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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 12/31/2005 2:53:58 AM

ShermanM4

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ravinhood

What I don't think you are taking into account though Sherman is I would say the majority of Americans don't really know "or care" what happened during the American Revolutionary War. Only the most die hard would read the actual histories of so many people during that time. People enjoy the Hollywood productions (I know I do). The guy that played Pvt HOOK in Zulu was nothing like the hollywood production, but, still the movie was great, they still made a hero out of him which actually is the truth, but, making him a slaggard and a thief just fit the movie for filling only. When we goto a movie we want to be "entertained", we don't usually goto them for a "history class", they have special movies for those. ;) To downplay Tarlton to be a bloodthirsty murdering killer made for good script and the good guy always wins ending the picture had. I'm sure people got a thrill when he got his at the end. If we had to sit through actual footage of real life of the days of history we'd all probably fall asleep during the movie. Except of course for the die hards that get into that boring stuff. People like action and heroic deeds and the good guys winning out over the bad guys, stuff like that. That's what hollywood brings. I don't think I've ever read in the credits that it was an historically accurate protrayal of what actually happened. Cept for the Exorcist which did state in the opening credits the movie was "based" off of actual events, though we all know no one spun their head around full circle, lol or probably threw up green pea soup like a fire hydrant. lol But, still the movie was good. ;)

Good point! I am not going to buck the entertainment argument one bit. I myself am in business to make money just like many Hollywood directors and producers. However, I think the best history classes I had in High School and College were the ones in which the professors did not make it a history class. The best story I ever heard was about Caesar Rodney. He was absolutely an American Hero. His life and times speak for themselves. Yes this does require story telling skills and finess on the part of the instructor, but there is nothing made up about his life. It is all fascinating and would make a great movie. Another example I could give is October Sky. That film is barnone one of my most favorite movies. It differs from the book Rocket Boys, but the the differences are not major. Because of the value of entertainment, I can see why certain changes were made.

As for the American Revolution. It speaks for itself! Characters like the one Mel Gibson played and the entire screenplay was just ridiculous.

The one thing I don't understand is your fascination with the Excorsist. That is way to scary for me. That makes the hair stand up on the back of my neck just thinking about it

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Post #: 91

RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 12/31/2005 5:16:29 AM

ravinhood

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quote:

The one thing I don't understand is your fascination with the Excorsist. That is way to scary for me. That makes the hair stand up on the back of my neck just thinking about it

Lol that's a sign of a good movie when it still effects you such after so many years after release. Does Halloween or Friday the 13th or Nightmare on Elm Street have the same effect? ;) No other horror movie was ever so scary as the Exorcist to me. I just grew up fasinated with horror movies. The Exorcist is one of the few that doesen't involve blood and guts and throat slashing. A mental horror movie that touched on some peoples spiritual values, that's what made it scary.

And if you ever wake up in the middle of the night, sometime near 3am, listen closely to the darkness and for sounds coming out from under your bed, for in the silence of the night that is where demons dwell. muahahahaha

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 12/31/2005 2:14:24 PM

Pippin

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quote:

I was so surprised that they still make movies like that in which the good guys always fire from the hip while running like crazy and still are able to kill at a 100:1 ratio.
quote:

What? Are you taking a cheap-shot at the Rambo fans!?

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Post #: 93

RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 12/31/2005 2:17:11 PM

Charles2222

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The Cars That Eat People and The Clonus Horror are the first two that leap to mind. The first one was one of the very few movies I seen in a theatre with my Dad. I think it got on his list too and he hated it enough to tell me his dislike.

In my childhood the Jerry Lewis movie The Family Jewels was pretty awful. I unfortunately saw it again about 6 months ago, not sure if I had seen it before. Oh yeah. It's not quite as bad to me now, since I'm not used to the better stuff of Lewis as I was back then, but then more awful movies, made me forget it.

Oh sorry, I thought this was awful movies altogether. Ah, for sheer awfulness, there's no war movie as awful as these. I can't think of any awful war movies off hand. I avoid awful movies liek the plague these days, and the chances of me remembering any of the bad war ones is practically nil. I guess Memphis Belle was pretty bad, but only because it was so farcically opposite of what the real crush mission for it was like. If you didn't know that it wasn't too bad I guess.

< Message edited by Charles_22 -- 12/31/2005 2:20:06 PM >

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Post #: 94

RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/1/2006 4:01:58 AM

Pippin

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I still have memphis belle, had it for many years. I have no doubts being holywood its story line was chagned, altered, etc, etc. But now that we mention it, some of the directing wasn't too bad, but then it had its moments of pure rediculous amateurness!

Like those scenes where you suddenly see an OVERLY OBVIOUS mini-model airplane where the props are suddenly moving only 5 revolutions a minute, and no motion blur anywhere, except for movement that just looked like a 5 inch toy model. LOL. That was pretty bad..

Or the time the guy got blown out of the cockpit. It looks like a barbie-doll they had and just tilted it so it fell out of the model. EEEEEEk. What kind of people do you know do cartwheels off planes without a parachutte, and not even move an inch the whole time? That was pretty rediculous, but got a lot of laughs.

As the saying goes, when you add humour in a movie, make sure the audience is laughing at the RIGHT places.

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Post #: 95

RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/1/2006 7:23:35 AM

trojan58

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In Order

1. Braveheart
2. Patriot
3. U571
4. Pearl Harbour
5 Objective Burma

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Post #: 96

RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/1/2006 10:54:53 AM

Charles2222

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Pippin

I still have memphis belle, had it for many years. I have no doubts being holywood its story line was chagned, altered, etc, etc. But now that we mention it, some of the directing wasn't too bad, but then it had its moments of pure rediculous amateurness!

Like those scenes where you suddenly see an OVERLY OBVIOUS mini-model airplane where the props are suddenly moving only 5 revolutions a minute, and no motion blur anywhere, except for movement that just looked like a 5 inch toy model. LOL. That was pretty bad..

Or the time the guy got blown out of the cockpit. It looks like a barbie-doll they had and just tilted it so it fell out of the model. EEEEEEk. What kind of people do you know do cartwheels off planes without a parachutte, and not even move an inch the whole time? That was pretty rediculous, but got a lot of laughs.

As the saying goes, when you add humour in a movie, make sure the audience is laughing at the RIGHT places.

Thank goodness I don't remember that much about that movie! If you didn't know, the real story was that during their whole flight, they only saw one German plane in flight, and it didn't even bother with them. Given I heard that said, it's clear their plane wasn't attacked, and it even calls into question whether the plane they saw, bothered attacking any of the group.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/1/2006 11:12:16 AM

Pippin

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I wouldn't doubt it was a duck flapping its wings they saw. Gota bring back some interresting story home...

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/2/2006 1:28:58 AM

gunny

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Maciste

quote:

ORIGINAL: gunny

If I had to pick one:

Sergeant Steiner.

The sequel to Cross of Iron with Richard Burton. I guess somebody couldn't accept a ficticious hero who was not only a skilled soldier but could also maintain an ant-war sentiment while fighting for survival on the side of the NAZIs. So the solution was to transfer him to the western front, then have him become a traitor, join the enemy and kill his best friend. Willi Heinrich must of rolled over in his grave when this came out.

What's the title? A sequel of Cross of Iron???

By the way, my particular list of bad war movies are:
-Pearl Harbor.
-Windtalkers.
-The thin (bo)red line.
-Saving Private Ryan.
-All of the "made-for-video" war movies about Vietnam (any fan of Chuck Norris out there? )
-Rambo III.
-Rambo II.

P.D: I'd like to see any time of my life, some of the war soviet movies made on the URSS during the Stalin rule... critics says that those films are polithically smelly, but also great blockbuster spectacles...

title clearly stated: sergent steiner

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/2/2006 10:15:53 PM

Drex

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quote:

ORIGINAL: VictorH

I have to say all Mel Gibson's War Movies. The reason being they are portrayed as Historically accurate, but in reality are just the opposite. The British never behaved like the SS in the Revolution, although to be fair there were massacres on both sides.

What about "We were soldiers....". that was a pretty good war movie and supposedly true.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/3/2006 10:00:11 PM

Puukkoo

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The worst one is Pearl Harbor with the memorable line "I think the Second World war just started". Kate Beckinsale however was good in that one. Because it's Mel Gibson's birthday (50), it's better to give him a special 'honorary' mention.

I have heard that there is some film about Hitler's head and it may be worse than anything presented here.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/3/2006 10:30:47 PM

Capt. Harlock

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Time for me to really date myself: my nominee is the Errol Flynn version of "The Charge of the Light Brigade". An utterly inaccurate version of what was arguably both the bravest and the stupidest action in the history of warfare.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/3/2006 10:33:33 PM

BlackVoid

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Thin Red Line
I had to turn it off half-way. I am sure there are worse (eg. Pearl Harbor), but I do not even start watching those. Enemy at the Gates sucked as well.

Strangely the best war movies were made in Germany: Stalingrad, Das Boot.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/4/2006 1:13:35 AM

jnier

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quote:

ORIGINAL: BlackVoid

Thin Red Line
I had to turn it off half-way.

Here we go again...Thin Red Line is my favorite war movie. Different strokes, I guess. BTW, for those of you who liked Thin Red Line, the director (Terrence Malick) has a new movie out about the British colony at Jamestown. Looking forward to seeing it.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/4/2006 3:43:38 AM

Sarge

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Ok since Battle of Britian with Tom Cruise looks like it will never make it to the shooting stage (thank god), but I am most certain it would have topped all of our list

I will have to go with Battle of the Bulge as being the biggist piece of censor Hollywierd has ever put out

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RE: Reality is optional - 1/4/2006 4:06:25 AM

Skyros

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I believe it was Battle beneath the Earth.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pippin

Does anyone remember this one movie... and older one.. where the chinese, or japanese were trying to take over the U.S. by digging tunnels under the oceans etc all the way over to the states, and were planning to do a suprise attack that way?

I forget how most of the plot went along, but something about the americans discovering what was going on, and they ended up saving the typical day in the end. For the life of me, I just can't remember what this one was called, but someone here HAS to have seen it!

And BTW, they ended up sticking caucasians in as the chinese/japs, and put makeup on em. I guess it was too hard to find oriental acters willing to play along with such a story...

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RE: Reality is optional - 1/4/2006 4:20:25 AM

RBWhite

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Skyros

It's on Turner Classic Movies, Saturday, January 21st. at 5:00 am.

< Message edited by RBWhite -- 1/5/2006 1:06:46 AM >

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RE: Reality is optional - 1/5/2006 9:38:16 AM

ShermanM4

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quote:

The Clonus Horror

That made it onto Mystery Science Theater 3000. It deserved it!

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/21/2006 2:32:14 PM

mutterfudder

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"Saving Ryan's privates"?? That and "Full Meatel Jacket" are the only military movies that have ever made me slack jawed for the first half of the film.

"Hamburger Hill" I hold in high regards because it had the right sight and sounds of real combat.
Ever wonder what it looks like to shoot a human with a M-60?

The death sceens in "The Patroit" and "We were solders" were very realistic.

I don't know if this counts but "Starship Troopers" was a really big let down for me.
Love the book,hate the movie.

Could go on and on but just wanted to make a lil comment....

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/21/2006 7:06:46 PM

sol_invictus

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Yeah, Thin Red Line was really bad. I just got a copy of March or Die and that is a really good Legion movie. I'm looking for a copy of The Duelists; haven't seen that for ages. Cross of Iron still has to be my favorite.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/21/2006 7:48:31 PM

rhondabrwn

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quote:

ORIGINAL: mutterfudder

"Saving Ryan's privates"?? That and "Full Meatel Jacket" are the only military movies that have ever made me slack jawed for the first half of the film.

"Hamburger Hill" I hold in high regards because it had the right sight and sounds of real combat.
Ever wonder what it looks like to shoot a human with a M-60?

The death sceens in "The Patroit" and "We were solders" were very realistic.

I don't know if this counts but "Starship Troopers" was a really big let down for me.
Love the book,hate the movie.

Could go on and on but just wanted to make a lil comment....

I agree "Starship Troopers" was a huge disappointment to me. I spent most of my time watching just ranting about stupid tactics, ridiculous array of trooper armament (glorified M-16's right along Nuke grenades... incredible... and don't get me started on a fleet of transports running so close together that a plasma burst shot out of a bug's A** could hit them!).

Anyway, here's a surprising alternative that you probably ignored after that first movie. Try Starship Troopers 2... yea, low budget, disappeared off the screens almost instantly, BUT....

If you get it and watch it, you'll find that it really does do a far better job of depicting combat. Characters are gritty and realistic, the plot is reasonable, and their weapons are more realistically effective. Lots of new defensive technology that fits the sci-fi era of the story. I liked it. Too bad the high budget original hadn't been done this way (or GASP... they had actually followed Heinlein's novel!).

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/21/2006 11:10:04 PM

Plodder

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn

I agree "Starship Troopers" was a huge disappointment to me. I spent most of my time watching just ranting about stupid tactics, ridiculous array of trooper armament (glorified M-16's right along Nuke grenades... incredible... and don't get me started on a fleet of transports running so close together that a plasma burst shot out of a bug's A** could hit them!).

Anyway, here's a surprising alternative that you probably ignored after that first movie. Try Starship Troopers 2... yea, low budget, disappeared off the screens almost instantly, BUT....

If you get it and watch it, you'll find that it really does do a far better job of depicting combat. Characters are gritty and realistic, the plot is reasonable, and their weapons are more realistically effective. Lots of new defensive technology that fits the sci-fi era of the story. I liked it. Too bad the high budget original hadn't been done this way (or GASP... they had actually followed Heinlein's novel!).

You've totally missed the point of the film. Starship Troopers the movie was a satire on war movies and in that vein it works brilliantly IMHO.Having said that, I would like to see the book given the proper treatment it deserves in film.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/21/2006 11:29:34 PM

Terminus

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Starship Troopers... Bleech... "Beverly Hills 90210 in Space". And why the hell were they in football uniforms?

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 1:03:39 AM

rhondabrwn

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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Plodder

quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn

I agree "Starship Troopers" was a huge disappointment to me. I spent most of my time watching just ranting about stupid tactics, ridiculous array of trooper armament (glorified M-16's right along Nuke grenades... incredible... and don't get me started on a fleet of transports running so close together that a plasma burst shot out of a bug's A** could hit them!).

Anyway, here's a surprising alternative that you probably ignored after that first movie. Try Starship Troopers 2... yea, low budget, disappeared off the screens almost instantly, BUT....

If you get it and watch it, you'll find that it really does do a far better job of depicting combat. Characters are gritty and realistic, the plot is reasonable, and their weapons are more realistically effective. Lots of new defensive technology that fits the sci-fi era of the story. I liked it. Too bad the high budget original hadn't been done this way (or GASP... they had actually followed Heinlein's novel!).

You've totally missed the point of the film. Starship Troopers the movie was a satire on war movies and in that vein it works brilliantly IMHO.Having said that, I would like to see the book given the proper treatment it deserves in film.

Well, that's the first time I've ever heard that defense put forth for this bomb.... oh, it's a "satire"... I get it now.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 1:35:26 AM

civdiv

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Walking Dead. What a horrible movie. I'm not sure it's been mentioned yet, but I'm not going to read through all the replies. And the movie is only worse for me as I used to bbe a member of the Walking Dead; 1st Battalion, 9th Marines.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 1:59:07 AM

Pippin

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One movie has just sprung to mind... I Forget the name, but it was another silly movie based around a submarine. No, it was not that u-571 abomination.

Lets see, the movie was poorly written, and poorly directed (etc,etc). There were only a couple shots that looked like something a highschool kid with a cam-corder didn't do, but those were obvious stolen frames from Hunt for Red October.

The movie was so bad I only could watch it once, I remember the one captain mentioning to his XO regarding a D/E enemy submarine. It seems his XO must have been so incompetant, the captain had to inform him that D/E ran on Deisel and Electric. When on Deisel they made lots of noise, but when on electric they were silent. Well, excuse my pun but, duh...

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 1:59:25 AM

Plodder

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn
Well, that's the first time I've ever heard that defense put forth for this bomb.... oh, it's a "satire"... I get it now.

Couldn't you tell by the in-movie commercials and fascist looking uniforms?check out the reviews at www.imdb.com

< Message edited by The Plodder -- 1/22/2006 2:02:38 AM >

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 5:05:21 AM

rhondabrwn

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quote:

ORIGINAL: The Plodder

quote:

ORIGINAL: rhondabrwn
Well, that's the first time I've ever heard that defense put forth for this bomb.... oh, it's a "satire"... I get it now.

Couldn't you tell by the in-movie commercials and fascist looking uniforms?check out the reviews at www.imdb.com

Sure, I got the humour of the announcements, the Morman colony getting wiped out etc etc, but that wasn't enough of the movie to make this a "brillian" satire. It was a mild political diatribe against militaristic, fascist societies, but that was in line with Heinlein's original novel.

Roger Ebert's Review

Ebert missed the "brilliance" of the satire too.

Anyway, my point being made abpve was that Starship Troopers 2 IS a serious looking war story that eliminates much of the stupidity of the original and delivers some great action and fighting sequences, grisly "alien bugs within you" scenes, and a real "anti-war" hero who consistently defies his superiors while saving the poor grunts (and incidentally the Human race) while he is at it. Not great art, but worth a view for your typical wargamer. My mention of "Starship Troopers" was only peripheral... someone else nominated it for worst movie honors, not me. I did enjoy the action and special effects, but could never get past the totally unrealistic nature of most of it.

Hey, I still have trouble with the "German" tanks in "Battle of the Bulge"

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Post #: 118

RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 9:28:11 PM

Doggie

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Makoto

I'm not nominationg "A Bridge To Far" but I have a question about the movie. After the Irish Guards jump off we have the whole bombardment scene with the bomber planes. I'm wondering if those were accurate, they look like Hawk 75 A3 or A4s to me, were the Brits still using those in 1944?

The fighter bombers in A Bridge too Far were AT-6 Texans modified with a camelback and painted up as either P-47s or RAF Typhoons. It's not clear what they're supposed to be, but these would be the two most common Allied CAS aircraft during that period. The British also used P-47s. Most P-47s were scrapped immediately following the end of the war, so they were scarce even in 1978. Thousands of surplus AT-6's were bought as surplus by civilians, and they're relatively common sights even today. They often double as Japanese Zeros in movies.

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RE: What's Your worst war movie ever - 1/22/2006 11:24:48 PM

Oleg Mastruko

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gunny

quote:

There's also an Italian flick about the Eastern Front that is pretty darn good. Can't remember the title.

would that be "The Battle of Neretva" by any chance? it was pretty good, Italian movie made in Yugoslavia about partisans vs italians/germans.

Battle of Neretva is Yugoslav movie, and very good at that. It was shot during late sixties or early seventies when Yugo national board of movies or whatever that body was called wasn't cheap when it was about to make a high budget movie.

So when you see a house being blown up in Yugoslav war movies from 60s/70s you can be sure someone actually blew the real house up, not some poor 10$ studio replica or model. Aerial shots of battlefield, mass charges over a mile-wide front, you name it. Whatever it was, it wasn't cheap movie making or CGI trickery. One may disagree with the motives and ideology behind the movie, but I for one truely enjoy good old Yugo war spectacles of the 70s.

Also, foreign movie stars were used: Neretva features Yul Brynner as partisan miner/engineer (great role, he had to blow the bridge against wishes of civilian refugees, but on direct order from Tito), Hardy Kr�ger (one of the best SS officer roles captured on film), great Orson Welles in the hilariously outworldly role of Chetnik "senator" (whatever it means). He gets killed by even worse badass chetnik dude, in a scene reminding of classic westerns.

(Later movie Sutjeska had Richard Burton in the role of Tito, too solemn for my taste, but I guess Burton wanted to make an impression on Tito himself, who occassionally dropped on the set to see what goes on.)

Italian star Franco Nero played the relatively prominent (and tragic) role of ex-Italian officer turned partisan in Neretva, which may be the reason why you confused it for an Italian movie.

Neretva is well worth renting in your local DVD outlet if you can find it.

Now, since I jumped in, as for the bad movies.... U-571 is everyone's favorite. Pretty much anything with that guy Dudikoff or S. Seagal is hilariously trashy (even if it's borderline as "war movie"). Windtalkers sucked big time but every movie featuring that IJA cap with "curtain" at the back gets points for style in my book.

I loved Thin Red Line, watched it couple times and was never bored, so count me in "I don't understand why TRL sucks for some guys" club.

Many of the John Wayne movies suck, though they are obviously product of some other, bygone era, and should be viewed as such. (Some have oneliners usable as sigs too.)

Pearl Harbor was fun though, if you knew what to expect and had FF button ready.

German Stalingrad was disappointement for me, I expected so much more from the team that made legendary Das Boot, but it's still far from being "bad".

O.

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(in reply to gunny)

Post #: 120