Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: willycube

I have noticed that Matrix rarely if ever has a demo for their new games, why? Battlefront puts out a demo for just about every game they do. Why can they do it and not Matrix. Will Matrix put out a demo on MWIF? and if not why?

Willy

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ORIGINAL: Recon

You could have a Demo of sorts - just use the Barbarossa scenario and limit the turns, say to 4.

No need to change any of the code that deals with processing a turn, just a cutoff point on a particular turn.

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ORIGINAL: willycube

Steve maybe it would be to hard for this particilar game [mwif] to create a demo, but Recon had a point with a small demo. Again if Battlefront does it for almost every game to allow people to get an idea what the game might be like before they spend 45 to 80 hard earned dollars on a bomb which I have done too many times with other companies, it sounds like to me Matrix wants you to buy their products sight unseen. Wrong!

Willy

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ORIGINAL: flipperwasirish

I agree, and I only have about 25 years in software jobs.

I also cannot fathom a demo for MWIF being inclusive enough to influence people.

Keep up the good work.

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ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.

Desktop recordings with voice overs of the various game aspects are the best IMHO. The more the better.

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ORIGINAL: OzHawkeye

It's hard to imagine a demo comprehensive enough to show-case MWiF sufficiently to influence a potential buyer without the demo itself being a long-drawn-out affair.

Demos are nice, but there has to be a cost/benefit analysis to them, and I'd think that the benefit side for a game like MWiF would be found a little wanting, not only because of the games complexity, but also because of it's relatively limited (and thus relatively informed) audience.

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ORIGINAL: willycube

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ORIGINAL: OzHawkeye

It's hard to imagine a demo comprehensive enough to show-case MWiF sufficiently to influence a potential buyer without the demo itself being a long-drawn-out affair.

Demos are nice, but there has to be a cost/benefit analysis to them, and I'd think that the benefit side for a game like MWiF would be found a little wanting, not only because of the games complexity, but also because of it's relatively limited (and thus relatively informed) audience.

Thank you Hawkeye I agree but what I was trying to get across also was Matrix never puts out a demo of any game to my knowledge, Battlefront does on every game and you can tell real quick whether this game will fill the bill so you dont throw your money away. Your comment on the limited number who might by this game and understand this game is right on never thought of that thank you.

Willy

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ORIGINAL: willycube

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ORIGINAL: OzHawkeye

It's hard to imagine a demo comprehensive enough to show-case MWiF sufficiently to influence a potential buyer without the demo itself being a long-drawn-out affair.

Demos are nice, but there has to be a cost/benefit analysis to them, and I'd think that the benefit side for a game like MWiF would be found a little wanting, not only because of the games complexity, but also because of it's relatively limited (and thus relatively informed) audience.

Thank you Hawkeye I agree but what I was trying to get across also was Matrix never puts out a demo of any game to my knowledge, Battlefront does on every game and you can tell real quick whether this game will fill the bill so you dont throw your money away. Your comment on the limited number who might by this game and understand this game is right on never thought of that thank you.

Willy

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ORIGINAL: Mad Russian

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ORIGINAL: willycube

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ORIGINAL: OzHawkeye

It's hard to imagine a demo comprehensive enough to show-case MWiF sufficiently to influence a potential buyer without the demo itself being a long-drawn-out affair.

Demos are nice, but there has to be a cost/benefit analysis to them, and I'd think that the benefit side for a game like MWiF would be found a little wanting, not only because of the games complexity, but also because of it's relatively limited (and thus relatively informed) audience.

Thank you Hawkeye I agree but what I was trying to get across also was Matrix never puts out a demo of any game to my knowledge, Battlefront does on every game and you can tell real quick whether this game will fill the bill so you dont throw your money away. Your comment on the limited number who might by this game and understand this game is right on never thought of that thank you.

Willy

How did you like the BFC demo for CMSF? Or did you wait for more than 10 patches before you bought it? A demo can be made to show whatever the owning company wants it to since they are often very limited in scope. If you think the game is questionable then wait for the reviews by GAMERS to be done on them.

Good Hunting.

MR

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ORIGINAL: Veldor

I need a demo simply to see if I can stand the awful screen resolution limits of some games without upchucking (I hate games with ugly stretch marks). And/or to get even the faintest feel for pitiful interfaces some games have. How am I to determine either of those things about this game without a demo? I could purchase it and play for 60 seconds and realize I cannot stand to play it any longer. Then I'm out close to $100. How is that anything other than a total ripoff?

Matrix has had bad results with demo's because they've generally only had them for games that were failing to begin with (Hornet Leader etc.). Also a demo really needs a tutorial included that teaches you at least a few parts of the game. If you've ever taught boardgames then you well know that even a complex game can be broken down quite easily into essentials and.. we can wait till later on all that other stuff..

When you start making the game is when you should figure out the plan for the demo.. Then its in your code or your code is structured in a way to later support it from day one and a no-brainer. Of course it would be a nightmare to add now to something like this. Even then there are "interactive recording" type demos that can be made wherein its basically a bunch of linked screenshots and motion video that lets you follow a training script and click/move like your in the game but you really aren't. But its not a skill just anyone would have to make from scratch and/or to purchase 3rd party products to do it would perhaps make it further cost prohibitive. I'd love to get just a demo that booted the game and let you click and move around without really even playing. That still shows me the screen graphics/resolution and some feel for the interface. Maybe let us play around with the game editor as well. There are things that can be done inexpensively enough should Matrix choose.

Maybe I'm pickier than most, or spoiled by other companies, but I'm in that camp of continually lost sales due to lack of demos. I'd probably have bought half or more of Matrix's titles otherwise. Here is a thought for Matrix... YOU MAKE TOO MANY GOOD GAMES? Did you ever think of that? I want them all but can't buy them all. It takes too much time to figure out which ones I really want so i end up buying NONE. If I played all the demos in a days time or less I'd be able to pick a few out easily instead of still procrastinating on the majority of them years later..

I don't have days or weeks to sit on these forums like others do sifting through countless posts and AAR's to try to determine what I could with 60 minutes or less and a demo.

If I cave in on this particular game and purchase it without a demo it will only be because I have a weak spot for nostalgia, which this game conjurs up. That and the fact that if I get a physical copy I believe this game will be new and hot enough that I suppose I could always sell it or trade it away for something else and get decent value back.

I hope this post is viewed constructively. I'm sure MWIF will be a fine product..

quote:

ORIGINAL: OzHawkeye

I think Mad Russian has some good advice in there. My very first post in this forum was "Is this the game I hope it is?", and the responses largely justified my hopes.

To be sure, I've learnt one thing about this game that goes into my negative column, that being the specific nature of units, which leads almost to a requirement that the game have a specified end-date. I've literally not bought games solely because I knew them to have an enforced end-date (HoI 1 for example).

For MWiF, I suspect I'll make an exception, but forums, far more so than demos, have always been the best source for deciding on games where the decision isn't an automatic yes or no.

I say all that despite the fact that I like (and use) demos to. I suspect it's just not practical at this point however to make one for MWiF, so forums, you-tube vids and the like will have to be what you make a decision upon, short of using the absence of a demo alone to make a negative decision.

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demos can be faked and paid reviewers can be manipulated.

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ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.

If the publishers and devs have the cajones to let customers come in and vent or rave about the game in an open forum then what the heck is there to be worried about ?

When the forums are over moderated to exclude any negative comments or opinions from customers, then I'd say maybe a demo makes sense. Even then as has been pointed out, demos can be faked and paid reviewers can be manipulated.

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ORIGINAL: willycube

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ORIGINAL: Jeffrey H.

If the publishers and devs have the cajones to let customers come in and vent or rave about the game in an open forum then what the heck is there to be worried about ?

When the forums are over moderated to exclude any negative comments or opinions from customers, then I'd say maybe a demo makes sense. Even then as has been pointed out, demos can be faked and paid reviewers can be manipulated.

Well said Veldor I agree with everything you say I don't understand why other players dont understand your feelings. This is not a knock against Matrix games its common sense. I have several Matix games.

Jeffrey H. please dont take this wrong I have promised myself not to get into any
arguments again and I will post no more on this subject but did you actually read my post about nato counters etc? I do not think so, what do fake demos and reviewers have to do with that post. If you do not understand what I am talking about say so and I will explain in sharper detail. I have no problem doing that.
This is why I get so discouraged posting about how I feel about something. Veldor it must be me not explaining myself right I guess I was talking about someone who might not like nato counters and would prefer units shown as tanks planes ships etc. and a demo might convince them that the game plays pretty well with nato counters, I am just using Nato counters as an example not to sell or unsell a game on this one particular minor issue. I said before if Matrix can get away with this [no demos] then more power to them.

Willy