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Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/11/2010 10:11:38 AM

RSF777

Posts: 19
Joined: 5/11/2010
Status: offline

I just bought this game and this is my first post, so bear with me. I was searching around for any information or websites related to distant worlds and this was the ONLY forum I found.

I am on my first game now with about 15 colonies, most of them pretty much new, I have a bunch of 3 ship fleets floating around that don't function like I thought they would, while still dishing it out to groups of sloppy AI ships, they don't seem to live up to their potential. Heres the deal:

Most ships cruise at around half their max speed, but when they are performing certain actions they hit the jets and try to max out. When a ship is in combat, looks like its always trying to stay a constant distance away from its target, which is constantly changing, so its always at full blast trying to move 3 inches to the left or right. As far as I can tell, if its already out of energy, it won't produce much more when its always at full throttle, so weapons come to a stop and I have to manually hit the "S" key every 10 seconds or so and unleash a glob of lasers as the ships default action with no mission, is there anyway of making the ship stop this pointless bahavior of running circles around enemy ships without firing anything? I have the default setting of Stronger: Standoff, Weaker: All Weapons, should I set it to point blank? Am I not giving the ship enough reactors even though its in the green on the ship design screen? Its a shame I created these expensive top of the line ships and my crew is shy about firing lasers.

A possible wishlist item could be the inclusion of ship or fleet captains that you could relay strategic commands to such as to use your energy more for speed or for weapons, formations, stay close to flag ship, change between standoff and all weapons, are only some of the possibilities. Having everything automated is nice to clear up the countless microing, but more detail in the basic combat functioning of individual ships or fleets would be nice, as when I take manual control of my ships during combat by using the S key to stop their engines, they inflict about 4-5 times the damage in a short amount of time, until they start moving again. Also my missle destroyers will sometimes just charge at enemies without firing a single torp, even though I have everything set to standoff. The only thing i've come up with so far is just to give the ship massive vector engines so it can move as freely as it wants, but this is quite unrealistic I think.

I realize that the above mentioned ships can easily be topped by a swarm of torpedo escorts, as well as everything else in the game, but effective close range ships would be nice as well.

Post #: 1

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/11/2010 12:57:01 PM

Fishman

Posts: 795
Joined: 4/1/2010
Status: offline

Your problem is insufficient reactorage. Reactor Green Power must be >= the energy cost of "Sprint" + DPS of all weapons. Additionally, some weapons have very irregular energy consumption patterns, so if you load a ship down with Waves, for instance, waves consume so much energy to fire that even if you meet the energy-per-second requirements, the immediate drain will overload the reactor's buffer.

On the other hand, this can be a good thing, since if done right, you'll get a ripple-fire of waves, which is both effective at repelling multiple targets and looks really cool.

(in reply to RSF777)

Post #: 2

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/11/2010 11:06:23 PM

RSF777

Posts: 19
Joined: 5/11/2010
Status: offline

How do I find the energy cost of Sprint, multply Max Energy Usage X # of engines?

So this ship would need about 4-5 reactors then? I thought the green meant I was good on energy, but I guess thats just for basic component power.

(in reply to Fishman)

Post #: 3

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/11/2010 11:35:43 PM

Erik Rutins

Posts: 37503
Joined: 3/28/2000
From: Vermont, USA
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The "Maximum Weapons Energy use per second 373" is pretty much the minimum excess power you want if you want to fire all your weapons regularly in combat. Add to that the 56 energy you need for Sprint and you've got what you want your Excess Energy Output to look like.

Right now you have 56 Excess Energy, but you actually want 56 + 373 for this design.

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(in reply to RSF777)

Post #: 4

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 4:40:38 AM

exelsiar

Posts: 25
Joined: 4/27/2010
Status: offline

it also looks like your speed is being capped by your lack of reactors too ^_^

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Post #: 5

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 5:49:29 AM

VarekRaith

Posts: 138
Joined: 2/21/2010
From: Manassas, Virginia
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: exelsiar

it also looks like your speed is being capped by your lack of reactors too ^_^

That, and she doesn't have enough power storage for a full alpha strike.

< Message edited by VarekRaith -- 5/12/2010 5:50:23 AM >

(in reply to exelsiar)

Post #: 6

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 6:06:36 AM

ceyan

Posts: 168
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: RSF777

How do I find the energy cost of Sprint, multply Max Energy Usage X # of engines?

So this ship would need about 4-5 reactors then? I thought the green meant I was good on energy, but I guess thats just for basic component power.

The Sprint energy requirement is listed in the Movement box. The red column is sprint (named on the top), followed by the Speed your ships moves in that phase and how much energy it takes to utilize it.

(in reply to RSF777)

Post #: 7

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 8:17:04 AM

RSF777

Posts: 19
Joined: 5/11/2010
Status: offline

Ah, ok cool, I did not notice that "Maximum Weapons Energy use per second: 373" before, I thought it added it into the upper right tab.

(in reply to ceyan)

Post #: 8

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 6:17:52 PM

Dadekster

Posts: 141
Joined: 4/18/2010
Status: offline

THIS ^

little thread has more info on how to build a proper ship than anything else I have seen here or in the game properly condensed.

STICKY STICKY STICKY!!

(in reply to RSF777)

Post #: 9

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 8:09:08 PM

ceyan

Posts: 168
Joined: 7/3/2004
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Dadekster

THIS ^

little thread has more info on how to build a proper ship than anything else I have seen here or in the game properly condensed.

STICKY STICKY STICKY!!

The main thing is to take your time when going through the design screen. All the information in here is on the design screen but you really have to sit down and force yourself to go through the screen line by line to make sure you find everything. For example, like RSF777, I initially missed the fact that the movement values had specific energy costs associated with them. I think the only thing I've really found missing in the design process (that I would really need versus want) is a connection between speed on the design screen and speed on the map. I haven't been able to translate (using the above screenshots as an example) what my real value add is between Speed 12 and Speed 19.

(in reply to Dadekster)

Post #: 10

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 9:34:56 PM

Canute0

Posts: 616
Joined: 4/30/2010
From: Germany
Status: offline

Impuse = Speed without Energy/no fuel
Cruise = 1.Gear, if the ship got Energy
Sprint = 2.Gear, so long the Ship got enough energy produktion the ship try to use Sprint. But Weapon use can prevent this.

the ship never got slower then Cruise so long it got fuel/energy. If you dont got enough energy the weapons shoot slower.

(in reply to ceyan)

Post #: 11

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/12/2010 11:13:35 PM

RSF777

Posts: 19
Joined: 5/11/2010
Status: offline

I got the energy system completely wrong. So I stripped off over half of its firepower loaded up a few more reactors and a small group of them can take on pirate bases and enemy space ports like its cake, its also 50 tons lighter(right unit of measurement... tons?)

Here it is now, despite now only having 212 firepower it shreds pretty much any 3-4 ships the AI has made so far, invades and bombards planets, and it can be yours for only 7 and a half big ones, plus s&h. It acts like it could possibly support some more weapons or one less reactor. Oddly, its cruise speed was reduced by one and its sprint speed went up 2???

It even makes parking lots!

< Message edited by RSF777 -- 5/12/2010 11:21:57 PM >

(in reply to Canute0)

Post #: 12

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/14/2010 12:46:06 AM

Astorax

Posts: 188
Joined: 4/11/2010
Status: offline

It still needs 1 (or possibly 2) energy collectors for idle/downtime so it doesn't use fuel needlessly. If you need it quick, you don't want it to have to go fuel up first and waste time. The energy collectors need only cover the Static Energy Usage of which your design = 16.

Also, maybe its just me but it seems very slow for a vessel thats stated tactic is "Standoff". For that tactic you want to be able to go faster than whatever you want to stand off of. Its usually only used for a torpedo heavy ship.

Oh, one more thing: Whats the 700 cargo capacity and the dock for?

< Message edited by Astorax -- 5/14/2010 2:34:27 AM >

(in reply to RSF777)

Post #: 13

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/14/2010 3:05:34 AM

RSF777

Posts: 19
Joined: 5/11/2010
Status: offline

Ah, thanks for the tip on the energy collectors, I did not think of that. I assume this doesn't work when they are patrolling?

Yes it is a tad slow for a standoff ship, most dedicated torpedo ships I make are small escorts that move and turn very fast. Its acually an all purpose planet attacking ship, the standoff is to prevent it from moving within starbase firing range if possible. It mainly uses torpedos, but I gave it enough lasers to hold its own if something closes on it. I just added the cargo and dock to make it an even 450 lol, and maybe for a little OCD realism. It doesn't hold many troops for a planet attacker, but it can bombard and I intended it to be used in groups.

(in reply to Astorax)

Post #: 14

RE: Ship AI Questions/Suggestions - 5/14/2010 3:25:37 AM

Astorax

Posts: 188
Joined: 4/11/2010
Status: offline

Energy collectors only work when the vessel is stationary. Also, the listed collected value is a maximum and can vary from distance to star or whether or not there IS a star where you are. For example, if you are outside some solar system waiting to attack you will not be collecting energy.

As for the docks/cargo - if you can live with the added maintenance cost, so be it. Heh. Just remember, once your empire starts getting really large, multiply however many ships you have now by X (whatever X is) and see if you are comfortable with THAT maintenance cost.

Added Tip: Bombarding planets makes EVERYONE hate you. You will take major reputation hits for bombarding and, as far as I know, everyone else has given it up as a bad job. Perhaps Fishman with his "Kill Everyone" strategy might use it but even then ...

(in reply to RSF777)

Post #: 15