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Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screenshot)

 
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Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screenshot) - 7/10/2005 11:01:47 PM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline 		All my trades with other countries they are sending me money for products...

My merchants are gainging 21 a month....(When there are no privateers in the same province)

I cant figure out why im in the negative here???




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< Message edited by Tanaka -- 7/10/2005 11:07:48 PM >

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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:07:09 PM   
gdpsnake

 

Posts: 786
Joined: 8/7/2000
From: Kempner, TX
Status: offline 		Your army upkeep is killing you disband or reduce their readiness.

(in reply to Tanaka)
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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:08:46 PM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: gdpsnake

Your army upkeep is killing you disband or reduce their readiness.


Does that include depot costs? Ive got way too many depots and am about to disband lots of them...

I dont think you can disband armies or units???

< Message edited by Tanaka -- 7/10/2005 11:09:53 PM >

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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:13:01 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline 		Trade routes also cost money to maintain, the longer the distance, the more it costs. You might want to try reviewing your trades and consolidating to fewer, more lucrative trade routes if possible.

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CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

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(in reply to Tanaka)
Post #: 4
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:16:39 PM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Trade routes also cost money to maintain, the longer the distance, the more it costs. You might want to try reviewing your trades and consolidating to fewer, more lucrative trade routes if possible.


hmm thanks erik i did not know this. i will check this out!

as i didnt really need any products i was just trading products for money. i didnt realize this would put me in debt!

canceling all trades now!

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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:18:58 PM   
gdpsnake

 

Posts: 786
Joined: 8/7/2000
From: Kempner, TX
Status: offline 		Yes, depots cost a lot of money - get rid of all you are not using or wherever you can forage below the area value containing your trrops. Click on an area - it gives a forage value - compare that to force size. Often, the info window when you click on units will say - unit is foraging expected losses of "X"

I never tried to disband, I just assumed it was an option. In either case, reducing readiness will help.

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Post #: 6
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:19:29 PM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Trade routes also cost money to maintain, the longer the distance, the more it costs. You might want to try reviewing your trades and consolidating to fewer, more lucrative trade routes if possible.


now my question is how do i cancel my trades in progress....

ah i see it now! the active/broken button!

warning!!! watch out when you push this button as there is no going back!!!

< Message edited by Tanaka -- 7/10/2005 11:24:43 PM >

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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:23:06 PM   
bluemonday

 

Posts: 233
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline 		Go to Economy menu -> Review Trade tab.

See trade route with "Active" button.

CLick on this button to change to "Broken"

Repeat for all routes you wish to cancel.

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Post #: 8
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:25:54 PM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bluemonday

Go to Economy menu -> Review Trade tab.

See trade route with "Active" button.

CLick on this button to change to "Broken"

Repeat for all routes you wish to cancel.


and once you push the button you cant change it back!


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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:28:50 PM   
bluemonday

 

Posts: 233
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tanaka

and once you push the button you cant change it back!

That seems to unfortunately be in line with the general theme of the game which is that once something has been done, it can't be undone.

This really needs to be addressed in a patch, not just for this but for all such cases.

(in reply to Tanaka)
Post #: 10
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/10/2005 11:29:42 PM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Erik Rutins

Trade routes also cost money to maintain, the longer the distance, the more it costs. You might want to try reviewing your trades and consolidating to fewer, more lucrative trade routes if possible.


Erik shouldnt there be a way to tell if a trade is worth it or not? How do I tell if it actually costs more to have the trade route than to trade the goods and money in the trade route themselves???

Im gussing u cany really trade for profit here only to get goods that u need...

< Message edited by Tanaka -- 7/10/2005 11:39:45 PM >

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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 12:05:28 AM   
max_h

 

Posts: 187
Joined: 10/18/2002
Status: offline 		negative expenses = income... you´re making money from your trades.

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Post #: 12
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 12:09:38 AM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: max_h

negative expenses = income... you´re making money from your trades.


hmm yep this would make sense as it is under expenses....

well this brings up the question:

Shouldnt they put a trade income section under income???

< Message edited by Tanaka -- 7/11/2005 12:13:01 AM >

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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 1:20:44 AM   
dpstafford


Posts: 1910
Joined: 5/26/2002
From: Colbert Nation
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tanaka
as i didnt really need any products i was just trading products for money. i didnt realize this would put me in debt!

canceling all trades now!

Canceling all trades to avoid going bankrupt! What a game!!

(in reply to Tanaka)
Post #: 14
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 1:22:28 AM   
dpstafford


Posts: 1910
Joined: 5/26/2002
From: Colbert Nation
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Tanaka

well this brings up the question:

Shouldnt they put a trade income section under income???

The way this game works, trading is a way to go broke fast........

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Post #: 15
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 1:27:31 AM   
dpstafford


Posts: 1910
Joined: 5/26/2002
From: Colbert Nation
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: bluemonday
That seems to unfortunately be in line with the general theme of the game which is that once something has been done, it can't be undone.

This really needs to be addressed in a patch, not just for this but for all such cases.

Yes. The interface in this game makes me long affectionately for a Grigsby DOS game UI.

(in reply to bluemonday)
Post #: 16
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 2:16:09 AM   
Ralegh


Posts: 1557
Joined: 2/1/2005
Status: offline

THE ADVICE IN THIS THREAD IS WRONG.

a) The negative amount next to the trade expense in the screenshot means the player is making a profit from trading - it is a good thing.
b) I can't find where the cost of trade routes is factored in: it seems to be somewhere deep under the hood between gross and net. The cost of trade routes is NOT included in this trade expense item.
c) The proposer of the trade route pays for it, according to the manual. So routes other players proposed are being paid for by them...
d) I think depot upkeep costs (15 per turn each) are included in the military upkeep item.
e) Personally, I hope WCS do NOT 'fix' the lack of an undo button. Commitment is part of the charm of the game. However so many people have asked for it, they very well might.

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HTH
Steve/Ralegh

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Post #: 17
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 2:44:26 AM   
Reiryc

 

Posts: 4991
Joined: 1/5/2001
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ralegh



THE ADVICE IN THIS THREAD IS WRONG.

a) The negative amount next to the trade expense in the screenshot means the player is making a profit from trading - it is a good thing.
b) I can't find where the cost of trade routes is factored in: it seems to be somewhere deep under the hood between gross and net. The cost of trade routes is NOT included in this trade expense item.
c) The proposer of the trade route pays for it, according to the manual. So routes other players proposed are being paid for by them...
d) I think depot upkeep costs (15 per turn each) are included in the military upkeep item.
e) Personally, I hope WCS do NOT 'fix' the lack of an undo button. Commitment is part of the charm of the game. However so many people have asked for it, they very well might.


Yep...

You'll note that in the screenshot the top half says income and the bottom half says expenses. Thus the numbers in the bottom half are subtracted from the total of the numbers in the top half. So if you subtract a negative, it actually adds to the numbers.

My opinion is that trade is listed in the incorrect place and should be moved to the Income half of the 'statement' as opposed to the expenses or if we want to get complex, then adding the income from trade up top and the expenses associated with the trade at the bottom.



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Post #: 18
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 2:50:30 AM   
bluemonday

 

Posts: 233
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ralegh

e) Personally, I hope WCS do NOT 'fix' the lack of an undo button. Commitment is part of the charm of the game. However so many people have asked for it, they very well might.

No offense, but this kind of attitude pre-supposes some kind of socio-military simulation that just is not in the game. There is no advantage to be gained from having a game system which causes half and hour of gameplay to be wiped out by a mis-click. Having no Undo button doesn't force people to live with their choices - it just forces them to go back to the previous save. I don't know how many times I've had to re-load a PBEM turn (and I'm in three right now) because I did not click exactly in the middle of a province, or I had inadvertently still selected a unit and then clicked to select another one, and moved the unit I had selected to a completely different province than I had intended. None of this improves gameplay - it just increases frustration with what could (after a lot of bug fixing) be a really good game.

(in reply to Ralegh)
Post #: 19
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 2:55:33 AM   
bluemonday

 

Posts: 233
Joined: 6/20/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Reiryc

My opinion is that trade is listed in the incorrect place and should be moved to the Income half of the 'statement' as opposed to the expenses or if we want to get complex, then adding the income from trade up top and the expenses associated with the trade at the bottom.

My opinion is that this screen needs another ten line items. Or expansion into a separate screen.

(in reply to Reiryc)
Post #: 20
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 5:02:09 AM   
YohanTM2

 

Posts: 1143
Joined: 10/7/2002
From: Toronto
Status: offline 		Now you really need the undo button after wiping out all those profitable trade routes <g>

quote:

ORIGINAL: max_h

negative expenses = income... you´re making money from your trades.


(in reply to max_h)
Post #: 21
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 5:23:39 AM   
Tanaka


Posts: 4378
Joined: 4/8/2003
From: USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Yohan

Now you really need the undo button after wiping out all those profitable trade routes <g>

quote:

ORIGINAL: max_h

negative expenses = income... you´re making money from your trades.




hehe yes luckily i had a save and reloaded...


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RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 11:02:38 AM   
Reg Pither


Posts: 196
Joined: 9/19/2003
From: London
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ralegh



THE ADVICE IN THIS THREAD IS WRONG.

a) The negative amount next to the trade expense in the screenshot means the player is making a profit from trading - it is a good thing.


Phew! I'm soooo glad that someone said that at last, as I was beginning to think I had a serious misunderstanding of the game on this screen. I'd always thought that a negative Trade figure under 'Expenses' meant I was making money, but it can be confusing at first. It should, as others have said, be moved to the 'Income' section.

(in reply to Ralegh)
Post #: 23
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 6:22:28 PM   
Erik Rutins

 

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Ralegh
THE ADVICE IN THIS THREAD IS WRONG.

a) The negative amount next to the trade expense in the screenshot means the player is making a profit from trading - it is a good thing.
b) I can't find where the cost of trade routes is factored in: it seems to be somewhere deep under the hood between gross and net. The cost of trade routes is NOT included in this trade expense item.
c) The proposer of the trade route pays for it, according to the manual. So routes other players proposed are being paid for by them...
d) I think depot upkeep costs (15 per turn each) are included in the military upkeep item.
e) Personally, I hope WCS do NOT 'fix' the lack of an undo button. Commitment is part of the charm of the game. However so many people have asked for it, they very well might.


Thanks for the explanation Ralegh.


_____________________________

Erik Rutins
CEO, Matrix Games LLC



For official support, please use our Help Desk: http://www.matrixgames.com/helpdesk/

Freedom is not Free.

(in reply to Ralegh)
Post #: 24
RE: Why am I losing money through trade??? (See screens... - 7/11/2005 10:43:54 PM   
Naomi

 

Posts: 654
Joined: 6/21/2005
From: Osaka
Status: offline 		Putting trade along with other expense/cost categories, designers seemingly intended to encourage us players to export our expense/cost problems to our trade partners.

(in reply to Erik Rutins)
Post #: 25
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