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RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 8:31:36 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline 		Referencing Matrix WiTP-AE screen shot #4 (ship transfer to TF42), what does the "set verbose" button do?

(in reply to el cid again)
Post #: 541
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 8:36:43 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline 		Referencing screen shot #3 (damaged Tennessee in Pearl Harbor), there is a "stand down to repair" toggle switch.

Can I assume that ship's that have stood down are less likely to sortie from the harbor in the event of an air attack?

Does a ship that has been "stood down" suffer a malus to its combat potential (such as reduced number of manned AA guns)?

Will ships that have NOT been stood down receive repairs at all?

(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 542
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 8:44:23 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

Referencing Matrix WiTP-AE screen shot #4 (ship transfer to TF42), what does the "set verbose" button do?


Turns down the description detail on the ship that you mouse over.

< Message edited by Terminus -- 12/20/2007 4:35:28 PM >

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Post #: 543
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 8:46:13 PM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

Referencing screen shot #3 (damaged Tennessee in Pearl Harbor), there is a "stand down to repair" toggle switch.

Can I assume that ship's that have stood down are less likely to sortie from the harbor in the event of an air attack?

Does a ship that has been "stood down" suffer a malus to its combat potential (such as reduced number of manned AA guns)?

Will ships that have NOT been stood down receive repairs at all?


You have to stand ships down to take full advantage of all port repair facilities, but repairs can still happen without standing down (just not as fast). If they're stood down, they won't go anywhere. I'm not sure what a "malus" is, but the combat potential is (IIRC) the same as for a disbanded ship.

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Post #: 544
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 8:52:26 PM   
JWE

 

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline 		Cid,

Do you happen to recall the size of the shore party in your era? I know during Korea and beyond, it was 2 crews, each about 10-12 ratings and a PO, with a CPO-1 as shore Boss.

I think it was very similar during War-2 but not really sure.

Maybe you could shoot me a pm, since this may be getting OT.

(in reply to el cid again)
Post #: 545
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 8:56:18 PM   
mlees


Posts: 2263
Joined: 9/20/2003
From: San Diego
Status: offline 		"Malus" = negative modifier.

I figured that if a ship was in Dry Dock, it would be at a reduced manning level, it's ammo off loaded, and so on. Reducing it's effectivness or number of AA guns available in the event of an air attack.

(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 546
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/19/2007 11:20:32 PM   
JWE

 

Posts: 6580
Joined: 7/19/2005
Status: offline 		Or maybe someone else with knowledge in this area.

Herwin .. your parts seem to be screwed on correctly .. any help ??

We know this much:

1) early war and at Guad’, the standard was half an ‘in port’ deck watch, i.e., 10 ratings and a PO (half from port, half from stbd, rotated through the watches).

2) after Guad’, things changed on account of the observed FUBARs, but nothing is on the scheds.

3) in Korea, we set the scheds as 2 full crews (12 each and a PO, with a CPO as Shore Boss).

What did we do between 01/43 and 01/46 ? is my question.

Since this is OT, please respond by pm.

(in reply to JWE)
Post #: 547
Naval Gun Penetration - 12/19/2007 11:56:21 PM   
Marc


Posts: 280
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: Braunschweig, Germany
Status: offline 		I always wondered why the 5.5" gun from the Japanese CLs/BBs had so little penetration value in WitP. This gun can't even scratch the lightest armor in the game.

If I'm not wrong no one ever touched gun penetration values from day 1 of WitP (at least with CHS).
In search for some data I stumbled over this Internetsite with values for many Naval Guns of WWII. WWII NAVAL GUN PENETRATION TABLES

Perhaps this data can be used for the Admirals Edition if the team thinks the values are correct.

Anyway thank you for your effort.

Marc

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Post #: 548
RE: Naval Gun Penetration - 12/20/2007 12:25:02 AM   
Terminus


Posts: 41459
Joined: 4/23/2005
From: Denmark
Status: offline 		Well, the 14cm gun didn't have much of an AP projectile to speak of... That's why its penetration is so poor. I would guess they took their data from navweaps.com...

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Post #: 549
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 12:35:56 AM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
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From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: mlees

Referencing Matrix WiTP-AE screen shot #4 (ship transfer to TF42), what does the "set verbose" button do?


Got a little time, so let's talk about this.

When selecting ships for a Task Force, it is good to know the basic military capabilities of each ship. We have added a large mouseover on each ship's name that shows guns, torpedoes, ASW, AA.

Sometimes very handy, especially for new players. But sometimes quite irritating, especially once one get's used to the ships.

So we added an option to enable or disable the large mouseover. For some reason (long since forgotten) it was originally called "Set Brief" and "Set Verbose". That was not very explanatory, and the text has been changed to "Mouseover On" and "Mouseover Off". There is a mouseover on the mouseover switch that gives an explanation.

We have also expanded the data shown for the "right click" more data option on this screen. You'll like it!





(in reply to mlees)
Post #: 550
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 12:49:16 AM   
Mike Solli


Posts: 15792
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From: the flight deck of the Zuikaku
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

When selecting ships for a Task Force, it is good to know the basic military capabilities of each ship. We have added a large mouseover on each ship's name that shows guns, torpedoes, ASW, AA.


Excellent! Thanks!

(in reply to Don Bowen)
Post #: 551
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 2:39:29 AM   
mlees


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From: San Diego
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen


Got a little time, so let's talk about this. <snip>



Ok, thanks!

(in reply to Don Bowen)
Post #: 552
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 2:44:05 AM   
ctangus


Posts: 2153
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From: Boston, Mass.
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Mike Solli

quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen

When selecting ships for a Task Force, it is good to know the basic military capabilities of each ship. We have added a large mouseover on each ship's name that shows guns, torpedoes, ASW, AA.


Excellent! Thanks!


I agree - great stuff!

A somewhat similiar question: are there any changes to how ship reinforcement details are displayed? It'd at least be useful to know the class of an arriving ship.

(in reply to Mike Solli)
Post #: 553
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 4:06:39 PM   
John 3rd


Posts: 17178
Joined: 9/8/2005
From: La Salle, Colorado
Status: offline 		Sounds like a practical and useful change for viewing the ships!

I agree about a little more detail on the reinforcement screen would help.

Personal note:  you guys appear to be on a great path with the Expansion Set.  Paul Layne and I are at Dec 1944 with our longterm campaign and are setting the date for concluding it by the time AE comes out!  We want to be able to tell people that we actually played EVERY day of a stock campaign and then start a whole new one with this...



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Post #: 554
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 7:13:18 PM   
Brady


Posts: 10701
Joined: 10/25/2002
From: Oregon,USA
Status: offline 		What about the smaller elements aboard CV's that WiTP could not represent, the recon and scout/patrole units, like the Early Judy's deployed in 2 or 3's on Japanese CV's and the SOC:



Has, or could small CV capable units be added to alow these planes a place in game?

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Post #: 555
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 8:19:41 PM   
siRkid


Posts: 6650
Joined: 1/29/2002
From: Orland FL
Status: offline 		Are ship repairs still random or does the "Stand Down for Repairs" guarantee some repairs will be made each turn? In other words does the "Stand Down for Repairs" give you about the same chances of repair as the old system but allows you to have ships in port that are not using repair points?

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Post #: 556
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 9:07:40 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Kid

Are ship repairs still random or does the "Stand Down for Repairs" guarantee some repairs will be made each turn? In other words does the "Stand Down for Repairs" give you about the same chances of repair as the old system but allows you to have ships in port that are not using repair points?


Use of random in ship repair has been greatly reduced (but still exists). This is true for ALL ship repair options.

There is, however, a chance of a major accident while under repair.



(in reply to siRkid)
Post #: 557
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 10:17:15 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Any chance you want to elaborate on that? A horrific image of exploding fleet carriers, that have just made port with some damage after a major clash with the other side, has ruined my meal and beer.

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Post #: 558
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 10:41:46 PM   
Don Bowen


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From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Norm3

Any chance you want to elaborate on that? A horrific image of exploding fleet carriers, that have just made port with some damage after a major clash with the other side, has ruined my meal and beer.



OK, but it's too early in the day for beer.

Repair has been completely reworked. It now consists of three distinct modes:

1. Damage Control. This is the only type of repair at sea and is used in port until a ship becomes stable (fires out, not about ready to sink).
Damage Control is primarily oriented to, well, damage control. It can accomplish repairs, especially with a well experienced crew. But best repair modes are:

2. Normal Repairs. Ship must be in port, fires out. Note that the ship is available for service, which limits the speed and extent of repairs. Repairs can be made by the ship's crew, port facilities (NOT including shipyards) and available repair ships (providing they have not been assigned to other duties).

3. Offline Repairs. Ship is stood down and is not available for operations. There are three sub-categories, based on resources assigned: Pier Side (good), Repair Ship (better), and Shipyard (best). Individual ships may be assigned high priority. This is the best way to repair any significant amount of damage - any other mode would take forever for a badly shot up ship.

Repair points are calculated based on type and extent of damage, repair mode, and assigned resources.

A repair time estimater is available and will be "close" as use of random has been significantly reduced. Random during routine repair has been (mostly) replaced with a random chance of an "event" during repair. These can increase damage to the ship and represents fires, cranes dropping things, ships falling off blocks in drydock (for two points, name that ship), other accidents, etc. The affect of these events is also random, from a few additional damage points to "Run for your lives, she's going to blow!". Complete loss of a ship is possible but would be very (very, very) rare. An extension of repair time is the usual result.

Some answers:
No, formulas or detailed descriptions will not be posted.
Yes, players will receive notification when a major event occurs.
Yes, size of ship and available resources are important.
Yes, capacity limits are used (ops for ships, something similar for repair facilties)
Yes, I did accidentally type "shot up s**t" when trying to type "shot up ship".



(in reply to NormS3)
Post #: 559
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 10:53:04 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Cassin was blown off during Pearl Harbor attack, wasn't she? Will spend a bit looking up possible others.

Judging form your last line I might not have been only one drinking. I do have an excuse. Christmas/birthday party at work.

How about just a list of what the random mishaps maybe. I am kinda jinxed and have a wonderful ability to have that lucky roll. This way I could keep a running tab on Norm's Shipyard Mishaps.

It would be a nice Christmas/Birthday gift.

(in reply to Don Bowen)
Post #: 560
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:13:38 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Did find this online. . . .

Fleet Tug Sotoyomo (YT-9) is sunk in floating drydock YFD-2, but that was Feb 15 of 1946.

(in reply to NormS3)
Post #: 561
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:17:38 PM   
Dixie


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From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Norm3

Cassin was blown off during Pearl Harbor attack, wasn't she? Will spend a bit looking up possible others.




It's the only one that springs to mind. Didn't she fall onto USS Downes which was next to her at the time?


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Post #: 562
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:17:45 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
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From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Norm3

Cassin was blown off during Pearl Harbor attack, wasn't she? Will spend a bit looking up possible others.

Judging form your last line I might not have been only one drinking. I do have an excuse. Christmas/birthday party at work.

How about just a list of what the random mishaps maybe. I am kinda jinxed and have a wonderful ability to have that lucky roll. This way I could keep a running tab on Norm's Shipyard Mishaps.

It would be a nice Christmas/Birthday gift.


There is no specific list of "events". The items I mentioned were the rationale. It is just random additional damage, that might be enough (combined with existing damage) to cause the ship to sink. Damage to facilities is also possible.



(in reply to NormS3)
Post #: 563
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:21:39 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		That's the way I remember reading it.

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Post #: 564
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:22:49 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Sorry was reading to much into your response. Please keep up the great work and forgive me for interrupting you.

< Message edited by Norm3 -- 12/20/2007 11:23:38 PM >

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Post #: 565
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:24:59 PM   
Dixie


Posts: 10303
Joined: 3/10/2006
From: UK
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL:  Don Bowen
....ships falling off blocks in drydock (for two points, name that ship)...[snip]



USS Stewart fell off her blocks in the drydock at Surubaya (as opposed to Cassin which was blown off by a bomb)

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Post #: 566
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:29:12 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Kind of funny I missed that considering I was just asking about captured ships being in AE. 

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Post #: 567
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:31:04 PM   
spence

 

Posts: 5400
Joined: 4/20/2003
From: Vancouver, Washington
Status: offline 		Are there "events" at sea too? The IJN nearly lost Ise and Hyuga on the same GUNEX in the spring of 1942 - one (can't remember which had what) had a gun blow up and the the fires nearly reached the magazines...on the other, some serious flooding including a fireroom and engineroom (something tells me these two had been on somebody's list to be replaced for a fair while but somehow they could never found the money to make it happen).

And then there's Mutsu that just up and blew up one day.

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Post #: 568
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:31:14 PM   
Don Bowen


Posts: 8183
Joined: 7/13/2000
From: Georgetown, Texas, USA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Dixie


quote:

ORIGINAL:  Don Bowen
....ships falling off blocks in drydock (for two points, name that ship)...[snip]



USS Stewart fell off her blocks in the drydock at Surubaya (as opposed to Cassin which was blown off by a bomb)


Two points! That's the one I had in mind.

I should have cited HMS Valiant in a floating drydock at Ceylon. The drydock (AFD-23, one of the big ones) collapsed under her. Valiant had to go home for repairs and AFD-23 was a total loss.



(in reply to Dixie)
Post #: 569
RE: Admirals Edition Naval Thread - 12/20/2007 11:32:20 PM   
NormS3


Posts: 521
Joined: 12/10/2007
From: Wild and Wonderful WV, just don't drink the water
Status: offline 		Like the Japanese Navy really needs any further help with their damage control

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Post #: 570
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