAK Mikasa Maru
xAP Kongo Maru

Aircraft Attacking:
5 x Swordfish I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo
1 x Albacore I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo

CAP engaged:
1st Sentai/A with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 6000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 6000.
Raid is overhead
Tainan Ku S-1 with A6M2 Zero (18 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
18 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 16000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 16000.
Raid is overhead
64th Sentai Det with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (4 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
4 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 6000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 6000.
Raid is overhead



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 11 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
Albacore I x 16
Hurricane IIb Trop x 4

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
AK Kinka Maru
xAK Hawaii Maru, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk (she was carrying supplies)
xAK Yamasimo Maru, Torpedo hits 1
xAP Shanghai Maru, Torpedo hits 1, heavy fires
xAP Dairen Maru

Japanese ground losses:
104 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 12 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 7 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 1 disabled
Vehicles lost 4 (1 destroyed, 3 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
16 x Albacore I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid spotted at 8 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIb Trop x 31
SB2U-3 Vindicator x 16

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
xAK Mikasa Maru
xAK Manila Maru, Bomb hits 1, on fire
xAK Kenyo Maru, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAK Zenyo Maru, Bomb hits 1
xAK Nako Maru, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires

Japanese ground losses:
241 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 26 disabled
Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 16 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 3 (1 destroyed, 2 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x SB2U-3 Vindicator releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
10 x SB2U-3 Vindicator releasing from 4000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring xAK Kenyo Maru

Afternoon phase.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 13,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 12
Ki-43-Ic Oscar x 6

Allied aircraft
Albacore I x 16
Fulmar II x 14
Hurricane IIa Trop x 30
Hurricane IIb Trop x 18
Swordfish I x 3

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 3 destroyed
Ki-43-Ic Oscar: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Fulmar II: 1 destroyed

Japanese Ships
xAK Kirishima Maru, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
CL Kashii
xAP Taizan Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Seian Maru
xAK Kaiko Maru
xAK Asahisan Maru, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
xAK Mikasa Maru, Torpedo hits 3, and is sunk

Japanese ground losses:
143 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 2 destroyed, 15 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Swordfish I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo
16 x Albacore I launching torpedoes at 200 feet
Naval Attack: 1 x 18in Mk XII Torpedo
6 x Fulmar II sweeping at 10000 feet *

CAP engaged:
1st Sentai/A with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (3 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 6000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 6000.
Raid is overhead
Tainan Ku S-1 with A6M2 Zero (12 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
12 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 16000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 16000.
Raid is overhead
64th Sentai Det with Ki-43-Ic Oscar (3 airborne, 0 on standby, 0 scrambling)
3 plane(s) intercepting now.
Group patrol altitude is 6000 , scrambling fighters between 0 and 6000.
Raid is overhead



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here come the Vindicators
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 18 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIa Trop x 29
Hurricane IIb Trop x 3
SB2U-3 Vindicator x 16

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
xAP Baikal Maru
xAP Kanzyu Maru, Bomb hits 1, heavy fires
xAP Kokuryu Maru
xAP Dairen Maru, Bomb hits 2, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAP Shanghai Maru, heavy fires, heavy damage

Japanese ground losses:
511 casualties reported
Squads: 7 destroyed, 45 disabled
Non Combat: 4 destroyed, 33 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 9 disabled
Guns lost 16 (5 destroyed, 11 disabled)
Vehicles lost 1 (1 destroyed, 0 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
6 x SB2U-3 Vindicator releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
2 x SB2U-3 Vindicator releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb
8 x SB2U-3 Vindicator releasing from 4000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 1000 lb SAP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring xAP Dairen Maru
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring a Heian Maru class xAP


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now the B17s from bases in India
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 20 NM, estimated altitude 6,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIb Trop x 16
B-17D Fortress x 8
B-17E Fortress x 28

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
xAK Kirishima Maru, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAP Ussuri Maru
xAP Kongo Maru
xAP Naminoue Maru
xAP Taizan Maru, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAP Keihuku Maru
xAK Hokuroku Maru
CL Tama
xAK Kano Maru
xAP Hoten Maru
xAK Asakasan Maru
xAP Shanghai Maru, heavy fires, heavy damage

Japanese ground losses:
456 casualties reported
Squads: 4 destroyed, 31 disabled
Non Combat: 8 destroyed, 54 disabled
Engineers: 1 destroyed, 2 disabled
Vehicles lost 2 (1 destroyed, 1 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
2 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
2 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
2 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
2 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring a Toho Cargo class xAK
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring a Japanese xAP
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring a Kanzyu Maru class xAP


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 17 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIa Trop x 15
Hurricane IIb Trop x 34
B-17D Fortress x 10

Allied aircraft losses
B-17D Fortress: 1 damaged

Japanese Ships
xAP Ukishima Maru
xAK Manila Maru, heavy fires, heavy damage
xAP Shanghai Maru, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk

Japanese ground losses:
912 casualties reported
Squads: 17 destroyed, 39 disabled
Non Combat: 13 destroyed, 24 disabled
Engineers: 10 destroyed, 10 disabled
Guns lost 9 (6 destroyed, 3 disabled)
Vehicles lost 4 (2 destroyed, 2 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb
3 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb SAP Bomb
4 x B-17D Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb SAP Bomb

Heavy smoke from fires obscuring a Toho Cargo class xAK
Heavy smoke from fires obscuring a Japanese AK


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on TF, near Pegu at 55,53

Weather in hex: Severe storms

Raid spotted at 9 NM, estimated altitude 5,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 2 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIa Trop x 14
Hurricane IIb Trop x 31
B-17E Fortress x 3

No Allied losses

Japanese Ships
xAK Kano Maru

Japanese ground losses:
121 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 20 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Guns lost 6 (1 destroyed, 5 disabled)

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x B-17E Fortress bombing from 5000 feet *
Naval Attack: 4 x 500 lb GP Bomb

When the day was over, I lost three transports outright, 3 more crippled, and 50 squads out of three divisions (10 each from the Imperial Guards and the 5th Div, and 30 from the 33rd Div). About 2/3rds of each division, an armor regiment, and 10,000 tons of supply got ashore. The artillery did not get unloaded. The divisions are in good order and Pegu is lightly held. The enemy did not attack a single combat ship either in the invasion hex or the adjacent BB/CA cover force (which had the other half of the CAP).
My losses in troops were light because the amphib TF included 3 empty transports to help rescue troops, and most of other transports were only partially full.
I will withdraw the transports, except the cripples, and unload at Tavoy. The army can march along the coastal highway to join the lead elements, since Moulmein will also fall next turn.




< Message edited by Wirraway_Ace -- 12/29/2021 1:41:44 AM >

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 178
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/29/2021 1:39:28 AM   
Wirraway_Ace


Posts: 1400
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Austin / Brisbane
Status: offline
11 Feb 42
The three crippled transports finish unloading at Pegu, then sink, bringing our total losses to 6 transports. All the other damaged vessels easily make Tavoy and unload the remainder of the troops. There are four moderately damaged transports, none in danger of sinking. Not a single combat ship was scratched. The enemy surface ships did not make an appearance, and his submarines refused to risk entering the shallows after our ships moving along the coast. To be fair, those submarines were also under constant harassment from Bettys on ASW from bases along the coast.

With the unloading finished, I was able to confirm the troop losses to be light, particularly given the number of transports hit. A total of 50 squads across three divisions were lost, and another 20 disabled. These losses (about 5%) will not affect our operations.

Up to the last moment, I questioned whether to go ahead with the operation. Pegu is a predictable target, but it appeared DW never really had a good sense of where the transport TFs were--or, the positioning of his large submarine wolfpack was a deception. The transports were not sighted in the lead up to the attack, yet his air force was fully ready. Either he was able to predict the timing and target based on when Port Blair fell (certainly a possibility), or he got last minute sigint once the invasion taskforce was given its final destination (also possible).
In the end, the operation looks to have been successful. Pegu and Moulmein fell on the same day, and the enemy has left Rangoon lightly defended. Our initial goal was to take Rangoon by the end of the month to cut supply flow to China. Rangoon seems likely to fall before the 15th.

In retrospect, I spent two weeks assembling the ships to conduct the operation, as the Java invasion had to be done first. I might have been better off transporting the troops to Bangkok using whatever transports I could make available, and invading overland. The enemy's initial deployments suggested he might try to hold the jungle/river hex north of Moulmein. That could have been a bloody fight. In the end, I think the amphibious invasion was the best option, though whether an alternate landing site other than Pegu should have been chosen as less predictable is open to debate.

(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 179
RE: Requiem for Tomorrow Wirraway (J) v DesertWolf (A) - 12/29/2021 1:43:57 AM   
njp72

 

Posts: 1372
Joined: 9/20/2008
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Wirraway_Ace

11 Feb 42
The three crippled transports finish unloading at Pegu, then sink, bringing our total losses to 6 transports. All the other damaged vessels easily make Tavoy and unload the remainder of the troops. There are four moderately damaged transports, none in danger of sinking. Not a single combat ship was scratched. The enemy surface ships did not make an appearance, and his submarines refused to risk entering the shallows after our ships moving along the coast. To be fair, those submarines were also under constant harassment from Bettys on ASW from bases along the coast.

With the unloading finished, I was able to confirm the troop losses to be light, particularly given the number of transports hit. A total of 50 squads across three divisions were lost, and another 20 disabled. These losses (about 5%) will not affect our operations.

Up to the last moment, I questioned whether to go ahead with the operation. Pegu is a predictable target, but it appeared DW never really had a good sense of where the transport TFs were--or, the positioning of his large submarine wolfpack was a deception. The transports were not sighted in the lead up to the attack, yet his air force was fully ready. Either he was able to predict the timing and target based on when Port Blair fell (certainly a possibility), or he got last minute sigint once the invasion taskforce was given its final destination (also possible).
In the end, the operation looks to have been successful. Pegu and Moulmein fell on the same day, and the enemy has left Rangoon lightly defended. Our initial goal was to take Rangoon by the end of the month to cut supply flow to China. Rangoon seems likely to fall before the 15th.

In retrospect, I spent two weeks assembling the ships to conduct the operation, as the Java invasion had to be done first. I might have been better off transporting the troops to Bangkok using whatever transports I could make available, and invading overland. The enemy's initial deployments suggested he might try to hold the jungle/river hex north of Moulmein. That could have been a bloody fight. In the end, I think the amphibious invasion was the best option, though whether an alternate landing site other than Pegu should have been chosen as less predictable is open to debate.


Speed is the key, push hard and ignore the losses (just don't lose CVs everything is expendable).

The more you can get into a knife fight in early 42 with Commonwealth infantry around Burma and India the happier you will be.


(in reply to Wirraway_Ace)
Post #: 180
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