Matrix Games Forums

Forums  Register  Login  Photo Gallery  Member List  Search  Calendars  FAQ 

My Profile  Inbox  Address Book  My Subscription  My Forums  Log Out

RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one..

 
View related threads: (in this forum | in all forums)

Logged in as: Guest
Users viewing this topic: none
  Printable Version
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. Page: <<   < prev  1 [2]
Login
Message << Older Topic   Newer Topic >>
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/6/2008 8:08:49 PM   
No New Messages
panda124c
Matrix Elite Guard


 

Posts: 1692
Joined: 5/23/2000
From: Houston, TX, USA
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: mdiehl

quote:

Remember all you need to do is warp a gate, so it don't work quite correctly.


They're rebar-concrete, and 9 meters thick.

And the Ruhr dams are a lot thicker.

All I'm saying is, nothing is invincible, and since the US considered the Panama Canal to be a very valuable resource there would be forces in place to protect it, particularly in war time.

I'd hate to be the guy who had to hand crank those puppies open or closed.

(in reply to mdiehl)
Post #: 31
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/6/2008 8:42:39 PM   
No New Messages
crashTX
Matrix Recruit


 

Posts: 5
Joined: 6/6/2008
From: Frisco, TX
Status: offline
There was a show about the large I type subs with hangars. In 1945 they got as far as just past the Hawaiian Island before being recalled to participate in suicide attacks at Okinawa.

Anyways the plan was to launch the 5 planes the sub carried... and then using torpedos... attack the locks on the Atlantic side. Why that side you ask? Apparently not only the locks would be destroyed... more importantly.... the water would drain out of the Gatun lakes... and thus even after repairing the locks... you had to refill the lakes before the canal could be used again. 

An attack like this I believe would disable the canal for a year.


(in reply to panda124c)
Post #: 32
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/6/2008 8:54:23 PM   
No New Messages
mikemike
Matrix Hero


 

Posts: 501
Joined: 6/3/2004
From: a maze of twisty little passages, all different
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Bywater had a better idea than destroying the locks by floatplane or submarine attack. He had the Japs load a freighter to the gunvales with explosives, and then sent it through the canal before war broke out, detonating in the middle and causing big landslides to block the waterway.


There is a story by C.S.Forester (Hornblower) in much the same vein. IIRC (I don't have that collection of stories at hand) the malefactor was a German ship posing as Swedish, loaded with iron ore; the plan was to enter a lock, fire torpedos from concealed underwater tubes into the lock gates, and blow the bottom out of the ship, thus creating a giant heap of scrap in the lock chamber. The plan was foiled by an attentive British DEMS gunner who recognized German-style shoes on the feet of one of the supposed Swedes. The attack was timed to coincide with the PH attack.

I've seen a TV documentary about the canal a short time ago; they showed how a lock gate leaf was swapped by a large floating crane, and as far as I am concerned, the most vulnerable spot of a gate would be the upper pivot point (the lower pivot is just a fireplug-shaped lump of steel, maybe three feet in diameter, concreted into the floor of the lock chamber - looked pretty impervious to anything short of a nuclear device) - but I don't think this would be an easy matter. Causing a landslide in the Culebra Cut would be feasible, too, but this happens frequently, anyway, so the Canal Authority is equipped to clear that kind of obstruction as quickly as possible. Most damaging would be to blow up the Gatun Dam which would drain the Gatun Lake and b*gger up the water supply for several months after the dam was closed again, and that without taking into consideration the damage the resulting flood wave would do to the Canal infrastructure. But as far as I know, the Gatun Dam is essentially a large earth dike, and pretty resistant to blasting. To sum up, you could probably close the Canal for months if only you could get maybe 10 ktons of TNT in the right place. Piece of cake, obviously.

_____________________________

DON´T PANIC - IT´S ALL JUST ONES AND ZEROES!

(in reply to Terminus)
Post #: 33
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/6/2008 9:53:30 PM   
No New Messages
Feinder
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline
quote:

Anyways the plan was to launch the 5 planes the sub carried... and then using torpedos... attack the locks on the Atlantic side. Why that side you ask? Apparently not only the locks would be destroyed... more importantly.... the water would drain out of the Gatun lakes... and thus even after repairing the locks... you had to refill the lakes before the canal could be used again. 


1.  One reason to attack the Atlantic side vs. the Pacific is that the locks are smaller on the Atlantic side (altho it might just be the practical difference between them being "dang that thing's big" and "dats one big mofo").

2.  It seems that blowing the locks to the Atlantic -and- blowing the locks to the center lake would be that much more effort.  Knocking out one lock is going to be tough with 5 planes (even if you can accomplish it), and now you've only got 2 planes on a lock and 3 on another - that's going to make it that much harder to disable.

_____________________________

"It is obvious that you have greatly over-estimated my regard for your opinion." - Me


(in reply to mikemike)
Post #: 34
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/8/2008 1:20:53 AM   
No New Messages
Hornblower
Matrix Elite Guard



Posts: 1361
Joined: 9/10/2003
From: New York'er relocated to Chicago
Status: offline
I didn't know they were aiming for the atlantic side, and it makes sence to attack the "down-hill side" - thanks for the info

(in reply to crashTX)
Post #: 35
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/8/2008 3:10:01 AM   
No New Messages
Twotribes
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 6929
Joined: 2/15/2002
From: Jacksonville NC
Status: offline
If the Japanese get the option does that mean the allied player gets all the assets assigned to Panama Canal Zone and areas?

(in reply to Knavey)
Post #: 36
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/8/2008 5:49:08 AM   
No New Messages
Feinder
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 6589
Joined: 9/4/2002
From: Land o' Lakes, FL
Status: offline
I know in CHS at start in Panama there is:

310 air support (over 3 bases)
3 RCT
Cbt Eng Rgt
4 AAA Rgt
Panama CD w/ 56 large guns

Within one month
2 RCT

Within two months
2 RCT
1 Arm Btn
2 AAA Rgt
5 Eng Rgt

Within three months
1 Arm Btn

So, can you capture Panma?  Sure.  I don't know what the historical OB is, but the CHS team seems to have done a good job of determining at least the starting OB of most of the units.  You'd need to go as early as possible, because for the first three months, it's steady build up.

I'm not sure if capturing Panama would break something tho.  Most of US reinforcments arrive in Panama, and if it's captured, it might wonker up their ability to arrive at all.

-F-

_____________________________

"It is obvious that you have greatly over-estimated my regard for your opinion." - Me


(in reply to Twotribes)
Post #: 37
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/8/2008 9:13:30 PM   
No New Messages
hvymtl13
Matrix Trooper



Posts: 214
Joined: 8/29/2007
Status: offline
Well I have prob 20 Seebea units in Frisco that are aching for something to fix. I would take a 7 to 1 trade for Combat units. :)
Either way they will fix the locks up np with that Seabee Can-Do attitude. :D

_____________________________


(in reply to Feinder)
Post #: 38
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/9/2008 7:00:15 AM   
No New Messages
Hornblower
Matrix Elite Guard



Posts: 1361
Joined: 9/10/2003
From: New York'er relocated to Chicago
Status: offline
So its safe to assume that there is nothing built into AE to allow an attack – OF ANY KIND – on the locks ?

(in reply to hvymtl13)
Post #: 39
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/9/2008 7:53:05 AM   
No New Messages
Andrew Brown
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 5007
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: Hex 82,170
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Hornblower

So its safe to assume that there is nothing built into AE to allow an attack – OF ANY KIND – on the locks ?


That is right. There is no provision in AE for this.

Andrew

(in reply to Hornblower)
Post #: 40
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/9/2008 6:46:22 PM   
No New Messages
bradfordkay
Matrix Legion of Merit


 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline
Well... the Japanese can invade and capture the canal...

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Andrew Brown)
Post #: 41
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/10/2008 2:09:40 AM   
No New Messages
Andrew Brown
Matrix Legion of Merit



Posts: 5007
Joined: 9/5/2000
From: Hex 82,170
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

Well... the Japanese can invade and capture the canal...


Actually in AE this won't be possible either. The Canal is in an "off map" area, and it was decided early on that allowing movement/combat between both sides in these areas would be too complex to add to the game, so use of the "off-map" areas is Allied only.

Andrew

(in reply to bradfordkay)
Post #: 42
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/10/2008 9:01:47 AM   
No New Messages
bradfordkay
Matrix Legion of Merit


 

Posts: 8683
Joined: 3/24/2002
From: Olympia, WA
Status: offline
Cool, that means I won't have to worry about I-boats catching my new carriers in the narrow channel...

_____________________________

fair winds,
Brad

(in reply to Andrew Brown)
Post #: 43
RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. - 6/12/2008 7:18:00 AM   
No New Messages
Hornblower
Matrix Elite Guard



Posts: 1361
Joined: 9/10/2003
From: New York'er relocated to Chicago
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Andrew Brown


quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

Well... the Japanese can invade and capture the canal...


Actually in AE this won't be possible either. The Canal is in an "off map" area, and it was decided early on that allowing movement/combat between both sides in these areas would be too complex to add to the game, so use of the "off-map" areas is Allied only.

Andrew


That answers my question, thanks...

(in reply to Andrew Brown)
Post #: 44
Page:   <<   < prev  1 [2]
All Forums >> [Current Games From Matrix.] >> [World War II] >> War In The Pacific - Struggle Against Japan 1941 - 1945 >> RE: Canal ? Not Guadal the other one.. Page: <<   < prev  1 [2]
Jump to:





New Messages No New Messages
Hot Topic w/ New Messages Hot Topic w/o New Messages
Locked w/ New Messages Locked w/o New Messages
 Post New Thread
 Reply to Message
 Post New Poll
 Submit Vote
 Delete My Own Post
 Delete My Own Thread
 Rate Posts


Forum Software © ASPPlayground.NET Advanced Edition 2.4.5 ANSI

3.109