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TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 6:57:19 PM   
PresterJohn001


Posts: 382
Joined: 8/11/2009
Status: offline 		What determines how far a TF will move... why will one at 6/6 (full speed) move 12 hexes and two other TF's (8/8) move 10 hexes and totally feck up your plans?

Not OP point related, no refueling going on.

< Message edited by PresterJohn -- 5/25/2011 6:59:07 PM >
Post #: 1
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 6:59:07 PM   
Alfred

 

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Status: offline 		Need to refuel is a factor.

Alfred

(in reply to PresterJohn001)
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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 7:01:18 PM   
PresterJohn001


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Alfred

Need to refuel is a factor.

Alfred


I give them homeports near the detination to stop them toppping up the DD's every hex, the further moving TF - the SLOWEST one - has the least fuel.



< Message edited by PresterJohn -- 5/25/2011 7:16:22 PM >

(in reply to Alfred)
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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 7:32:58 PM   
Sardaukar


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Status: offline 		If you move with Full Speed, your ships accumulate Sys damage fast and that can seriously impact your TF movement. 

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 8:35:01 PM   
PresterJohn001


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Sardaukar

If you move with Full Speed, your ships accumulate Sys damage fast and that can seriously impact your TF movement. 


Just the one turn at Full speed, Sys Damage not an issue.

Full speed engaged in order to position the TF for strike.
Actual speed less than Mission Speed for 2 out of 3 TF's

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 8:37:59 PM   
Don Bowen


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There is, and always has been, a slight random in TF speed. Over a set number of days the TF will move at an even multiple of the set speed. However each day in that period will have a slight variation. This accounts for all the variables in ship movment that are not directly represented in the game.

Same in WITP, UV, and probably PacWar.

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 9:04:32 PM   
PresterJohn001


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Don Bowen


There is, and always has been, a slight random in TF speed. Over a set number of days the TF will move at an even multiple of the set speed. However each day in that period will have a slight variation. This accounts for all the variables in ship movment that are not directly represented in the game.

Same in WITP, UV, and probably PacWar.


62.5% of projected movement achieved, whilst other slower (in knots) TF in similar position moves 100% of projected speed and thus moves further.


Part of the issue is that in a such a detailed game where i know the names of every pilot i send into action, but at crucial points control is illusionary, i don't know how far or what governs how far TF's can move.


(in reply to Don Bowen)
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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 9:34:52 PM   
TommyG


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"Part of the issue is that in a such a detailed game where i know the names of every pilot i send into action, but at crucial points control is illusionary, i don't know how far or what governs how far TF's can move."


Amen to that

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Post #: 8
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 10:37:26 PM   
inqistor


Posts: 1813
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Status: offline 		The reasons for TF not traveling all distance in turn:
Not enough fuel in some of the ships.
Commander decides risk is too great, and takes detour.
Path is not set to Direct, and tries to avoid detected danger.
Spending OP points.

I am guessing one of your ships was low on fuel, and decided to refuel. If it was in red, she would try to refuel no matter of distance to homebase.

(in reply to TommyG)
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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/25/2011 11:32:55 PM   
PresterJohn001


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quote:

ORIGINAL: inqistor

The reasons for TF not traveling all distance in turn:
Not enough fuel in some of the ships.
Commander decides risk is too great, and takes detour.
Path is not set to Direct, and tries to avoid detected danger.
Spending OP points.

I am guessing one of your ships was low on fuel, and decided to refuel. If it was in red, she would try to refuel no matter of distance to homebase.


no red fuel issues, path set to direct...etc.. i've had all the above issues and accounted for them... no OP Points listed before or after..

i don't mind having d6 movement points, but i'd like to know i have d6 rather than 6 move points.. kinda important

don't mind me i'm just pissed coz my most excellent plan failed because of reasons unknown.



< Message edited by PresterJohn -- 5/25/2011 11:33:47 PM >

(in reply to inqistor)
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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 12:35:49 AM   
spence

 

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Status: offline 		It is unfortunate that sometimes you play the role of CINCPAC and sometimes the role of Fireman Apprentice Schwantz and it is up to you to know when you are playing one or the other.

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Post #: 11
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 1:41:51 AM   
Don Bowen


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OK, you've convinced me. I'll never try and explain anything again.

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 6:14:49 PM   
dorjun driver


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Status: offline 		I'll bet you can't explain that!

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 8:08:04 PM   
Rainer

 

Posts: 1210
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Status: offline 		Don't be bothered by the un-educated and childish.
We - the community - need you and your advice.

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(in reply to Don Bowen)
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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 8:31:05 PM   
freeboy

 

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Status: offline 		guys.. you NEED to listen to DON, he is on the developement team...
REALLY
so when Don says there is xy or  z affecting this or that.. listen..
Now what I want to know is why some troops will strategic move on roads from a base, and other not move from the same base over the same roads?

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 8:43:26 PM   
EUBanana


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Rainer

Don't be bothered by the un-educated and childish.
We - the community - need you and your advice.


Who is being uneducated and childish?

Seemed pretty much a legit gripe/question to me.

It's a bit of an arse to put it mildly, having your CVs suddenly run around the place at random on the eve of battle. It's happened to me, too...

Moving full speed before the eve of battle is a risk, though, as a result. I try and use mission speed at all times, seems considerably more reliable when precision movement is required.

< Message edited by EUBanana -- 5/26/2011 8:44:56 PM >

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RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 9:39:56 PM   
KenchiSulla


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Status: offline 		I dont know the why but I have a way to remedy the problem.

Execute taskforce commander and keelhaul the helmsman... That will teach them!

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(in reply to PresterJohn001)
Post #: 17
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/26/2011 9:41:32 PM   
KenchiSulla


Posts: 2948
Joined: 10/22/2008
From: the Netherlands
Status: offline 		On a more serious note, the randomness isnt all that crazy. Perhaps the taskforce had to slow down for some kind of event (simulated event)... If all your requests were executed with mathematical precision would you have fun?

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"It happened, therefore it can happen again: this is the core of what we have to say. It can happen, and it can happen everywhere.”
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Post #: 18
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 12:37:07 AM   
erstad

 

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quote:

Now what I want to know is why some troops will strategic move on roads from a base, and other not move from the same base over the same roads?


Some nationalities cannot use strategic road movement. For example, chinese can't. Is there a nationality difference between the ones you cite?

(in reply to freeboy)
Post #: 19
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 2:45:57 AM   
Mynok


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Best to only set a destination one movement phase away for striking purposes IMO. We don't know enough really about the situation to understand what you were trying to do, but that general principle has always done well for me.


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Post #: 20
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 6:39:21 AM   
freeboy

 

Posts: 9088
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From: Colorado
Status: offline 		are you sure the chinesse cannot? oops, I just sent a division by rail... maybe they used hi speed road .. but regardless they moved ove r rough terrian, multiple hex, like 8, in a few days...

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Post #: 21
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 2:36:09 PM   
morganbj


Posts: 3634
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From: Mosquito Bite, Texas
Status: offline 		Chinese can use rail, I do it all the time, but I have not been able to get them to use strategic road movement.

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Post #: 22
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 4:58:13 PM   
rev rico

 

Posts: 155
Joined: 5/7/2010
Status: offline 		I learned the hard way that even putting a TF on cruise speed isn't a guarantee of its speed. My CV TF still rushed ahead to its destination before I intended ... and got wacked!

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Post #: 23
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 10:59:27 PM   
erstad

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: freeboy

are you sure the chinesse cannot? oops, I just sent a division by rail... maybe they used hi speed road .. but regardless they moved ove r rough terrian, multiple hex, like 8, in a few days...



They can go by rail. The previous question was about strategic road movement.

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Post #: 24
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/27/2011 11:43:38 PM   
Mistmatz

 

Posts: 1399
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Status: offline 		Isn't strategic road movement depending on the LCUs motorisation level (Motorised Support, aka trucks)?

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If you gained knowledge through the forum, why not putting it into the AE wiki?

http://witp-ae.wikia.com/wiki/War_in_the_Pacific:_Admiral%27s_Edition_Wiki


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Post #: 25
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/28/2011 4:31:49 AM   
erstad

 

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From: Midwest USA
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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mistmatz

Isn't strategic road movement depending on the LCUs motorisation level (Motorised Support, aka trucks)?


If there is any linkage, it's pretty subtle. As a quick test, I was able to order 36th Indian Brigade from Calcutta to Imphal via major road movement in 12/41 of Scenario 1; said unit starts with no motorized support.


< Message edited by erstad -- 5/28/2011 4:32:29 AM >

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Post #: 26
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/28/2011 7:39:30 AM   
inqistor


Posts: 1813
Joined: 5/12/2010
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quote:

ORIGINAL: PresterJohn

quote:

ORIGINAL: inqistor

The reasons for TF not traveling all distance in turn:
Not enough fuel in some of the ships.
Commander decides risk is too great, and takes detour.
Path is not set to Direct, and tries to avoid detected danger.
Spending OP points.

I am guessing one of your ships was low on fuel, and decided to refuel. If it was in red, she would try to refuel no matter of distance to homebase.


no red fuel issues, path set to direct...etc.. i've had all the above issues and accounted for them... no OP Points listed before or after..

i don't mind having d6 movement points, but i'd like to know i have d6 rather than 6 move points.. kinda important


There are two naval movement phases, and TF could spent OP in night phase, so you would have not seen it anyway. Also, if that was CV TF they actually spend lots of OP on air operations, I am not even sure, if simple Naval Search mission actully uses OPs. Never count, that CVs will move full length. Maybe with all airgroups down, they will.

There could be also TF reaction to enemy. But this is written in Operation Report.

The only randomization, I know, is 1 extra movement hex, every few days, to recalculate different speeds, so 21 kn, is actually more, than 20.

(in reply to PresterJohn001)
Post #: 27
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/28/2011 7:42:28 AM   
inqistor


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quote:

ORIGINAL: Mistmatz

Isn't strategic road movement depending on the LCUs motorisation level (Motorised Support, aka trucks)?



Nope. There is only two unit types, defined in editor:
Motorized
Non-motorized

No matter what they actually consist of. They simply use different movement costs.

(in reply to Mistmatz)
Post #: 28
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/28/2011 4:29:29 PM   
Bullwinkle58


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quote:

ORIGINAL: EUBanana


It's a bit of an arse to put it mildly, having your CVs suddenly run around the place at random on the eve of battle.


It seems a lot of the griping here is by forumites who have never been to sea. Don has.

The weather and resulting wave and current effects are enough to bring out the variation built into the code. The sea is not like land. It moves. If you want to protest that tanks on the Eastern Front didn't have these problems, protest away. But the problems are still realistic.

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Post #: 29
RE: TF Movement Speed - 5/28/2011 7:13:36 PM   
Don Bowen


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OK guys. TF movement speed allows a slight increase each phase (Half Day). The amount per half day differs but the total adjustment for each day is the same.

Don't know why, always been that way.

So a TF movement that starts in a PM phase might be different than if it started in the AM phase.

That's all, no big deal, no need to go off like Chicken Little.

Lots of other things affect TF movement. Basically if it comsumes op points it reduces movement.

(in reply to Bullwinkle58)
Post #: 30
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