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All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Tactical Game

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Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 12:28:59 AM

Vincenzo_Beretta

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In the early '90s, when PacWar come out, Grisby published also a companion game called "Carrier Strike", about carrier warfare in the Pacific at tactical level. And of course those were the days of "Carriers at War" by SSG, too.

Now that we have both Grisby and the SSG crew aboard, what about a "companion tactical game" to WitP? On the usenet the idea is supported - eleven years passed since CAW2 and the last good game on the topic. I don't know if this is the right forum, but I re-installed both CS and CAW as a stopgap measure while waiting for WitP, and they are cool games even now

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 12:31:56 AM

Mr.Frag

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quote:

Now that we have both Grisby and the SSG crew aboard, what about a "companion tactical game" to WitP? On the usenet the idea is supported - eleven years passed since CAW2 and the last good game on the topic. I don't know if this is the right forum, but I re-installed both CS and CAW as a stopgap measure while waiting for WitP, and they are cool games even now

We are all dying for a Tactical Naval sim. You are not alone.

(in reply to Vincenzo_Beretta)

Post #: 2

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 12:35:45 AM

freeboy

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From: Colorado
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ditto.. its Midway and your decks are full of planes... Suddenly the next hour turn shows up and your going to launch.. but weight, those us cv's just got sighted......

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Post #: 3

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 1:42:15 AM

Huskalator

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I think a tactical carrier game would be great.

I'm thinking of a real-time game that is able to be paused so you could plan your next move. It would have IL-2 quality graphics and you could use a camera to follow you groups into battle. Maybe man some AAA guns on defense. That would be cool.

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 1:49:13 AM

gunnergoz

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I beg to differ - Please, no RTS crap, just a good, solid turn-based naval tactics game with contemporary graphics and really good AI. And I sure don't want an AA shooter! There are plenty of kiddie games in the bargain bin that fit the RTS and shooter addicts out there as it is.

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 1:52:38 AM

Huskalator

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Why does everyone assume that a game with good graphics and some action wouldn't have any depth or strategy?

Why can't we have the best of both worlds?

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Post #: 6

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 1:57:27 AM

gunnergoz

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Speaking only for myself, I have no desire whatsoever for "action." I play strategy games to think, not to twitch. I don't need the stress. I like to ponder my moves and take as long as I like to do it. I am OK with games that allow both sides to play then have simultaneous execution, but don't really care to work under a clock. But that's just me.
As to graphics, the 3D zoom in stuff is great and can be very engaging, but I all too often see it used as a substitute for substance. If they can incorporate it into a good strategic game, well then, great. I'd love to see it. I just doubt it can be done in a reasonable budget and timescale.

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Post #: 7

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 1:58:16 AM

kev_uk

Posts: 288
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

quote:

Now that we have both Grisby and the SSG crew aboard, what about a "companion tactical game" to WitP? On the usenet the idea is supported - eleven years passed since CAW2 and the last good game on the topic. I don't know if this is the right forum, but I re-installed both CS and CAW as a stopgap measure while waiting for WitP, and they are cool games even now

We are all dying for a Tactical Naval sim. You are not alone.

Norm Koger has what looks like a real time naval sim due out sometime, based on the Russo-Japanese was of 1905..here the link: http://home.austin.rr.com/normkoger/RJW.html
Looks pretty cool, seems to be more indepth than what Fighting Steel offered, but then again I had great fun with FS.

(in reply to Mr.Frag)

Post #: 8

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 2:14:06 AM

pad152

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I don't like real-time games either, but then I forget Harpoon was a real-time real wargame, one of the best every.

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Post #: 9

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 2:22:30 AM

Moose 4075

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I second the request for a tactical game. One that focuses on maneuver takes a little emphasis of of how one prepares ones planes, although I wouldn't want that aspect completely ignored.

Strategic, operational, and tactical levels all offer their own goodies and I love them all.

(in reply to pad152)

Post #: 10

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 2:26:44 AM

gunnergoz

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Go, Norm, Go!

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Post #: 11

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 2:36:48 AM

AlbA

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Have a look at http://www.mithis.hu/ and navigate to games in development where you'll find "Midway". I've seen a trailer for this and it looks very very good. Screenshots, details and movies at http://www.3dgamers.com/games/midway/. Due for release sometime next year.

(in reply to gunnergoz)

Post #: 12

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 2:59:36 AM

Yank

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Hmm...a "real-time" game. I'll have to see a lot more detail on this before I'm sold. The only people I think who have ever done a tactical carrier game right are Grigsby and SSG.

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Post #: 13

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 3:08:02 AM

freeboy

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I can think that a serious cpu problem would exists trying to model anything like a multiplane strike.. turn based with 30 min turns could have lots of options.. for carrier vs carrier action.. I suppose you could add a surface action component but few games are able to merge realtime and turn based well

(in reply to Yank)

Post #: 14

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 4:11:47 AM

PBYPilot

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quote:

ORIGINAL: gunnergoz

Speaking only for myself, I have no desire whatsoever for "action." I play strategy games to think, not to twitch. I don't need the stress. I like to ponder my moves and take as long as I like to do it. I am OK with games that allow both sides to play then have simultaneous execution, but don't really care to work under a clock. But that's just me.
As to graphics, the 3D zoom in stuff is great and can be very engaging, but I all too often see it used as a substitute for substance. If they can incorporate it into a good strategic game, well then, great. I'd love to see it. I just doubt it can be done in a reasonable budget and timescale.

Sort of like a "'Combat Mission' of the Sea"? I've always thought that would be very hot and am surprised no one has tackled it.

If only I were a better programmer....sigh

PBYPilot
"Slow airplanes and fast women"

(in reply to gunnergoz)

Post #: 15

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 4:28:17 AM

gunnergoz

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"Combat Mission of the Sea" is exactly what I'm thinking of...with a campaign component, of course. Wouldn't it be sweet?

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Post #: 16

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 4:32:37 AM

2Stepper

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You know? This is just my 2 cents, but I don't think I'll EVER understand aversions to RTS games. Sure some of us twitch at the idea of a warcraft or something equally weak. I just can't bring myself to play Command and Conquer for example...

That said however, if they put out a great tactical level ship to ship game REGARDLESS of the time frame I'd love it. I've played my share and they're good times...

One interesting point though is if you really look at WiTP and UV? Aren't they at least KINDA tactical? I mean at the naval and aircraft level we're watching the battles take place. Ships and planes getting hit, etc... Granted it's not from the first or third person level, but it's essentially the same... While it is abstracted somewhat one might argue that GG and the rest of the development lads have given us a marriage of tactical and strategic all wrapped up in a nice neat turn-based package.

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Post #: 17

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 4:40:54 AM

Copper

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Please take a look and support this game
http://home.austin.rr.com/normkoger/RJW.html

it looks to be a great game, norm kroger has some great stuff.

I dont know when it is coming out though.

trust me this is the game you're looking for. The time period is one i am very interested in.

darn someone beat me to it! Oh well i just wanted to express my support for this game

< Message edited by Copper -- 6/28/2004 2:56:56 AM >

(in reply to Vincenzo_Beretta)

Post #: 18

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 5:00:04 AM

Ron Saueracker

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quote:

ORIGINAL: kev_uk

quote:

ORIGINAL: Mr.Frag

quote:

Now that we have both Grisby and the SSG crew aboard, what about a "companion tactical game" to WitP? On the usenet the idea is supported - eleven years passed since CAW2 and the last good game on the topic. I don't know if this is the right forum, but I re-installed both CS and CAW as a stopgap measure while waiting for WitP, and they are cool games even now

We are all dying for a Tactical Naval sim. You are not alone.

Norm Koger has what looks like a real time naval sim due out sometime, based on the Russo-Japanese was of 1905..here the link: http://home.austin.rr.com/normkoger/RJW.html
Looks pretty cool, seems to be more indepth than what Fighting Steel offered, but then again I had great fun with FS.

That looks OK! If it works and the AI is good, on to a naval race game between Germany and Great Britain, with maybe alternate start time for conflict than Aug 1914.

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Post #: 19

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 10:40:52 AM

kev_uk

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quote:

ORIGINAL: AlbA

Have a look at http://www.mithis.hu/ and navigate to games in development where you'll find "Midway". I've seen a trailer for this and it looks very very good. Screenshots, details and movies at http://www.3dgamers.com/games/midway/. Due for release sometime next year.

Mmm looks like it will also be ported onto consoles as well....and we all know how many strategy titles are availible for them..

. I cant take it seriously.

It just seems a bit 'gamey', but I may be wrong. I think the upcoming 'Pacific Fighters' holds my attention better, cant wait to fly those Kates at 200ft on a torpedo run!

(in reply to AlbA)

Post #: 20

RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 2:12:37 PM

2Stepper

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Pacific Fighters eh? Sounds like an upscale version of Aces of the Pacific and/or Microsofts Combat flight sim 2 for the pacific.

Both good games... I DO enjoy a top flight sim in WW2. Though I've done WW1 flight sims also and loved em...

ah well... will see what happens...

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 4:43:35 PM

kev_uk

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Well you must have played IL2? Pacific Fighters is based on that game engine, looks stunning so far, and should be out end of this year.

(in reply to kev_uk)

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 7:38:11 PM

Nikademus

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update Warship and Battlecruiser....turn based. Never been bested.

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/28/2004 7:56:02 PM

Damien Thorn

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I would love to see a modern version of Microprose's "Pacific Air War: 1942". It was an operational game, around the scale of UV, but once you spotted the enemy and launched a strike you could jump in and take control of any of the airplanes. You could even play it over a modem but it wasn't too stable. The other thing that kind of ruined the modem experience is that everybody always rammed their planes into the enemy CV because is was worth it to take out the enemy CV.

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/29/2004 5:38:17 AM

CynicAl

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I can only speak for myself, but my aversion to RT"S" games is based on my aversion to the game mechanics of the genre. The basic "strategy" for nearly all of them is the same: build a big gaggle of units and then rush them at your opponent, and hope it's enough to win. Some units may have various special abilities which might be interesting... except that there's no possible way any human being who is not a speed-addled twelve-year-old can activate them in a timely manner, making them completely useless. So it comes back to the rush - Zerg Rush, Tank Rush, whatever, it's all the same. It ain't my idea of fun - nor of strategy, neither.

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/29/2004 5:45:22 AM

2Stepper

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Different type of RTS in my experience. It all depends on how the engine is designed to run. Steady with no changes in time (i.e Warcraft, C&C etc), ya, those bug the snot outta me and I gave them up ages ago.

Now games where you have control of the flow be it by slowing time down or having real time for a "tactical level" part of the game and turn based for the rest? I'm all in for that. Not everyone likes the "knee-jerk" reaction that some of the "RTS" games of today call for...

Bout the only "real time" wargame I play other then my turn based fav UV and eventually WiTP will be HOI (Hearts of Iron). And that's primarily because I don't consider it real time since I control the flow of time in the game... Just my thought on the matter...

On that note... time to crash...

< Message edited by 2Stepper -- 6/28/2004 9:46:10 PM >

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/29/2004 5:51:23 AM

Von Rom

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I would also like to see a new Carrier Strike:

1) Turn-based

2) The zoomed out ship models could have graphics like the ships in Pacific General and/or CivIII. They could even be animated (swivelling turrets; smoke from barrels; etc).

3) We can go onto the carrier itself and make decisions about fuel, bomb loads, types of planes, when to launch, targets, etc

4) Add a campaign as well as scenarios

5) Add a scenario/campaign/unit editor.

6) Provide for a random map generator that can create ocean/island environments, and allow places to be named by the user.

There is no reason why a game of this type would not only appeal to the traditional wargamer, but would also be appealing to many other types of gamers, thus expanding Matrix's gamer base.

Cheers!

< Message edited by Von Rom -- 6/29/2004 3:57:27 AM >

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RE: Tactical Game - 6/29/2004 6:13:07 AM

freeboy

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ditto, pbem or hth

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Post #: 28