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OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/5/2006 9:13:22 PM   
Przemcio231


Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline 		Any one ever played it?? what do you think about it??? is it worth purhasing

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RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/5/2006 10:51:31 PM   
greg_slith


Posts: 490
Joined: 9/14/2004
Status: offline 		Well, I have it but the instructions made me want to gouge my eyes out. The maps are friggin HUGE! This is one of those games that would require six months and a seperate room to play. In a word NO I have not played it but maybe someday

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Post #: 2
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/5/2006 10:55:38 PM   
Halsey

 

Posts: 5069
Joined: 2/7/2004
Status: offline 		Irrelevant and I have played it.

Complex, with a pretty good representation of the conflict.

If it's a monster game. Irrelevant and I have played it.

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RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 12:48:58 AM   
Kwik E Mart


Posts: 2447
Joined: 7/22/2004
Status: offline 		there's a vassal edition of this game...i recommend you google it and give it a whirl to see if it gets your attention enough to purchase it...well, i guess you might need a rulebook first...

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Post #: 4
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 1:28:18 AM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Halsey

Irrelevant and I have played it.

Complex, with a pretty good representation of the conflict.

If it's a monster game. Irrelevant and I have played it.

1989 I think it was. I was the VC/NVA. Got my a$$ kicked, ran out of boys. Tough game. I think there may be some problems with the way combat on the Ho Chi Minh Trail is handled. It was lots of fun though. Seasonal turns. The VC/NVA player's game is like 90% planning and deployment, while the US player's task is operations oriented.



< Message edited by irrelevant -- 12/6/2006 1:37:36 AM >

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RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 1:37:07 AM   
jwilkerson


Posts: 10525
Joined: 9/15/2002
From: Kansas
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Przemcio231

Any one ever played it?? what do you think about it??? is it worth purhasing


Having played most of the "monster" board games, I can say that this one is "unusual". It is not a traditional YUGO-IGO type system. Movement and combat happen under the control of "operations" which involve one or more battalions/brigades on each side. Airpower is abstract consisting of "points" those these can be used for tactical support as well as more "strategic" purposes. The US (or whatever the side the US is on is called) has a lot of flexability, you can try to bring a lot of stuff in fast or you can try to trickle things in and stay for the long haul. Everything you bring in costs political points and the faster you bring things in (country) the more you pay in terms of PP. Bringing things in too slowly gives the VC/NVA player a good chance to get ahead in terms of province control and province control is what determines victory. Bringing lots of stuff in quickly can stem the tide in terms of VC/NVA but will run the US side out of PP and trigger an early withdrawal, resulting in losing the game. So that is the fundamental trade-off. The one time I did play the campaign game (as the US). My opponent eventually "quit" though he was winning. I think he was just frustrated that he couldn't "do" anything (except win). So if the VC/NVA try to get fancy, and the US player is geared up, then the VC/NVA will not win on the battlefield, but, they can still win the game. But the full campaign is a very long game.
If the Vietnam era is of long term interest to you, then yes I'd say pick this up. There are not many titles out there that cover the whole campaign at this level of detail. It is a game I would consider playing again. But I would not recommend it, if you are not pretty strongly interested in this conflict. Also, it is not something that could be played solitare, at least not the campaign game.



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RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 1:46:38 AM   
tsimmonds


Posts: 5498
Joined: 2/6/2004
From: astride Mason and Dixon's Line
Status: offline 		Yes, solitare playability is zero.

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RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 4:16:24 AM   
USSMaine

 

Posts: 213
Joined: 12/23/2001
From: Maine (USA)
Status: offline 		Solo play was not bad for me - in fact made it through half the game once - but then I was rather schizophrenic and had no problems playing both sides - ymmv

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Post #: 8
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 4:30:43 AM   
spence

 

Posts: 5400
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline 		As US Player one could have an interesting time working through a particular operation but once you went beyond that in scope the game got unmanageable. 

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Post #: 9
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 8:26:06 AM   
David Heath


Posts: 3274
Joined: 3/29/2000
From: Staten Island NY
Status: offline 		I was at Victory Games when they released this game.  I think this is one of the best designs on very hard topic that is even harder to convert to a game.  I felt you really see how hard it was to get a handle on things for the US.  This to me was one of Victory's Games best.

David



< Message edited by David Heath -- 12/6/2006 8:34:45 AM >

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RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 2:29:55 PM   
Przemcio231


Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline 		Hmmm so im now off to ebay to search for some good christmas deal... well i think i will be able to find rules on-line for vassal

Corection found a CB module for the game... looks great i want it

< Message edited by Przemcio231 -- 12/6/2006 3:47:47 PM >

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Post #: 11
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 4:22:33 PM   
Mike Scholl

 

Posts: 9349
Joined: 1/1/2003
From: Kansas City, MO
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: David Heath

I was at Victory Games when they released this game.  I think this is one of the best designs on very hard topic that is even harder to convert to a game.  I felt you really see how hard it was to get a handle on things for the US.  This to me was one of Victory's Games best.

David



I would agree. I played it three times (finding an opponant with the patience to do so is a challange) and found it a great representation of the hurdles facing both sides. The US has all these wonderfull "toys" to work with..., but often even well-planned operations result in the VC "slipping away". On the other hand, if the VC/NVA get too cocky, that massive US firepower will "melt them away" rapidly. It's a game of patient strategic planning, constant tactical hit and run, and slow overall political progress. You have to be interested in the subject, and ready for a long haul, but if you are it's the best thing ever done on the War.

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Post #: 12
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 6:15:10 PM   
Przemcio231


Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline 		Hmmmmm if any one want to play this game with me via Vassal or CB im open for suggestion... i already started to downlad the Rules

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Post #: 13
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 6:22:21 PM   
Mike Scholl

 

Posts: 9349
Joined: 1/1/2003
From: Kansas City, MO
Status: offline 		Due to the "interleaved nature of tactical play" it's virtually impossible to play this game any way but face to face.

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Post #: 14
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/6/2006 6:56:59 PM   
Przemcio231


Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline 		buuu this suck so i need to find a cheep copy on E-bay

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Pinky: Hey Brain what are we goeing to do this evening?
Brain: The Usual Pinky we will try to take over the World;)

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Post #: 15
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/7/2006 2:40:27 AM   
bstarr


Posts: 881
Joined: 8/1/2004
From: Texas, by God!
Status: offline 		I've always wanted this game. Once the christmas pocket drain is over I may try to find a copy.

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Post #: 16
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/7/2006 11:15:53 AM   
Przemcio231


Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline 		Well i think you can buy it for something like 20$ on E-bay but i got a problem becouse i do not own a credit card so i cant pay for it via PayPal and the shipping cost's to Poland are deadly but i will get it sooner or later

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Pinky: Hey Brain what are we goeing to do this evening?
Brain: The Usual Pinky we will try to take over the World;)

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Post #: 17
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/7/2006 11:30:39 AM   
Sardonic

 

Posts: 215
Joined: 12/1/2005
Status: offline 		I have played it many times. The hardest part is to keep track of province loyalties.

The air support is overwhelming.

Early Vietnamization doesnt really work. You will need to commit something on the ground.

If Dave was actually at VG when it was released I am surprised that he has not considered
making it a computer game. That would be a damn good game.

ARVN simply is almost useless, and the musical chairs of SVietnam government is a grind.

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Post #: 18
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/7/2006 12:29:13 PM   
Przemcio231


Posts: 1901
Joined: 10/11/2005
From: Warsaw,Poland,EU:)
Status: offline 		Well i would love a game about Vietnam... but i think its demn hard to do it so that it would work realistic;)

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Pinky: Hey Brain what are we goeing to do this evening?
Brain: The Usual Pinky we will try to take over the World;)

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Post #: 19
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/7/2006 4:33:23 PM   
Mike Scholl

 

Posts: 9349
Joined: 1/1/2003
From: Kansas City, MO
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardonic

I have played it many times. The hardest part is to keep track of province loyalties.

The air support is overwhelming.

Early Vietnamization doesnt really work. You will need to commit something on the ground.

If Dave was actually at VG when it was released I am surprised that he has not considered
making it a computer game. That would be a damn good game.

ARVN simply is almost useless, and the musical chairs of SVietnam government is a grind.




I'm going to say it's because no-one thinks they can design an AI competent to play either side---and game companies are reluctant to try a PBEM only Title.

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Post #: 20
RE: OT: Victory Games "Vietnam" boardgame - 12/7/2006 5:07:06 PM   
Sardonic

 

Posts: 215
Joined: 12/1/2005
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl


quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardonic

I have played it many times. The hardest part is to keep track of province loyalties.

The air support is overwhelming.

Early Vietnamization doesnt really work. You will need to commit something on the ground.

If Dave was actually at VG when it was released I am surprised that he has not considered
making it a computer game. That would be a damn good game.

ARVN simply is almost useless, and the musical chairs of SVietnam government is a grind.




I'm going to say it's because no-one thinks they can design an AI competent to play either side---and game companies are reluctant to try a PBEM only Title.



Well certainly it would be hard to AI the United States operations...that cannot be minimized.
But the NVA/VC component would not be all that hard. Could likely use heuristic code of some type.
After all most of the Commie move is unit placement and supply infiltration.
It is very rare to do multi-unit moves or attacks because of US airpower making it suicide to remain in contact.
I agree it is difficult to get sufficient supply to the delta as the NVA.

It is more likely that you break contact instantly when the US player declares an Op.
I can only remember one epic battle where I simply got dammed tired of not fighting.
And I delibretly burned like 50 RPL just to irritate the US player. It didnt matter.
His die mods got so high that he didnt even need to roll.

I loved the 'free-fire' rules. In fact I must say that game is the most accurate game I have ever seen
on the topic. The OB was an eyeopener. Someone at VG loved that game.


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Post #: 21
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