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rd Aircraft in RHS

 
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rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/3/2008 4:20:56 AM   
okami


Posts: 404
Joined: 5/23/2007
Status: offline 		As the Japanese you start the game with a number of rd aircraft in your airplane pool. Are you allowed to use them or are they just there to give a jump start once they are produced?

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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/3/2008 2:45:48 PM   
el cid again

 

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Joined: 10/10/2005
Status: offline 		They are there because - they are there. Simply put. Further - some actually were used in combat. At least one squadron used the Ki-44 before it was in production - a bit strange - and successfully so. The exact number of planes for that unit are in the pool - and it will equip with them when the unit becomes available.

There are two other important cases - the Ki-45 - which had extensive problems preventing production - and the Ki-49. Niether was ever entirely liked or successful - but both certainly were produced and used in some numbers. Wether or not the early airframes would be useful is debatable - but since you won't be able to replace them until production begins - use em if you want. EOS family scenario has three small units fitted with 9 in the main element and 3 in a recon flight - for Ki-49. I am not a big fan of two engine fighters - and don't see Ki 45 as a war winner. But there are something like 14 machines available when the war begins.

(in reply to okami)
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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/3/2008 4:40:00 PM   
Mistmatz

 

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Status: offline 		el cid, is this also true for the allied planes in the pool but not yet in production?

B-24 or C-87/LB-30 come to mind, both have some stock in Dec/41 but production begins in mid/late 42.

Okami, maybe we should agree on either using or not using them for both sides? I'm good either way.



(in reply to el cid again)
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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/4/2008 1:48:29 AM   
okami


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mistmatz

el cid, is this also true for the allied planes in the pool but not yet in production?

B-24 or C-87/LB-30 come to mind, both have some stock in Dec/41 but production begins in mid/late 42.

Okami, maybe we should agree on either using or not using them for both sides? I'm good either way.




I would have to say that Sid believes they can be used, whether they are Japanese or Allied would not change that assertion. So let us use them if we wish.

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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/4/2008 6:29:53 AM   
el cid again

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mistmatz

el cid, is this also true for the allied planes in the pool but not yet in production?

B-24 or C-87/LB-30 come to mind, both have some stock in Dec/41 but production begins in mid/late 42.

Okami, maybe we should agree on either using or not using them for both sides? I'm good either way.





C-87 is also LB-30 - both variants of B-24 as transport. The LB-30s were actually ex French bombers - and they really were used - mainly as transports - long before the C-87 was made. In the game you get them - and SHOULD use them - but they will not replace until a line comes up - at Long Beach I think.

The first model of B-24 is similar. There are some bombers in existence - so you get them. I don't see it as a problem if they get used - and I use them. They cannot be used long unless used wisely (e.g. for recon or transport or some such - where long range matters). They will not work for attrition warfare. But that is the real deal - and one unit was sent to Alaska - where it did little but watch the vast distances in the area - so this is also historica.


< Message edited by el cid again -- 3/7/2008 1:01:34 PM >

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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/4/2008 6:31:20 AM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16922
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Status: offline 		As a game modder - if I give it to you - I think it can be used.

But some things should be restricted: PAN AM civil transports, Empire Flying boats of BOAC - these are not for offensive para drops for example.


Early in the war these provide critical transport services - and even patrol for the flying boats - when nothing else is available. They are in because the matter - but not to masquarade as milittary planes. And their gorund support is static - and won't move from where it is.


< Message edited by el cid again -- 3/4/2008 6:33:12 AM >

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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/4/2008 1:28:59 PM   
okami


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Joined: 5/23/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: el cid again

As a game modder - if I give it to you - I think it can be used.

But some things should be restricted: PAN AM civil transports, Empire Flying boats of BOAC - these are not for offensive para drops for example.


Early in the war these provide critical transport services - and even patrol for the flying boats - when nothing else is available. They are in because the matter - but not to masquarade as milittary planes. And their gorund support is static - and won't move from where it is.


A clarification on this Sid... are you saying that these two units should not be transfered from their start positions? What about upgrades to full military statis aircraft?

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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/6/2008 3:25:11 PM   
el cid again

 

Posts: 16922
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Status: offline 		First - there are more than two units.

There is one unit of Pan Am DC-3s at Asanol India.

There are two units of Empire Flying Boats - a BOAC unit at Bombay and a QANTAS (however it is spelled) unit - at Melbourne I think.

There also are PAN AM manned Boeing 314 Clipper units - one USAAF and one USN - which I think do not start but arrive soon after the war begins.

ALL these are civil air units under military contract.

Japan has a similar number of units - DNKKK is All Japan Air Lines - and MNKKK is a simlar outfit in Manchukuo. These are divided by plane type - and operate from hubs.

I do NOT restrict WHERE the planes can go. I do not think the word would be spread far enough to make that happen. But I DO restrict where the ground support can be - by folding it into static units. These contractors WILL refuel and service ANY plane that lands where they are - just as they did IRL - but they will not move to some combat area. ONLY the ground support is static. But good play would not use the transports themselves for offensive para ops - they are to move supplies or units around - not to go where they expect to be lost. Since the planes are so valuable I think this will work - players will want to keep them safe - and if they mess areound - they will lose them - a self inflicting penalty.

In principle the aircraft can be upgraded - you probably won't want to do that - but in some scenarios you might want to go from Clippers to the Martin Mars (you get a fair number in EOS family). This would be OK - but they remain civil air units - and while I don't think any reasonable player would use a Mars for paras anyway - civil units would not do that. Upgrading is not restricted UNLESS YOU think it is not something that would be done - but it does not convert the units to military ones. It would be a bit awkward to have a PAN AM USN Clipper unit flying something else - but if you like it - fine by me. The name tells you "this is a civll unit". FYI the contractors were under military command - but remained civilians as such. This was widely adapted for services to ferry aircraft later in the war and women flew in numbers.


< Message edited by el cid again -- 3/7/2008 1:01:15 PM >

(in reply to okami)
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RE: rd Aircraft in RHS - 3/6/2008 8:55:08 PM   
mikemike

 

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Joined: 6/3/2004
From: a maze of twisty little passages, all different
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quote:

ORIGINAL: el cid again
.
.
.
and a QUANTAS (however it is spelled) unit - at Melbourne I think.



Just can't resist:
QANTAS = Q.ueensland A.nd N.orthern T.erritories A.ir S.ervice


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