Suggestions for Waste

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Suggestions for Waste - 8/19/2005 4:50:35 PM

ian77

Posts: 627
Joined: 4/27/2004
From: Scotland
Status: offline

I hope this is not too presumptuous of me but I should like to make a series of Game Play suggestions. These are not necessarily my own original ideas;

Waste

Overall I really like the concept and implementation of waste. It helps to stop COG from being just any other empire building game where once the player hits critical mass it is only a question of when not if they will win.

My biggest problems with waste are money and food. Playing the longer campaigns it becomes impossible to place a single depot without causing starvation amongst civilians and the inability to pay all your unit support costs.

Courts - every level of courts in each province should generate one additional gold, after waste has been applied.
Farms - every level of farms in each province should generate one additional food, after waste has been applied.

Every province with level 6 Courts, level 6 Roads, and level 6 Culture increases the waste base level by one. The province must have all 3 developments at level 6 to qualify for the bonus. Now instead of waste kicking in at 10 textiles we will get 11 before waste begins. Not a huge improvement, but every little helps. To my mind this represents a province with good infrastructure and government presence/supervision.

I believe these suggestions will encourage players to build more courts and roads, and to develop farms in all provinces not just those which they target as food producers, but without completely unbalancing the present waste restrictions. Early game we may see more excess cash and food, but the existing stock piling limits will continue to stop this being a major problem IMHO, and I think they may be easier to implement with regard to programming(?)...

I also think that it will now be more practical for a nation to plunder its own developed provinces to reduce their economic value to the conquering power� a good practical reason for scorched earth tactics.

Ian

Post #: 1

RE: Suggestions for Waste - 8/19/2005 8:39:02 PM

Hard Sarge

Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
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not to put down ideas or anything
but I think Eric already has an idea on what and how he hopes to get this working

hopefully, some of the ideas that have been made will be slipped in

but overall, with Eric's track record with these game, I am willing to take a chance on what he thinks is best

so saying....

level of Docks help the amount of money Merchants make ?????

Factories, improve the number of Labor/Iron made, not lost to waste ????

and so on :)

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RE: Suggestions for Waste - 8/19/2005 9:03:39 PM

ian77

Posts: 627
Joined: 4/27/2004
From: Scotland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hard Sarge

I think Eric already has an idea on what and how he hopes to get this working
with Eric's track record with these game, I am willing to take a chance on what he thinks is best

I agree 100%, Eric has come up with a fantastic game

quote:

so saying....

level of Docks help the amount of money Merchants make ?????

Factories, improve the number of Labor/Iron made, not lost to waste ????

and so on :)

I think factories do increase labour, luxuries and iron already..

I was just looking to put down some suggestions for what I think is a great game, hoping to get others to join in a group discussion, and if Eric wants or can implement any of them then Great, we have all helped make our great game.

Ian

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RE: Suggestions for Waste - 8/19/2005 11:15:44 PM

ericbabe

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Joined: 3/23/2005
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These are good ideas and are sort of similar to what we're working on. The model we're testing right now gives diminished waste penalties for nations with fewer than 20 provinces and increased waste penalties for nations with more than 30 provinces. Protectorates don't count toward the limit. Provinces with 5 or more levels of Courts also don't count toward the limit. We've lowered the steepest level of waste from -90% to -80% -- which is a huge change just in itself.

I'd like to assign some other special abilities to the other developments -- something concrete at sufficiently high levels and combinations of levels would be preferable, in my mind, to bonuses that are abstracted and graduated. Any ideas along these lines are welcome.

(in reply to ian77)

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RE: Suggestions for Waste - 8/19/2005 11:32:41 PM

ian77

Posts: 627
Joined: 4/27/2004
From: Scotland
Status: offline

I just cannot wait to see the new version Eric, I am drooling all over my keyboard in anticipation!!

ian

I think the concept of waste is great, it really stops the juggernaut style play which nearly every strategy game suffers from. My suggestions were trying not to weaken the waste element just add a bit more food and cash to allow a bigish empire the chance to use a depot now and again, and to try and encourage the balanced developement of a players provinces. As I mentioned above, I do not claim authorship of these ideas, in another thread I recall Eric saying he wanted to give players more of a reason to build courts and thought that waste could be the carrot, I just wanted to put in my suggestion(s)... as Hard Sarge says below, Eric's involvement and posting at the forum encourages us all to give voice to our ideas and flights of fancy. Most of it will never see the light of day within the game, but you never know. I am sure someone will come up with a seemingly simple suggestion which everyone else has overlooked, and we will all be wondering why we had not thought of it sooner!

Ian

< Message edited by ian77 -- 8/19/2005 11:56:01 PM >

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Post #: 5

RE: Suggestions for Waste - 8/19/2005 11:35:22 PM

Hard Sarge

Posts: 22741
Joined: 10/1/2000
From: garfield hts ohio usa
Status: offline

Kewl
and thanks Eric
the more you guys post, the free'er I am say stuff :)

I am going to post some screen shots in the war room, from my current game, so maybe you all can get a better idea of what it may look like

HARD_Sarge

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RE: Suggestions for Waste - 8/20/2005 1:52:28 AM

Latour_Maubourg

Posts: 90
Joined: 7/7/2005
Status: offline

I would be very interested to see how the developers made AI country rules, no joke. Just to compare. What makes an AI country tick. How come an AI country can easier build armies. How come an AI country can easier fill their treasury. How come an AI country can easier develop. Because If i try to combine these 3 things. I always fale. I have to make concessions to one of those.

So my questions are:

1) Does is take the same time (on a average) to build let's say a light infantry division?
2) Does it take the same amount of time to develop let's say a 2 level culture to 3 level?
3) do AI countries have the same level of waste calculation?
4) What's the priority rule for an AI country?

If the 1 to 3 questions have the same rules as human players, then they are better and I will admit that I am a lousy but enthousiastic player..

L-M

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"What have you got to cry about man, you have one less boot to polish in future." L-M's reaction at his distressed valet after his leg was shot off at Leipzig.

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Post #: 7