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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> A really stupid question

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A really stupid question - 5/14/2004 10:17:27 AM

Onime No Kyo

Posts: 16842
Joined: 4/28/2004
Status: offline

Hi guys.

If anything this should give you guys a laugh.

Although I'm a sim gamer with enough experience to be proud of, my familiarity with the Pacific is limited to Koei's P.T.O. on the Genesis console, WW2: Battles in the South Pacific (if anyone remembers that gem), and UV.

My historical knowledge of the area is also about fair to middling.

My question is this. In every Pac simulation I've ever seen, surface units seem to be nigh-well useless. They make juicy targets for LBA, even jiucier meat for CBA and not much besides. Bombardment I have only seen to be effective in one single case, Lunga (and only in UV). Surface action I have seen work nicely but only about one time out of five (the other times being complete massacres by air). Basically, what I have always used it for is to flesh out my AA protection of the CVs.

Now I know that I have only played the AI. I also know that I wouldnt stand a chance against most of you wise-guys

, but is this essentially right or am I completely off?

Having said that, is there even any great point to saving the ABDA navy besides the sentimental and VP values? Is there anything that would suggest a workable advantage to Japan's corner of the market in BBs until '44?

And a bit off the topic. Suva was a brilliant stroke. But is there any real point to it besides causing raver to lose sleep? Wouldnt it be more practicable to gobble up the SRA, fortify it and then throw your effort accross the central pacific right at PH (god forbid Pasternaksi will read this)?

I'm not sure why, but all my games have always turned out to be CV hunts (once again AI only, no wise-guys). So essentially, I end up spending the first half sinking hulls and the second, taking realestate. Is this not how it turns out for you guys?

Thanks,

ps....hope it was a hearty laugh

(in reply to stubby331)

Post #: 391

RE: A really stupid question - 5/14/2004 2:17:18 PM

sven6345789

Posts: 1050
Joined: 3/8/2004
From: Sandviken, Sweden
Status: offline

Well, in WITP., the hunting grounds are much larger.
happy hunting!!

_____________________________

Bougainville, November 1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9. It rained today.

Letter from a U.S. Marine,November 1943

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)

Post #: 392

RE: A really stupid question - 5/14/2004 2:22:32 PM

DoomedMantis

Posts: 1922
Joined: 8/24/2002
From: Sydney, Australia
Status: offline

Bombardments are very useful, and even more important in WitP do to the increased effect that CD's have on invasion TF's

Also the most effective way to wipe out transoprts unloading is still an aggressive commander in charge of your TF. There is also the fact that the only real way to protect aginst this is if your forces are there as well.

Carriers cant be everywhere, especially in WitP

_____________________________

I shall make it a felony to drink small beer.

- Shakespeare

(in reply to sven6345789)

Post #: 393

RE: A really stupid question - 5/14/2004 2:32:22 PM

Raverdave

Posts: 6520
Joined: 2/8/2002
From: Melb. Australia
Status: offline

Yup I shall echo what has been said...............the map is friggn HUGE so there will be little or none "CV hunting" in the early few years of the game, but from '44 onwards the allied player will be loading his CVs to hunt bear.

_____________________________

Never argue with an idiot, he will only drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

(in reply to DoomedMantis)

Post #: 394

RE: A really stupid question - 5/14/2004 6:00:38 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

This turn was very very quiet. In Malaya things haven't stalled - I'm just waiting for the proper application of overwhelming force (thanks Winnie!) so Raver-the-Wonderful looses as many troops there as possible. less to kill in the DEI that way.

Several new, fresher Divisions that had been assigned to the Southern Area Army but not initially used in any invasions are embarking for the PI for the end game there. Until then - my troops that originally landed at Legaspi have reached Manila, finally. They will test the defences there this turn, and we'll see what happens. Hoping that Raver has all of his army tied up at Tugeragao and Clark (where I outnumber him in both palces - but not by enough to drive him out).

If I have outflanked the bastard, i'll steal manila out from behind his troops and beat him to Bataan. Dugout Dug is probably wetting himself at the thought of my Samurai Sword stuck up his ass!

In other operations, Rabaul was reinforced last turn, with lots of supplies and guns arriving to form a CD unit/fort/jump off point for my next assault.

Perhaps most importantly, probably the largest convoys in any witp/UV game to date, code named "Big Mamma 1" and "Bigger, Badder Mamma 2" (it looses something when you translate it out of japanese) arrived at Osaka - a little creative route selection and these two invaluable convoys escaped Raver's subs altogether.

Between them there were over 150 ships, mostly transports and tankers packed to the rafters with oil and resources - especially from Saigon/Camranh bay/Brunei/kendari. Basically I had big stockpiles at these locations that were just getting bigger - but were doing my economy absolutely no good. Now that it is all arriving in Japan - I can safely assure the emperor that our economy is stronger than ever. All those locations are now drained of oil and resources, but that is ok - by the time I've captured the bases in malaya, China, Borneo and of course PI and DEI, these bases will have renewed stockpiles (and my economy will be WAY in the black, instead of just temporarily).

A few damaged ships made port this turn, and a few other ships refitted and reloaded for continuing ops. I shuffled some air squadrons around, and the fighting in china wears on, grinding down both sides at Homan and Wuchow (but soon I'll have done enough to win one or both (then of course the other would fall quickly).

At Rangoon my troops prepare their next assault, while the 1st tank regiment secures their supply lines.

Every turn or so raver tries to slip a single transport out of manila (gets caught by 50+ betties all alone in the middle of the celebe straight - outcome not really in doubt).

I'm guessing that he has now had too much time in the PI and Malaya and is probably evacuating his planes left right and centre using all his accumulated PP points. One thing I should have done on turn 1 was invade Cagayan and wine out the b17s there on the ground. That mistake will haunt me later on perhaps.

Snot Pus and Phlegm stand by, as Raver's cvs have not been sighted. But then, neither have mine ;)

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Raverdave)

Post #: 395

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 6:26:02 AM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

Another very quiet turn as the sieges at Wuchow, Homan, Rangoon, Johore Bharu, Clark, Tugeragao and Manila continue.

However, my probing of the defences at manila has revealed that I've outflanked Raver - and outnumber him there by 2 to 1 at least! We'll see if I can't snatch it, move some nates in and strafe the defenders at Clark to oblivion. Raver has long since saved his aircraft in the area.

Nothing big planned in the near future, so Raver, feel free to relax for a few turns.

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 396

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 6:42:02 AM

Capt. Harlock

Posts: 5358
Joined: 9/15/2001
From: Los Angeles
Status: offline

quote:

Nothing big planned in the near future, so Raver, feel free to relax for a few turns.

Tell it to the marines!

_____________________________

Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn't every war fought between men, between brothers?

--Victor Hugo

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 397

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 7:38:20 AM

Raverdave

Posts: 6520
Joined: 2/8/2002
From: Melb. Australia
Status: offline

Many ships have managed to be slipped out of the PI without being found, about 1 in 10 have been spotted (and then quickly sunk) but at least am still getting ships out. Luskan is right, I have been slowly getting my good air units out of the PI and most of them are now safely tucked away in Australia to be used for the defence of the mainland.
It will be interesting to see what happens at Rangoon in the next few days when Luskan attacks again as last time he got the snot kicked out of him, and I am sure that I can repeat that process again.

Jap troops have now reached Manila from the south, but not in the numbers needed to take the city, but they do at least pose a threat to my troops in Clark if they can take Manila fast, so I am going to have to factor that into my defensive plans.

I have now lost sight of Bananananana boys CVs so I am in two minds in regards to using them for a planned raid. Pearl has just had a huge convoy arrive which has brough much needed supplies (and a few Inf Divs as well....chew on that thought ratbrain).

_____________________________

Never argue with an idiot, he will only drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 398

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 7:51:01 AM

mogami

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From: You can't get here from there
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Ask Luskan about ships that have made it out of SRA......last turn at least 4 ships were sunk by Japanese air attack at Darwin. (including the CL Perth) The Japanese have a very long arm

(Raver where is my turn?)(never mind seems I have been sitting on it since Wen)

< Message edited by Mogami -- 5/15/2004 1:17:01 AM >

_____________________________

I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

(in reply to Raverdave)

Post #: 399

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 9:38:54 AM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

bah - you'll try for suva (use the reinforcements to help that nz inf unit next door to get over to suva and take it). Failing that, rabaul or wake. Do your worst.

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to mogami)

Post #: 400

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 4:55:46 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

Well, Homan fell, and I enjoyed watching Raver's little army scurry up the road. Unfortunately, everywhere else, from Rangoon to Clark to Johore to Wuchow stalled. Seems I am overextended and I should be trying to steal Tarakan as well.

Also, My troops unlaoded onto two little bases in the PI to find one of Raver's Filipino divisions sitting there - and they mauled one of my naval guards units! Will be leaving them to starve for a while I think.

My betties at Brunei missing ships passing by - something keeps them from using torps? Sure as hell isn't the range.

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 401

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 6:01:08 PM

mogami

Posts: 12789
Joined: 8/23/2000
From: You can't get here from there
Status: offline

Brunei is only a size 3 airfield. Betty/Nell require a size 4 so all attacks from there use extended range loads.

_____________________________

I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 402

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 10:43:29 PM

Onime No Kyo

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Joined: 4/28/2004
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Interesting how that works. There are all these wonderful little details that never made it into the UV manual (unless this doesnt apply to UV).

(in reply to mogami)

Post #: 403

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 10:47:34 PM

Mr.Frag

Posts: 13410
Joined: 12/18/2002
From: Purgatory
Status: offline

If the manual sucks blame me not 2by3. I did the master edit to cut down the 70+ pages into what amounted to the history of whats changed

Lots of stuff in those patch notes but really, a lot of it simply makes sense so it should not be that tough to grasp all the new concepts.

The economy stuff will require you to play "what if?" with a pad and calculator but that really cannot be helped. I would suggest you just leave it alone for a while. I must confess that I still make a lot of mistakes here doing the math to make sure I get the best out of the design.

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)

Post #: 404

RE: A really stupid question - 5/15/2004 11:29:34 PM

mogami

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From: You can't get here from there
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Onime No Kyo

Interesting how that works. There are all these wonderful little details that never made it into the UV manual (unless this doesnt apply to UV).

Hi in UV manual 16.3 effects of airfield size are given. WITP has further size requirements. (4 Engine bombers require a size 7 airfield to avoid penalty)(it might be B-17 need a 6 and B-29 need a 7)

< Message edited by Mogami -- 5/15/2004 7:28:43 PM >

_____________________________

I'm not retreating, I'm attacking in a different direction!

(in reply to Onime No Kyo)

Post #: 405

RE: A really stupid question - 5/16/2004 6:39:37 AM

Raverdave

Posts: 6520
Joined: 2/8/2002
From: Melb. Australia
Status: offline

Luskan's troops are now over extended and worn out in all areas of the map. The PI continues to defiy the odds and still holds back the yellow hord. The same for Malaya and in some places in China. Simply put Luskan's troops are exhausted and it will be to his cost. In the big clashes in China he is now loosing 2000 troops per attack, a sure sign that his men are on the edge. What he SHOULD be doing is resting one hex away, and then launching an attack. At this rate the PI mat well hold out until Feb and Singapore should be ok till at least the 15th of Jan.

_____________________________

Never argue with an idiot, he will only drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

(in reply to mogami)

Post #: 406

RE: A really stupid question - 5/16/2004 10:58:05 AM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

Raver spoke too soon. Yes my troops are tired, but not so tired that he can shock attack me at 1 to 3 or 1 to 2.5 odds and get away with it! I have 900 more guns than he does at Wuchow for crying out loud. It was like mass allied suicide this turn - but I'm not complaining. It is actually easier for Raver to kill his own troops than for me to kill them.

With Homan fallen I am chasing Raver's pathetic rag tag group down the road to Sian. There i'll crush them once and for all (if they escape I'll have to leave strong garrisons, move my hqs forward that sort of thnig. Easier to crush these chinese units in a long bloody conflict and then have a few years of stalemate.

At Wuchow and Singapore Raver shock attacked and it was glorious (barely half my malayan troops have arrived so far and he still got his ass whipped. Singapore will fall very, very soon, and then I intend for the PI to fall very bloody soon after - even if it means ignored the DEI and southern Borneo for another month (god only knows how many troops, planes and base forces Raver will have evacuated to Oz by then (Spread out all over the SRA they're no threat, but once in Oz in nice supply, those little DEI INF units flesh out with replacements and can make a very strong counter invasion force if dumped onto a vulnerable beach). Easier to atke them down one by one thorughout the DEI. Or trap them crowded into a single base and let them starve.

Enjoy the combat report. This was probably Raver's first big mistake of the game - he's been pretty restrained - usually he's sent his cvs to bomb my troops in Japan or China or perhaps sent some dds to bombard tokyo by now.

I'm spread too thin (China is fine because Raver condensed early, however in the PI I'm spread to thin to overwhelm him anywhere and it is costing me time and supply and troops) in the PI. I'm going to have to reinforce before I can do any more real damage there - perhaps a parachute inf unit or two into Bataan????

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 01/14/42

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Naval bombardment of Samarinda, at 31,63

Japanese Ships
CA Mogami
DD Karukaya
CA Nachi
CA Kumano
DD Hagikaze
DD Tsuga
DD Yugumo
DD Asagao
DD Hiyodori
DD Oshio
BB Kongo
CL Oi
CA Suzuya
CA Takao
DD Nowaki
CA Atago
DD Fuyo
DD Minekaze
DD Kuri
DD Hokaze
DD Hasu
DD Hayabusa
CA Haguro
CA Chokai
BB Mutsu

Allied ground losses:
99 casualties reported
Guns lost 5

Airbase hits 6
Airbase supply hits 6
Runway hits 14
Port hits 6
Port fuel hits 4
Port supply hits 4

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack at 32,54

Japanese Ships
SS I-156

Allied Ships
AK Corregidor, Shell hits 2, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 65th Brigade, at 43,51

Allied aircraft
P-36A Mohawk x 15

Allied aircraft losses
P-36A Mohawk: 2 damaged

Aircraft Attacking:
15 x P-36A Mohawk strafing at 100 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 84th Chinese Corps, at 42,39

Japanese aircraft
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 6
Ki-51 Sonia x 25

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-51 Sonia: 2 damaged

Allied ground losses:
34 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Aircraft Attacking:
25 x Ki-51 Sonia bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 32,54

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 18
G4M1 Betty x 15

no losses

Allied Ships
AK Corregidor, Bomb hits 8, on fire, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x A6M2 Zero bombing at 2000 feet
3 x G4M1 Betty bombing at 10000 feet
9 x A6M2 Zero bombing at 2000 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty bombing at 10000 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty bombing at 10000 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty bombing at 10000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 34,63

Allied aircraft
Brewster 339D x 3
Martin 139 x 3

Allied aircraft losses
Martin 139: 3 damaged

Japanese Ships
CA Chokai

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x Martin 139 bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 36,61

Japanese aircraft
G4M1 Betty x 15

no losses

Allied Ships
AK Capillo, Torpedo hits 3, on fire, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 44,62

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 21
G4M1 Betty x 6

no losses

Allied Ships
AK Compagnia Filipinas, Torpedo hits 1, on fire

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 114,65

Japanese Ships
SS I-5, hits 1, on fire

Allied Ships
PC Tiger
PC Reliance
DD Litchfield
DD Schley
DD Ward

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Wuchow

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 111728 troops, 993 guns, 17 vehicles

Defending force 58363 troops, 160 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
202 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at 48,30

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 52218 troops, 518 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 44082 troops, 87 guns, 0 vehicles

Japanese assault odds: 16 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
587 casualties reported
Guns lost 9

Allied ground losses:
555 casualties reported
Guns lost 8

Defeated Allied Units Retreating!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Clark Field

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 48454 troops, 513 guns, 172 vehicles

Defending force 33219 troops, 375 guns, 23 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
18 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Manila

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 50902 troops, 524 guns, 27 vehicles

Defending force 21623 troops, 142 guns, 9 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
10 casualties reported

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tuguegarao

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13284 troops, 172 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 7574 troops, 20 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
1 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Manila

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 10816 troops, 127 guns, 6 vehicles

Defending force 53248 troops, 527 guns, 27 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
63 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at 48,37

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 746 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 13138 troops, 173 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1

Allied ground losses:
38 casualties reported

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Wuchow

Allied Deliberate attack - are you NUTS??

Attacking force 56664 troops, 155 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 137310 troops, 1005 guns, 161 vehicles

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
282 casualties reported
Guns lost 8
Vehicles lost 1

Allied ground losses:
1648 casualties reported
Guns lost 15

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at 50,38

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 8660 troops, 55 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 6328 troops, 76 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
13 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Allied ground losses:
115 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Singapore

Allied Shock (suicide) attack

Attacking force 18566 troops, 169 guns, 4 vehicles

Defending force 71366 troops, 738 guns, 114 vehicles

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
65 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

Allied ground losses:
1468 casualties reported
Guns lost 29

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Rangoon

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13929 troops, 135 guns, 3 vehicles

Defending force 41458 troops, 322 guns, 114 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
52 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Allied ground losses:
3 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Clark Field

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 23881 troops, 321 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 73232 troops, 513 guns, 317 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
202 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tuguegarao

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 3418 troops, 9 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 13284 troops, 172 guns, 0 vehicles

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Raverdave)

Post #: 407

RE: A really stupid question - 5/16/2004 12:29:28 PM

Raverdave

Posts: 6520
Joined: 2/8/2002
From: Melb. Australia
Status: offline

Drats! I was really hping that I could shock attack and cause an upset somewhere along the line, but as Bananananaanannana boy has pointed out, all I did was to make life easy for him. I really though that he was worn out in a few areas. Double drats! As I have been saying for the last week....Singapore will fall on or after the 15th......Luskan is one month ahead as opposed to what the japanese did in real life.....but the PI is still the shining jewel in my crown ! Those boys, one and all, each deserve the MOH !

My CVs are just about in place for a sneak attack....this one will really throw Luskan of balance. I am just waiting for one more thing to fall in place then BooM !

_____________________________

Never argue with an idiot, he will only drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 408

RE: A really stupid question - 5/16/2004 1:25:40 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

Raver attacks at singapore again - determined to take as many of my troops with him as he can. Raver's starving troops in central malaya get back to Kuantan - just in time to be helloed by my newly landed division (they're actually there to add the final crunch to singapore. After that, I will have all bases garrisonned and safe - and more importantly I will have two very large air bases for my LBA (they're getting bored in Saigon). Hopefully that will secure my southern flank - and since my eastern flank is actually looking very secure from the arctic down to Wake (Raver can send his cvs in there - but I think he knows that after Frag's little escapade I'm ready for that).

No, Raver will sneak his cvs in somewhere my lba can't get them, where he can bag a few transports and run like hell. Suva and Rabaul are my bets at the moment, maybe he's brave enough to try wake?

Why he'd do that when I'm menacing from Suva I don't know - but I can certainly accomodate him if he is spoiling for a fight.

SO - to reiterate the plan: Snot, Pus and Phlegm all got postponed. I've got Malaya wrapped up, with lots and lots and lots of troops there. The engineers have already landed to create my Fortress Malaya, and I'm going to be piling in garrison troops and more HQs fairly soon to make sure that the troops there don't need to go back to the homeland for R and R - they'll refit right where they are. That way I don't risk drowning them before I send them onto the DEI.

There are a few divisions earmarked for the PI - but they're yet to do any real fighting in Malaya so far! Also, there are two extra divisions that will be returning to China and to hanoi to squeeze the chinese a bit more on a different front. There are also several engineering and CD and ART units on their way to Rangoon to finish that off and set ti up as a powerful fortress too. I have the 15th army HQ in Rangoon already, coordinating the siege, and proving my troops there with support and supply.

There are units preping for the invasion of Borneo - and in the pacific I'm stealing atolls with tiny little transport groups and little inf units that storm ashore, take the place and move on.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 01/15/42

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 114,65

Japanese Ships
SS I-5, hits 2, on fire, heavy damage

Allied Ships
PC Tiger

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Naval bombardment of Tarakan, at 33,61 - Coastal Guns Fire Back!

2 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.
Japanese Ships
CA Mogami
DD Karukaya
CA Nachi
CA Kumano
DD Hagikaze, Shell hits 1
DD Tsuga
DD Yugumo
DD Asagao
DD Hiyodori
DD Oshio
BB Kongo
CL Oi
CA Suzuya
CA Takao
DD Nowaki
CA Atago
DD Fuyo
DD Minekaze
DD Kuri
DD Hokaze
DD Hasu
DD Hayabusa
CA Haguro
CA Chokai
BB Mutsu

Allied ground losses:
262 casualties reported
Guns lost 7
Vehicles lost 1

Airbase hits 5
Airbase supply hits 2
Runway hits 32
Port hits 3
Port fuel hits 4
Port supply hits 8

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 8 troops unloading over beach at Apamama, 86,92

Japanese ground losses:
72 casualties reported

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack at 48,47

Japanese Ships
MSW Fuji Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
MSW Fukeui Maru #7

Allied Ships
SS Grayling

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 2nd Division, at 43,51

Allied aircraft
P-26A x 3
P-36A Mohawk x 15

Allied aircraft losses
P-36A Mohawk: 1 damaged

Aircraft Attacking:
15 x P-36A Mohawk bombing at 2000 feet
3 x P-26A bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 37,64

Allied aircraft
Martin 139 x 2

Allied aircraft losses
Martin 139: 2 damaged

Japanese Ships
BB Mutsu

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x Martin 139 bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 45,65

Japanese aircraft
G4M1 Betty x 10

no losses

Allied Ships
AK Compagnia Filipinas, Torpedo hits 3, on fire, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G4M1 Betty launching torpedoes at 200 feet

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Apamama

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 1223 troops, 6 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles

Japanese assault odds: 20 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Apamama base !!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Singapore

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 67346 troops, 775 guns, 10 vehicles

Defending force 34390 troops, 157 guns, 11 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
81 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Wuchow

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 112128 troops, 986 guns, 17 vehicles

Defending force 56434 troops, 132 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
191 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Manila

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 50991 troops, 529 guns, 29 vehicles

Defending force 22265 troops, 157 guns, 14 vehicles

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tuguegarao

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13324 troops, 176 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 7613 troops, 19 guns, 0 vehicles

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Clark Field

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 46471 troops, 512 guns, 172 vehicles

Defending force 33425 troops, 380 guns, 23 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
10 casualties reported

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Mersing

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 802 troops, 5 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles

Japanese assault odds: 24 to 1 (fort level 3)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Mersing base !!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Manila

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 11036 troops, 135 guns, 6 vehicles

Defending force 53311 troops, 531 guns, 29 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
38 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Singapore

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 17520 troops, 132 guns, 4 vehicles

Defending force 115632 troops, 1093 guns, 222 vehicles

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1

Japanese ground losses:
87 casualties reported
Guns lost 6

Allied ground losses:
497 casualties reported
Guns lost 13

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Rangoon

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 14110 troops, 137 guns, 3 vehicles

Defending force 41578 troops, 323 guns, 115 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
78 casualties reported
Guns lost 2
Vehicles lost 1

Allied ground losses:
1 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Clark Field

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 24040 troops, 323 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 73185 troops, 514 guns, 318 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
54 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tuguegarao

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 3438 troops, 9 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 13324 troops, 176 guns, 0 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
9 casualties reported

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Raverdave)

Post #: 409

RE: A really stupid question - 5/16/2004 3:44:11 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

Singapore fell - of course it did. I had kicked the crap out of Raver's troops the length of the place, the aussies weren't there to defend it to the death and I outnumbered him about 5 to 1 ni numbers and 50 to one when it comes to assault troops.

Raver
s crazed and starving troops were massacred at Kuantan - they'll surrender tomorrow. Malaya is mine, as planned.

Singapore is a bloody mess - the port, airfield and industry are all wrecked and it is going to take more than the 600 engineers I've got there to clean it up. On the other hand, I did capture over 50000 points of supply and plenty of fuel. Garrisons are all in position, I've got more engineer units come out to build forts and airfields, and CD units from all over the map have already begun arriving to make any early conuter invasion a really bad idea.

Won't be long until these troops are in fighting trim again and on their way to teach those bloody yanks in the phillipines some humility (some people just don't know when they're conquered - rat faced guy in gladiator(quintus IIRC)).

Aircraft ready to move in, and of course, this relieves the pressure on Brunei's little airfield somewhat. Although i still need fighters there to beat off Raver's bombers (his martins try to get my tankers every single turn - I still shoot down a few of them every turn).

I wonder if this was what he was waiting for (to launch his cvs).

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR 01/16/42

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 115,67

Japanese Ships
SS I-21

Allied Ships
PC Tiger
PC Reliance
DD Litchfield
DD Schley
DD Ward

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 115,67

Japanese Ships
SS I-21, hits 6, on fire, heavy damage

Allied Ships
PC Tiger
PC Reliance
DD Litchfield
DD Schley
DD Ward

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack at 38,58

Japanese Ships
AK Kanaiyama Maru, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
PG Choko Maru #2
PC Shonon Maru #15
PC Toshi Maru #3
PG Takunan Maru #10
PG Choan Maru #2
PC Takunan Maru #2
PG Koei Maru
PC Tama Maru #8
PG Keijo Maru
PG Seikai Maru
PG Nikkai Maru
PG Heijo Maru

Allied Ships
SS Gar

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 8 troops unloading over beach at Tarawa, 85,91

Japanese ground losses:
39 casualties reported

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 8 troops unloading over beach at Tarawa, 85,91

Japanese ground losses:
56 casualties reported

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack at 116,68

Japanese Ships
SS I-19

Allied Ships
PC Tiger
PC Reliance
DD Litchfield
DD Schley
DD Ward

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on 2nd Division, at 43,51

Allied aircraft
P-26A x 3
P-36A Mohawk x 14

no losses

Japanese ground losses:
14 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

Aircraft Attacking:
14 x P-36A Mohawk bombing at 2000 feet
3 x P-26A bombing at 2000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF, near Brunei at 32,57

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 7

Allied aircraft
Brewster 339D x 2
Martin 139 x 2

no losses

Allied aircraft losses
Brewster 339D: 2 destroyed

Japanese Ships
TK Itukusima Maru

Aircraft Attacking:
2 x Martin 139 bombing at 6000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Air attack on TF at 59,46

Japanese aircraft
G3M Nell x 20
Ki-48 Lily x 27

no losses

Allied Ships
AK Palawan, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x Ki-48 Lily bombing at 15000 feet
4 x G3M Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
9 x Ki-48 Lily bombing at 15000 feet
9 x Ki-48 Lily bombing at 15000 feet
4 x G3M Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G3M Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G3M Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
4 x G3M Nell launching torpedoes at 200 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack at 37,60

Japanese Ships
AK Tien Lee, Torpedo hits 2, on fire
PG Choko Maru #2
PC Shonon Maru #15
PC Toshi Maru #3
PG Takunan Maru #10
PG Choan Maru #2
PC Takunan Maru #2
PG Koei Maru
PC Tama Maru #8
PG Keijo Maru
PG Seikai Maru
PG Nikkai Maru
PG Heijo Maru
AP Chichibu Maru

Allied Ships
SS Gar

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tarawa

Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 1070 troops, 3 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 0 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles

Japanese assault odds: 17 to 1 (fort level 0)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Tarawa base !!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Singapore

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 114049 troops, 1155 guns, 223 vehicles

Defending force 34293 troops, 156 guns, 11 vehicles

Japanese engineers reduce fortifications to 5

Japanese assault odds: 8 to 1 (fort level 5)

Japanese forces CAPTURE Singapore base !!! mwhahahahahahaaaaaaaaa!!!!

Japanese ground losses:
477 casualties reported
Guns lost 25
Vehicles lost 1

Allied ground losses:
47401 casualties reported
Guns lost 136
Vehicles lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Wuchow

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 112734 troops, 991 guns, 17 vehicles

Defending force 56774 troops, 138 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
164 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Manila

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 51191 troops, 528 guns, 28 vehicles

Defending force 22530 troops, 167 guns, 14 vehicles

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tuguegarao

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13353 troops, 178 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 7594 troops, 19 guns, 0 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Clark Field

Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 46525 troops, 511 guns, 172 vehicles

Defending force 33550 troops, 384 guns, 23 vehicles

Allied ground losses:
7 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Rangoon

Japanese Deliberate attack

Attacking force 37998 troops, 326 guns, 114 vehicles

Defending force 19394 troops, 169 guns, 10 vehicles

Japanese assault odds: 0 to 1 (fort level 4)

Japanese ground losses:
950 casualties reported
Guns lost 31
Vehicles lost 1

Allied ground losses:
474 casualties reported
Guns lost 15

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Manila

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 11220 troops, 144 guns, 6 vehicles

Defending force 53537 troops, 530 guns, 28 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
49 casualties reported
Guns lost 2

Allied ground losses:
15 casualties reported
Guns lost 1

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Kuantan

Allied Deliberate attack

Attacking force 5635 troops, 26 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 23789 troops, 250 guns, 17 vehicles

Allied assault odds: 0 to 1 (fort level 0)

Allied ground losses:
326 casualties reported
Guns lost 11

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Rangoon

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 13911 troops, 130 guns, 3 vehicles

Defending force 39948 troops, 277 guns, 113 vehicles

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Clark Field

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 24143 troops, 324 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 73334 troops, 512 guns, 321 vehicles

Japanese ground losses:
44 casualties reported
Guns lost 3

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Tuguegarao

Allied Bombardment attack

Attacking force 3429 troops, 9 guns, 0 vehicles

Defending force 13353 troops, 178 guns, 0 vehicles

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 410

RE: A really stupid question - 5/16/2004 4:17:12 PM

Adnan Meshuggi

Posts: 2220
Joined: 8/2/2001
Status: offline

Hi i have a question about sub attacks...

i belive you play with FOW but i think if a sub torpedo a single transport ship, it should say if the enemy went down or not....

is it possible to get "... and sunk" reports from subs ?
In UV i never get such results (maybe i had just bad luck)

Good AAR... go ahead

_____________________________

Don't tickle yourself with some moralist crap thinking we have some sort of obligation to help these people. We're there for our self-interest, and anything we do to be 'nice' should be considered a courtesy dweebespit

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 411

RE: A really stupid question - 5/17/2004 1:45:00 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

i think so?

in the aar things at kuantan are great. I culled 4000 of Ravers' stranded troops whlie loading my units onto ships to send them home! Sort of like a very casual morning battle with a trip home in the afternoon. Too much fun.

At Sian I am grinding Raver's battered northern army to dust. This is the end of the road for them here! (railroad at least).

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Adnan Meshuggi)

Post #: 412

RE: A really stupid question - 5/17/2004 4:19:42 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

Well, Siam is mine now and Raver's troops in the north are done for. I control the railway from the north all the way to Canton and then towards hanoi (but i think there must be some of Raver's little unf units sitting on that line downt here somewhere disrupting my supply.

Now he's cut off at Wuchow - it has resources I want and I'm not sure he can escape, so i'll be crushing him there with my now more than adequate armies (reinforcements from the north will peter down slowly, HQs repositinoing, forts getting built in the north etc etc). Kweilin is still under seige but has no resources and isn't on the raliway line. I'm curious whether or not Raver will fight or get his troops to run down the road back to protect the real big centre of chinese industry (probably a biyt too much for me to take on atm).

Singapore was scary this turn - Raver's bombers had a go at my cvls and cves that are refuelling, restocking aircraft and ammo. They didn't get any hits (thank god for the a6m2) but it was heart in mouth stuff.

Also, Raver' bombarded Suva - and caught me napping there. I had a transport in harbour and she got smacked up pretty bad, but my troops there are ok I think.

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 413

RE: A really stupid question - 5/17/2004 10:50:45 PM

Nikademus

Posts: 25684
Joined: 5/27/2000
From: Alien spacecraft
Status: offline

someone needs to remind Raver that not only can you screw yourself with a failed counter-attack when defending a base by mass losses and disruption, you also make it easier for the attacker because the following attack by the siege'er will be made without having to contend with the defender's fort levels.

_____________________________

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 414

RE: A really stupid question - 5/18/2004 4:17:05 AM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

too late really. A few stragglers that Raver has thrown onto the rali line aronud the place that my divisions are chasing down and destroying, a possible army at Kwelin which would have to fight an army justa s bag as it sitting on the railway line prepping for their attack, and Wuchow where my forces grind his down every single day. Wuchow won't hold more than a week now.

Which is good because the industry and manpower pools are really stretching to supoprt the number of losses i've started incurring. At Singapore supplies are vanishing as my hqs refit my inf units. I have one division that didn't do any fighting in Malaya because it arrived so late. This division is still in the north so they're marching off to Rangoon to fix that stalled offensive (fortunately prong 1 is still around to dissuade any brit reinforcement attempt).

Also several divisions are earmarked for the Phillipines when they're at full strength. Already I ahve landed one new, fresh division somewhere in the PI - hoping to tip the scales at one of the three battle hexes there. I'll crush Dugout dougs men if I have to strip divisions from the home defence force to do it!

Singapore is repairing quickly (800 engineers there now to fix the place up) and they're installing a CD unit - not as big as I'd like, but I'll get a bigger one in later. Troops all up and down the peninsula, several little hqs up there and htree engineering regiments moving from base to base, repairing and fortifying their way along. Malaya is coming together quite nicely and in 1944 when Raver tries to steal it back, I'm going to have size 9 forts everywhere and lots of big nasty airfields.

This turn my troops invaded and took Naaru in the pacific - soon these troops will be sent into the solomons to continue their tediuous work of stealing empty allied bases. However fuel shortages have become an issue out there - I haven't transported enough fuel to keep things going (and although I have a few tankers that a very full of fuel for emergencies) these are being saved for combat ops not transports.

Raver still hasn't made a move at Suva or Wake (especially Suva - his little bombardment only killed a few and smacked up a transport). Starting to think maybe Rabaul, or the Indian ocean???????

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Nikademus)

Post #: 415

Singapore and Rangoon - 5/18/2004 6:14:25 AM

Capt. Harlock

Posts: 5358
Joined: 9/15/2001
From: Los Angeles
Status: offline

I kind of wish Raver had only used bombardment attack at Singapore -- he must have been thinking of the historical situation where the Japanese were down to their last rounds of ammunition, but got Percival to surrender just in time. Still, in spite of the fact that Singapore fell a month ahead of historical, Raver lost less than half as many troops as in the actual event. I dare say the evacuees will be put to good use somewhere.

Rangoon is showing surprising resistance. (Maybe that's where the Australians at Singapore went to?)

_____________________________

Civil war? What does that mean? Is there any foreign war? Isn't every war fought between men, between brothers?

--Victor Hugo

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 416

RE: Singapore and Rangoon - 5/18/2004 1:30:31 PM

Luskan

Posts: 1897
Joined: 7/11/2002
From: Down Under
Status: offline

I think my troops are very tired from marching all the way from saigon months ago.

Singapore is repaired, and is now the largest most dangerous airbase I've got anywhere in the SRA. Woe betide anything bombable with an allied flag on it. The fatgiued units are resting, there are lots of replacement troops guns and tanks being generated now the the Southern Area HQ as well as a couple of little army HQs have gone to their designated bases (along with the rtoops they're assigned to repair etc.). This is all excellent news.

As for Phillipines . . . well it is taking bloody forever. decided against rushing troops out of malaya over to the PI - because then I'd only have those naval garrison units (90 or so assault points each) at every base. I'd like to be a bit more secure than that, and besides the troops in Malaya have earnt a rest, while those in the bloody phillipines could be doing a better job.

If this is still going on next week I'm going to start beheading generals and replacing them with more aggressive LCU commanders. Pity I can't promote a few of my squadron leaders to command armies - I'd have masascred the allies from manila to maroochydore by now!

_____________________________

With dancing Bananas and Storm Troopers who needs BBs?

(in reply to Capt. Harlock)

Post #: 417

RE: Singapore and Rangoon - 5/18/2004 1:40:25 PM

Pascal_slith

Posts: 1651
Joined: 8/20/2003
From: back in Commiefornia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Luskan

I think my troops are very tired from marching all the way from saigon months ago.

Singapore is repaired, and is now the largest most dangerous airbase I've got anywhere in the SRA. Woe betide anything bombable with an allied flag on it. The fatgiued units are resting, there are lots of replacement troops guns and tanks being generated now the the Southern Area HQ as well as a couple of little army HQs have gone to their designated bases (along with the rtoops they're assigned to repair etc.). This is all excellent news.

As for Phillipines . . . well it is taking bloody forever. decided against rushing troops out of malaya over to the PI - because then I'd only have those naval garrison units (90 or so assault points each) at every base. I'd like to be a bit more secure than that, and besides the troops in Malaya have earnt a rest, while those in the bloody phillipines could be doing a better job.

If this is still going on next week I'm going to start beheading generals and replacing them with more aggressive LCU commanders. Pity I can't promote a few of my squadron leaders to command armies - I'd have masascred the allies from manila to maroochydore by now!

Hey, it's only January 1942. I find most of what's going on is a little too fast in terms of base losses and the Japanese advance. Places are falling much faster than historically.

_____________________________

So much WitP and so little time to play.... :-(

(in reply to Luskan)

Post #: 418

RE: Singapore and Rangoon - 5/18/2004 3:23:19 PM

Raverdave

Posts: 6520
Joined: 2/8/2002
From: Melb. Australia
Status: offline

Not really, I have have nor will I ever try to hold either Singapore or Malaya for that matter, so I have contributed to it's fast down fall (One month short of it's historic fall date is not bad). Clarke and Manila are still holding out quite well, and I expect to still be causing headaches for Luskan there well into march.

_____________________________

Never argue with an idiot, he will only drag you down to his level and beat you with experience.

(in reply to Pascal_slith)

Post #: 419

RE: Singapore and Rangoon - 5/18/2004 4:14:49 PM

Speedysteve

Posts: 15998
Joined: 9/11/2001
From: Reading, England
Status: offline

A quick question regarding Garrison units -

Do these units 'appear' in captured bases or do you have to move them in?

Regards,

Steven

(in reply to Raverdave)

Post #: 420

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