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AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia

 
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AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:10:38 AM   
Ralegh


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Prussian campaign, Napolean level of difficulty.
Feel free to ask questions about why I made certain decisions, etc etc!

My initial strategy was to combine my armies and join in the French attack on Austria. My ambition was to grab a couple of provinces, and then spend the rest of the game being nice to Austria. Economically I got Magdeburg busy working on my first corps, and started producing lots of iron and textiles - I want some more corps counters and some artillery! I made lots of treaties - giving free passage and guarantees of peace to anyone who would spare some overseas colonies. Part of the reason is that giving them these things helps improve their perception of me… I also established a few trade routes, trading my surplus iron and horses for wine and textiles, but I also took some gold and food - again, this was mainly to improve other nations' view of Prussia (although I did want the wine!). Population wise we were expanding, with a couple of growth each month.

Austria surrendered quite early to all powers, including me, and I was able to take both Bohemia and Prague, which are Prussian objectives. At the same time, Galicia (another Prussian objective, and previously Austrian) went neutral, so I declared war on it and invaded with the army. The peurile Galicians went running to the French begging to be protected from me: the French issued me an ultimatum: let the war lapse or else. I figured the French couldn't possibly be silly enough to declare war on me: they were fighting Russia in parts of Austria and Prussia, there was a British army inside France, and the Swedes were marching. So I told them my war was going ahead. I was wrong in my analysis: they stood up for the protectorate, and declared war on Prussia.

EDIT: In fairness to the AI, they had just received Austria's unconditional surrender, without losing many men.

[By now, I had accepted Empire status, largely because of all the colonies I had been getting as a result of treaties…]

I immediately allied with Russia, and instructed my ally to gather his forces at my capital. It wasn't threatened yet, but I knew it would take the Russians a few months to get organised and then travel there, and I reckoned that would be the place… Meanwhile, Britain got Portugal as a protectorate, but lost the army in France (mostly prisoners), and Spain marched armies north to help its French ally.

French forces beseiged Berlin, but I steadfastly continued with the siege in Galicia, wanting it conquered before I turned the army west. This was a risky decision, and I was in some doubt about it. However, the next month the Russians relieved the seige of Berlin - my morale was at -458 at this point: couldn't have run it much closer! [If the enemy occupy or beseige your capital you lose 275 morale every month until you go under -750 and start being forced to surrender by insurrectionists.] I finished with Galicia, and moved to Berlin to consolidate.

EDIT - here I gloss over several important battles where we focused on capturing French artillery. Having Russian armies in the neighbourhood allowed me to call them in as reinforcements several times, as well as fight some battles jointly. The French attack on Prussia only failed because (a) most of the Russian army came down to help defend me (b) the Prussians fought darn well. And even then, in was very very close!

By this stage, I had built a couple of corps counters, and filled them with infantry and a bit of captured French artillery - why build artillery when you can confiscate it from the French! I sent the army to take Batavia, one corps to grab Bavaria, and left one corps with the Russians to defend my home. Why not smash the remaining French forces and move on Paris? Even more than defeating the French, I wanted LOTS of their territory: I wanted to conquer some before they surrendered, and given the huge alliance fighting them, this seemed safe enough.

At this stage I got an unpleasant surprise - an Austrian army took Bavaria before I could! I wanted Bavaria. Darn! I assume Austria's enforced peace with France was over, and they had rejoined the coalition and declared war! Still, it relieved some pressure…

To cut the story short, we conquered Batavia (using the Prussian fleet to blockade during the seige - I knew they would come in handy one day!), and occupied Kleves, Palatinate and Berg. We then reset the Russian rally point to Paris, and moved a large army (about 100,000 men, including 5 artillery divisions, 7 cavalry divisions, 4 infantry divisions organised in one army with 2 corps and my 8 leaders) to besiege Paris. We were joined by a 60,000 Russians (with more coming), and 80,000 Austrians who were allied to the Russians if not to me.

Saxony were so impressed with me they asked to be my protectorate: yeah! 96,000 men, and Saxony comes with a corps counter (and lots of cav). I hadn't done anything deliberately to make them like me: but I suppose beating up the French helped!

The French counter attack was significant: 131,000 men under Napoleon. There was a surprise, however, somehow Spain was allowed to participate in the battle - I didn't know COG did that! (At this point Spain and I were not at war with each other!) I am not sure what would have happened in the battle if I had taken a pot shot at a Spanish unit - in the event they went haring after Russians, and I was busy turning the French right flank while putting a cav charge into their supply caissons. I suspect the game would not have allowed me to shoot at them.

Anyway, the battle wasn't bad - we significantly outnumbered them, and at this point the French were poor on artillery and cavalry - I had already captured most of it. [The POW camp in East Prussia held 17 French divisions and 2 generals at this point, and 4 of the arty divisions I was using started the game French!]






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< Message edited by Ralegh -- 6/28/2005 10:05:05 AM >


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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:13:32 AM   
Ralegh


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France surrendered to Britain first, then a couple of months later to the allies Russia and Austria. A final counter attack had me worried for a moment - 80,000 French against my 90,000 Prussians - but I had better quality units with lots of cav and arty - they were down to no arty and only one cav! Finally France surrendered to me.

I got lots of victory points in the surrender because I had taken so many of their cities, and am an empire. In the surrender terms, I hired the Grand Armee for 3 years (hehe!), exiled Napolean, and took Flanders, Gascony, Lorraine, Palatinate, and Kleves as ceded provinces. This is about as mean as am unconditional surrender gets.
- Here is the treaty:




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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:16:00 AM   
Ralegh


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Oh - while we are talking about treaties, here is a screenie of the deal I cut with Spain.




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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:17:28 AM   
Ralegh


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Meanwhile, Spain had taken Portugal off Britain, and then given it to Turkey as part of a surrender to them (the Spanish army was in Prussia fighting Russians, remember!)

So at this point it is Nov 1808, and I am a long way ahead!





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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:20:08 AM   
Ralegh


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We have 19 cities, 165 colonies, 535,000 men under arms (and a French Grand armee on loan for 3 years), national morale has just recently maxed at 1000. And the only people who hate us are France and Spain - which is OK. Spain is still fighting Russia (mainly in Prussia!), and I have enforced peace with France.

I pulled the army back into automatic forage zones, and kicked my economy into top gear, building lots of culture to peaceably get more glory. At the same time, I traded Austria some territory I didn't really want (Thorn, Breslau and Krakow, which aren't on my political goals list) for Bavaria, which is on my goals list. I also got them to ally with me, preparing for the moment when everyone else realizes I am about to win. This also helped my waste situation, as I now have less countries under my control.

I immediately changed Bavaria into a protectorate - although this means I don't get to choose what they build etc, it means still less waste, and I get the Bavarian army - its only got a couple of divisions at this point, but it is a free army! What the heck: the game is almost over - I made protectorates out of everyone else I could: waste dropped, and my empire score went up to 50, which is the highest I've ever seen.

The "All of Europe is alarmed at the rise of Prussia" message started, and suddenly Sweden and Britain started redeploying their units. Guess what they are going to do! Austria and Russia are allied to me - I don't have to worry about them (as long as I keep them sweet). Spain still hates me, but they are at war with Sweden and Britain, so I won't have to worry about them (the AI believes the enemy of my enemy is my friend, as it were). France is under enforced peace with me. Hmmm: the turks - oh, nothing anywhere near me: ignore them.

Sure enough, 2 months later Sweden and Britain start attacking - I didn't actually see a declaration of war, so they must have paid extra for a surprise attack! Good luck guys - you'll need it. I send:
- A corps and the French army against Thuringia (Swedish, with a Swedish army present)
- An army and a corps (Saxon) against Hannover
- An army (Bavarian) and a corps against Mecklenburg
- Leaving an army and a corps in reserve in Berlin as my manoevre force.
[At this point, each of my corps and armies is 2 inf, 2 cav, 2 arty, and I am just building the guards I want to put into each army as well.]

Yep - the Swedes fight well, but I have lots more troops in these areas, and short supply lines. The French take a defeat (that army on loan is all infantry: they didn't have arty or cav by the end of their war with me), but I kick butt in all the other combats. Three months of minor battles (that’s unfair - there were 100,000 men in that Swedish army), and the game is won in October 1809.

Prussia 1012
Britain 721
Sweden 721
Spain 655
Turkey 642
Austria 629
Russia 421
France 143

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:27:25 AM   
Ralegh


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Elapsed playing time: about 12 hours. (I fought detailed combats whenever the system would let me.)

Particular points of note:
- battle for Paris where not all the participants were at war with all the other participants
- the battle where the French Grand Armee on loan plus a Prussian corps went to the third day (!) against the Swedes, with both sides wavering for several turns and (for the first time I have seen it) both sides breaking simultaneously!
- the report doesn't cover the French losing most of their troops, because I didn't see it: the Austrians/Russians/British wore them down for me.
- Spain and Russia spent most of the game going at it: giving them both access was a masterstroke that neutralised them for most of the game from my point of view.
- I didn't see any leaders die during the game at all - and I was trying to kill some!

Any questions?

< Message edited by Ralegh -- 6/28/2005 9:55:42 AM >


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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:53:42 AM   
grudge

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Ralegh
Any questions?



Give me that game! Now!

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:58:28 AM   
Ralegh


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PS - If you like this sort of AAR (or want to suggest some tweaks), speak up. If no one says anything, I will assume this was a waste of time. If people like it, I can do more as I play the other countries (I want to win at the top level as each country in the GOLD version of the game - I have done it a few times before at different versions - do you want info on the games?) Would other info have been better? Too much?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 10:17:06 AM   
grudge

 

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Oh, I like these AARs. Very good to spend my time while waiting for the 30th.
Keep on!

cu
grudge

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 11:07:11 AM   
ess1

 

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Much appreciated. Please continue reports with, perhaps, a few screenies.

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 11:14:34 AM   
cbpraem

 

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Good AAR. Nice to read how the game plays
The past 3 AARs have left me wondering of the capabilities of the AI...

Why would Russia and Spain figth it out on Prussian territory? What could they possibly gain by doing that?
Allso it seems the AI should have avoided an alliance with Prussia in the later part of the game, and when in the alliance, Russia and/or Austria should have forsaken it to keep Prussia from winning after less than 5 years?

Ralegh what is your take on the AI? Is it a deasent challenge?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 11:42:52 AM   
steveh11Matrix


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I for one really appreciate the AAR's posted here, Ralegh.

Steve.

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 5:07:32 PM   
benpark

 

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Thanks for that.

Two questions: Was that the hardest level(and did it seem especialy tough)? Could you also post some screens from the tactical level battles in the next one?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 5:34:20 PM   
sol_invictus


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Very interesting. Please continue with further exploits. I agree, Austria and Russia should have forsaken their alliance with Prussia and joined the Grand Coalition in order to halt Prussian hegemony. Maybe the diplomatic AI needs a tweak so that whenever any nation starts to approach a win, all treaties with that country go by the board and a Grand Coalition against said warmonger is the result. I thought this is how it was already.

Can the Glory Level be modified by the player? Say, increase it to 1500 or so before victory is declared?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 6:34:30 PM   
Jordan

 

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Probably they should have. However, it could get tricky. It could (and probably would) depend on the relative position of the other nations. In the AAR, it appears that Austria and Russia were so far behind - and Prussia so far ahead with no credible threats to their power - that they should have chucked the treaty with Prussia and joined Britain and Sweden. If one of them was closer in terms of points and perhaps Britain or Sweden more of a threat to Prussia, then maybe they should wait and see what happens.

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 6:39:38 PM   
Feralkoala

 

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The ganging up aspect doesn't concern me nearly as much as countries with absolutely nothing in common (i.e., Spain and Russia in this particular AAR) fighting it out pointlessly in a 3rd country that allows them both access!

It appears that there is no penalty to having foreign armies (particularly two as rapacious historically as the Russians and Spanish) fight on your land--you might as well rent it out like an arena The ability to continue using this at the highest AI level as a matter of strategy is a bit disturbing to me, especially since it was used primarily in this fashion to circumvent the large anti-Prussian coalition from coming into force at the end of the game.

I hope that this is either not possible in Gold or is remedied in a patch fairly quickly.

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 7:20:00 PM   
Forwarn45

 

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quote:

"It appears that there is no penalty to having foreign armies (particularly two as rapacious historically as the Russians and Spanish) fight on your land--you might as well rent it out like an arena"


I agree with this. There should be substantial penalties (economic/morale) when foreign countries use your home country as a battleground. Is this modeled in the game?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 7:55:09 PM   
Zan

 

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Thx for the good AAR.Some screens would be nice.

Can the player set their own political goals?

I wonder about the foolish Spanish and Russian war as well.Maybe they were fighting for colonies?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 8:10:22 PM   
pfhokie

 

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The AARs are great because they give you a great feel for how things are managed.

What about Naval? Any action on the sea?

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 8:41:03 PM   
Titanwarrior89


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Your AAR was great, liked it. But I would rather have the game in my hands

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:22:12 PM   
ericbabe


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Arinvald

Very interesting. Please continue with further exploits. I agree, Austria and Russia should have forsaken their alliance with Prussia and joined the Grand Coalition in order to halt Prussian hegemony. Maybe the diplomatic AI needs a tweak so that whenever any nation starts to approach a win, all treaties with that country go by the board and a Grand Coalition against said warmonger is the result. I thought this is how it was already.

Can the Glory Level be modified by the player? Say, increase it to 1500 or so before victory is declared?


Glory level can be set by the player.

The AI does begin to break alliances with nations that are getting close to winning. I used to have it happen more deterministically but beta testers thought there should be a lower chance of losing your good allies when you start winning -- it's something that could easily be tweaked more aggresively in a patch.

Russia and Spain start at war in the 1805 scenario and the AI does not often surrender or propose peace unless it has a good reason. A third nation starting to win is one of the "good reasons", but it doesn't happen automatically.


Eric

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:57:43 PM   
Mr. Z


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quote:

Can the player set their own political goals?

Not exactly. Political goals, inasmuch as they exist, are preset for each scenario (though IIRC they may currently be identical for each scenario, but I think we did change them slightly) and consist of a list of target provinces to either capture or keep independent. Otherwise, "political goals" are just whatever strategic and diplomatic options the player decides would constitute a winning strategy. (However, Eric has noted in another thread that you can easily modify the target provinces for a nation in the appropriate text file.)


< Message edited by Mr. Z -- 6/28/2005 10:00:55 PM >

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 9:58:55 PM   
Mr. Z


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quote:

Russia and Spain start at war in the 1805 scenario and the AI does not often surrender or propose peace unless it has a good reason. A third nation starting to win is one of the "good reasons", but it doesn't happen automatically.

Is losing an ally a good reason? I again propose that if it isn't, it should be.

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/28/2005 10:46:58 PM   
Warfare1


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Keep up with AARs - I enjoy reading them :)

What I would like to see:

1) Maps of the situation as you progress

2) Casualty reports for many of the battles


Issues:

1) I think any country that starts winning should be looked upon as a threat and countries should start joining a coalition against that country. It just seems odd that Prussia would have been allowed to go on to victory in that fashion.

2) Does Napoleon offer special bonuses for the French? He repeatedly destroyed larger armies than he had under his command time and time again, by attacking them separately. Is this modelled in the game?

3) What is modible in the game? What can the player himself change in the game files? Is there an editor?

Thanks

< Message edited by Warfare1 -- 6/28/2005 10:53:03 PM >

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/29/2005 12:04:55 AM   
ericbabe


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I've been considering making an infallible-Napoleon game toggle switch that could be set from the .INI file. If turned on, the French would never lose a battle in which Napoleon participated. It would be kind of a cute little thing to add.

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/29/2005 12:21:35 AM   
Arditi


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EricBabe says...."I've been considering making an infallible-Napoleon game toggle switch that could be set from the .INI file. If turned on, the French would never lose a battle in which Napoleon participated. It would be kind of a cute little thing to add".

Ha ha ha...

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/29/2005 2:32:18 AM   
Guderon

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ericbabe

I've been considering making an infallible-Napoleon game toggle switch that could be set from the .INI file. If turned on, the French would never lose a battle in which Napoleon participated. It would be kind of a cute little thing to add.


AAAACK! I get to be the French!

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/29/2005 3:06:20 AM   
dpazuk


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I want to give my 'thumbs' up to your AAR's. Please by all means continue!

I have been chomping at the bit for this title. I can't wait for the long weekend!

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/29/2005 3:19:13 AM   
Ralegh


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quote:

ORIGINAL: cbpraem

Good AAR. Nice to read how the game plays
The past 3 AARs have left me wondering of the capabilities of the AI...

Why would Russia and Spain figth it out on Prussian territory? What could they possibly gain by doing that?
Allso it seems the AI should have avoided an alliance with Prussia in the later part of the game, and when in the alliance, Russia and/or Austria should have forsaken it to keep Prussia from winning after less than 5 years?

Ralegh what is your take on the AI? Is it a deasent challenge?


a) Russia and Spain started at war, and neither ever had a good reason to stop. (The Turkish attack on Spain was over too quickly to affect the other war.) I think Spain should have included Russia in its surrender to Turkey - after all, it didn't have anything to gain out of the war. Or declared a cease fire. Once France (Spains ally, and the reason they start the game at war with Russia) surrendered to the Russians, Spain should have taken a cease fire or something.

b) Austria really liked me at this point - I had been trading with them, and had diplomats stationed there improving our relationship, and I offered a really good trade deal to get the alliance. At the same time, I tried to get alliances with Sweden and Britain - no way. Even though I had never done anything bad to either of them, (as opposed to Austria, who I had attacked at the start of the game), neither of them liked me much, and neither would even consider an alliance with me. I think this was the AI working really well!

What I raised as a bug was Spain continuing its pointless war with Russia. Spain hated my guts, and didn't mind their Russian enemies. The "All of Europe is Alarmed" message should have triggered Spain making a cease fire with Russia so they could attack me.

c) I don't want to brag, but I am the most experienced tester - Eric (the designer) concedes that I might have actually played more games than he has! I wrote most of the briefing material for the testers on game dynamics, tactics etc, and co-wrote the strategy and tip guides for the manual with Eric, and will provide tip sheets etc to help people at release. All of that said, at Napoleon level even if I try my very hardest, I don't always win. And that is WITHOUT using the handicapping feature!

Is the AI a challenge? Definitely. Is it perfect? No - the other playtesters and I are raising bugs and working with both Matrix and WCS to fine tune the AI. Although the game has gone GOLD, work hasn't stopped - mainly at the moment on a free service pack, and then we are hoping for an expansion pack. For me, this is one of the most exciting things about this game (and why I have been willing to pour so much time and effort into it) - they care, and plan for it to continue improving!

[Handicapping feature: at the start of the game you can modify the 'power' of each country on a scale of +3 to -3, with 0 being normal. I use it in solo games so I can play 2 or 3 countries and have a challenge even if they work together!]

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Steve/Ralegh

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RE: AAReport - Ralegh as Prussia - 6/29/2005 3:24:49 AM   
Ralegh


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A number of people have said things like:

quote:

Austria and Russia should have forsaken their alliance with Prussia and joined the Grand Coalition in order to halt Prussian hegemony


Do you all really think that? I have been very outspoken with the idea that very strong allies should be quite happy for you to win (historical) - especially if they have no chance (gameplayer). Remember that I was the main trading partner for both of them, had fought on their side against France, had provided access/supply/etc, had active treaties with them where I promised not to attack them.

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Steve/Ralegh

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