RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use?

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:12:27 AM

Sheytan

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LOL! Good point about the revolution. I really enjoy shooting though. I love seeing my brothers jaw drop when I knock a target over shooting his SCAR or AR 18 that I didnt battlesight. He cant believe I can shoot that well. Thats probably another factor in my desire to get a longarm now, I am a much better shot then him and frankly I love the competition.

When I worked in Turkey firearms were also very restricted although you could buy fowling arms locally, typically side by side double barrel shotguns. The US airforce did at one time have a rod and gun club in Izmir where I worked but it was shut down after the last military coup. At any rate the Turkish gun laws seem to be comperable to what you have in the UK.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sheytan

The irony of all this is the legacy of gun ownership and a armed citizenry are a direct legacy of the revolution here in America against the British Crown.

Again great discussion.

Perhaps that's the reason we are strict in fire arms laws - maybe they don't want another revolution...last time I heard, the last one didn't go too good

It may well be easier than I imagine to get a firearm in the UK...I have never looked into it. Someone else mentioned it's the culture and I believe that's possibly the case. As I said, I shot an L1A1 SLR in the army and loved it (except for the cleaning!) - loved the smell of cordite, loved seeing those targets go down (especially the moving ones - worryingly!)...but it NEVER occurred to me I would own a weapon outside the forces...and I guess that's because we just don't.

Someone else said about not knowing where a gun shop is. That's absolutely true. I am 43 years old and I have seen 1 gun shop in the UK. Strangely enough, that wasn't in a big city (I hail from Glasgow), but in my sleepy wee town of Colchester. I pass by one every day going to and from my place of work to the town centre for lunch break. I've often thought about going in and having a look about - but you know what - it's always seemed kind of wrong - seedy maybe? - like I shouldn't have one or people will be wondering why I'm going in there...a bit like a some people and sex shops maybe...wanting to go in out of curiosity but bothered by what people will think.

I will pop into that shop one day and ask the guy what's involved and maybe post back here. (I just hope no-one sees me )

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:12:33 AM

Missouri_Rebel

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From: Southern Missouri
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

On behalf of Europe, I would like to apologise for Terminus' post

On behalf of us U.S. cowboys, we accept Terminus' apology. He cannot help himself I know. Some sort of anti-social behavior or something. Shock therapy might just be in order. Or maybe a long stretch in the Military. Or even exiled to Australia. They'd know how to handle him.

Us Americans love the Europeans. We consider them our much better mannered cousins whom we share some common interests.

mo reb

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Post #: 62

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:16:41 AM

JudgeDredd

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So are you allowed in some states (I gather all states have different local rules) to walk about actually carrying a gun? Tucked in a holster under your jacket or in your pocket? Are there any states where it's allowed to be on show?

I understand the world is a dangerous place and in a perfect world we wouldn't need guns (never going to happen) and maybe I've lived a nice sheltered life in my sleepy little Colchester - but I dread the day when Colchester (UK) gets violent enough that it's deemed necessary to carry a weapon for protection.

I understand alot of people have guns as a hobby - and I understand that people carry them for protection because there place of residence isn't as safe as perhaps it should be...and if the criminals are carrying guns, then there is an argument for normal people to do so for protection. Maybe as gun crime and ownership escalates in the UK and deaths by firearm rise (if they do and I hope not) then maybe pressure would be put on government to change the laws...but I hope that isn't in my lifetime or my daughters lifetime

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:20:13 AM

JudgeDredd

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one more thing before I go to work - when your police stop people (in a car) - is it normal practice for them to pull a sidearm immediately? Do they assume everyone is armed or do they have to have reasonable cause to pull their firearm?

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Post #: 64

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:26:41 AM

Missouri_Rebel

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There are federal laws that pertain to firearms and local laws also. The problem is that there are too many gun laws on the books and the average citizen needs to keep up on them. Most states have what is called concealed carry that lets people carry hidden with permit. Others don't require permits. Others also allow what is called open carry and might also allow c&c. And some states don't allow either. Each state has it's own laws and some municipalities have their own laws as well.

For example. In Missouri you can c/carry with permit statewide where state law would trump local laws. You can also open carry in almost all counties yet it is not often done in metropolitan areas. In rural areas, no one would look twice at it. So it all depends which area of the states you are in.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:26:57 AM

Sheytan

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Carried openly here in Arizona if you have a carry permit. Meaning people have them in a holster on their hip.

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Post #: 66

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:28:40 AM

Sheytan

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What pray tell is a Bogan hunter?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Heh Judge good point I live in a out of the way town that has a couple hundred house no sex or gun shop, but nearest provincial town (about 16000 pops) has a sex shop and no gun shop. Plenty of bogan hunters around here, I don't know where they get their supplies from. Also as a youn'em before gun laws got tight down here I own an old Mauser re barrelled or bored to 30.06 kicked like a mule, I grew up and tired of it.

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Post #: 67

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:29:49 AM

Sheytan

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

On behalf of Europe, I would like to apologise for Terminus' post

On behalf of us U.S. cowboys, we accept Terminus' apology. He cannot help himself I know. Some sort of anti-social behavior or something. Shock therapy might just be in order. Or maybe a long stretch in the Military. Or even exiled to Australia. They'd know how to handle him.

Us Americans love the Europeans. We consider them our much better mannered cousins whom we share some common interests.

mo reb

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Post #: 68

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:31:40 AM

Sheytan

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Joined: 11/28/2006
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No they will not draw a firearm, they will place thier hand on thier weapon, ask you to place your hands on the steering wheel, then approach. Its for thier protection.

quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

one more thing before I go to work - when your police stop people (in a car) - is it normal practice for them to pull a sidearm immediately? Do they assume everyone is armed or do they have to have reasonable cause to pull their firearm?

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Post #: 69

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:34:24 AM

Sheytan

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Pretty common to see people here in Arizona to bear weapons openly. I was at the local Golden Corral with my Dad before he passed a few weeks ago and there was a fellow eating dinner there with a sidearm evident. I spoke to him briefly, he is a construction contractor that does work outside city limits and carries the weapon for protection against two and four legged varmits.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel

There are federal laws that pertain to firearms and local laws also. The problem is that there are too many gun laws on the books and the average citizen needs to keep up on them. Most states have what is called concealed carry that lets people carry hidden with permit. Others don't require permits. Others also allow what is called open carry and might also allow c&c. And some states don't allow either. Each state has it's own laws and some municipalities have their own laws as well.

For example. In Missouri you can c/carry with permit statewide where state law would trump local laws. You can also open carry in almost all counties yet it is not often done in metropolitan areas. In rural areas, no one would look twice at it. So it all depends which area of the states you are in.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 8:35:00 AM

Missouri_Rebel

Posts: 3065
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From: Southern Missouri
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

one more thing before I go to work - when your police stop people (in a car) - is it normal practice for them to pull a sidearm immediately? Do they assume everyone is armed or do they have to have reasonable cause to pull their firearm?

They usually have hand on gun but in holster if they are a little apprehensive but it really all depends on the police and the circumstances. The few times I've been pulled over I have made it known immediately that I am armed and usually request that I am able to leave the car and immediately grant permission for the police to have command of the vehicle and its possessions. It is better for everyone that they are at ease. It's really not as it seems as most law abiding citizens with guns do not commit gun crimes and therefore the police do not fear the average citizen.

mo reb

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 9:03:30 AM

Fallschirmjager

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From: Chattanooga, Tennessee
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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

So are you allowed in some states (I gather all states have different local rules) to walk about actually carrying a gun? Tucked in a holster under your jacket or in your pocket? Are there any states where it's allowed to be on show?

I understand the world is a dangerous place and in a perfect world we wouldn't need guns (never going to happen) and maybe I've lived a nice sheltered life in my sleepy little Colchester - but I dread the day when Colchester (UK) gets violent enough that it's deemed necessary to carry a weapon for protection.

I understand alot of people have guns as a hobby - and I understand that people carry them for protection because there place of residence isn't as safe as perhaps it should be...and if the criminals are carrying guns, then there is an argument for normal people to do so for protection. Maybe as gun crime and ownership escalates in the UK and deaths by firearm rise (if they do and I hope not) then maybe pressure would be put on government to change the laws...but I hope that isn't in my lifetime or my daughters lifetime

It does depend on the state or in some cases city. California and New York state have the strictest regulations and New York City is extremely hard to get a gun license and even harder to get a carry permit. Unlicensed firearms in the city is also a very serious crime. It is a very lucrative business to carry unlicensed firearms into NYC and sell them to criminals.
Washington DC is also a very hard city to carry a firearm in.

In California the laws are such that most weapons needs to have special safeties on them that are considered child proof. There is a special category of California approved guns that are sold.

I believe that Illinois is also another no concealed carry state.

There are some places that are off limits no matter where they are. That is schools and government offices and court houses. It is also illegal in places where election stations are.

Placed where alcohol is served by the drink used to be off limits but that has loosened recently.

One little secert that the NRA and gun lobbies don't want people to know is that over the past two decades carry laws have loosened up considerably. Here is a .gif from Wikipedia that demonstrates that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rtc.gif

My brother has a concealed carry permit and carries one pretty much everywhere. Personally I have never wanted to have the responsibility or want to carry one. I do well enough not to lose my phone or iPod ;)
The city I live in also has a manageable crime rate.
When I was in college and we would on the weekends go up to Washington DC...those were scary times at night walking back to the car. And if I have to go to Atlanta on business there are certain places downtown and on the southwest part of the city that are scary at night.

Hope that sheds some more light on the issue for you

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 9:07:44 AM

Fallschirmjager

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

one more thing before I go to work - when your police stop people (in a car) - is it normal practice for them to pull a sidearm immediately? Do they assume everyone is armed or do they have to have reasonable cause to pull their firearm?

They keep them holstered unless they have been told that the suspect is armed and has been violent.
The worst thing you could do during even the most routine of traffic stops, is to get out of your vehicle. That is the most guaranteed way to have them draw their weapon and aim it at you.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 9:59:12 AM

goodwoodrw

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sheytan

What pray tell is a Bogan hunter?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Heh Judge good point I live in a out of the way town that has a couple hundred house no sex or gun shop, but nearest provincial town (about 16000 pops) has a sex shop and no gun shop. Plenty of bogan hunters around here, I don't know where they get their supplies from. Also as a youn'em before gun laws got tight down here I own an old Mauser re barrelled or bored to 30.06 kicked like a mule, I grew up and tired of it.

They aren't the prey there are the hunters that wear check shirts or navy blue singlets swilling bourbon while trying to shoot straight, and generally bugger the bush in their 4WDs EG if you ever saw the the original Crocodile Dundee the hunters in the outback scene where Hogan frightens the crapper out of them.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 10:03:51 AM

JudgeDredd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Missouri_Rebel
...It's really not as it seems as most law abiding citizens with guns do not commit gun crimes and therefore the police do not fear the average citizen.

That's why I was asking.

Presumably in a country where it's your right to carry a weapon, it must make it slightly more difficult to the law enforcers to determine who is an "average" citizen. My guess would be (and possibly depending on the state or municiple even) the law enforcers approach every situation as pulling someone who is NOT your average citizen...

Anyway - thanks for the info. I have to say, I'd feel pretty uneasy walking down a street in Arizona if people are allowed to carry a sidearm on show...purely because I'm not used to seeing them. I even get a little nervous walking through the terminal at the airport because it's common practice for airport police to have automatic weapons!

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 10:41:36 AM

Phatguy

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New York State is one of the, if not the most restrictive states for gun ownership. Typical nanny state that wants/needs to have it's fingers in every cookie jar and find a way to charge you accordingly.The waiting period can be very long(6 months). I had to jump through hoops to get a pistol permit but I can walk into Walmart and browse and buy shotguns and hunting rifles without a permit.....

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 11:50:04 AM

Zakhal

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One of my friends is totally against guns. Then when he was travelling as tourist in portugal group of 4 young men attacked him behind with tire irons. Smacked him all around even the head and his right ear became deaf (has been so for month atleast). The men just wanted his wallet but beated him too with tire irons just for the kicks. They never got caught for the crime. After the incident my friend wanted another talk about guns. This time he wasnt that much against them.

< Message edited by Zakhal -- 12/24/2010 11:53:24 AM >

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 12:58:44 PM

bairdlander2

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Judge when you were in the forces did any instructers ever say "Only the artillary has guns".We would get chastised if we referred to our weapons as "guns"

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 12:59:28 PM

06 Maestro

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From: Nevada, USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Zakhal

One of my friends is totally against guns. Then when he was travelling as tourist in portugal group of 4 young men attacked him behind with tire irons. Smacked him all around even the head and his right ear became deaf (has been so for month atleast). The men just wanted his wallet but beated him too with tire irons just for the kicks. They never got caught for the crime. After the incident my friend wanted another talk about guns. This time he wasnt that much against them.

I hope the cops had some sympathy for your friend-sometimes they are good for that. The police show up well after a crime-the only way to actually be safe is if you insist on taking the appropriate precautions yourself. Even if the cops can catch the criminals they are released back onto their prey again all too soon (instead of hanging them).

About the OP, my primary hunting rifle (for over 20 years) is a Winchester 308 center fire bolt action rifle-a nice traditional piece. I bought my son a 3.06 (Savage)-as someone else mentioned, that thing has a good kick-he want to be a Ranger, so I might as well get him used to a little pain.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 1:26:24 PM

JudgeDredd

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quote:

ORIGINAL: bairdlander

Judge when you were in the forces did any instructers ever say "Only the artillary has guns".We would get chastised if we referred to our weapons as "guns"

I can't recall tbh - I was a REMF so we didn't quite have the same training as infantry

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 2:17:18 PM

hgilmer3

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JudgeDredd

one more thing before I go to work - when your police stop people (in a car) - is it normal practice for them to pull a sidearm immediately? Do they assume everyone is armed or do they have to have reasonable cause to pull their firearm?

Police typically run your plates and know if there is any question about your car. If nothing comes back, they are still cautious and there are certain rules that you have to go by to make them less suspicious of you. You stay in your car. You roll down the window. You keep your hands on the steering wheel. You follow their directions. You tell them if you have a gun in the car. If you are going to get information and documents they asked for, you inform them before hand what you are doing and where you are getting said documents from. the best way to be shot by police is to go for the glove compartment or console without telling them and doing it in a fast manner.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 6:20:27 PM

NefariousKoel

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus
The US is a very immature country. When you're small, you like things that go BANG.

Aren't there some new board members you should be accosting somewhere, Termite?

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/24/2010 7:38:11 PM

Sheytan

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LOL!

quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

quote:

ORIGINAL: Sheytan

What pray tell is a Bogan hunter?

quote:

ORIGINAL: BASB

Heh Judge good point I live in a out of the way town that has a couple hundred house no sex or gun shop, but nearest provincial town (about 16000 pops) has a sex shop and no gun shop. Plenty of bogan hunters around here, I don't know where they get their supplies from. Also as a youn'em before gun laws got tight down here I own an old Mauser re barrelled or bored to 30.06 kicked like a mule, I grew up and tired of it.

They aren't the prey there are the hunters that wear check shirts or navy blue singlets swilling bourbon while trying to shoot straight, and generally bugger the bush in their 4WDs EG if you ever saw the the original Crocodile Dundee the hunters in the outback scene where Hogan frightens the crapper out of them.

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Post #: 83

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/26/2010 6:20:40 AM

D.Ilse

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When I go to the outdoor ranges I normally take along both of my Bolt actions(Iron Sights, no scopes on either one)
1942 K98K
1938 Tula built Mosin Nagant

those are my big plinkers, then for small/cheap shooting I have Marlin .22LR for making holes in cans and rodents.
actaully after a sale at BassPro Shop more than 2years ago, I bought so much buy 1 get one 1/2 off blocks of .22LR I haven't had to buy anymore since...I wish I could say the same with Romanian Mauser and 7.62-R feed for the bolt actions.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/26/2010 4:23:25 PM

Chijohnaok2

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quote:

The US is a very immature country. When you're small, you like things that go BANG.

Seemed to be a fairly civil discussion going on until someone decided to walk in and take a crap in it.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/26/2010 6:01:30 PM

Terminus

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Nya-nya to you.

Coming from somebody with THAT sig banner, that's a bit pot-and-kettle.

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/26/2010 7:27:25 PM

mjk428

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Terminus

Nya-nya to you. Coming from somebody with THAT sig banner, that's a bit pot-and-kettle.

More of that superior maturity on display.

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Post #: 87

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/29/2010 12:15:37 AM

Sheytan

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So today I decided to trade in my P94 for a Glock17 in 9mm. Looking foreward to shooting it. As a aside I am still waiting to hear from the dealer on the AR15 tactical I mentioned previously, hopefully he can give me a good price.

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Post #: 88

RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/29/2010 1:05:56 AM

Jim D Burns

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston
Im curious. As JD said we have have a totally different culture regarding guns in the UK. What exactly do you do with guns like that? I can understand target rifles, and hunting rifles and shotguns, but surely assault rifles belong in the military?

Assault rifles are a blast to shoot, though only semi-auto is allowed for civilians. Having served in the USMC and as a police officer, I�ve fired a lot of weapons in my life and full auto is a lot more fun to shoot than semi, but either way it�s still a fun activity.

Last year about 20-30 friends and family got together for a 4 day camping trip in the Colorado Mountains. The theme of this campout was shooting, sometimes it�s hiking or fishing, but this time it was shooting.

With so many people showing up we had over 30 different firearms present, so there was lots to do if you wanted to try them all out. My personal preference was long range pistol shooting, but that probably stems from my days on the force since I got so good at shooting pistols, but most people preferred shooting the semi-auto weapons and the long range scoped weapons.

I highly recommend you try shooting as a fun pastime if you haven�t tried it before. We had kids aged around 16 up to adults aged in their 40s-50s and everyone had a great time. It can be an expensive hobby if you get into the target shooting side of things, as you�d need to buy ammo a lot. But doing a trip like this every few years is affordable and a fun diversion from normal campouts.

I�d compare the atmosphere of the trip to a fun BBQ, though no drinking was allowed until the days shooting had ended.

Here�s a shot of most of the weapons that were there:

Jim

Attachment (1)

< Message edited by Jim D Burns -- 12/29/2010 1:47:10 AM >

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RE: So what type of LONGARM do you use? - 12/29/2010 1:51:50 AM

Jeffrey H.

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From: San Diego, Ca.
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Hertston

Im curious. As JD said we have have a totally different culture regarding guns in the UK. What exactly do you do with guns like that? I can understand target rifles, and hunting rifles and shotguns, but surely assault rifles belong in the military?

Shoot them ! There is not as much distinction to the terminology as you might think. Military style semi autos are usually fun to shoot and as an added bonus, you can often get ammo very cheaply. I don't have a license for the full autos, you need a federal license for those and most people can't or wont be capable of getting one.

Best of all is that the military style rifles are time tested designs that are as reliable as such things can be.

Bolt action riles with scopes are essentially old military guns. There simply is not a significant difference between a "sniper" rifle and an accurate "hunting" rifle.

Anyway, if you're into shooting as a hobby, you'll find youself drawn to the better weapons for what ever style of shooting you like best.

The state of California has really cracked down on many types of rifles, including simple design features and specific makes. Do I feel safer ? Not really, especially since 20 minutes South of where I live is an open war zone where anything can be bought or sold, a.k.a Mexico. So the laws prevent honest people from possessing and aquiring but won't stop dishonest poeple from getting them in any number of ways.

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History began July 4th, 1776. Anything before that was a mistake.

Ron Swanson

(in reply to Hertston)

Post #: 90