Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

Name This...(266 Special Edation)

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Name This...(266 Special Edation) Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 6:21:24 PM   
Brady


Posts: 10701
Joined: 10/25/2002
From: Oregon,USA
Status: offline
???








_____________________________





Beta Team Member for:

WPO
PC
CF
AE
WiTE

Obi-wan Kenobi said it best: A lot of the reality we perceive depend on our point of view
Post #: 1
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 6:53:50 PM   
2Stepper


Posts: 948
Joined: 1/19/2003
From: North Burbs of Omaha
Status: offline
Tried to do a lil digging, but couldn't find a specific reference so I'll take a stab...

18" shell from either BB's Musashi or Yamato that just happened to be a dud.

Had also thought perhaps 16" shell from one of our bigboys, but in comparison to the soldiers hand, I'm betting its an 18"er.

Only other possibility I can think of is its a dud from a railcar howitzer, but I didn't think the Japanese employed those. So I'm doubting that.

_____________________________


"Send in the Infantry. Tanks cost money... the dead cost nothing..." :)

(in reply to Brady)
Post #: 2
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 7:41:02 PM   
jcjordan

 

Posts: 1900
Joined: 6/27/2001
Status: offline
Arm pointing to a line on an unexploded shell

(in reply to 2Stepper)
Post #: 3
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 7:43:11 PM   
dr. smith

 

Posts: 221
Joined: 6/30/2004
From: lost in space
Status: offline
world's first breast implant (size 88DD)

(in reply to jcjordan)
Post #: 4
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 8:05:54 PM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
Nope, Im guessing its too blunt to be a naval shell. Its a bomby thingy and if it goes off that guy is never going to be able to sit in his car and pick his nose again.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to dr. smith)
Post #: 5
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 8:07:32 PM   
pompack


Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: 2Stepper

Tried to do a lil digging, but couldn't find a specific reference so I'll take a stab...

18" shell from either BB's Musashi or Yamato that just happened to be a dud.

Had also thought perhaps 16" shell from one of our bigboys, but in comparison to the soldiers hand, I'm betting its an 18"er.

Only other possibility I can think of is its a dud from a railcar howitzer, but I didn't think the Japanese employed those. So I'm doubting that.


don't think it's a dud since the driving band doesn't seem to be engraved

(in reply to 2Stepper)
Post #: 6
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 8:13:04 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline
What's a driving band?

(in reply to pompack)
Post #: 7
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 8:20:53 PM   
pompack


Posts: 2582
Joined: 2/8/2004
From: University Park, Texas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

What's a driving band?

If you look at that raised thingee just above the hand, that is the driving band.

It is usually made of copper and is the diameter (roughly) of the bottom of the rifling grooves. The shell itself is the diameter (roughly) of the top or raised portion of the rifling groves. When the shell is fired, the driving band is deformed by the rifling; this gives a good gas seal and insures that the shell gets a good spin imposed as it travels up the barrel. If you tried to do something similar with the hardened steel of the shell itself, it would erode the rifling VERY quickly.

Disclaimer: I actually know nothing about ordnance and have never been present when anything larger than .30 cal was fired.

Edit: I need a spelling checker

< Message edited by pompack -- 12/17/2004 12:25:04 PM >

(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 8
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 8:31:12 PM   
ChezDaJez


Posts: 3436
Joined: 11/12/2004
From: Chehalis, WA
Status: offline
Appears to be a HE shell from a large caliber naval gun or very large artillery round. Its HE due to its rounded, not pointed shape and due to the fusing port on top. Has what apears to be rifling marks in places but that could also be scratches on the picture.

I don't see any attachment points on the bottom that a bomb would need for fins. The flat bottom also points to a naval shell.

Whose? Don't know. Architecture in background appears to be European but because the Europeans had colonies in the Far East, can't rule that area out.

Size? 16-18".

Best guess: Japanese naval shell, 18" dud.

_____________________________

Ret Navy AWCS (1972-1998)
VP-5, Jacksonville, Fl 1973-78
ASW Ops Center, Rota, Spain 1978-81
VP-40, Mt View, Ca 1981-87
Patrol Wing 10, Mt View, CA 1987-90
ASW Ops Center, Adak, Ak 1990-92
NRD Seattle 1992-96
VP-46, Whidbey Isl, Wa 1996-98

(in reply to Brady)
Post #: 9
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 8:31:53 PM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline
Is that one of those "san shiki" main battery AA rounds?

_____________________________

Fear the kitten!

(in reply to pompack)
Post #: 10
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 9:09:04 PM   
tc464

 

Posts: 126
Joined: 2/27/2004
From: Sodom on Potomac
Status: offline
I don't have access to my books at the moment, so I'm going off experience here. I'll be checking on it at home though, this one is a good challenge.

I don't think this is a projectile, for a couple reasons...

Not streamlined enough. The shape of the nose in the picture indicates a large bomb to me.

Rough surface. Projectiles were machined on the outside. Granted, this one may be dirty, but not that dirty.

Rotating band. First, I don't recall any projectiles with rotating bands located that far up on the body. Also, rotating bands on projectiles that size would be far more noticeable (2"-4" in width)

Nose fuze. All nose fuzes on projectiles are streamlined, making the projo look like it has a nice pointy tip. Again, if this is a dud, that nice pointy fuze would be mangled, but the small gap between the body and the widest part of the fuze is also suspicious. You wouldn't see that on a projectile fuze.

Now, as far as bombs go, this one fits better. It has a rough, or semi smooth body, a common shape to the nose, and the fuze reminds me of a typical nose impact fuze (possibly the M103 ?). Lugs may or may not be present, either due to impact, or because some bombs had strapped on lugs. If it's a dud, the fins may not be present. I rarely found a large size bomb with intact fins, and if I did, it was almost always the first thing I removed, in order to gain access to the tail fuze pocket.

I also thought it might be a breech loaded mortar round, like the ones used by Coastal Artillery, but I don't recall one being that big (I think 12" was the largest diameter). I actually measured my hand and used at as a way to try and measure the pic, and it came out to about 16"-18".

I think its a bomb, 1,000 to 3,000 lb range, general purpose, fragmentation or demolition. Like I said, I'll be hitting the books later.

Just my .02

(in reply to tsimmonds)
Post #: 11
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 9:20:34 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline
Dang thing looks (from the scale of the guys hand) to be four or five feet tall.

If you removed the back end off a torpedo, (and placed the engine section out of picture frame) would it look similar?

Forgive my speculating...

(in reply to tc464)
Post #: 12
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 9:30:06 PM   
tc464

 

Posts: 126
Joined: 2/27/2004
From: Sodom on Potomac
Status: offline
The nose would be wrong for that too. Torpedoes didn't have protruding nose fuzes, and the ones I saw either had a nice smooth round nose or a round nose with a rubber bladder (?) looking thing (due to chronic beer poisoning, the technical term escapes me at the moment), for acoustic fuzing. I'm speculating a bit too, its been years since my few days in Area 8.

(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 13
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 9:30:17 PM   
DrewMatrix


Posts: 1429
Joined: 7/15/2004
Status: offline
This is a film from the Yellow River Delta, spring 1942.

The guy is pointing to the high water mark from the winter flooding, where it left a stain on some boring old thing sitting on a blanket.

From the fact the boring old thing is sitting on a blanket, I assume it is taken on the beach, during optimum sun-tan hours (noon to 1 PM)

Beezle in California, Dude

_____________________________


Beezle - Rapidly running out of altitude, airspeed and ideas.

(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 14
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 10:04:40 PM   
panda124c

 

Posts: 1692
Joined: 5/23/2000
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline
Looks to be about 30cm or approx. 12" in diameter shaped much like a mortar round.
Some sort of round for a siege mortar.

If it was shorter and a little wider I'd say a 380mm StumTiger round.

(in reply to Brady)
Post #: 15
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 10:31:04 PM   
2Stepper


Posts: 948
Joined: 1/19/2003
From: North Burbs of Omaha
Status: offline
Nah, I doubt Brady would grab anything from the European theater. He's been pretty good about keeping them all Pacific based. Though I have been in "quiet" mode a while doing other things lately so anything is possible...

As for the pic, one of my first thoughts was a rail born howitzer round as I was pretty certain it was HE in nature due to the rounded off top.

Still, its tough to say. The dirty nature of it leads me to think it was a dud. Is it just possible the picture was taken to use as a training tool to other EOD troops of the day? As to explaining why it didn't go off maybe? Still bobbing for apples here, but I'm sticking with an unexploded 18" round.

_____________________________


"Send in the Infantry. Tanks cost money... the dead cost nothing..." :)

(in reply to panda124c)
Post #: 16
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:09:39 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
quote:

Nah, I doubt Brady would grab anything from the European theater. He's been pretty good about keeping them all Pacific based.


Have you forgotten the recent Italian pneumatic ASW mortar/R2D2's great-great-great-great-great grandfather?

_____________________________


(in reply to 2Stepper)
Post #: 17
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:12:36 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline
So what is Mr. Hand trying to draw our attention to?

(in reply to Brady)
Post #: 18
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:16:13 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
Measuring my own (average sized) hand from tip of index finger to wrist (about 7"), and comparing to this guys, the shell is about 2x that size = 14" diameter. I am surprised - I was guessing on the 18" size.

Similarly, it is 6.5 x 7" = 45.5" long. Of course, if our demo hand is from a giant or dwarf, it will skew the results.

_____________________________


(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 19
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:18:31 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
Could this represent the Japanese 800 kg AP bomb/converted BB shell?

_____________________________


(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 20
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:19:47 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline
I think several other folks have agreed that an AP shell would have a more "pointy" nose.

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 21
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:22:53 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

I think several other folks have agreed that an AP shell would have a more "pointy" nose.


Maybe - but the 800 kg bomb was a CONVERTED shell - no need for a ballistic cap, i think.

Just guessing, though...

_____________________________


(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 22
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:28:37 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

So what is Mr. Hand trying to draw our attention to?


Mr. Hand appears to be trying to point out the dark band on this thing. Why? I don't know

_____________________________


(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 23
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:33:09 PM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rtrapasso

quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

So what is Mr. Hand trying to draw our attention to?


Mr. Hand appears to be trying to point out the dark band on this thing. Why? I don't know


This look disturbingly like the top part of a Japanese Army 500 kg HE bomb (14.5" diameter). The fins are missing (if that is the case) - maybe Mr. Hand is pointing out the line where they USED to be attached. There appears to be a large hole in the background. Maybe this is where they dug it from?

_____________________________


(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 24
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/17/2004 11:39:01 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline
If your talking about the dirt pile to our left of the warhead, I think it's an AA gun emplacement. You can JUST make out the AA gun if you squint just right...

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 25
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/18/2004 12:14:23 AM   
rtrapasso


Posts: 22653
Joined: 9/3/2002
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

If your talking about the dirt pile to our left of the warhead, I think it's an AA gun emplacement. You can JUST make out the AA gun if you squint just right...


Yeah - I think you're right. I thought it was a crane/lifting device, but I think those are sandbags.

As for my idea of the 800 kg bomb - I found a picture of one - it is NOT the type 99 #80 mk 5 800 kg AP bomb used at PH. Body shape is wrong. That bomb is slightly pointed, though not so pointed as I would have thought a battleship shell would look like.

Could be part of a Japanese Type 98 #25 Land Bomb with part of fuze and fins stripped off - proportions are about right, but I don't know dimensions of this bomb yet.

_____________________________


(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 26
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/18/2004 12:51:05 AM   
tabpub


Posts: 1019
Joined: 8/10/2003
From: The Greater Chicagoland Area
Status: offline
I agree with PBear...looks SturmTigery to me...remember, this is the "Special Edition"....

(in reply to rtrapasso)
Post #: 27
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/18/2004 12:57:57 AM   
String


Posts: 2661
Joined: 10/7/2003
From: Estonia
Status: offline
it's a part of the innovative japanese anti-tank design ofcourse..

ya know, a soldier in a hole with an aircraft bomb and a hammer

(in reply to tabpub)
Post #: 28
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/18/2004 2:53:07 AM   
ADavidB


Posts: 2464
Joined: 9/17/2001
From: Toronto, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

Nah, I doubt Brady would grab anything from the European theater. He's been pretty good about keeping them all Pacific based. Though I have been in "quiet" mode a while doing other things lately so anything is possible...


I thought that Brady's "special edition" photos were from his other, non-pacific war Name This posts...

Dave Baranyi

(in reply to 2Stepper)
Post #: 29
RE: Name This...(266 Special Edation) - 12/18/2004 7:06:20 AM   
bbbf

 

Posts: 493
Joined: 7/16/2000
From: Hobart, Tasmania, Australia
Status: offline
The buildings are European.

I reckon its this: 380mm Stu M RW61 L/5.4, from a Sturmtiger.

Adapted naval mortar mounted on a tiger chassis (for those that don't know).

Full descriptiopn here: Achtung Panzer

_____________________________

Robert Lee

(in reply to ADavidB)
Post #: 30
Page:   [1] 2   next >   >>
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> Name This...(266 Special Edation) Page: [1] 2   next >   >>
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

2.203