Slitherine

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ORIGINAL: Terminus

And that's bad how?

England expects that every man will do his duty. Horatio Nelson October 1805

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ORIGINAL: Terminus

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ORIGINAL: Hertston

Im curious. As JD said we have have a totally different culture regarding guns in the UK. What exactly do you do with guns like that? I can understand target rifles, and hunting rifles and shotguns, but surely assault rifles belong in the military?

The US is a very immature country. When you're small, you like things that go BANG.

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ORIGINAL: Mac67

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ORIGINAL: Terminus

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ORIGINAL: Hertston

Im curious. As JD said we have have a totally different culture regarding guns in the UK. What exactly do you do with guns like that? I can understand target rifles, and hunting rifles and shotguns, but surely assault rifles belong in the military?

The US is a very immature country. When you're small, you like things that go BANG.

Funny that. Terminus is always the first one to squeal about trolls but he never trolls himself...

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ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

Dunblane was the incident. I remember now after searching.

There's not a ban on guns here per se - I don't know what the gun laws are here, but I do know it's not common place to have guns and I'm pretty happy about that and long may it live. What are the gun laws in the US? Are you vetted at all?

Couple of interesting links (or not )
Dunblane http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunblane_massacre
and gun policitics in the UK http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_politics_in_the_United_Kingdom

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ORIGINAL: Terminus

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ORIGINAL: Hertston

Im curious. As JD said we have have a totally different culture regarding guns in the UK. What exactly do you do with guns like that? I can understand target rifles, and hunting rifles and shotguns, but surely assault rifles belong in the military?

The US is a very immature country. When you're small, you like things that go BANG.

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I still cant understand why he hasnt been banned

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ORIGINAL: ezz

In the UK the gun laws generally followed the major wars.
After the Napoleonic wars there was an act to disarm the population as many former soldiers, now unemployed, had taken to roaming the country robbing people. Same after the first world war. The major firearms act was in 1968.
Firearms of any type, pistol, rifle etc are virtually unkown in the UK. A friend of mine is in the British rifle team otherwise I would know no-one who owns a weapon.
I have never seen a pistol in a house in the UK. hunting is very rare too. Deer hunting would be considered a heinous crime. Squirel shooting too would get very strange looks if it was announced in a bar.

The later firearms acts were knee jerk politician reactions to two massacres, Dunblane and Hungerford, but gun laws were already very strict and I doubt that having a semi or single shot weapon would have made a lot of difference.
There has been a recent random shooting spree in June when a gunman killed 12 and injured 11.

But generally in the UK gun deaths is ridiculously low by US standards. 42 deaths from firearms, including suicide, in 2008. In the USA it is around 11,000 from a population about 5 times larger than the UK.
The firearm ownership statistics would show an even greater discrepancy.

Its just cultural. In the UK guns are owned by farmers, a tiny minority of sporting shooters and then criminals.
You never ever see them Most people would not be able to tell you where a gun shop is located as they would never have seen one. UK police are not armed and carry no weapons except a tin stick and a can of pepper.

It is really strange when USA citizens talk of their gun collections. To a British resident it is just something {generally} we don't do.{Northern Ireland , at war for 30 years is slightly different}
I'm not knocking gun ownership or disparaging it. Just agreeing with Judge.
It is cultural.

It might be like us all telling you "oh we all drive AFV's. We don't have automobiles. Just AFV's! Its sooo much safer. Sure a few thousand  pedestrians are squashed in parking accidents but thats the price of safety..and then we go on to describe our recreational tank collections!"

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ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

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ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

The thing is - I recall my time on the ranges in the Military...it was VERY regimented and under strict conditions. The thought of people wandering the country shooting at what they like scares the crap out of me!

Imagine, if you will, standing in a field and firing a high velocity rifle...that bullet, if it doesn't hit something, will travel quite far. For an ordinary civilian to determine whether it's safe to fire that weapon or not seems dangerous.

This almost never happens. Like I said, more than 9/10 gun related deaths occur from handguns and the vast majority of those occur from cheap legally purchased handguns who find their way to inner cities by illegal methods.

A death or injury from what you describe is exceedingly rare. Most larger cities make it harder to have a gun permit and damn near impossible to have a carry permit (Washington DC and NYC are good examples). They also make it illegal to fire a gun within city premises. Even the medium sized city I live in (about 300,000) makes it illegal to find a weapon outdoors, inside city limits unless you are at a range.

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ORIGINAL: Zakhal

I was very fond of my rk62 in army. I made top scores with it all the time and trainer called me a murderer when I made a shot ring the size of matchbox shooting from a knee 300m away.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6a/RK_62_76.jpg

After army I thought about making it a hobby to shoot at targets but after ten years I never got to doing it.

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ORIGINAL: Terminus

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ORIGINAL: Hertston

Im curious. As JD said we have have a totally different culture regarding guns in the UK. What exactly do you do with guns like that? I can understand target rifles, and hunting rifles and shotguns, but surely assault rifles belong in the military?

The US is a very immature country. When you're small, you like things that go BANG.

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ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

When I want to conceal I carry the Kimbers Ultra Carry CDP (Edit to say that this is an incredible weapon. Have fired over a thousand rounds through it and never a fail to feed or fail to eject. Rather pricey though.)



If I'm open carrying I also harness the 357




The missus carries a small hammerless 38


Terminus, please don't insult my country of origin.

'Any government that fears arms in the hands of it's citizens should also fear the rope.'

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ORIGINAL: Sheytan

I can have a weapon in my vehicle as long as it isnt chambered and that is legal, even with a loaded clip in it. That is all I need.

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ORIGINAL: BASB

MR, How does a hammerless gun work, what is it? The other question as Australian I fail to understand why people need to carry a weapon at all? ( by the way this is not a criticism just curious!

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ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

Kimbers are nice but also incredibly expensive (you probably can't touch one factory new below $1,000). They are more for show/match grade accuracy rather than everyday pieces.

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ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

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ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

Kimbers are nice but also incredibly expensive (you probably can't touch one factory new below $1,000). They are more for show/match grade accuracy rather than everyday pieces.

Yeah, I warned him they were expensive. But if your life is on the line what is a few more hundred dollars. The real problem with cheaper autos is that they are prone to stovepipe, something very dangerous if at the worst possible time. Like I said before also, it really depends on what you want it for. As far as ammo, reloading will save you TONS of cash if you practice/shoot often. But those are only for target guns. The Kimber never sees anything but hornsby hollow points.

mo reb

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ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

Also Sheyton, the weapon you choose must be an extension of what you want to use it for. If you want to C&C a small pistol is the way to go. Keep in mind that most gunfights happen at around 10 feet or less. A revolver VERY RARELY fails to fire but you are limited in shots where an auto gives you many more. If you are wanting to target shoot, a 9mm etc. with a longer barrel is a better choice as the ammo on larger calibers are expensive to fire and a longer barrel improves accuracy.

If it is for home protection, not much beats a Remington 870 mag shotgun with a 18.5 inch barrel and the plug removed for more shells. Don't have to be too good a shot while waking up with sleep in your eyes.

But do check out the kimbers. It kicks very mildly for what it is.

mo reb

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ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

Kimbers are nice but also incredibly expensive (you probably can't touch one factory new below $1,000). They are more for show/match grade accuracy rather than everyday pieces. I don't carry a weapon and have no desire to do so. I also am inside a courthouse a few days a week and couldn't carry one even if I wanted to. But now that I shoot with my brother twice a month I did make my first weapon purchase.
It is a Sig Sauer P250 .40 that I got factory new with two magazines for $380
I found a model a few years older than the current one and saved quite a bit of money

If I can make one suggestion, if you are going to make a pistol purchase then I reccomend it be 9mm. The ammo is easily the most common and least expensive of pistol ammo besides .22
I wish I had done the same when I made my first purchase. The large and more exotic ammo you buy the more expensive it becomes.

Maybe it is just a local problem, but I also have a hard time finding ammo sometimes as well as weapons I want to purchase. Ever since Jan 2009 when Obama took office some hardcore gun nuts think their weapons are going to be taken away so they buy ammo in bulk.
Most of them don't realize that in several states gun laws have been loosened since he took over

Anyways, it has made some ammo hard to find and dealers have taken advantage of the paranoia and made ammo and guns 30-40% more expensive than pre 2009. Nothing like taking advantage of peoples fear and driving up the prices eh?

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ORIGINAL: Fallschirmjager

If I remember correctly they are hand made and also have things like real wood grips made of precious woods. You can buy a polymer/blued steel gun for half as much and not have to worry about reliability. If you are a first time owner there is nothing wrong by going with Sig, Springfield, Beretta, Walther etc. None of those carry any excessive reliability problems
There are some brands though I would stay away from even if I you did not carry the weapon around. I would be scared just being around them.

If you decide you like it as a hobby then you can step up to the big time and get a Kimber or H&K

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ORIGINAL: BASB

MR, How does a hammerless gun work, what is it? The other question as Australian I fail to understand why people need to carry a weapon at all? ( by the way this is not a criticism just curious!

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ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

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ORIGINAL: BASB

MR, How does a hammerless gun work, what is it? The other question as Australian I fail to understand why people need to carry a weapon at all? ( by the way this is not a criticism just curious!

A hammerless gun is just what it implies. Without the hammer. It is a revolver that is fired by pulling the trigger alone. Good for women who put them in their purses and people who prefer to carry in pockets, mostly the front, in that the hammer will not get caught on articles of clothing and or purse contents.

As to why? I can only speak for myself in that I would rather protect myself and family with something that is effective. I have owned guns since a small child and have lawfully carried pistols for years. Never have I pulled it and hope and plan that I never will. It's never known by anyone when I choose to carry. In short, you only get to see it once.

mo reb

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ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

On behalf of Europe, I would like to apologise for Terminus' post

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ORIGINAL: Sheytan

The irony of all this is the legacy of gun ownership and a armed citizenry are a direct legacy of the revolution here in America against the British Crown.

Again great discussion.