RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why?

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 3:50:15 AM

JeffroK

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"Saturday night in Toledo, Ohio
Is like being nowhere at all
All through the day
How the hours pass by
We sit, in the park
And we watch the grass die!!"

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 3:56:27 AM

n01487477

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The Japanese almost singularly ... because of all the reasons above & for these similar reasons I don't support Man Utd. or Chelsea ... (for you Americans think NY Yankees) ...

The Americans can only lose the war, winning is "almost" a certainty (snatching defeat from the jaws of victory).. the Japanese must snatch victory from the jaws of defeat, through economic, strategic and tactical savvy.

Hence my dislike of Sir Robin and all related Allied supposed "strategies"...

I guess if the Allies had more production choices ... Nah ... I want to be like "sniffy" - my childhood kelpie-corgy (type of sheep/cattle dog) ... he could take on any dog bigger than him, lie on his back, & get under to the soft underbelly and make that bigger dog run for hell !!!

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Post #: 32

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 4:31:56 AM

jwilkerson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bobogoboom

i play most of my games as japan cause it is hard to find allie players,

Hey I play Japanese, because it is hard to find Japanese Players!

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Post #: 33

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 4:44:23 AM

Oldguard1970

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cuttlefish

The guy I started playing WitP with is a long-time computer wargaming buddy. I played Japan in my first game because we fell into the pattern a long time ago of me playing the "bad guys". That is, I always play the Confederacy in our Civil War games and the Axis powers in our WWII games.

Ahem....the Confederacy the bad guys? You must've grown up on the wrong side of the Mason-Dixon Line and don't enjoy a tall glass of ice tea!

(Seriously, I recognize the taint slavery imparts to the Confederacy, but down this way we all separate slavery and the Confederate army and nobody in his right mind wants to play the guys in blue).

It is interesting to note that two slave states stayed in the union. It is also interesting to note that the Emancipation Proclamation only applied to slaves in Confederate-controlled territory. Those two facts cause me to think that sectionlalism was the dominant cause of the war. Slavery was part of that, but only part. (Had ending slavery been the dominant motivation of the North, one would think that emancipation would have been applied to all slaves, not just those in Confederate hands.)

By the way, Great-Great-Grandfather was Quartermaster General of the Army of the Potomac during the Peninsular Campaign, so please don't think my post was motivated by elevated southern sympathies.

Back on topic, I am playing Allies now. It is great fun to try to cope with the early Japanese advance. However, I am eager to learn the Japanese side, and I plan to do so when AE comes out.

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 34

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 6:10:06 AM

Mike Scholl

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The Allies.., probably because of my Father. He got out of the US Army December 1st, 1941; bought a new Chevy to drive home to a waiting job and waiting fiance, and getting back to his life. By January 1st, he was "re-uped", on his way overseas, lost $800 selling the car, and the girlfriend told him she wouldn't wait again. As far as he was concerned, Japan's attack was a personal one on his life. He cursed Japan and everything Japanese for the rest of his life.

Grow up in that environment, and the thought of playing the Japanese is an anethma...

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Post #: 35

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 7:41:15 AM

tigercub

Posts: 2004
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From: brisbane oz
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The winners write�history and the losers are lost in it.

So i play japan to rewrite it.

(Banzi for the Empire)

< Message edited by tigercub -- 6/17/2008 7:44:08 AM >

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 7:44:22 AM

bradfordkay

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"I've been a transplant since '92 and still consider myself a "Damn Yankee.""

You certainly qualify as one... For those who've never lived in the south let me explain the difference between a Yankee and a Damn Yankee... A yankee comes south for a vacation, a damn yankee comes south and stays...

As far as the OP's question: so far I have played only the allies, partly because of the variety of nations, ships and aircraft. Another reason is that I enjoy playing out desperate defenses, and certainly in the first year of the war this is what describes the allied play. I have played the first six months of the war several times against the AI, mainly due to restarts for new versions.

When it came time to play PBEM, I advertised for a Japanese opponent mainly because I had never even opened the game on the Japanese side and so felt that this could give my opponent an extra advantage (my not knowing the exact capabilities of his units).

I also happen to have a love affair with some of the USN and RN ships so I figure that my first time or two through the game should be on that side...

In high school and college I often had to play as the Axis player in WW2 games, mainly because it was hard to get a casual player to take the other side. Now I have access to other diehard wargamers on this forum and so it is not necessary to do so just to find a game.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 7:47:49 AM

Gem35

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bradfordkay

"I've been a transplant since '92 and still consider myself a "Damn Yankee.""

You certainly qualify as one... For those who've never lived in the south let me explain the difference between a Yankee and a Damn Yankee... A yankee comes south for a vacation, a damn yankee comes south and stays...

As far as the OP's question: so far I have played only the allies, partly because of the variety of nations, ships and aircraft. Another reason is that I enjoy playing out desperate defenses, and certainly in the first year of the war this is what describes the allied play. I have played the first six months of the war several times against the AI, mainly due to restarts for new versions.

When it came time to play PBEM, I advertised for a Japanese opponent mainly because I had never even opened the game on the Japanese side and so felt that this could give my opponent an extra advantage (my not knowing the exact capabilities of his units).

I also happen to have a love affair with some of the USN and RN ships so I figure that my first time or two through the game should be on that side...

In high school and college I often had to play as the Axis player in WW2 games, mainly because it was hard to get a casual player to take the other side. Now I have access to other diehard wargamers on this forum and so it is not necessary to do so just to find a game.

I , acording to you Bradfordkay, qualify as a DAMN Yankee( I take it a s a compliment actually), and believe me, I have been referrerd to that phrase by quite a few here in Texas in my 4 years here so far.
Living in Chicago, unless you were from Milwaukee or St. Louis, I never looked down on anyone.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 8:17:08 AM

bradfordkay

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Gem... I didn't make up that daffynition... It was repeated to me many times during my youth and young adulthood. I moved out the the south in my 30's, but the south has never left me...

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Post #: 39

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 8:24:31 AM

Gem35

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I just love the weather here alot more.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 9:42:29 AM

hvymtl13

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The Allies. Ever since I started playing Flattop board game. And my Brother enjoyed playing Axis in all games. Squad LEader, Axis and Allies etc etc. So I played the Allies, and got to know the ships, planes, Admirals and such along the way including Pacwar for a few years. I stop the game ever so often when I spot a boat or Leader I am not familer with and search his/her history. So I guess I got familier with the Allies so well I don't really feel much like swapping over. You never know, I might get bored with the Allies someday and play Japs. Though I sort of doubt it.
Enjoyed reading the responses. That was funny about Toledo. :)

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 10:56:38 AM

Japan

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quote:

ORIGINAL: DD696

For what it's worth, I only play as the allies against the AI. Reason, in real life the Japanese did their utmost to sink DD696 (USS English) and end the naval elistment and life of my father. Therefore, it is a family tradition to fight against the Japanese.

To counter this, however, I have found that the AI is quite incompetent at running the Japanese industry, therefore I have to go in and nudge the enemy in the right direction on a regular basis while playing a heavily modified CHS 2.08. This is a lesson sadly learned after numerous restarts. Hopefully, AE will be considerably more competent at managing the industry and running the war. The proof remains to be seen, though, as the competance and improvement of the AI is almost invaribly a taboo or ignored subject whenever information and knowledge is sought.

On a side note, referencing my thread of almost 2 years ago, it really was CHS: The End of the Line....except that nobody in the know was willing to admit it.

HA HA

You shoud play vs a human, will give you an entierly different experience..

Maby consider to brake the tradition, and do a game as Jap vs a Allied Human also, that will give you a interesting experience.

< Message edited by Japan -- 6/17/2008 10:58:45 AM >

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 11:09:03 AM

jwilkerson

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Japan

HA HA

You shoud play vs a human, will give you an entierly different experience..

Maby consider to brake the tradition, and do a game as Jap vs a Allied Human also, that will give you a interesting experience.

Oh no, poor Japan, for what you are about to receive ...

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/17/2008 12:22:38 PM

undercovergeek

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Japan - like to think i could rewrite a bit of history and finally have the occupants of Hawaii speaking Japanese and taking holidays in Fiji - one day

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Post #: 44

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 1:35:48 AM

Gem35

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Japan, fix your sig, I hate mispleed wrods, I rilly do height bad spleeing.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 2:01:06 AM

Mike Solli

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Cuttlefish

quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

quote:

ORIGINAL: Cuttlefish

The guy I started playing WitP with is a long-time computer wargaming buddy. I played Japan in my first game because we fell into the pattern a long time ago of me playing the "bad guys". That is, I always play the Confederacy in our Civil War games and the Axis powers in our WWII games.

Ahem....the Confederacy the bad guys? You must've grown up on the wrong side of the Mason-Dixon Line and don't enjoy a tall glass of ice tea!

(Seriously, I recognize the taint slavery imparts to the Confederacy, but down this way we all separate slavery and the Confederate army and nobody in his right mind wants to play the guys in blue).

I grew up in Michigan and was raised on tales of the Iron Brigade, so I am most definately a Yankee. But I understand what you mean and that is why I put "bad guys" in quotes. We Michiganders bear no ill will to our brothers from the South. The ill will is reserved for those thieving Ohioans, aggressors of the Toledo War.

Just kidding about Ohio. The joke in Michigan is that "Michigan and Ohio fought a war over Toledo and Ohio lost."

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 2:55:47 AM

niceguy2005

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What I find interesting are all the posts about how playing Japan is hard - ok, the production system is extremely complex and it's simple for the Japanese player to hang himself by screwing it up. However, what I think is underwhelmingly represented here is the difficulty of trying to defend the Pacific as an allied player in the first 12 to 18 months of the war - or even harder is to really go on the offensive. Try defending the DEI, I mean really defend it, or even Australia.

Right now in a PBEM I'm trying to McGyver a defense of Northern Oz in CHS with garrison units, fragments of this and that and lots of fighters like the P-40B that essentially aren't replaceable. What's not challenging about that?

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 4:05:28 AM

FeurerKrieg

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quote:

ORIGINAL: niceguy2005

What I find interesting are all the posts about how playing Japan is hard - ok, the production system is extremely complex and it's simple for the Japanese player to hang himself by screwing it up. However, what I think is underwhelmingly represented here is the difficulty of trying to defend the Pacific as an allied player in the first 12 to 18 months of the war - or even harder is to really go on the offensive. Try defending the DEI, I mean really defend it, or even Australia.

Right now in a PBEM I'm trying to McGyver a defense of Northern Oz in CHS with garrison units, fragments of this and that and lots of fighters like the P-40B that essentially aren't replaceable. What's not challenging about that?

This will probably become a debate about which side is harder now... so, I might as well throw the first log on the fire!

I totally agree that Allies are challenging. The reason I think Japan is harder is the (lack of a) margin of error. As Japan, every ship is irreplaceable (except barges) and, more importantly, time is irreplaceable.

If you screw up an operation as Allies and lose ships - "Oh well, I'll have to wait a couple months longer than I planned to get some new ships to replace these losses."
If you don't land enough troops, and it take another month to attack an island again, "Darn, I won't destroy Japan until May 1945, instead of March like I was planning".

If either of those things happen as Japan - you have little recourse. Lose too many ships - they are gone forever. Take two months too long to get Rabaul? Sorry - the allies got troops there, you just handed the Allies about 3-6 months of their timetable.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 5:33:19 AM

Big B

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Interesting thread.

I like to play the Allies - but first, some thoughts about playing Japan.

Japan IS difficult to play because of the production system and the need to secure resources - no question. Japan is perhaps easier to play - for a while - because of the game advantages that Japan gets...that were not actually there in real life (surface combat and air combat are weighted towards Japan in various technical ways in stock WitP, at least early).

I like the Allied side for a number of reasons.
1) They are very much the underdog for the first 18 months (the usual game-span), just try to accomplish what the Allies did.
2) As far as difficulty and complexity go - try actually managing what the Allies have for prosecuting the multi-dimensional offensive they must do in the second half of the war, mind-boggling.
3) Baggage, ...if Japan behaved like they did in the Russo-Japanese War of 1904-1905, it would be much easier for me to get behind their victories - history tells a different story...if your relatives were participants - that's tougher.
4) I respect every-ones POV, but raised where I was and when I was - I find it easier to cheer for my team (part of point #3 I guess).

NEUTRAL - Overall, I think both sides present an equal (though different) challenge to play.

B

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 6:06:56 AM

Rainerle

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quote:

ORIGINAL: LargeSlowTarget

Japan. 'Rising Sun beer' (aka Tsingtao beer) is so much better than Miller or Bud... And because of the harder/honour/underdog/challenge reasons.

Uhh-ohhh unfortunately Tsingtao is chinese and therefore allied brew

Should go with the Asahi or Kirin

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 8:50:37 AM

bradfordkay

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Besides, Anchor Steam is far better than Tsingtao or any Japanese beer - so we still have the advantage there. And that's not even one of the local brews!

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 9:07:35 AM

John 3rd

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I love to play the Japanese but will dabble at playing the Allies in the beginning of the war. The Japanese are so tough for all the reasons mentioned earlier in this Thread. I want to do better then the historical model. As a Professor of History, it is a lure that I cannot avoid wanting to TRY.

Additionally, handling the economy is a continuing learning experience. After playing this game for 3 solid years, I am still learning and absolutely LOVE THAT!

As to the whole North--South commentary, I am a Yankee who loves to study the South for very similar reasons. Once you get past the Slave argument, it is truly something learn about and study. I've been sorely tempted to buy the new Matrix North/South game just out or buy the revamped Battleground set but haven't been able to break myself away from this darned game!

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/18/2008 2:56:54 PM

Yamato hugger

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I prefer Japs as well, but for a different reason. I find most Jap players when Im allies quit as soon as I deal serious damage to their carrier fleet (which usually happens in Feb-Mar 42).

The game I have in late Dec 43 I lost the Akagi on Dec 10 (took the Lex and E with her), and the Kaga about a month later (with a couple of Brit carriers). To date I think I lost 5 carriers but still plugging on. In fact in a lot of areas I am still on the offensive.

< Message edited by Yamato hugger -- 6/18/2008 2:57:12 PM >

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Post #: 53

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 4:20:56 PM

LargeSlowTarget

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rainerle

quote:

ORIGINAL: LargeSlowTarget

Japan. 'Rising Sun beer' (aka Tsingtao beer) is so much better than Miller or Bud... And because of the harder/honour/underdog/challenge reasons.

Uhh-ohhh unfortunately Tsingtao is chinese and therefore allied brew Should go with the Asahi or Kirin

From http://www.feldgrau.com/articles.php?ID=11

"Just as a small anecdotal side bar, when German monks established their first orders in Tsingtao, (the German monks were primarily from Franken, or Franconia), as an extra activity to supplement their primary calling they did in China what they did back in Germany - make beer. Soon, a small plant was established in Tsingtao to increase production and satisfy the demand. When the Japanese took over the facility in 1914 and when the Chinese took over the beer making facility in 1922, they both changed the name of the brew, but they both also retained the original formula. During World War Two, the Japanese occupied the brewery again and this time, they renamed it "Rising Sun Beer". But as before, the formula remained unchanged. Today, at least in North America, the beer is known as "Tsingtao Beer". But the formula is still the original German one!"

Hence it is 'Japanese' beer in the WitP time frame

.

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Post #: 54

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 4:55:22 PM

Andy Mac

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Stock Allies
AE Japan

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Post #: 55

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 4:59:43 PM

Andy Mac

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Oops and why in stock I know the allies better and I am a far better defensive player put me on defence and I am sneaky make me attack and I hesitate and get it wrong so I prefer playing defence hence my allied preference - plus I know the allied side better.

(I am also a careless player and the allies are more forgiving of my style of play)

In AE I am getting more familiar with the Japanese side of things and the ability to over run Japan the way the allies can in 43 44 in stock is I think going to dissapear

A gritty long haul defence is going to be easier and I think AE will be more forgiving of Japanese player errors because its slowed down as a game quite a lot.

Andy

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 5:14:44 PM

Nikademus

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I'd play either side if there were more hours in the day.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 5:39:42 PM

Oldguard1970

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Nikademus

I'd play either side if there were more hours in the day.

Nik wins the best answer prize. Now, after the AE team launches AE next week, (which will be perfect and require no patching), it can devote its attention to adding more hours to each day so we can play more!

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Post #: 58

RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 6:10:53 PM

bobogoboom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

quote:

Ahem....the Confederacy the bad guys? You must've grown up on the wrong side of the Mason-Dixon Line and don't enjoy a tall glass of ice tea!

I've been a transplant since '92 and still consider myself a "Damn Yankee." Don't like ice tea, grits, and a few other "Southern" dishes. I still have trouble pronouncing certain words with a "southernese" style and locals continue to correct me. I may end up living down here for the rest of my life, but I'm still a New Englander at heart.

grits are good. if you really want to throw yourself for a loop moved to western louisiana(my moms family is from that area) the food is strange(but very tasty. i love boudin) and you can't understand a damn thing they say.

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RE: What side you you prefere to play, and why? - 6/20/2008 6:12:26 PM

bobogoboom

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jwilkerson

quote:

ORIGINAL: bobogoboom

i play most of my games as japan cause it is hard to find allie players,

Hey I play Japanese, because it is hard to find Japanese Players!

i hate english it never comes out like i mean it to.

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