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CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion

 
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CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 12:40:52 PM   
GreasyLake


Posts: 206
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		Missed having these two ships in Osaka Dec 31 1941, new player, but I read on another thread they would convert if they were there on the 31st of the next month. They have been parked there for 90 days with no sys damage and nothing happens. At first I thought it might be because the supply was below 20K there, not anymore. Now is there a certain amount of repair points needed on hand to enter the pipeline as CVL conversion? Or am I just out of luck for ever converting these two? If someone tells me they are just in the wrong port I can take it?

I am playing a mod but I already checked with the creator of the mod and he said he did not change any ship production/upgrade routines.

Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance!

Post #: 1
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 12:56:07 PM   
n01487477


Posts: 4779
Joined: 2/21/2006
Status: offline
quote:

Chitose


1942 NOT 1941 ...

From the Hitchhikers guide ...

Special Japanese Ship Conversion – The Chitose and Chiyoda may undergo a major
conversion from a CS to a CVL. The Ise and Hyuga may undergo a major conversion to add a
large contingent of floatplanes (it remains a BB type ship).

These conversions occur if the ship is at anchor in Osaka after December 31, 1942. At that time
the ship enters the reinforcement pipeline. Assuming that normal, uninterrupted shipbuilding and
available Naval Shipyard Points, the Chitose or Chiyoda will take 180 days to convert, while the
Ise will take 330 days.

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Post #: 2
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 1:32:04 PM   
nobunaga

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: n01487477

These conversions occur if the ship is at anchor in Osaka after December 31, 1942.


Not after but exactly on 12/31/42. Conversion happens on the last day of every month starting with 12/31/42, not on the first day.

quote:


[...] the Chitose or Chiyoda will take 180 days to convert, while the
Ise will take 330 days.


This is a manual error. The Chiyodas will take 330 days to convert, the Ises 180 days.

(in reply to n01487477)
Post #: 3
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 4:54:03 PM   
GreasyLake


Posts: 206
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		That was easy, wrong year.

I liked 180 day conversion better, but at least now I know.

Happy gaming all.

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Post #: 4
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 4:56:43 PM   
n01487477


Posts: 4779
Joined: 2/21/2006
Status: offline 		Well theoretically, if you have the ship build points available you could accelerate them ... and halve the time.

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Post #: 5
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 10:26:40 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		Two things:

1. Remove the air units from Chitose/Chiyoda before the conversion happens. They disappear if you don't do that.
2. The CHITOSES are a good conversion.

But I don't like the ISE's. The conversion gives better AA, but takes away guns, and it removes them from the map. The A/C Capacity isn't useful, because you can only use float planes. I think ISEs are a waste of time, but others may have a different opinion.

Also, the Chitose/Chiyoda twins come equipped with 2 full Daitai each of Zero/Kate. Those Daitai are buildable to 27 planes each. You may want to remove and expand them. Then, you can load the Chitoses with whatever you think you need more of before a battle, fighters or TBs.

< Message edited by Q-Ball -- 9/26/2008 10:28:01 PM >

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Post #: 6
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/26/2008 11:26:53 PM   
nobunaga

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline 		Imo both conversions are equally "good" with a slight edge in favour for the Ises.

If you absolutely need more carriers you are better off investing your scarce shipyard points into accelerating Unryus and skip all conversions.

Chiyoda/Chitose airgroups are useless anyway as they aren´t real carrier airgroups but come from the LBA-reinforcement queue (so you wont "miss" any airgroup by not converting) and arrive understrength without any pilots.

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Post #: 7
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/27/2008 9:55:16 AM   
rominet


Posts: 523
Joined: 10/23/2007
From: Paris
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Q-Ball

Also, the Chitose/Chiyoda twins come equipped with 2 full Daitai each of Zero/Kate. Those Daitai are buildable to 27 planes each. You may want to remove and expand them. Then, you can load the Chitoses with whatever you think you need more of before a battle, fighters or TBs.




Are you sure of that? Can you give the name of these airgroups?
I didn't see any special airgroup for Chitose/Chiyoda in the database editor.


quote:

ORIGINAL: Nobunaga

Chiyoda/Chitose airgroups are useless anyway as they aren´t real carrier airgroups but come from the LBA-reinforcement queue (so you wont "miss" any airgroup by not converting) and arrive understrength without any pilots.



Do you know their names?




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Post #: 8
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/27/2008 4:04:26 PM   
nobunaga

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: rominet

Do you know their names?


A1/653rd Daitai (B6N)
A2/653rd Daitai (B6N)
F1/653rd Daitai (A6M5)
F2/653rd Daitai (A6M5)

Scenario 15, not sure about other scenarios.

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Post #: 9
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/27/2008 11:03:02 PM   
rominet


Posts: 523
Joined: 10/23/2007
From: Paris
Status: offline 		Well, thanks for your answer.

But, after having a look at the scenario editor, i wonder what is the difference between these groups and the others in reinforcements!
Why these groups especially are associated with the CVL Chitose and Chiyoda?

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Post #: 10
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/28/2008 4:01:18 PM   
Mobeer


Posts: 662
Joined: 1/17/2007
Status: offline 		In my v1.806 game, the Chitose and Chiyoda air groups were moved ashore automatically when the ships started conversion, not lost.

The air groups on each ship can be expanded to overload the carriers if allowed automatic replacements. The AI does this and then uses them as carriers, whereupon they cannot launch any combat missions and so are easy to sink.

(in reply to rominet)
Post #: 11
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/29/2008 3:20:05 PM   
GreasyLake


Posts: 206
Joined: 11/1/2007
Status: offline 		nobunaga has a good point. 330 days worth of stealing valuable naval shipyard points for 2 CVL lights that could be used getting fleet carriers out. That does give me pause.
I had been thinking any type carrier at any cost. Got about 50 turns to add up the cost benefits.

(in reply to Mobeer)
Post #: 12
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/29/2008 3:31:30 PM   
Yamato hugger

 

Posts: 5475
Joined: 10/5/2004
Status: offline 		I keep the CS's with my CV TFs for recon work. Far more valuable to me in that regard than losing them for a year and by the time they get back the allied '44 modifier kicks in (which is brutal btw).

(in reply to GreasyLake)
Post #: 13
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/29/2008 5:10:08 PM   
Q-Ball


Posts: 7336
Joined: 6/25/2002
From: Chicago, Illinois
Status: offline 		It's an interesting debate. I do appreciate the CS units, and how their search can add strike capability by allowing DB's to focus on attack and not any Nav Search. You can also load Rufes on them for extra CAP, which I do (every little bit helps).

I think the Chitoses are still worthwhile if you have the capacity. You also still have Nisshin available for that role if you have not lost her, and Mizuho if speed isn't an issue.

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Post #: 14
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/29/2008 8:08:58 PM   
rominet


Posts: 523
Joined: 10/23/2007
From: Paris
Status: offline 		If my memory is good, some CS/AV were used by the japanese for CAP protection of transport TF with Pete and Rufe.
Pete was not very effective against bombers because of its weak weapons (2x7.7mm, 1x7.7mm) but it was a very maneuverable and very robust plane and was never an easy task even for allied fighter.
In WitP, you have to choose: or it is a float-fighter, or it is a float plane for reco.
IRL, this plane did both jobs.

< Message edited by rominet -- 9/29/2008 8:48:05 PM >

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Post #: 15
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 9/30/2008 9:57:00 PM   
nobunaga

 

Posts: 23
Joined: 8/12/2006
Status: offline 		The A6M2-N on CAP performs like a Zero (same armament), and from '43 onwards you no longer really need much recon since you will be on defense most of the time anyway and your LBA will do the recon and spotting job.

Should you opt for a large scale CV building program those pitiful 1174 naval yards you start with will never suffice, you need to expand into the 1600-1800 range or even higher. That done you can accelerate Taiho and all 6 Unryus into the 2nd half of '43. Seems more profitable to me than bothering with those conversions.
And having Mega-KB with 30 carriers in spring '44 is something like a wet dream for all IJN lovers.

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Post #: 16
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 10/2/2008 7:01:03 AM   
Ken Estes

 

Posts: 125
Joined: 9/14/2006
From: Seattle
Status: offline 		Indeed, almost any measure proves better than converting these excellent CS to CVL. Check out the a/c sorties they store, very very low number [is it 75?].

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Post #: 17
RE: CS Chitose Chiyoda conversion - 10/2/2008 10:50:33 AM   
Arstavidios

 

Posts: 780
Joined: 11/19/2004
Status: offline 		I prefer to keep them as CS and accelerate other carriers..........
I like to organize the carriers into four divisions with a CS each.

(in reply to Ken Estes)
Post #: 18
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