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RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa

 
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RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 8:04:37 AM   
Apollo11


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Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus







Ahhh... that explains it all..


When is the real event for Paul the octopus regarding upcoming Germany - Spain match?



Leo "Apollo11"

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Post #: 511
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 12:20:31 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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This morning. Already done

Looks like the final will be Spain vs - ???




Attachment (1)

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Post #: 512
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 12:59:17 PM   
Bliztk


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Paul is wise.

All hail Paul

Germany offensive power is overrated IMHO, only played weak teams with offensive aspirations. Spain has played ultra-defensive weak teams, thus the lesser goal average


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Post #: 513
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 1:17:27 PM   
Jaroen


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From: Amsterdam
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Maybe a misconception but do many Brits root for Holland as the second best after England?
For what it's worth, ie not much, I believe many Dutch would settle for supporting England if Holland would drop out earlier.

Btw. is that octopus only drawing winners for German matches???
Would definately hope for a Holland vs. Spain final since the German mannschaft is certainly an angstgegener for the Dutch. Although winning a final against Germany is just about a dream come true for all the Dutch after loosing the 1974 final.

Go Orange!!!

(in reply to Bliztk)
Post #: 514
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 2:05:59 PM   
vinnie71

 

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Well one can always rely on the fact that Germany is a kind of boogey man for the Spanish.  Truth is that the Spanish on an individual basis are formidable and therefore on paper should be favourites. Incidentally I believe that it will be a tactical game rather than a goalfest. I also believe that whoever scores first will dramatically change the course of the game in his favour.

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Post #: 515
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 2:42:46 PM   
Apollo11


Posts: 24082
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Hi all,

quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

This morning. Already done

Looks like the final will be Spain vs - ???





Darn... so the true Paul the Octopus also choose Spain (i.e. this is no hoax any more)... interesting...


Leo "Apollo11"

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Prior Preparation & Planning Prevents Pathetically Poor Performance!

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P: UV, WitP, WitP-AE

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Post #: 516
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 3:11:13 PM   
vinnie71

 

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OCTOPUS SALAD ANYONE??????


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Post #: 517
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 4:08:16 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Anyway, I am pretty certain about ONE thing. The squad which is going to win on Wednesday (either Germany or Spain) is going to be World Champion...

In other words, Holland or Uruguay don't have any possibility. Well, a catastrophe, who knows...

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Post #: 518
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 7:24:59 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaroen

Maybe a misconception but do many Brits root for Holland as the second best after England?
For what it's worth, ie not much, I believe many Dutch would settle for supporting England if Holland would drop out earlier.

Btw. is that octopus only drawing winners for German matches???
Would definately hope for a Holland vs. Spain final since the German mannschaft is certainly an angstgegener for the Dutch. Although winning a final against Germany is just about a dream come true for all the Dutch after loosing the 1974 final.

Go Orange!!!

Warspite1

I'm English and I support the Dutch in Football (in the absence of England and the other home countries) because my first memory of the World Cup finals was as a 9-year old football mad - no, football obsessed - little boy in 1974, who, in the absence of an England team to support (and the poor Scots who went home on goal difference without losing a game ), was totally bowled over by this team in an unusual but interesting Orange and Black strip. Although I didn't truly appreciate then how good the football was, I still remember the 2-0 win over Brazil in the semi-final and what a big thing that was because Brazil had won the cup 3 times and were the holders. I still remember that match like it was yesterday - Holland in their White "away" kit with Orange trim and Orange socks - Cruyff, Neeskens, Krol, Jongbloed, Van Hanegem, Rensenbrink, Rep .

I don't remember the second semi-final but recall my dad desperately wanting the Poles (even though they had despatched England in the qualifiers) and the reason he gave - because of WWII and the fate that befell that poor country thanks to the Nazis. Sadly the Poles did not make it but that made the final all the more interesting; Holland vs Germany.

Unfortunately the Germans won that one, coming from behind to beat the best team in the world; just as they had done twenty years earlier against the then best team, the Hungarians (You've just got to admire the Teutonic efficiency!! ).

The Dutch, by then without Cruyff but still a great side, should have won four years later but were beaten by the home country - this time Argentina - once more.

In the interim they have continued to produce great players - Van Basten, Gullitt, Bergkamp (even if he is a Gooner ), Van Der Sar et al.

This may not be the best Dutch side ever, but Holland are certainly overdue a World Cup win. So nothing against Spain, Germany or Uruguay - but please please please let it be Holland this year





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Post #: 519
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 7:44:08 PM   
frank1970


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this octopus made one wrong tip two years ago, too. Chose Germany as winner in the Eurocup. Was plain wrong. This time it is Germany who will win. No european champion ever won the world cup, so bad luck Spain

I hope it will be a good match with Germany winning, but my guts say otherwise

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Post #: 520
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 8:06:59 PM   
Apollo11


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Hi all,

quote:


Germany v Spain: Paul the psychic octopus predicts World Cup defeat for Joachim Löw

Germany have been dealt a 'massive' blow to their World Cup chances after the psychic octopus, Paul, picked Spain to win their semi-final clash.

by By Tim Hart
Daily Telegraph UK


Ominous for the octopus: Paul the psychic octopus has predicted Spain will beat Germany but its days may be numbered as angered Argentinan fans have threatened to cook it in a paella:



Paul has predicted all of Germany's World Cup results correctly so far, including wins against England and Argentina.

Paul even said that Serbia would beat Germany 1-0 in the group stage.

However, there is still a glimmer of hope for Germany. In all his years of making predictions, the only one Paul has ever got wrong was the Spain v Germany final at Euro 2008.

The octopus opted for Germany but Spain were the victors, winning 1-0.

German fans are now hoping the opposite will happen and by picking Spain to win it will actually be Germany who come out on top.

Such is the popularity that surrounds the octopus the German news channel n-tv actually broadcasted its Germany-Spain prediction live, even having two reporters commentating on it.

The handlers of the psychic octopus at Aquarium Sea Life in Oberhausen encourage Paul to make the predictions by putting mussels into two glass cubes, with each cube having one of the nation's flags on the front.

The mussel Paul chooses first is taken to be its prediction.

Paul initially went to the Spain-marked container before moving around the tank and then hovered over the German box. But he eventually opted for the European champions.

Paul has become world reknowned, but this good humoured, quirky phenomenon has not been well recieved by everybody.

Following the quarter-final prediction where Paul correctly guessed Argentina would lose to Germany the Argentineans threatened to kill the octopus and put it in a paella.

The newspaper El Dia gave this recipe for anyone daring to capture Paul: "All you need is four normal potatoes, olive oil for taste and a little pepper."

Argentinan chef Nicolas Bedorrou has suggested on Facebook a far more simplistic and brutal way to cook the octopus.

"We will chase him and put him on some paper. We will then beat him (but correctly!) in order to keep the meat tender and then put it in boiling water."



Leo "Apollo11"

_____________________________



Prior Preparation & Planning Prevents Pathetically Poor Performance!

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P: UV, WitP, WitP-AE

(in reply to frank1970)
Post #: 521
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 8:32:18 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Amazing Holland goal

But 1 - 1...

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Post #: 522
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 9:30:26 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaroen

Maybe a misconception but do many Brits root for Holland as the second best after England?
For what it's worth, ie not much, I believe many Dutch would settle for supporting England if Holland would drop out earlier.

Btw. is that octopus only drawing winners for German matches???
Would definately hope for a Holland vs. Spain final since the German mannschaft is certainly an angstgegener for the Dutch. Although winning a final against Germany is just about a dream come true for all the Dutch after loosing the 1974 final.

Go Orange!!!

Warspite1

I'm English and I support the Dutch in Football (in the absence of England and the other home countries) because my first memory of the World Cup finals was as a 9-year old football mad - no, football obsessed - little boy in 1974, who, in the absence of an England team to support (and the poor Scots who went home on goal difference without losing a game ), was totally bowled over by this team in an unusual but interesting Orange and Black strip. Although I didn't truly appreciate then how good the football was, I still remember the 2-0 win over Brazil in the semi-final and what a big thing that was because Brazil had won the cup 3 times and were the holders. I still remember that match like it was yesterday - Holland in their White "away" kit with Orange trim and Orange socks - Cruyff, Neeskens, Krol, Jongbloed, Van Hanegem, Rensenbrink, Rep .

I don't remember the second semi-final but recall my dad desperately wanting the Poles (even though they had despatched England in the qualifiers) and the reason he gave - because of WWII and the fate that befell that poor country thanks to the Nazis. Sadly the Poles did not make it but that made the final all the more interesting; Holland vs Germany.

Unfortunately the Germans won that one, coming from behind to beat the best team in the world; just as they had done twenty years earlier against the then best team, the Hungarians (You've just got to admire the Teutonic efficiency!! ).

The Dutch, by then without Cruyff but still a great side, should have won four years later but were beaten by the home country - this time Argentina - once more.

In the interim they have continued to produce great players - Van Basten, Gullitt, Bergkamp (even if he is a Gooner ), Van Der Sar et al.

This may not be the best Dutch side ever, but Holland are certainly overdue a World Cup win. So nothing against Spain, Germany or Uruguay - but please please please let it be Holland this year




Warspite1

YES!!

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RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/6/2010 10:26:39 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Bliztk
Germany offensive power is overrated IMHO, only played weak teams with offensive aspirations.


HAHAHA, 8 goals scored in the last 2 matches

Congatulations, Holland... *but... I stick to my prediction*

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Post #: 524
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 8:23:36 AM   
moonraker65


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Those who count their chickens before they've hatched ...

And yes I'd love to see Holland win it.

< Message edited by moonraker -- 7/7/2010 8:24:33 AM >

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Post #: 525
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 12:17:01 PM   
Jaroen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

Congratulations, Holland... *but... I stick to my prediction*




You know, a lot of Dutch people in WC football pools opt for selecting the opposing team (often Germany!?).
When you win the pool you can say you're happy because of winning the pool (silently crying).
But if the Dutch accidentally win the final you're even happier (screaming loudly).

Only a few brave (stupid/patriotic/wise???) did select the Holland team to win.

BTW Tullius, why thinking the German/Spain team to win the final? If the Germans/Spanish win you were right in predicting but still being very happy when your prediction fails???

Do the Germans/Spanish really have a better team??? On paper I'd say those teams are about equal in strength overall (skill/mentality/etc.) so there's no clear favorite is there?

PS: Very much like Warspite I remember 1974 being 9 years old at the time. So the feeling of retribution in this 3rd chance for a WC is strong. Oh boy, oh boy. I decided not to visit Duxton (England) for the air show (Flying Legends) next weekend to watch the final.

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 526
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 12:36:03 PM   
BShaftoe

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Offworlder


quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

quote:

ORIGINAL: Offworlder

Germany's midfield is rather eclectic and flexible. Except for Osil, all are capable of defending or at least doubling an adversary, which is a huge advantage. Heck even Klose sometimes can be found chasing adversaries for the ball

Btw if Paul the octopus screws up, send him to Malta on 'vacation'. Here he'll meet a lot of his friends...


Well, even a pure striker as Samuel Eto'o could defend, true... Against Barcelona (Champions League semi-final) and Bayern München (final) Mourinho made him play as a right winger But this does not mean he will be good at that "new" job. You will hardly find very good creative midfielders who are very good destructive midfielders. It's either one thing or the other. And above all, you cannot do both things at the same time. So you need a creative and destructive guy. Different guys, different (and important) tasks.



True enough. But never underestimate the fact that even a creative midfielder hovering at your back or doubling you, exerts that certain pressure on anyone who's with the ball. The truth is that more often than not its Schweinsteiger who recovers (and proposes) balls in the midfield. As I said, the German midfielders do seem to double back many times leaving little space for their adversaries and basically clogging the midfield.

Btw Fletcher I think that on paper the Spanish team can be superior - more experience, an ability to find a way through somehow and a coach who is ready to make tough calls when needed. I mean the guy doesn't look at the name but at the requirements of that particular game, even though he espouses a certain football mentality. It takes guts to go up in front of the press after the loss to Switzerland, say it was mostly bad luck (which it kind of was) and that he's not going to change because of that.


Ok.

Then I think we will win. We have a rugged and strong midfield (that is extremely good creating AND destroying, and is probably the best midfield of the championship, including Germany) that is used to play international championships, a striker in a good luck streak (Villa), and we have demonstrated that we can begin losing and actually turn around the result (losing against Switzerland, but managing to win two matches afterwards and get out of the league phase as first of our group).

Also, the only reason we haven't shined until now is because we have played against teams that have gone on the defensive, on a extreme way. Every time we have scored a goal and those teams have gone on the offensive, letting their defenses "down", our game has improved a lot, and it always seemed we were on the brink to score more goals.

So I think this match will be different: Germany is not going to be ultradefensive, so probably, we will see a very good match (a match I think we'll win). As someone has already said, I think that the first team to score will have a huge advantage and will most likely win the match, but I think, that given the advantage in experience of Spain players, recovering a goal would be slightly more likely for Spain than for Germany.

That being said, if we lose against Germany (something of course possible), at least we will lose against a team that is actually playing football, and not just adding players behind the ball, and waiting for the first mistake of the team actually playing.

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RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 12:36:23 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaroen
Only a few brave (stupid/patriotic/wise???) did select the Holland team to win.

BTW Tullius, why thinking the German/Spain team to win the final? If the Germans/Spanish win you were right in predicting but still being very happy when your prediction fails???

Do the Germans/Spanish really have a better team??? On paper I'd say those teams are about equal in strength overall (skill/mentality/etc.) so there's no clear favorite is there?


Why? Simply because I think both Germany and Spain squads are way too strong for Holland. I do know the players of the 3 squads. I know how they play... I can be wrong? Of course

Just let me say one word: Kuyt... I DO love this player. He is an incredibly honest player who always plays at 120%... But he is quite limited... especially when you compare him with his German and Spanish counterparts. And he made it to this Holland squad...

And Holland defense seems made of butter... normal, Holland is still the victim of four decades of ultra-offensive football

Good luck though. You will really need it

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Post #: 528
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 12:37:41 PM   
LoBaron


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I cross my fingers for Holland, always been an Oranje at heart (since its hard to be Austrian when football is concerned you have to look elsewhere... )

Still I´m with TulliusDetrius on this. Both, Spain and Germany looked more secure in their own style of playing up to now. Whichever
of the two will make it (my bet is on Spain but they are very evenly matched) is my bet for winning the world cup.

Holland had a tough time in the semi finals. If they want to win against Spain or Germany they will have to do better than one perfect (and lucky) 38m
shot and a second from a corner. They have to make the chances they got count. And I have seen 100% chances being stupidly missed
by them a tad too often already.


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Post #: 529
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 2:54:04 PM   
Jaroen


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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus


quote:

ORIGINAL: Jaroen
Only a few brave (stupid/patriotic/wise???) did select the Holland team to win.

BTW Tullius, why thinking the German/Spain team to win the final? If the Germans/Spanish win you were right in predicting but still being very happy when your prediction fails???

Do the Germans/Spanish really have a better team??? On paper I'd say those teams are about equal in strength overall (skill/mentality/etc.) so there's no clear favorite is there?


Why? Simply because I think both Germany and Spain squads are way too strong for Holland. I do know the players of the 3 squads. I know how they play... I can be wrong? Of course

Just let me say one word: Kuyt... I DO love this player. He is an incredibly honest player who always plays at 120%... But he is quite limited... especially when you compare him with his German and Spanish counterparts. And he made it to this Holland squad...

And Holland defense seems made of butter... normal, Holland is still the victim of four decades of ultra-offensive football

Good luck though. You will really need it


Luck is definately needed!

I'm not completely in agreement with your estimate of team strength and hopefully the final match will show it.
I'd say the Dutch have a good defense (assuming the regulars will play), a very good/super midfield all of them potential scorers and a good/very good offense (when playing according to expectations). Now I'm thinking both the German/Spanish offensive certainly is somewhat stronger/effective than the Dutch but the Dutch midfiled is compensating for this. Defensively all teams are not much different strengthwise in my opinion. With the Kuyt story you hit a much discussed issue (nerve) over here in The Netherlands. On the positive score he's said to be a huge contribution to the team effort and the negative claims he's not a striker. Which is both right I think. I think the manager is thinking to never change a winning team or he would have exchanged Kuyt for Huntelaar who's much more the finisher.

BTW: that Kuyt discussion always makes me think about the way managers built a team. How much of value is a player/forward who doesn't score easily but enables the whole team to perform on a higher level?! And what about player's mix and mentality to create that much wanted team spirit? The managers (both Van Basten and Van Marwijk) never had a truly satisfying answer to press questions about Kuyt. This might be because of the brittle aspect of team spirit which is easily crashed by saying Kuyt is not a very capable player but nevertheless very important. By saying that you loose Kuyt in every way and with it some of the team spirit and performance as well.

Do we have any managers in the audience???

Aside from skill there's fitness, mentality, confidence and that all important luck (is there such a thing?).
Against the Germans the Holland team will definately feel intimidated if only by history alone. And there's the always expected Dutch implosion which happened during a few matches already but happily not for a full game.

So I'd predict a Dutch win against Spain or loss against Germany and expecting the Germans to win against Spain. Paul the octopus is making 1 mistake every 5 predictions so . . .

Now hoping for that luck!!!

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 530
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 3:35:43 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Jaroen, you have missed my point about Kuyt Holland gave him this position because the coach does not have Van Bastens, Gullits anymore... You see the glass half full (he struggles a lot, like a mule), I see it half empty (an attacker MUST be talented, he is not)...

Another Dutch player we should mention... van Persie. Similar to Torres case. Both players are not performing very well. They are expected to appear though... The sooner the better

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Post #: 531
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 4:51:52 PM   
BShaftoe

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

Jaroen, you have missed my point about Kuyt Holland gave him this position because the coach does not have Van Bastens, Gullits anymore... You see the glass half full (he struggles a lot, like a mule), I see it half empty (an attacker MUST be talented, he is not)...

Another Dutch player we should mention... van Persie. Similar to Torres case. Both players are not performing very well. They are expected to appear though... The sooner the better


Torres is playing awfully. I think that Llorente would do a lot better, at least until Torres is at 100%. So right now, every time Torres is in the starting team, I think we're playing with 10'5 players, not with 11.

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 532
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 7:25:12 PM   
warspite1


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quote:

ORIGINAL: BShaftoe


quote:

ORIGINAL: TulliusDetritus

Jaroen, you have missed my point about Kuyt Holland gave him this position because the coach does not have Van Bastens, Gullits anymore... You see the glass half full (he struggles a lot, like a mule), I see it half empty (an attacker MUST be talented, he is not)...

Another Dutch player we should mention... van Persie. Similar to Torres case. Both players are not performing very well. They are expected to appear though... The sooner the better


........So right now, every time Torres is in the starting team, I think we're playing with 10'5 players, not with 11.

Warspite1

You're lucky - when we start with Rooney, Lampard and Gerrard we usually start with 9.5 players (if we're lucky) .

Interesting discussion re Kuyt. I'm with Tullius in one regard - he's simply not that good! However, what I like about him is that he is an honest grafter who gives max effort all the time - unlike some more skilful, high profile names who were awful in the World Cup (sorry I'm back to our miserable shower yet again ).

Speaking of our players, I was delighted with Mehmet Ozil's comment re Rooney and the fact that he was complaining of being bored. Ozil, not unreasonably, queried why any footballer should be bored at a World Cup finals. Well said young Mr Ozil. Don't suppose any of them thought to bring a good book?

_____________________________

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



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Post #: 533
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:22:40 PM   
TulliusDetritus


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Spain Midfield 1 - 0 Germany

GAME OVER



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Post #: 534
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:31:02 PM   
Dixie


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quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Interesting discussion re Kuyt. I'm with Tullius in one regard - he's simply not that good! However, what I like about him is that he is an honest grafter who gives max effort all the time - unlike some more skilful, high profile names who were awful in the World Cup (sorry I'm back to our miserable shower yet again ).



Every team needs a 'donkey' Shame that Lincoln usually have 8 of them on the pitch

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Post #: 535
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:32:04 PM   
traskott


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PODEEEMOOOSSS !!

PODEEEEMOOOOOS SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII !!!!

CAMPEOOOONES; CAMPEOOOOOONES, OEEEE; OOOOEEE OOOOEEE

Well...Not yet, aheam.

I said IT !! ( I posted it several days ago ).

(in reply to TulliusDetritus)
Post #: 536
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:35:34 PM   
Walloc

 

Posts: 3141
Joined: 10/30/2006
From: Denmark
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Gratz to Spain,

They played by far the best football!
A well deserved win, i just hope u guys win the finals too.

Kind regards,

Rasmus

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Post #: 537
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:40:17 PM   
warspite1


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From: England
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Dixie


quote:

ORIGINAL: warspite1

Interesting discussion re Kuyt. I'm with Tullius in one regard - he's simply not that good! However, what I like about him is that he is an honest grafter who gives max effort all the time - unlike some more skilful, high profile names who were awful in the World Cup (sorry I'm back to our miserable shower yet again ).



Every team needs a 'donkey' Shame that Lincoln usually have 8 of them on the pitch

Warspite1

Only 8??

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England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805



(in reply to Dixie)
Post #: 538
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:53:14 PM   
moonraker65


Posts: 556
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From: Swindon,Wilts. UK
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Oh dear did the Germans turn up ?? . Mwahahahahahahahaha

(in reply to warspite1)
Post #: 539
RE: OT World Cup 2010 South Africa - 7/7/2010 9:55:30 PM   
frank1970


Posts: 1678
Joined: 9/1/2000
From: Bayern
Status: offline
Congratulation Spain!
The Spanish team was much better than the Germans today.
Nearly no German player was playing good today. Too passive, to many bad passes, to little power.
I hope they will defeat Uruguay neat and clean: two goals for Klose and two for Müller, who was really missed this match.
So next time the Germans will do it .


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(in reply to warspite1)
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