RE: Enemy carriers near SRA!

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All Forums >> [New Releases from Matrix Games] >> War in the Pacific: Admiral's Edition >> After Action Reports >> RE: Enemy carriers near SRA!

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RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 12:04:24 PM

bigbaba

Posts: 1238
Joined: 11/3/2006
From: Koblenz, Germany
Status: offline

your plan seems to pay off. his CAG are in fight for several days and you have fully supplied carriers with well rested naval pilots and fully equiped air groups on them. i dont want to bring bad luck for andy but it looks not good for him when he decides to stay there with his carriers.

i am very intrested ion the outcome of this battle.

(in reply to Tullius)

Post #: 2041

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 12:20:07 PM

Erkki

Posts: 1461
Joined: 2/17/2010
Status: offline

Maybe he has his CVEs in the area as well, taking their turn when the CVs have to retire? Or have they been sighted in PH? I could see it maybe going to work provided he could fly in enough land based groups and repair the freshly captured fields. And quick.

I cant see it going to work for him if he doesn't hold a still hidden ace or two. Banzai!

_____________________________

(in reply to bigbaba)

Post #: 2042

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 6:35:04 PM

inqistor

Posts: 1813
Joined: 5/12/2010
Status: offline

So, there was no fight over control of airspace, or sea? He just came headlong into strong Japan position? But, so far, Japan loses were pretty small, and airforce is at full strength!
It seems you have serious holes in recon net. Few transports to Darwin could sneak, but not whole invasion fleet. I doubt that were fast ships. Better check your search networks.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB
My question is really how well Andy has thought this through.
- Does he have the fuel and supplies and logistics to support a shoe-string operation from Perth?

All transports went directly to Perth, so it probably swimming in goods.

quote:

Northern Oz ports are still not fully operational and there's hardly a single port in a 1000 miles that can replenish carriers and capital ship

I would bet on Darwin. That is why Allies tried to supply it so bad.

quote:

Enemy numbers and brute force may still preveal but Andy has now gathered all his eggs in one basket and started a massive battle of attrition.

Remember, that few days ago you observed movement around Hawaii. But without CVs the only viable target would be Midway. Or maybe it is risky attempt at Kwajalein/Line Islands?
Also in Burma there could be some moves. Lots of planes in action.

quote:

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 9
A6M3a Zero x 13
A6M5 Zero x 9
N1K1 Rex x 7
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 18
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 39
Ki-45 KAIc Nick x 9

You are still using A6M2?

quote:

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-15-II Babs: 1 destroyed on ground

You are still using BABS?!!

quote:

Since Andy did a late PM landing he ownly got a smaller part of hit assault force ashore and they took casualties - meaning they're not 100% prepped, so this is invaison
was not planned 3 months back or more as I see it.

Maybe he did not watch Combat Replay carefully, and thought, that his PANZERFIST just defeated half of Japan army in Northern Australia?

quote:

A number of bombers have also been ordered to attack the invasion fleet..there is a chance that enemy CAP will get them or that the bombers attack the carriers instead.

If CVs stay, where they are now, you can tailor northern, and western attack-planes to exact range into invasion hex. CVs will be 1+ hex farther. How many lvl 4+ airfields in range? How quickly can you shut down airfield from air?

quote:

KB will not be able to arrive at the contested zone before 6-7 days.

But its planes can be in area in 2 days. How many lvl 2+ airfields in range to strike CV fleet? They will probably retreat before KB arrive.

quote:

If Andy doesn't hang around for more than 5-6 more days, what will he have achieved? A stranded garrison on a size 4 AF island base continously bombed from sea and air?

I hope there are few more Divisions enroute. Landing in just ONE place would be very stupid.

quote:

This is were I don't follow the enemy logic; is Andy counting in an early and easy capture of a handfull of bases were he quickly can establish a strong LBA defense and thus drive away the KB? This is a wet AFB dream...

It could work at some isolated location. But it is not Guadalcanal, and this is not 1942. Japan have bases everywhere around, and have already comparable planes.

quote:

I consider Andy's gamble as something that has Market Gardens potential...in both directions.

Attack against last large land obstacle, to strike into heart of weakened enemy?
Even if successful, only Southern Java, and Borneo would be in range of 4Es. Soerabaja is in range of like 20 airfields, and Borneo 5-10. It will be free shooting range. Fuel could be pumped up coast, so no serious challenge for Japan economy.
I would say, it is more, like Dieppe. And probably with same results...

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2043

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 7:08:59 PM

Nomad

Posts: 5905
Joined: 9/5/2001
From: West Yellowstone, Montana
Status: offline

Keep in mind John that Andy can make a lot of 5400 load sized AEs. I am using three of them to support a 3 BB+ bombardment fleet making daily runs from La Foa( port size 1 ) to Koumac. They will also reload CV torpedoes and sorties.

_____________________________

(in reply to inqistor)

Post #: 2044

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 8:30:04 PM

Cribtop

Posts: 3890
Joined: 8/10/2008
From: Lone Star Nation
Status: offline

PzB, IMHO this is a classic Andy Op - full bore commitment of combat elements but shaky on the details and the logistics. His assumption is that you could not yet be ready in the Timor region because he just ejected you from NW Oz. This is shown by his "large garrison" comment re Waingapoe. You are in a position to punish him for this erroneous assumption and IMHO have the plan to pull it off.

Learn from the past, though. Be careful what hexes KB traverses in the crowded archipelago. Review Cuttlefish's unfortunate battle with Q-Ball caused by a single USN PT TF. CT's AAR showed the option of isolating an invasion of this region and turning the enemy force into a prison camp.

_____________________________

(in reply to Nomad)

Post #: 2045

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 8:50:57 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

Thx for the support and input guys, appreciated

Lots of things may go wrong; the side who makes the least will win and I foresee a rough ride.

Inq; Andy planned this as a high speed invasion and included only fast APs and APAs in the invasion force.
If you ask him he'll probably tell you that the slowest ship sailed at 20 knots.

We have dozens of long range search planes but despite having a range of 20-28 hexes they almost never spot anything beyond
15 hexes. So the enemy fleets left the corner of NW Oz ca 20+ hexes away from our nearest search planes, the next turn we spotted them
13 hexes out and in another 2 turns they had arrived and started unloading. Quite impressive really.

A6M2s are still in use because of their long range; they're still among the fighters with the longest legs we have and perform well enough
in that role. The Babs in Burma perform some locating recon flights, why not "expend them" before upgrading to Dinah IIIs.

There are lots of size 2 fields but they don't have air support and what good is 50 dispersed strikes without torpedoes?
Better be patient and not expend our resources recklessly.

That's true Ken but northern Oz ports ain't very safe spot unless all Allied carriers protect it the fleets in the process.
The other question is were Andy should send his damaged and crippled ships...straight to Davy Jones I guess!-)

Did Andy comment about the size of the garrison Cribtop?
He did so in his last mail to me;

Andy McPhie:
>
> Big garriosn for a small island�.

My reply... Welcome to the Tojo line!

I am surprised that Andy would take such a chance without thorough recon of the bases in the region.
What I expected was that he would slowly capture and build the smaller islands north of and around Darwin from which he over time could conduct an island jumping
campaign. My efforts lately have been towards the Malaya - Sumatra region; I feared an invasion of this region cause it was the last non-fortified zone in the Jap perimeter.
As we speak units are taking up positions and digging in there to extend the Tojo Line.

Well, this was a most intersting turn - again!

Lets see what we accomplished and how much iron we sent to Davy Jones today

Our surface strike force launched successful attacks; gawd how I love the Jap heavy cruisers

First the 4 torpedo boats messed up enemy formations and placed a torpedo in an old British battlewagon.
Then the cruiser squadron with its uber aggressive commander arrived.

In one of the longest battles I've ever seen the smaller and more agile Jap ships harassed the Allied battle line that lacked destroyers.
We again hit the damaged battleship with a torpedo, sank the heavy cruiser Hawk and lobbed dozens of shells into most other ships.
- Ofcourse we didn't get away unscatched; the Furutaka and a light cruiser were so badly shot up by heavy shells that they both sank next morning.
The Chikuma got away with light to moderate damage, quite amazing.

In the aftermath of the battle a sub sank the damaged enemy battleship

Our air strikes mostly failed to materialize, so did the Allied strikes; someone's obviously afraid of running smack into our CAP traps.
The only major sized strike with 42 Judys got badly shot up but they did hit a light cruiser with a 500kg bomb and a little bird whispered into my ears that
the enemy had to flood their aft magazines.

I think something went wrong for Andy today; only a very small force continued unloading troops while a larger force was reported heading south.
Is it possible that our aggressive attack convinced a rather carefull admiral to leave?

Well, the result was not good for Andy! The Allied ground troops assaulted and achieved a 1-2 odds

The place is a jungle hex with 5 fort levels; now we're nicely rewarded or all the efforts of digging in for months.
- All forts are in place and valuable time has been lost for the Allies.

In the meanwhile hundreds of Combined Fleet ships are getting closer.
100 specialist ASW Helens and Betties have been placed in their path to scout for subs...poor Akagi's fait is not forgotten Cribtop.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Sep 20, 43

Invasions

Invasion Support action off Waingapoe

19 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Allied Ships
BB Resolution
BB Colorado
CL Concord
CL Raleigh
DD Vendetta
DD Chew
APA Fayette <- high speed assault transport
DD Quadrant

Allied ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

BB Resolution firing at 52nd JNAF AF Unit
BB Colorado firing at 52nd JNAF AF Unit
CL Raleigh firing at 52nd JNAF AF Unit
DD Vendetta firing at 52nd JNAF AF Unit
DD Chew firing at 15th Garrison Unit
DD Chew fired at enemy troops
Defensive Guns fire at approaching troops in landing craft at 1,000 yards
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Invasion Support action off Waingapoe
20 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Allied Ships
APA Fayette
DD Quadrant

Allied ground losses:
11 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 2 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Defensive Guns fire at approaching troops in landing craft at 2,000 yards
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Invasion Support action off Waingapoe
17 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Allied Ships
APA Fayette
DD Quadrant

Allied ground losses:
12 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Defensive Guns fire at approaching troops in landing craft at 1,000 yards
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Invasion Support action off Waingapoe
24 Coastal gun shots fired in defense.

Allied Ships
APA Fayette
DD Vendetta
DD Thracian

Defensive Guns fire at approaching troops in landing craft at 2,000 yards
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Surface Combat

Night Time Surface Combat, near Waingapoe at 63,113, Range 2,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
E Sanae, Shell hits 4, heavy fires
E Karukaya
E Hasu
E Tsuga, Shell hits 5, and is sunk

Allied Ships
BB Pennsylvania, Shell hits 8
BB Warspite
BB Valiant
BB Royal Sovereign, Shell hits 2, Torpedo hits 1
CA Sussex
CA Devonshire
CA Hawkins
CL Birmingham
DD Eaton
DD Renshaw
DD Ringgold

Reduced visibility due to Rain with 64% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Rain and 64% moonlight: 2,000 yards
Range closes to 27,000 yards...
Range closes to 25,000 yards...
Range closes to 23,000 yards...
Range closes to 21,000 yards...
Range closes to 19,000 yards...
Range closes to 17,000 yards...
Range closes to 15,000 yards...
Range closes to 13,000 yards...
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
Range closes to 10,000 yards...
Range closes to 9,000 yards...
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
Range closes to 7,000 yards...
Range closes to 6,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 6,000 yards
Range closes to 5,000 yards...
Range closes to 4,000 yards...
Range closes to 3,000 yards...
Range closes to 2,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 2,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 2,000 yards
BB Royal Sovereign engages E Tsuga at 2,000 yards
E Hasu engages BB Pennsylvania at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Karukaya at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Sanae at 2,000 yards
CA Sussex engages E Sanae at 2,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages E Sanae at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Tsuga at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Hasu at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Karukaya at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Sanae at 2,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages E Tsuga at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
E Tsuga sunk by BB Royal Sovereign at 3,000 yards
Range increases to 5,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Hasu at 5,000 yards
BB Valiant engages E Karukaya at 5,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Sanae at 5,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages E Karukaya at 5,000 yards
CA Devonshire engages E Sanae at 5,000 yards
CA Sussex engages E Karukaya at 5,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages E Karukaya at 5,000 yards
Task forces break off...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Waingapoe at 63,113, Range 6,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
CA Chokai, Shell hits 6, on fire
CA Furutaka, Shell hits 16, heavy fires, heavy damage
CL Abukuma, Shell hits 5, heavy fires
DD Shinonome, Shell hits 1
DD Shirakumo
DD Sagiri, Shell hits 4, heavy fires
DD Yugiri
DD Harukaze
DD Uruyuke

Allied Ships
BB Pennsylvania, Shell hits 7
BB Warspite, Shell hits 2
BB Valiant, Shell hits 7
BB Royal Sovereign, Shell hits 9, Torpedo hits 1, heavy fires, heavy damage
CA Sussex, Shell hits 1
CA Devonshire, Shell hits 1
CA Hawkins, Shell hits 8, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
CL Birmingham, Shell hits 4
DD Eaton, Shell hits 1
DD Renshaw
DD Ringgold, Shell hits 2

Reduced visibility due to Rain with 64% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Rain and 64% moonlight: 6,000 yards
Range closes to 23,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 23,000 yards
Range closes to 17,000 yards...
Range closes to 11,000 yards...
CONTACT: Allies radar detects Japanese task force at 11,000 yards
Range closes to 8,000 yards...
Range closes to 6,000 yards...
CONTACT: Japanese lookouts spot Allied task force at 6,000 yards
CONTACT: Allied lookouts spot Japanese task force at 6,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages BB Valiant at 6,000 yards
BB Royal Sovereign engages CL Abukuma at 6,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages BB Pennsylvania at 6,000 yards
CA Hawkins engages DD Harukaze at 6,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages CA Devonshire at 6,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages DD Sagiri at 6,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages CA Furutaka at 6,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Harukaze at 6,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Renshaw at 6,000 yards
Range closes to 5,000 yards
BB Royal Sovereign engages CA Furutaka at 5,000 yards
CA Chokai engages BB Valiant at 5,000 yards
CA Chokai engages BB Warspite at 5,000 yards
DD Uruyuke engages DD Renshaw at 5,000 yards
CA Hawkins engages CA Chokai at 5,000 yards
CA Sussex engages DD Sagiri at 5,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CL Birmingham at 5,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Harukaze at 5,000 yards
DD Sagiri engages DD Renshaw at 5,000 yards
DD Sagiri engages DD Eaton at 5,000 yards
Range closes to 2,000 yards
BB Royal Sovereign engages CA Furutaka at 2,000 yards
CA Chokai engages CA Hawkins at 2,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CL Birmingham at 2,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages CA Chokai at 2,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Hawkins at 2,000 yards
DD Yugiri engages DD Eaton at 2,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CA Sussex at 2,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CL Birmingham at 2,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Ringgold at 2,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Sagiri at 2,000 yards
DD Eaton engages DD Harukaze at 2,000 yards
Range increases to 3,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages BB Royal Sovereign at 3,000 yards
BB Valiant engages CL Abukuma at 3,000 yards
CA Sussex engages CL Abukuma at 3,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages BB Pennsylvania at 3,000 yards
DD Eaton engages DD Harukaze at 3,000 yards
CA Devonshire engages CA Furutaka at 3,000 yards
DD Eaton engages DD Sagiri at 3,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CL Birmingham at 3,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Yugiri at 3,000 yards
Range increases to 5,000 yards
BB Royal Sovereign engages CA Furutaka at 5,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages BB Valiant at 5,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages BB Warspite at 5,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages BB Pennsylvania at 5,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Eaton at 5,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Devonshire at 5,000 yards
CA Chokai engages CA Sussex at 5,000 yards
CA Chokai engages CL Birmingham at 5,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Eaton at 5,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Sagiri at 5,000 yards
Range increases to 7,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages CA Furutaka at 7,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages BB Valiant at 7,000 yards
CA Hawkins engages CL Abukuma at 7,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Uruyuke at 7,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Ringgold at 7,000 yards
CA Devonshire engages DD Yugiri at 7,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CA Sussex at 7,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages CL Abukuma at 7,000 yards
DD Eaton engages DD Shinonome at 7,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Eaton at 7,000 yards
Range increases to 8,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages CA Furutaka at 8,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages BB Valiant at 8,000 yards
BB Warspite engages CA Furutaka at 8,000 yards
DD Uruyuke engages DD Ringgold at 8,000 yards
CA Hawkins sunk by CL Abukuma at 8,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Yugiri at 8,000 yards
CA Sussex engages CA Furutaka at 8,000 yards
DD Shirakumo engages DD Eaton at 8,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Ringgold at 8,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Eaton at 8,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Sussex at 8,000 yards
BB Valiant engages CL Abukuma at 8,000 yards
BB Warspite engages CL Abukuma at 8,000 yards
DD Uruyuke engages DD Eaton at 8,000 yards
DD Eaton engages DD Harukaze at 8,000 yards
CA Sussex engages CL Abukuma at 8,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CL Birmingham at 8,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Ringgold at 8,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Renshaw at 8,000 yards
Range increases to 10,000 yards
CA Chokai engages BB Royal Sovereign at 10,000 yards
BB Valiant engages CA Furutaka at 10,000 yards
BB Warspite engages CL Abukuma at 10,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages CA Furutaka at 10,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Devonshire at 10,000 yards
CA Sussex engages CL Abukuma at 10,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages CL Abukuma at 10,000 yards
DD Sagiri engages DD Ringgold at 10,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Shinonome at 10,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Sussex at 10,000 yards
BB Valiant engages CA Furutaka at 10,000 yards
BB Warspite engages CL Abukuma at 10,000 yards
CA Chokai engages BB Pennsylvania at 10,000 yards
CA Devonshire engages CL Abukuma at 10,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Yugiri at 10,000 yards
DD Sagiri engages DD Ringgold at 10,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Sagiri at 10,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Renshaw at 10,000 yards
Lee, Willis "Ching" orders Allied TF to disengage
CA Furutaka engages CA Devonshire at 10,000 yards
CA Devonshire engages CA Chokai at 10,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CL Birmingham at 10,000 yards
DD Uruyuke engages DD Eaton at 10,000 yards
CA Sussex engages DD Yugiri at 10,000 yards
CL Birmingham engages CA Furutaka at 10,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Shirakumo at 10,000 yards
DD Yugiri engages DD Renshaw at 10,000 yards
DD Sagiri engages DD Eaton at 10,000 yards
BB Royal Sovereign engages CA Furutaka at 10,000 yards
CA Devonshire engages CA Chokai at 10,000 yards
CL Abukuma engages CA Sussex at 10,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages CA Furutaka at 10,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Renshaw at 10,000 yards
DD Yugiri engages DD Ringgold at 10,000 yards
CA Chokai engages CL Birmingham at 10,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Shirakumo at 10,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Renshaw at 10,000 yards
Range closes to 9,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CL Birmingham at 9,000 yards
BB Valiant engages CA Furutaka at 9,000 yards
BB Warspite engages CA Furutaka at 9,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages CA Chokai at 9,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Devonshire at 9,000 yards
CA Furutaka engages CA Sussex at 9,000 yards
DD Ringgold engages DD Sagiri at 9,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Ringgold at 9,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Shirakumo at 9,000 yards
Range increases to 11,000 yards
CA Sussex engages CL Abukuma at 11,000 yards
BB Pennsylvania engages DD Uruyuke at 11,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Harukaze at 11,000 yards
DD Sagiri engages DD Renshaw at 11,000 yards
DD Shirakumo engages DD Renshaw at 11,000 yards
DD Shinonome engages DD Eaton at 11,000 yards
Range increases to 13,000 yards
CA Sussex engages CA Chokai at 13,000 yards
BB Warspite engages CA Chokai at 13,000 yards
DD Uruyuke engages DD Ringgold at 13,000 yards
DD Harukaze engages DD Eaton at 13,000 yards
DD Renshaw engages DD Sagiri at 13,000 yards
DD Uruyuke engages DD Ringgold at 13,000 yards
DD Eaton engages DD Shinonome at 13,000 yards
Task forces break off...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Endeh at 64,113, Range 2,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
E Karukaya, Shell hits 2, on fire

Allied Ships
BB Pennsylvania
BB Warspite
BB Valiant
CA Sussex
CA Devonshire
CL Birmingham
DD Eaton
DD Renshaw
DD Ringgold

Reduced visibility due to Rain with 53% moonlight
Maximum visibility in Rain and 53% moonlight: 2,000 yards
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Day Time Surface Combat, near Memboro at 63,112, Range 15,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
xAK Tokiwa Maru, Shell hits 8, Torpedo hits 1, and is sunk

Allied Ships
CL Dragon
DD Ammen
DD Thatcher

Reduced visibility due to Rain
Maximum visibility in Rain: 15,000 yards
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Sub Attacks

Submarine attack near Endeh at 65,114
Japanese Ships
SS I-158

Allied Ships
BB Royal Sovereign, Torpedo hits 2, heavy damage

BB Royal Sovereign is sighted by SS I-158
SS I-158 launches 8 torpedoes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submarine attack near Waingapoe at 63,113 <-- Main enemy invasion fleet made up by fast assault ships...heading south!
Japanese Ships
SS RO-100, hits 24, and is sunk

Allied Ships
BB Resolution
BB Colorado
CL Raleigh
KV Commandant Duboc
AM Tumult
APA Fayette
APA Custer
APA Joseph T. Dickman
APA Leonard Wood
LSI(L) Empire Pride
APD Herbert
AKA Aquarius
xAP Rangitiki
xAP Kedah
xAP Athlone Castle
xAP Maui
xAP Santa Elena
xAP Mariposa
xAK Kina II
xAK Clan Macdonald
DD Quadrant
DD Thracian
DD Vendetta
DD Vampire

SS RO-100 is sighted by escort
DD Quadrant fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Thracian attacking submerged sub ....
SS RO-100 forced to surface!
DD Thracian firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Vendetta firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Vampire firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Quadrant firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Thracian firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Vendetta firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Vampire firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Quadrant firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Vendetta firing on surfaced sub ....
DD Vampire firing on surfaced sub ....
Sub slips beneath the waves
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air Combat

Morning Air attack on TF, near Memboro at 63,112
Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 28 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Japanese aircraft
N1K1 Rex x 1
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 3
Ki-45 KAIc Nick x 9

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 3
Martlet II x 1
Martlet IV x 5
F6F-3 Hellcat x 44

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-45 KAIc Nick: 2 destroyed
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Memboro at 63,112
Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid detected at 120 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 31 minutes

Japanese aircraft
D4Y1 Judy x 42
N1K1 Rex x 1
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 2

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 2
Martlet II x 1
Martlet IV x 5
F6F-3 Hellcat x 40

Japanese aircraft losses
D4Y1 Judy: 12 destroyed, 4 damaged

Allied Ships
CL Dragon, Bomb hits 1, on fire
DD Ammen
DD Thatcher

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x D4Y1 Judy releasing from 3000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 500 kg SAP Bomb
6 x D4Y1 Judy releasing from 1000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 500 kg SAP Bomb
9 x D4Y1 Judy releasing from 2000'
Naval Attack: 1 x 500 kg SAP Bomb
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Kimura Det , at 63,112 (Memboro)
Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid spotted at 13 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 2
Ki-45 KAIc Nick x 2

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 9
Martlet II x 1
Martlet IV x 18
F6F-3 Hellcat x 33
TBF-1 Avenger x 8

No Japanese losses
No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x TBF-1 Avenger bombing from 7000 feet
Ground Attack: 2 x 500 lb GP Bomb
6 x F6F-3 Hellcat sweeping at 18000 feet
12 x Martlet IV sweeping at 13000 feet
7 x Sea Hurricane Ib sweeping at 13000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Mandalay , at 59,46
Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIc Trop x 4
P-47D2 Thunderbolt x 3

No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
3 x P-47D2 Thunderbolt sweeping at 14000 feet
2 x Hurricane IIc Trop sweeping at 14000 feet *
2 x Hurricane IIc Trop sweeping at 14000 feet *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on 15th Garrison Unit , at 63,113 (Waingapoe)
Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 23 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 1
A6M5 Zero x 4
N1K1 Rex x 1
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 6
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 15

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 9
Martlet IV x 30
F6F-3 Hellcat x 34

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed
N1K1 Rex: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 4 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F6F-3 Hellcat: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x Martlet IV sweeping at 13000 feet
13 x Martlet IV sweeping at 13000 feet
7 x Sea Hurricane Ib sweeping at 13000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on 1st Recon Regiment, at 63,113 (Waingapoe)
Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 41 NM, estimated altitude 21,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 17 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 5
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 5

Allied aircraft
F6F-3 Hellcat x 84

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
7 x F6F-3 Hellcat sweeping at 18000 feet
6 x F6F-3 Hellcat sweeping at 18000 feet
4 x F6F-3 Hellcat sweeping at 18000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on 15th Garrison Unit , at 63,113 (Waingapoe)
Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 43 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 18 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 2

Allied aircraft
F6F-3 Hellcat x 61

No Japanese losses
No Allied losses

Aircraft Attacking:
8 x F6F-3 Hellcat sweeping at 13000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Afternoon Air attack on 15th Garrison Unit , at 63,113 (Waingapoe)
Weather in hex: Heavy rain

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 19 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 1

Allied aircraft
F6F-3 Hellcat x 50
TBF-1 Avenger x 31

No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
TBF-1 Avenger: 1 damaged

Also attacking 1st Recon Regiment ...
Also attacking 52nd JNAF AF Unit ...
Also attacking 15th Garrison Unit ...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground Combat

Ground combat at Waingapoe (63,113)
Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 4057 troops, 20 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 194
Defending force 15899 troops, 305 guns, 186 vehicles, Assault Value = 900

Japanese ground losses:
5 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
1st Recon Regiment
15th Garrison Unit
52nd JNAF AF Unit

Defending units:
73rd Motorised Brigade
7th Infantry Div /2
7th Australian Div /3
33rd Infantry Div /2
36th Aviation Base Force
XIV US Corps
872/873rd Engineer Aviation Battalion
3rd USN Naval Construction Regiment
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at 65,128
Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 3401 troops, 16 guns, 347 vehicles, Assault Value = 225
Defending force 257 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 12

Allied adjusted assault: 50

Japanese adjusted defense: 1
Allied assault odds: 50 to 1

Combat modifiers
Defender:
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(-), supply(-)

Japanese ground losses:
354 casualties reported
Squads: 17 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 11 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Units destroyed 1

Allied ground losses:
78 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 10 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 13 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
4th Armoured Brigade

Defending units:
4th Indpt SNLF Coy
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Waingapoe (63,113)
Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 11442 troops, 305 guns, 75 vehicles, Assault Value = 900
Defending force 5817 troops, 34 guns, 34 vehicles, Assault Value = 194

Allied adjusted assault: 476
Japanese adjusted defense: 580

Allied assault odds: 1 to 2 (fort level 5)

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), fatigue(-)
experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+)

Japanese ground losses:
386 casualties reported
Squads: 2 destroyed, 40 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 20 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Allied ground losses:
297 casualties reported
Squads: 1 destroyed, 40 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 8 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled

Assaulting units:
7th Australian Div /3
73rd Motorised Brigade
7th Infantry Div /2
33rd Infantry Div /2
36th Aviation Base Force
XIV US Corps
872/873rd Engineer Aviation Battalion
3rd USN Naval Construction Regiment

Defending units:
1st Recon Regiment
15th Garrison Unit
52nd JNAF AF Unit
-------------------------------------------------------------------

Hitting were it hurts

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to Nomad)

Post #: 2046

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 9:12:23 PM

Hortlund

Posts: 2884
Joined: 10/13/2000
Status: offline

The difference is that he can take those losses while you cannot. Same if you decide to throw the KB into the battle. Caution and setting up a functioning second line of defence is far wiser than throwing everything into the fray. He is in the SRA now, and I doubt you have a realistic chance to dislodge him.

_____________________________

The era of procrastination, of half-measures, of soothing and baffling expedients, of delays, is coming to a close.
In its place we are entering a period of consequences..

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2047

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 9:53:24 PM

Cribtop

Posts: 3890
Joined: 8/10/2008
From: Lone Star Nation
Status: offline

PzB,

I was referring to your recent post where you commented that Andy e-mailed you he thought the Waingapoe garrison was surprisingly heavy. This to me is evidence that his (inaccurate) strategic assessment behind the Op is "since I just evicted the Japs from NW Oz they can't be prepared for an invasion near Timor yet."

_____________________________

(in reply to Hortlund)

Post #: 2048

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 10:33:07 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

Ok, your comment was just so surprisingly similar to Andy's Cribtop

PzJaeger; Few Jap losses can be replaced but it is still important to inflict high casualties on the Allies at a favorable ratio in 43 than at a poor ratio in 44-45.
Waingapo is the new Zamboanga the Emperor has foreseen

As some may remember Zamboanga actually fell a long time ago only to be recaptured in a counterstrike.
Today the full sized Allied shock attack had no problems achieving a 12-1 odds thus capturing Waingapo.
- This means we only have a few turns to chase away the Allied carriers and start suppressing the place.

The good news is that our fighters were thick in it today and in heavy air battles 120 ac on both sides were reported lost.
No less than 60 Hellcats and 20 Martlets among them!

- I can hardly believe that the Allied carrier force still is a match for the KB when it arrives.

Let's see if Andy is keen on sticking around or whether he will leave the place...not sure he can if he wants to keep the place he just took.
In total I'm now moving 5 divisions to land at the northern tip of Waingapo.
-Our paras also recaptured one of the bases captured by enemy paras today.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Sep 21, 43

Sub - ASW Attacks

Several close calls but Andy was lucky today.
Not so with his subs; ran straight into a newly laid minefield in the straith SSE of Soerabaja...bye bye.

Sub attack near Endeh at 64,113
Japanese Ships
SS RO-102

Allied Ships
CL Dragon

CL Dragon is sighted by SS RO-102
SS RO-102 launches 4 torpedoes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 51 encounters mine field at Banjoewangi (57,107)

Allied Ships
SS Grouper, Mine hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TF 229 encounters mine field at Banjoewangi (57,107)

Allied Ships
SS Sawfish, Mine hits 1, heavy damage
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Submarine attack near Sawoe-eilanden at 64,115

Japanese Ships
SS I-19

Allied Ships
CL Dragon

CL Dragon is sighted by SS I-19
SS I-19 launches 6 torpedoes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Endeh at 64,113

Japanese Ships
SS RO-102

Allied Ships
CVL Hermes
CA Northampton
CL Montpelier
CLAA Reno
DD Anthony
DD Taylor
DD Strong
DD Radford
DD Philip

SS RO-102 launches 4 torpedoes at CVL Hermes
RO-102 diving deep ....
DD Taylor fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Strong fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Radford attacking submerged sub ....
DD Philip fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Taylor fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Strong fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Radford fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Radford fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Radford fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Radford fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Radford fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Radford fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Surface Combat

Night Time Surface Combat, near Lomblen at 68,113, Range 2,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
E Natsushima
E Nasami, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
xAP Rochambeau, Shell hits 16, on fire

Allied ground losses:
Vehicles lost 5 (3 destroyed, 2 disabled
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Lomblen at 68,113, Range 1,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
E Natsushima, Shell hits 9, and is sunk
E Nasami, Shell hits 13, and is sunk

Allied Ships
DD Ammen
DD Thatcher
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Night Time Surface Combat, near Lomblen at 68,113, Range 5,000 Yards

Japanese Ships
DD Uruyuke, Shell hits 1

Allied Ships
DD Ammen
DD Thatcher, Shell hits 1
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Air Combat

Morning Air attack on Waingapoe , at 63,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 37 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 15 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 30
A6M3a Zero x 10
A6M5 Zero x 15
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 13
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 38
Ki-45 KAIc Nick x 6

Allied aircraft
F6F-3 Hellcat x 57

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
A6M3a Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 1 destroyed
Ki-45 KAIc Nick: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F6F-3 Hellcat: 16 destroyed
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Endeh at 64,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 33 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 37
A6M5 Zero x 6
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 12
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 27

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 13
Martlet II x 20
Martlet IV x 40
F6F-3 Hellcat x 200

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 3 destroyed
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 3 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Martlet IV: 3 destroyed
F6F-3 Hellcat: 13 destroyed, 1 damaged

Aircraft Attacking:
9 x Ki-44-IIb Tojo sweeping at 30000 feet
1 x Ki-44-IIb Tojo sweeping at 10000 feet
4 x Ki-44-IIa Tojo sweeping at 15000 feet
3 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 30000 feet
9 x A6M2 Zero sweeping at 30000 feet
3 x A6M5 Zero sweeping at 30000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Endeh at 64,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 11 NM, estimated altitude 20,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Japanese aircraft
Ki-45 KAIa Nick x 25

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 12
Martlet II x 16
Martlet IV x 20
F6F-3 Hellcat x 151

Japanese aircraft losses
Ki-45 KAIa Nick: 7 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F6F-3 Hellcat: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
1 x Ki-45 KAIa Nick sweeping at 15000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Endeh at 64,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 22 NM, estimated altitude 18,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M5 Zero x 32
Ki-45 KAIb Nick x 6

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 10
Martlet II x 13
Martlet IV x 17
F6F-3 Hellcat x 132

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M5 Zero: 5 destroyed
Ki-45 KAIb Nick: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Martlet II: 1 destroyed
F6F-3 Hellcat: 1 destroyed

Aircraft Attacking:
13 x A6M5 Zero sweeping at 15000 feet
2 x Ki-45 KAIb Nick sweeping at 15000 feet
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Endeh at 64,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 200 NM, estimated altitude 19,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 52 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 24
A6M5 Zero x 25
D4Y1 Judy x 25

Allied aircraft
Sea Hurricane Ib x 9
Martlet II x 9
Martlet IV x 13
F6F-3 Hellcat x 113

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed
D4Y1 Judy: 4 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F6F-3 Hellcat: 3 destroyed
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 52nd JNAF AF Unit , at 63,113 (Waingapoe)
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 14 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 23
A6M3a Zero x 6
A6M5 Zero x 16
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 10
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 32
Ki-45 KAIc Nick x 2

Allied aircraft
Albacore I x 14
Sea Hurricane Ib x 5
Martlet II x 8
Martlet IV x 10
F6F-3 Hellcat x 55
SB2C-1C Helldiver x 141
SBD-3 Dauntless x 36
SBD-5 Dauntless x 58
TBF-1 Avenger x 159

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
A6M3a Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 4 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
Albacore I: 1 destroyed
Sea Hurricane Ib: 1 destroyed
Martlet II: 1 destroyed
Martlet IV: 1 destroyed
F6F-3 Hellcat: 5 destroyed
SB2C-1C Helldiver: 4 destroyed, 9 damaged
SBD-3 Dauntless: 1 destroyed
SBD-5 Dauntless: 2 destroyed, 2 damaged
TBF-1 Avenger: 3 destroyed, 4 damaged

Japanese ground losses:
33 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 11 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Waingapoe , at 63,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 16,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 17 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 11
A6M3a Zero x 2
A6M5 Zero x 9
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 2
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 18
Ki-45 KAIc Nick x 1

Allied aircraft
F6F-3 Hellcat x 56
TBF-1 Avenger x 45

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
A6M3a Zero: 1 destroyed
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
TBF-1 Avenger: 1 destroyed, 16 damaged
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 11th Garrison Unit , at 63,112 (Memboro)
Weather in hex: Partial cloud

Raid spotted at 31 NM, estimated altitude 10,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Allied aircraft
F6F-3 Hellcat x 8
SBD-5 Dauntless x 27

No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
9 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Waingapoe , at 63,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 11,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 4
A6M3a Zero x 1
A6M5 Zero x 5
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 1
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 9

Allied aircraft
B-17E Fortress x 3
B-24D Liberator x 9
B-24D1 Liberator x 18
F6F-3 Hellcat x 7
PB4Y-1 Liberator x 6

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 1 destroyed
Ki-44-IIb Tojo: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
F6F-3 Hellcat: 1 destroyed

Airbase hits 4
Airbase supply hits 1
Runway hits 91
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Waingapoe , at 63,113
Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 40 NM, estimated altitude 12,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 13 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 1
A6M3a Zero x 1
A6M5 Zero x 4
Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 1
Ki-44-IIb Tojo x 5

Allied aircraft
B-24D Liberator x 3
B-24D1 Liberator x 6
F6F-3 Hellcat x 6

Japanese aircraft losses
A6M3a Zero: 1 destroyed
A6M5 Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
B-24D1 Liberator: 1 damaged
F6F-3 Hellcat: 1 destroyed

Airbase hits 1
Runway hits 13
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ground Combat

Ground combat at Waingapoe (63,113)
Japanese Bombardment attack

Attacking force 3880 troops, 20 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 166
Defending force 18793 troops, 406 guns, 219 vehicles, Assault Value = 1063

Japanese ground losses:
5 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 1 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled

Assaulting units:
1st Recon Regiment
15th Garrison Unit
52nd JNAF AF Unit

Defending units:
7th Australian Division
33rd Infantry Division
73rd Motorised Brigade
7th Infantry Division
36th Aviation Base Force
872/873rd Engineer Aviation Battalion
XIV US Corps
3rd USN Naval Construction Regiment
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Waingapoe (63,113)
Allied Shock attack

Attacking force 14160 troops, 406 guns, 104 vehicles, Assault Value = 1063
Defending force 5445 troops, 34 guns, 35 vehicles, Assault Value = 166

Allied adjusted assault: 1627
Japanese adjusted defense: 130

Allied assault odds: 12 to 1 (fort level 5)
Allied forces CAPTURE Waingapoe !!!

Japanese aircraft
no flights

Japanese aircraft losses
No Japanese losses

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), forts(+), leaders(+), disruption(-), morale(-)
experience(-)
Attacker: shock(+), fatigue(-)

Japanese ground losses:
953 casualties reported
Squads: 92 destroyed, 10 disabled
Non Combat: 78 destroyed, 22 disabled
Engineers: 11 destroyed, 0 disabled
Guns lost 4 (4 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Vehicles lost 44 (44 destroyed, 0 disabled)
Units retreated 3

Allied ground losses:
644 casualties reported
Squads: 13 destroyed, 68 disabled
Non Combat: 1 destroyed, 8 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled

Assaulting units:
7th Australian Division
33rd Infantry Division
73rd Motorised Brigade
7th Infantry Division
36th Aviation Base Force
872/873rd Engineer Aviation Battalion
XIV US Corps
3rd USN Naval Construction Regiment

Defending units:
1st Recon Regiment
15th Garrison Unit
52nd JNAF AF Unit
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ground combat at Pantar (69,114)
Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 274 troops, 1 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 20
Defending force 30 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1

Japanese adjusted assault: 18
Allied adjusted defense: 1

Japanese assault odds: 18 to 1 (fort level 0)
Japanese forces CAPTURE Pantar !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), op mode(-), leaders(+), preparation(-)
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(-)

Allied ground losses:
33 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Non Combat: 3 destroyed, 0 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled
Units destroyed 1

Assaulting units:
4th Raiding Rgt /4

Defending units:
2/6 Cavalry Cdo Bn /2
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Waingapo Falls

Attachment (1)

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to Cribtop)

Post #: 2049

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 10:45:52 PM

bigbaba

Posts: 1238
Joined: 11/3/2006
From: Koblenz, Germany
Status: offline

although you lost Waingapoe everything speaks for a japanese victory.

if andy sails away with his carriers, his troops and remaining ships are toast in few turns.

and if he decides to stay and fight you can sink a good number of his carriers.

whatever andy decides to do, it smells like a victory for you. a great victory if you destroy some carriers and a medium size victory if you can destroy some of his combat troops and transport ships.

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2050

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 10:49:16 PM

Nomad

Posts: 5905
Joined: 9/5/2001
From: West Yellowstone, Montana
Status: offline

Just another caution, the USN should have 6 or more replenishment CVEs by now. That will be 6 x 28 = 168 replenishment fighters and 168 SBD/TBFs available to him if he has them behind the main CV TFs in range.

Just think of me as the little voice trying to keep everyone from getting victory disease.

< Message edited by Nomad -- 2/14/2011 10:54:17 PM >

_____________________________

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2051

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/14/2011 10:54:46 PM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
Status: offline

I'm 95% certain that Andy's fleet will leave Waingapu next turn...anything else would surprise me.
But that still doesn't answer the question; "What does Andy want with Waingapu alone?"

I haven't spotted US CVEs yet Ken, no Wildcats on CAP and no ships spotted by recon nearby.
Another question is how many replacement Hellcats that are available to Allies in 09/43.

Together with our LBA I'm more than confident about our chances if there is a carrier fight.
Heck, no we can even sweep Waingapu

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

(in reply to Nomad)

Post #: 2052

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 7:51:48 AM

castor troy

Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB

I'm 95% certain that Andy's fleet will leave Waingapu next turn...anything else would surprise me.
But that still doesn't answer the question; "What does Andy want with Waingapu alone?"�

I haven't spotted US CVEs yet Ken, no Wildcats on CAP and no ships spotted by recon nearby.
Another question is how many replacement Hellcats that are available to Allies in 09/43.

Together with our LBA I'm more than confident about our chances if there is a carrier fight.
Heck, no we can even sweep Waingapu �

the only major flaw of Andy�s op I notice is the fact that he has chosen Waingapo which can only be built up to level 8 airfield. He should have gone for one of the bases that can be built up to level 9 and the Japanese would be toast. A couple of hundred thousand supplies, av and nav support, lots of engis and flak and the Japanese can exactly do nothing about it but seeing the base growing and suddenly turn into a level 9 that is going to dominate the whole area. Landing at Waingapo also got the small disadvantage of having another connected base on the island so you�ve got to defend two bases. For such an operation I would have gone with one base as main target (potential level 9 af) with another optional target (also potential level 9 af). With a dozen divs plus support there is nothing that can really hold and there�s also nothing that could take it back, not even if you would take the primary and secondary target. And moving the carriers in for supply runs every third month wouldn�t be a problem.

< Message edited by castor troy -- 2/15/2011 7:52:58 AM >

_____________________________

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2053

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 8:36:07 AM

Hortlund

Posts: 2884
Joined: 10/13/2000
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: bigbaba

although you lost Waingapoe everything speaks for a japanese victory.

I disagree, there is nothing that speaks for a japanese victory here, except blind luck. The allies are ashore now, within LBA range from Australia. 4Es can attrit any Jap CAP at any base in the vincinity of the fighting, and replacements can be flown in. The massive logistic superiority of the allies can now be brought to bear on the battlefield.

Throwing the KB into the battle here will only put the only remaining strategic asset Japan has at risk, while battling an enemy force that can absorb any loss.

I honestly do not understand the "victory disease" displayed by some posters in this thread. This battle is lost, the transports reached shore. Like Rommel said, the only way to win a defensive battle against an allied invasion is to prevent them from leaving the beaches. That has failed, and now the question is how to contain this invasion, not how to re-capture the base.

Sure, PzB can throw 2, 4 or 6 divisions at this base, but that wont work, he will just be throwing them into a prison camp, like the Jap reinforcements at Guadalcanal. He cannot lift that entire force at once in good enough amphibs, that means his forces will land heavily disrupted against over 1000 well supplied AVs in JR-terrain. Inside allied LBA-range no less!

The only thing that can change this equation is if the KB arrives and sinks the entire allied fleet. That is hardly something to base a defensive strategy on, and that is merely wishful thinking in late 43.

_____________________________

The era of procrastination, of half-measures, of soothing and baffling expedients, of delays, is coming to a close.
In its place we are entering a period of consequences..

(in reply to bigbaba)

Post #: 2054

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 9:02:31 AM

veji1

Posts: 1019
Joined: 7/9/2005
Status: offline

Agreed, for me this will now all be about slowing them down.. Which is very hard to do in the area once they get 3/4 bases running...

_____________________________

Adieu � Dieu odieux... sign� Adam

(in reply to Hortlund)

Post #: 2055

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 9:06:26 AM

castor troy

Posts: 14330
Joined: 8/23/2004
From: Austria
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund

quote:

ORIGINAL: bigbaba

although you lost Waingapoe everything speaks for a japanese victory.

I disagree, there is nothing that speaks for a japanese victory here, except blind luck. The allies are ashore now, within LBA range from Australia. 4Es can attrit any Jap CAP at any base in the vincinity of the fighting, and replacements can be flown in. The massive logistic superiority of the allies can now be brought to bear on the battlefield.

Throwing the KB into the battle here will only put the only remaining strategic asset Japan has at risk, while battling an enemy force that can absorb any loss.

I honestly do not understand the "victory disease" displayed by some posters in this thread. This battle is lost, the transports reached shore. Like Rommel said, the only way to win a defensive battle against an allied invasion is to prevent them from leaving the beaches. That has failed, and now the question is how to contain this invasion, not how to re-capture the base.

Sure, PzB can throw 2, 4 or 6 divisions at this base, but that wont work, he will just be throwing them into a prison camp, like the Jap reinforcements at Guadalcanal. He cannot lift that entire force at once in good enough amphibs, that means his forces will land heavily disrupted against over 1000 well supplied AVs in JR-terrain. Inside allied LBA-range no less!

The only thing that can change this equation is if the KB arrives and sinks the entire allied fleet. That is hardly something to base a defensive strategy on, and that is merely wishful thinking in late 43.

From what I�ve been experiencing in my PBEM I can only totally agree with PzjH post. The biggest hope now can only be one or many big Andy booh boohs he tends to make now and then.

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Post #: 2056

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 9:16:49 AM

janh

Posts: 1216
Joined: 6/12/2007
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB
I can hardly believe that the Allied carrier force still is a match for the KB when it arrives.

Mind Yamamoto before Midway...

Indeed the CVE come to mind... If he is not planning a simultaneous strike with them covering elsewhere in CentPac, which can be doubted as 6 CVE against LBA would be a tight match in the Line Islands, those thingies are surely carrying Hellcats and stuff.

I tend to think now that the US Fleet is going to stick around a few turns longer... Maybe Andy had more in mind than just those three islands, but his surprise didn't work out -- or this operation was really thrown together in a rush. Might be along the lines of the last Line Islands incursion. Clearly I cannot see that Andy made this a center of gravity. For example all the 4E in Burma might be indeed much more important here to suppress the LBA fields around, rather than bombing trees and trenches if not followed up by a major offensive as well.

The Japanese can surely retake Wai* (respect to the guy that typed up all the base names for this map... must have been a nightmare!), though time will be critical. The base will be fortified quickly, so I would almost advocate a direct landing by all 5 division you can scap together. That is if they can be landed without terrible losses, and if you can get all necessary transport together for them to land in 1 wave.
I am not sure whether you could successfully isolate the base without another successful CV clash. Andy will be back in 7 days with supply and reinforcement convoys, and taking that time to march your 5 divisions over land might be too slow. In a week you might be starring at strong forts...

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2057

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 9:36:15 AM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
Joined: 10/3/2000
From: No(r)way
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Your lack of faith is disturbing!

We in the Imperial High Command have great plans though: The battle has merely started!

The SRA and Europe are 2 different theaters and we're not yet in 44.
Remember Anzio; Allies almost had to learn to swim. The only Allied air supremacy in SRA comes with their carriers, when they're gone a single Allied base + LBA from Oz isn't enough.

I do know the Allies have lots of resources but as of yet we have almost as many ships in theater, more troops, more ac, more bases and more supplies.

A few comments:
1. LBA From Australia is still limited to 2 bases: Port Hedland, size 6 and Darwin, size 7 - not convinced supply levels are topped up either.
2. I don't need to amph land on Waingapoe, it's possible to land on the northern shore base which we still own.
- It takes a week to march a LCU from one base to another...without interdiction.

My initial feeling was that this Allied invasion here is premature; in 3-4 months this would have been a settled case.

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
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Post #: 2058

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 11:12:55 AM

janh

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Probably you are right. A week's march is hopefully quick enough not to face huge fortifications. It is definitely the time to stand and fight, the loss-gain ratio will not become better with time. So banzai for the next week...

The Imperial High Command should send a few ISD over... Reminds me that I wanted to dig out good old "Rebellion" again. Too bad nobody ever made a good sequel for that. I always hoped that someone would perhaps combine that with X-Wing Alliance. Would have had great potential.

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2059

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 11:43:59 AM

castor troy

Posts: 14330
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From: Austria
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Andy not taking the Northern base also would be what I called one of "Andy�s booh boohs". If he does, any Japanese landing on the island has to be postponed for months as you can not land without preparation at an enemy base, no matter if there are 10 soldiers or 100,000.

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Post #: 2060

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 11:53:19 AM

PzB74

Posts: 5076
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From: No(r)way
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All these are valid concerns and with the arrival of KB I also plan to land the first division on the northern tip of the island.
Currently there are 250AV there and I'm constantly try to pour in more men. This should provide the time we need..but the shortline is that Andy needs to keep his CVs around to prevent us from deadlocking the island and pounding it into rubble.

No forts will be built as long as battle damage has to be repaired first and that's going to be constant

Within 10 days I also plan to trebble aviation support in the area and Soerabaja is a size 9 AF with Makassar 7 and building towards 8 and 9.

So nothing is decided yet; the battle still hangs in the balance - the old truth about base posession being meaningless without also having sea and air supremacy still holds water.
My entire belief in victory is based on the simple fact that I think Jap LBA and naval assets in this local region are stronger than what the Allies can field.

_____________________________

"The problem in defense is how far you can go without destroying from within what you are trying to defend from without"
- Dwight D. Eisenhower

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Post #: 2061

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 12:24:59 PM

bigbaba

Posts: 1238
Joined: 11/3/2006
From: Koblenz, Germany
Status: offline

more confidence in PzB abilities guys.:)

if i could make a bet it would be in favour of our admiral from norway. why?

-LBA from australia is very limited. andy lost a good number of his heavies in useless raids before. also, he lost a huge number of transports supplying N australia to the cruisers and destroyers of PzB. i doubt that he can keep the 2 bases in NA supplied for great ais operations from there.

-1 isolated allied base in the range of several japanese airfields. PzB can keep the base closed via bombers or bombard TFs under air cover. sure th� allied seabees can repair at a fast speed but it will eat andys supplies away very quickly.

time will tell what will happen but PzB has a good chance here.

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Post #: 2062

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 12:37:07 PM

Hortlund

Posts: 2884
Joined: 10/13/2000
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB
So nothing is decided yet; the battle still hangs in the balance - the old truth about base posession being meaningless without also having sea and air supremacy still holds water.

Id say this battle hangs in the balance about as much as Utah Beach did on June 7th 1944. You have lost that base, but you dont have to turn it into Guadalcanal. If you take a step back you will realize that you are building this entire strategy on the hope that the KB will arrive and sink the enemy CVs, if that happens, then you can do x, y and z. Sure that might happen, but to use poker terms here, the only card left is the river and you are going all in on the hope of hitting that inside straight. Sure it might happen, but the odds are massively stacked against you.

quote:

My entire belief in victory is based on the simple fact that I think Jap LBA and naval assets in this local region are stronger than what the Allies can field.

That is something I do not understand, its late 43, not early 42. But I can see that you have made up your mind about this, so I'll stop pestering you with my comments. Should make for an interesting showdown for us on the sidelines though

< Message edited by Panzerjaeger Hortlund -- 2/15/2011 12:39:14 PM >

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The era of procrastination, of half-measures, of soothing and baffling expedients, of delays, is coming to a close.
In its place we are entering a period of consequences..

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Post #: 2063

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 4:43:04 PM

witpqs

Posts: 26087
Joined: 10/4/2004
From: Argleton
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund

... its late 43, not early 42.

Exactly. Allied divisions at this point are worth much more than IJ divisions. Go into Tracker and look at the anti-soft and anti-hard values of the squads.

(in reply to Hortlund)

Post #: 2064

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 6:43:56 PM

PresterJohn001

Posts: 382
Joined: 8/11/2009
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A single base that requires the allied navy to support it and outside effective air support range. I think theres a decent chance of pushing the allies back. A second or third base and the long road begins. The conditions are about as favourable as the Japanese are going to get at this stage of the war. Isolate, stop allied reinforcements and pound the allies from the air. Sure the Japanese divs are not as good as the allies, but the allies got to have supplies, and the Japanese have numbers. Looks like a carrier battle in the making, except the Japanese get land based air into the bargain as well.

good luck and if goes pear shaped this is not legal advice so don't sue.

< Message edited by PresterJohn -- 2/15/2011 7:03:34 PM >

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Post #: 2065

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 6:45:55 PM

inqistor

Posts: 1813
Joined: 5/12/2010
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: PzB
Your lack of faith is disturbing!

Well, I think all those "unfaithful" are actually playing Allied side currently

quote:

In one of the longest battles I've ever seen the smaller and more agile Jap ships harassed the Allied battle line that lacked destroyers.

BBs seems to fare poorly at night. Next time get maximum number of ships, and lotsa torpedo tubes.

quote:

I can hardly believe that the Allied carrier force still is a match for the KB when it arrives.

with those number of attack planes it will be win-for-first-strike. So you better wait, until you decimate his attack planes.

quote:

Ground combat at Pantar (69,114)
Japanese Shock attack

Attacking force 274 troops, 1 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 20
Defending force 30 troops, 0 guns, 0 vehicles, Assault Value = 1

Japanese adjusted assault: 18
Allied adjusted defense: 1

Japanese assault odds: 18 to 1 (fort level 0)
Japanese forces CAPTURE Pantar !!!

Combat modifiers
Defender: terrain(+), op mode(-), leaders(+), preparation(-)
Attacker: shock(+), leaders(-)

OK, what is this? Are they in strategic mode? Is it even possible to drop paras not in Combat Mode?

quote:

But that still doesn't answer the question; "What does Andy want with Waingapu alone?"

Obviously, he want to get other side of island by land. There is also possible, that in few days, invasion fleet quickly return to assault other base.

quote:

Another question is how many replacement Hellcats that are available to Allies in 09/43.

You wish. They are available from 4/43, at 130 per month.

quote:

LBA From Australia is still limited to 2 bases: Port Hedland, size 6 and Darwin, size 7 - not convinced supply levels are topped up either.

And Yamato can pay them "visit" any moment

How many radar sets have you got at nearby islands? Are this lvl0 base in range of Allied CVs leaky CAP? If so, it would be interesting to sweep there

quote:

ORIGINAL: castor troy
A couple of hundred thousand supplies, av and nav support, lots of engis and flak and the Japanese can exactly do nothing about it but seeing the base growing and suddenly turn into a level 9 that is going to dominate the whole area.

Tell me, how exactly are you going to keep ONE airfield open (not even mentioning upgrading it), with 5-10 large Japan airfields in range, and bombarding from sea, and air at will?

quote:

ORIGINAL: Nomad
Just think of me as the little voice trying to keep everyone from getting victory disease.

What victory exactly? So far there was only some air battles. Indecisive mostly. Landing was overkill, so it went, as it should with those numbers.

quote:

ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund
I disagree, there is nothing that speaks for a japanese victory here, except blind luck. The allies are ashore now, within LBA range from Australia.

Oh? What Allied fighter types can reach this base from Australia coast? You seriously expect Allies to give a fair fight at maximum range, against 15 Japan bases at close range?

quote:

4Es can attrit any Jap CAP at any base in the vincinity of the fighting, and replacements can be flown in. The massive logistic superiority of the allies can now be brought to bear on the battlefield.

Allied planes production for 10/43:
F 615
FB 54
NF 2
DB 194
LB 237
RC 12
TR 82
PA 37
FP 18
TB 42

100 fighters more, than in 9/43. The only serious boost in next month would be TBs. Fighters numbers are static, and even drop slightly.
So... can you match it, PzB?
I am afraid it is not 1945. Everything is still in the balance.

quote:

This battle is lost, the transports reached shore. Like Rommel said, the only way to win a defensive battle against an allied invasion is to prevent them from leaving the beaches. That has failed, and now the question is how to contain this invasion, not how to re-capture the base.

Why do you compare invasion against weakened Germany, with total air, and sea dominance, to this situation? In game terms it is impossible to stop invasion at beach, because you can not move reinforcements in one day.
Yes, Japan will lose attrition battle, in like 12 months. But I am afraid Allies will not stand even 3 in this situation. Considering last "antics" in Burma, Andy will probably resign after 2 weeks.
In 4 days Allies have lost ONE month of HELLCATs replacements. They are produced for 6 months now. Simple calculation shows, that with current attrition rate:
6*4=24. In 24 days there will be no HELLCATs flying.

quote:

Sure, PzB can throw 2, 4 or 6 divisions at this base, but that wont work, he will just be throwing them into a prison camp, like the Jap reinforcements at Guadalcanal.

At Guadalcanal Japan never reached numeral superiority. Your comparison is right, but it works other way. It is Allies now, who works at extreme range of their fighters, and once CVs left area, all day transports will be sunk by Japan planes.

I remind, that in THIS game, there was no great Japan defeat so far. Their land, and air forces are at full strength. And the year is still 1943, not 1945, with Japan airforce in shambles.

< Message edited by inqistor -- 2/15/2011 6:48:04 PM >

(in reply to PzB74)

Post #: 2066

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 7:18:16 PM

Nomad

Posts: 5905
Joined: 9/5/2001
From: West Yellowstone, Montana
Status: offline

So I guess I don't need to post here anymore. It seems that others know more than I do. I think John will do good since I feel he is a better player than Andy is, but it will be a fight and I still think that Andy will not only be able to hold what he has but expand.

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Post #: 2067

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 7:19:57 PM

Hortlund

Posts: 2884
Joined: 10/13/2000
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: inqistor

Oh? What Allied fighter types can reach this base from Australia coast? You seriously expect Allies to give a fair fight at maximum range, against 15 Japan bases at close range?

I said LBA range because I meant 4E-range. That means that the allies can support all operations in the area with the untouchable deathstar (a 100 4E airfield attack). Those 4Es can also bring in supplies if needed (although that should not be necessary). The base is also inside fighter ferry-range, meaning that the allies can constantly replace all fighter losses.

quote:

Allied planes production for 10/43:
F 615
FB 54
NF 2
DB 194
LB 237
RC 12
TR 82
PA 37
FP 18
TB 42

100 fighters more, than in 9/43. The only serious boost in next month would be TBs. Fighters numbers are static, and even drop slightly.
So... can you match it, PzB?
I am afraid it is not 1945. Everything is still in the balance.

I think you missunderstand what I mean when I say logistic superiority. There is more to logistics than aircraft production numbers. At this point in time, the number of aircraft coming off the production line is absolutely irrelevant. This battle will be decided in a week, maybe two...if it goes to extremes, say a month. What will decide this is aircraft in the reserve pool, composition and location of forces, avaliable supply, distance to replenishment facilities.

Presumably, Andy has planned this one right, meaning the logistics tail is in place. He also has the benefit of having the troops of his chosing in place from day 1. PzB on the other hand got caught with his forces badly out of place. Nothing can cure that now, and my point is that the right way to handle this situation is not to throw everything into a Hail-Mary-counterattack. Especially not since the KB is more or less a one-shot weapon at this point in time.

quote:

Why do you compare invasion against weakened Germany, with total air, and sea dominance, to this situation? In game terms it is impossible to stop invasion at beach, because you can not move reinforcements in one day.
Yes, Japan will lose attrition battle, in like 12 months. But I am afraid Allies will not stand even 3 in this situation. Considering last "antics" in Burma, Andy will probably resign after 2 weeks.
In 4 days Allies have lost ONE month of HELLCATs replacements. They are produced for 6 months now. Simple calculation shows, that with current attrition rate:
6*4=24. In 24 days there will be no HELLCATs flying.

I compare the situation to give the readers a mental image of what the situation is like. But you are correct in that there is a huge difference between D-day and this battle. At D-day, Germany actually had fighters that could stand up to and go toe-to-toe with the allied airforce. Japan does not have that.

It is most certainly not impossible to stop an invasion at the beach. There are countless of examples of invasion fleets slaughtered on the way to the invasion beach, or having the unloading disrupted by night surface action etc.

Hellcat replacement figures are completely irrelevant to this battle. This battle will not last 24 days, it is already over. What is left to decide is how much damage can be inflicted on the allied forces, and what the cost to japan will be to inflict that damage. I meant what I said regarding Utah beach on June 7th.

quote:

At Guadalcanal Japan never reached numeral superiority. Your comparison is right, but it works other way. It is Allies now, who works at extreme range of their fighters, and once CVs left area, all day transports will be sunk by Japan planes.

Allied fighters will operate at range 0, allied 4Es will operate inside normal range. And again you are basing your post on the assumption that allied CVs will leave the area. That means you are basing your suggestions/ideas on the very shaky notion that when the KB arrives it will sail victorious from the carrier clash that presumably follows. This is late 43. Allied CVs have Hellcats. The writing is on the wall. A 1-1 exchange is something that Japan should be very happy to achieve.

quote:

I remind, that in THIS game, there was no great Japan defeat so far. Their land, and air forces are at full strength. And the year is still 1943, not 1945, with Japan airforce in shambles.

Indeed, and therefore it is better to avoid that great defeat and fight another day, at a location of own choosing and with forces in place from day 1.

< Message edited by Panzerjaeger Hortlund -- 2/15/2011 7:23:45 PM >

_____________________________

The era of procrastination, of half-measures, of soothing and baffling expedients, of delays, is coming to a close.
In its place we are entering a period of consequences..

(in reply to inqistor)

Post #: 2068

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 7:32:30 PM

Tullius

Posts: 1174
Joined: 11/18/2004
From: Saxony (Germany)
Status: offline

quote:

They are available from 4/43, at 130 per month.

Are the replacement rates for AC historically correct ? In the game the US forces become ca. 4000 Hellcats. But until 11/45 12,275 Hellcats were built. Even when you substract 2.000 planes for the British forces there is still a gap of 6000 planes. Alone in March 1945 606 Hellcat -5/-5N were delivered. That was also the peak. In the game the player will receive only 223.

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Post #: 2069

RE: Enemy carriers near SRA! - 2/15/2011 7:35:37 PM

PresterJohn001

Posts: 382
Joined: 8/11/2009
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: Panzerjaeger Hortlund

Indeed, and therefore it is better to avoid that great defeat and fight another day, at a location of own choosing and with forces in place from day 1.

The problem is if the allies get established there won't be a place of pzb's own choosing. Once established, the allies will grind their way to the Phillipines without too much trouble. lots of fighting maybe but the outcome is inevitable. If the KB gets into position before the next allied waves, combined with Japanese LBA theres a fighting chance of throwing the invaders back. Its a prepared Japanese position. You have to know when to pick your fights and the odds aren't going to get any better as time goes on.

Let the string of unending victories continue PzB, your Army and Navy are invulnerable, the Emperor has decreed it

(in reply to Hortlund)

Post #: 2070