Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: spence

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Will there be allied guerilla forces in the DEI and Phillipines? Judging from what I read above, it seems that they might be to small of a unit. My arguement would be that although small they did tie down large numbers of troops in garrisons and pacification efforts.

I doubt the DEI would warrant any anti-Japanese guerilla units (though I guess some Ozzies operated as such on Timor and/or Dutch New Guinea for an extended time). But the Philippines certainly had a pretty active anti-Japanese guerilla movement that provided good intel on Japanese dispositions and imposed a drain on Japanese resources. I

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ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

N guerrillas or at momnet garrison requirement in PI Japanese would be silly to leave it ungarrisoned though - need to think about this

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ORIGINAL: JeffK

Andy,

Will the INA & BNA forces be shown??

 For the BNA, they get a TOE change which also sees them change sides.

At least the INA had a couple of Divisions, I dont think the BNA got that far though, with a more succesful japanese player they may have got more recruits.

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ORIGINAL: witpqs

I thought a major (real life) problem with defending in Bataan instead of manila was the mountain of supplies, etc. in Manila?

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ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Good question there are now 2 types of city terrain with different bonuses to defence and the ability to control more supply will help here as well so I expect it to be 50:50 where the allies defend.

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Yes..., the supplies MacArthur refused to permit being moved to Bataan because it might look "defeatist." Wasn't until the Japanese landed at Linguyan Gulf and broke his defense that he started making serious attempts to shift supply to the penninsula. Weeks wasted, and immediate "half-rations" for his men when they got there. The twit!

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ORIGINAL: Blackhorse
Jim,

Thanks. Yes, it was organized as a slightly-smaller-than-standard infantry division in 1943 still using some aspects of the cav TO&E including, I know 4 artillery battalions and a tank company, but exactly how much smaller was the infantry component is mostly what I would like to know. In 1945 the division reorganized as a standard infantry division.

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ORIGINAL: spence

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Yes..., the supplies MacArthur refused to permit being moved to Bataan because it might look "defeatist." Wasn't until the Japanese landed at Linguyan Gulf and broke his defense that he started making serious attempts to shift supply to the penninsula. Weeks wasted, and immediate "half-rations" for his men when they got there. The twit!

Actually I think it was more the peacetime Army mindset at work. There was some sort of Philippine law restricting the movement of rice between provinces. The responsible officers were avoiding lawsuits

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ORIGINAL: Mike Scholl

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ORIGINAL: spence

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Yes..., the supplies MacArthur refused to permit being moved to Bataan because it might look "defeatist." Wasn't until the Japanese landed at Linguyan Gulf and broke his defense that he started making serious attempts to shift supply to the penninsula. Weeks wasted, and immediate "half-rations" for his men when they got there. The twit!

Actually I think it was more the peacetime Army mindset at work. There was some sort of Philippine law restricting the movement of rice between provinces. The responsible officers were avoiding lawsuits

Can't quite buy this Spence. MacArthur was Generalissamo of the Philippine Army as well as US Commander of the US forces in the Philippines. And the military had accumulated large stocks of supplies for just such an occurance. Unfortunately Mac had it stored all over central Luzon to support his forward defence scheme (a pipedream given the actual state of training and equipment of his new Philippines Army Forces). I don't think local legislation had anything to do with where the Army stored it's supplies.

The "Peacetime Army Mindset" you refer too had more to do with Mac's failure to "confiscate" useful cargoes from ships in Manilla, and reluctance to order the destruction of civilian stores and property (such as oil) to prevent the Japanese from getting them. Much of this was very much a "last minute effort" and ineffective.

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ORIGINAL: anarchyintheuk
Supplies were stored all over central Luzon because that was where they were stored. WPO-3 had divided Luzon into several areas and depots had been constructed to supply each. The plan contemplated retreat to Bataan, but didn't specify the amount of time required to displace the supplies nor was enough attention paid to how they would be displaced. MacArthur's forward defense strategy was only approved in the first week of November, 1941. Hardly enough time, given Phillipine transportation assets, to either forward Bataan's supplies or displace all of the supplies of the Luzon depots to Bataan, assuming that storage space was available.

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ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

ps if you disagree with where we ended up you can make a small 16 AV Supp unit for every air sqn thats micromanagement hell to me  which is why we stuck at Wings but you can do it you have the slots........

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ORIGINAL: Andy Mac

Oh now msieving1 you just hit upon an issue that we went round and round and round and round on in the land team CW Av support !!!

Lots of debate on this one

I ended up for CW as opposed to US and Japanese with a 4 level Aviation Support system.

Lvl 1 and biggest Air Group Base Forces combined arms units with AA (equivalent to a LAA and HAA Regt in each one), radar , garrison, RE field park coy, support etc etc for each CW 'Group' HQ you get 1 central Base Force with 75 AV Support (or it could be 90 I would need to go check) - I think RAF gets 6 of these, RAAF 2 and RNZAF 1 basically bases designed to act as nodes for operations of a series of subsidiary fields

Lvl 2 a series of historical RAF, RAAF and RNZAF Wings each with 75 Av Support and NO support or other units - these replace the old Aviation Regts in CW terms they are significanlty smaller 75 v 250 AV Support but you get more of them (I assumed 4 RAF Sqns plus a recon or transport flight per Wing).

Lvl 3 Normal base forces with 16 or 32 AV Support (1 or 2 Sqns) and with a small garrison, support and AA echelon - broadly these forces are 1/3 or less than the Group base forces especially in AA assets these are the most common base force type in mid war and are general purpose 'utility' base forces.

Lvl 4 What I call outpost base forces a few AAMG's if they are lucky, a platoon of ISF troopers/Dutch Militia/NZ Can or Aus Militia enough AV support to cope with a flight of planes from a dirt strip - these vary a lot and are by far the most common base force type at start there are about 25 in India, 10 or so in Burma and most of the DEI, Malaya base forces are of this type each with bespoke addons where appropriate (there is one lvl 4 base force in one of the Dutch islands with 2 attached improvised AFV's (trucks with a bit of metal stuck on front and an LMG on top) where I have the data to give these small units non TOE addons I have done so.

Typically the lvl 4's will be destroyed in the Japanese advance or can amalgamte to form lvl 3's but the sheer number of new bases requiring a little av support in a rear area will I think mean that a lot of these small detachments will persist for a while.

Just so I am clear lets take 221 Group RAF it will have a Group HQ, a Group Base Force and 2 - 5 Aviation Wings plus it may have attached 1 or 2 small type 3 or 4 Base Forces for smaller strips it may also have attached AA Regts .

Whereas 9 RAAF Gp will have fewer aviation wings but it has a few more small base forces and several construction squadrons attached.

Andy