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RE: The RN Worst Day

 
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RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 11:04:40 AM   
ADB123

 

Posts: 1559
Joined: 8/18/2009
Status: offline 		CVEs are too slow (18 - 21 knots) to put into danger in AE. The AE Engine puts slower ships at a BIG disadvantage in all aspects - against subs, against surface ships and against planes.

Send your CVEs on an indirect path towards the Front and when you get close, fly off your planes to your land bases and let them fight from there. Then sail your CVEs away in an indirect manner again. Send them back to where you have Army Fighters, load the fighters on board, and sail back using the CVEs as AC transports. Then fly off your fighters. "Rinse, lather, repeat".

Radar is essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory" by throwing away so many planes every turn. You are being "rewarded" by the AE Air Combat model. You can win this war of attrition in the South Pacific if you can bring in your reserves of Air Units from the Eastern Pacific. (I presume you have some Reserves. If not, treat your CV AC as your reserves.)

Can you post some totals on the Combat Ships that Radar has lost? I didn't realize that he has lost 1908 points worth of ships. He must have lost a number of cruisers and destroyers or else he would be sending them in to attack your ships in the Eastern Solomons.

And yes - LR CAP will stop Transport Planes. That is one of the best uses of LR CAP. Always keep an eye on Enemy Transport Plane losses. When you see Transport plane Ops losses, you know that your opponent is transporting Supplies or Troops somewhere. And if that "somewhere" can be LR CAPed by you, you can stop those transports.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1681
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 11:35:41 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ADB123

CVEs are too slow (18 - 21 knots) to put into danger in AE. The AE Engine puts slower ships at a BIG disadvantage in all aspects - against subs, against surface ships and against planes.

Send your CVEs on an indirect path towards the Front and when you get close, fly off your planes to your land bases and let them fight from there. Then sail your CVEs away in an indirect manner again. Send them back to where you have Army Fighters, load the fighters on board, and sail back using the CVEs as AC transports. Then fly off your fighters. "Rinse, lather, repeat".

Radar is essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory" by throwing away so many planes every turn. You are being "rewarded" by the AE Air Combat model. You can win this war of attrition in the South Pacific if you can bring in your reserves of Air Units from the Eastern Pacific. (I presume you have some Reserves. If not, treat your CV AC as your reserves.)

Can you post some totals on the Combat Ships that Radar has lost? I didn't realize that he has lost 1908 points worth of ships. He must have lost a number of cruisers and destroyers or else he would be sending them in to attack your ships in the Eastern Solomons.

And yes - LR CAP will stop Transport Planes. That is one of the best uses of LR CAP. Always keep an eye on Enemy Transport Plane losses. When you see Transport plane Ops losses, you know that your opponent is transporting Supplies or Troops somewhere. And if that "somewhere" can be LR CAPed by you, you can stop those transports.



I see...Now i'm not out of the danger anyway...he's flooding the whole area with subs and i have my most valuable ships there...i'm trying to find solutions to get out of that hell without anymore headhaces!

I'm bringing as much as i can...but my so called reserve are over. Empty pools are always killing me.... and then i try to make only my best pilots fly. So who's not up to the task will keep on training in the background. However more airgroups are flowing from WC...but it takes time... I'll use my CVs as "reserve", hoping that i can last till April when the Hellcats will for sure give me a great hand!

Yes but i had a strong CAP (not RLCAP) over Tulagi...why my transports didn't fly?!
Oh well, putting me too some LRCAP...but it's expensive in terms of op losses...and Rader can spare as many planes as he likes...while i cannot.

Rader basically hasn't lost anything of value.
The CA and the CV are for sure a FOW product
I've dispatched some more recon and patrol crafts north of Suva and Pago Pago...who knows if Rader sends his KB moving in the shades to raid me!?




Attachment (1)

(in reply to ADB123)
Post #: 1682
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 11:54:21 AM   
ADB123

 

Posts: 1559
Joined: 8/18/2009
Status: offline 		Ha! "Nothing of value"?.....

You've gutted his DD force and those CAs and CLs would be worth their weight in gold right now. Otherwise he would be sending in multiple CA/CL/DD TFs to wipe out your surface forces in the region and clear the way for Bombardment TFs. That's the real reason why he is throwing away so many planes - he is trying to make up for his lack of ships to close your air bases. (BBs by themselves won't do it.)

So as long as you don't throw away more forces in thoughtless counterattacks you've won this battle. Just tough it out.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1683
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 12:10:17 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		As far as i know Japan gets gazzillions of DDs...and, however, i've lost defenetly more than him (in terms of cruisers and DDs...not to speak about BBs...)

Let's hope you're right mate... anyway, i went back reading Rader's previous AAR...in scen1 he had lost by dec 1943 11k planes...and he still he did have plenty of them in pools...so i don't know... At Karachi, after 8 months of battle, he finally has won the air war by attrition...The only very good thing is pilot quality. My pools are full of pilots with HUGE experience, A2A skill and Defence Skill. These guys will be very usefull when they'll be equipped with T-Bolts, Corsairs, Spits and so on...

Now i have to resist....i have to minimize my ship losses but i cannot efford to simply sit back. Tulagi is worth the price we're paying. If i can pinn him down there the tide can finally be stopped. I have to bleed him away and, above all, i have not to be too predictable. Till now Rader has always suprised me, while i was never able to do the same. This must change!

Think different GreyJoy

(in reply to ADB123)
Post #: 1684
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 1:40:04 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		I'm getting less and less ager to committ my CVs after the recent losses. I'll probably try to use my 600 planes to gain a local superiority over Lunga, Tulagi and Tassafronga in order to get to Tulagi the reinforcements needed. My 4Es will be used to shut down his advancing Airfields, while my navu, marine and navy fighters will only be used on the defensive (so i'll save most of my CV pilots).
Yes, the more i think of it and the more this idea suits me. A massive fighter umbrella to cover the arrival of reinforcements (Infantry, artillery, tanks etc), and to cover the surface fleet that will guard the iron bottom sound. Under these conditions i think i can fight. I'll probably be able to have a concentration of 1000+ a/c once i unload my CVs...enough to fight a defensive battle...
...well the plan needs to be cleaned for sure...but more or less this is the general idea.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1685
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 1:42:41 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		oh...and wih feb 43 i'm getting 43 brand new B-24s...each month

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1686
RE: Fighting for surviving - 7/26/2011 8:10:59 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Roger Neilson II

To 'borrow' a comment from the Crimean War and change it..... this is a great war, but its not the Pacific War.....



Wimber then related a story from the beginning of World War I. The war ministry of London dispatched a coded message to one of the British outposts in the inaccessible areas of Africa. The message read: "War is declared. Arrest all enemy aliens in your district." The war Ministry received this reply: "Have arrested four Germans, six Belgians, four Frenchmen, two Italians, three Austrians and an American. Please advise immediately who we are at war with."

http://rianniello.blogspot.com/2007/09/c-magnifique-mais-ce-n-pas-la-guerre.html

(in reply to Roger Neilson II)
Post #: 1687
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 8:26:46 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
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quote:

Allied Ships
     BB Royal Sovereign, Torpedo hits 6, and is sunk
     BB Resolution, Torpedo hits 5, and is sunk
     CA Cornwall, Torpedo hits 1
     CL Dauntless, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
     CL Hobart
     CA Exeter
     CA Dorsetshire, Torpedo hits 1
     CL Capetown, Torpedo hits 2,  heavy damage
     CL Ceres, Torpedo hits 2,  on fire,  heavy damage

     CA Dorsetshire, Torpedo hits 2, and is sunk
     CL Hobart, Torpedo hits 2,  on fire,  heavy damage
     CL Ceres, Bomb hits 3, and is sunk





I really like the Brit ships in my game as they have good exp. RIP.
Dorsetshire seems even one of the best imo. And the cap is an agressive guy, man.

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1688
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 8:30:02 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

I allow and use one ship TF only for Dec 41 when the Allies are in headlong retreat from manila and other places. Afterwards, I will use 2 or 3 ship TF even as picket ships as the AI will often ignore one ship TF and not launch attacks against them.

This tactic was very gamey, IMO. He should have used 4 two ship SC TF vs 8 single ship TF.


Not agreed, in "real war" single ships were used as pickets / fast recons etc.


"In Potter's bio of Arleigh Burke he discusses this subject. When Burke and Mitscher saw Admiral Kelly Turner's invasion and naval support plan for the invasion of Okinawa, Burke (according to Potter) immediately recognized the vulnerability of the picket destroyers to kamikaze. Burke had spent a lot of time in DDs and must have been sensitive to issues affecting those ships.

Burke approached Turner and suggested that he place more destroyers together on picket duty so that they could be more mutually supportive with AA. Turner replied that he didn't have enough DDs to follow Burke's suggestion, so Burke offered to lend him some of the fast carrier task force's destroyers to help out. Turner replied, "I'll take your destroyers, but not as a loan, if you give me your destroyers they will belong to me and I'll do with them what I will." Upon hearing that, Burke withdrew the offer and departed. Potter implies that the casualties suffered by the picket DDs off Okinawa were unnecessary and due, in part, to Turner's ego and control issues."

http://www.ww2f.com/war-pacific/36256-obbs-picket-ships-okinawa.html

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 7/26/2011 8:37:14 PM >

(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 1689
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 8:46:53 PM   
aztez

 

Posts: 4031
Joined: 2/26/2005
From: Finland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Alpha77

quote:

ORIGINAL: ny59giants

I allow and use one ship TF only for Dec 41 when the Allies are in headlong retreat from manila and other places. Afterwards, I will use 2 or 3 ship TF even as picket ships as the AI will often ignore one ship TF and not launch attacks against them.

This tactic was very gamey, IMO. He should have used 4 two ship SC TF vs 8 single ship TF.


Not agreed, in "real war" single ships were used as pickets / fast recons etc.


"In Potter's bio of Arleigh Burke he discusses this subject. When Burke and Mitscher saw Admiral Kelly Turner's invasion and naval support plan for the invasion of Okinawa, Burke (according to Potter) immediately recognized the vulnerability of the picket destroyers to kamikaze. Burke had spent a lot of time in DDs and must have been sensitive to issues affecting those ships.

Burke approached Turner and suggested that he place more destroyers together on picket duty so that they could be more mutually supportive with AA. Turner replied that he didn't have enough DDs to follow Burke's suggestion, so Burke offered to lend him some of the fast carrier task force's destroyers to help out. Turner replied, "I'll take your destroyers, but not as a loan, if you give me your destroyers they will belong to me and I'll do with them what I will." Upon hearing that, Burke withdrew the offer and departed. Potter implies that the casualties suffered by the picket DDs off Okinawa were unnecessary and due, in part, to Turner's ego and control issues."

http://www.ww2f.com/war-pacific/36256-obbs-picket-ships-okinawa.html


Yes! However RL and history don't always mix with AE game mechanics.

As ny59giants said. That was gamey move. No questions about it at all.

It was not "picket line". He wanted to consuume his OP points and succeeded.

Lets say he would have had 3-4 DD's per hex. Than that would be a picket line.

The same goes with using single ships to draw carrier strikes towards them. You can do that too.. and it falls into same category since with AE you cannot give commands to ignore these ships.

Now let the AAR continue...

(in reply to Alpha77)
Post #: 1690
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 8:56:28 PM   
Alpha77

 

Posts: 2116
Joined: 9/24/2010
Status: offline 		Well maybe, I have not much experience in pbm games and "houserules" etc. Let´s continue then

Btw. Even if the air situation is quite good by now at some places for GJ, it seems to me the shipping losses he now has, even with the CVs intact might prevent any serious navy op in the near future. Even if the Jap DD force also suffered. Maybe - just a thought - bring in the US CVs to the next favourable opportunity as the deciding factor. Or he needs to wait for the Hellcats first (I guess in 5/43 he might have enough to equip 3-4 sqdrs). Untill then he needs to hold on, or bring the biggies in for an earlier "pitched battle"... if it goes in his favour fine.

If not.....

< Message edited by Alpha77 -- 7/26/2011 8:57:04 PM >

(in reply to aztez)
Post #: 1691
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/26/2011 9:27:49 PM   
SqzMyLemon


Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

As far as i know Japan gets gazzillions of DDs...and, however, i've lost defenetly more than him (in terms of cruisers and DDs...not to speak about BBs...)


Japan does not get a "gazzillions" of DD's. The CL losses wouldn't bother me much either although they are good for raiding TF's. Every Japanese CA and DD you sink though is worth their weight in gold. Consider the fact most players use 6-10 DD's to escort carrier TF's you've knocked out the equivalent of 3 CV TF's worth of escorts. He's lost good quality DD's, not some of the obsolete ones with endurance of only 2500-3600. Chances are his tanker TF's are under escorted now as well.

You are the one who will get "gazzillions" of DD's so don't fret, just don't throw the ones you have now away for nothing. As to you having to fight, well pick your fights, if the Solomon's are a meat grinder for your forces then don't fight there. Easier said than done I know, but don't play his game, attrition is what he wants from you so don't give in to it.

You staved off autovictory and fought tooth and nail to get to this point, if you have to simply pull back and wait your chance to clobber him than do it. You've earned the right to pull back and do what's best for your forces at the moment. Your torpedoes are improved so your subs will pack more of a punch now, just chip away. Use what you can for as little cost as possible to disrupt him. The Solomon's is a meaningless theatre for you, it's a reverse Guadacanal and you're letting yourself get pummeled there. Tie him down sure, but don't risk your fleet when you don't have to. As Canoerebel said earlier, if you lose the ground forces it's not the end of the world, you'll get more and if you're patched up you'll be able to buy them back later. Don't throw away what little strength you have against his massed air, or if you want to still try and attrition him, do it on your terms not his.

One thing about the sheer number of aircraft Rader's producing is there is a cost to that. I bet he has no HI reserve to speak of. It may not take affect till much later, but he's sowing the seeds for a rapid collapse in the future. I feel your immediate priority should be to start recapturing industrial bases in India, start hurting him industrially, bomb his oil/fuel/production. Find those under escorted tanker's, start bleeding him where it matters. He'll lose planes till the cows come home. Start looking at strangling him economically, taking him head on only delays your ability to strike back later in a meaningfull way.

Take this with a grain of salt, as I've never been in a situation like yours. It just seems to me your fighting the wrong fight at the moment. If you can keep him focused on the Solomons I think you can use that to your advantage. I'd be looking at ways to strike directly at his guts, bleed his industry, not his armed forces. You'll have loads of opportunities to do that when the odds are finally in your favour.

< Message edited by SqzMyLemon -- 7/26/2011 9:30:24 PM >

_____________________________

Luck is the residue of design - John Milton

Don't mistake lack of talent for genius - Peter Steele (Type O Negative)

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1692
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 1:23:50 AM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

He wanted to sweep my PTs to say the truth... I admit that i changed my PTs disposition after the what ADB told me (about their effectiveness).
If it's gamey to use single DD TFs so it's game to flood a base with multiple 2 PTs TFs...so i'm guilty as much as he is...


Your right about this-one good cheese move deserves another... Once again I was too harsh on Rader as this is exactly what I would do to counter your PTs. We have a HR in our game limiting PTs to not more than six in one TF per base. It seems to work well.


Actually, in scen 2 Japan does get a gazillion DDs. Well, at least a lot more than he normally would. He can also covert a lot of AKs to patrol type ships and older DDs to E type ships. The Japanese player also gets the full planned amount of the super class type of DD where in real life they only built one. I forget the class name but I think he gets about a dozen. There is a flood of DDs in late 44 45 and 46 but they are mostly escort types and not very good. Still there are a lot of them. The Allies get more and better but Greyjoy has got a long way to go before the Japanese DD fleet is done with.

< Message edited by crsutton -- 7/27/2011 1:39:12 AM >

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1693
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 1:44:40 AM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: GreyJoy

Conerning the Corsair i have to say that i'm not impressed at all. The plane is better than the F4F no doubt, but the Spits Vc for ex is defenetly better and in my game it isn't showing no where the strenght it had in RL.
That's probably because Corsair was a good plane, but not THE plane. His successes related mainly in the way the USN and USMC units started to use it...and it's service rate is so bad that it's a pain to make it flying for a decent period of time!

Give me the SpitVc all the way! :-)

This is a good machine indeed. The Australian using it are doing wonders in the Solomons.





No the corsair is much better than the spit V. The early version has to be used in the same manner as the P38. That is not from an advanced base. Later in the game the corsairs get drop tanks and they then have excellent range. The second version which shows up in 10/43 is great and can defeat any Japanese 2nd generation plane. The corsair is about 50 mph faster than the spit V and I think the most dominant factor in the game for a fighter is speed.

_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1694
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 4:24:36 AM   
SqzMyLemon


Posts: 4239
Joined: 10/30/2009
From: Alberta, Canada
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Actually, in scen 2 Japan does get a gazillion DDs. Well, at least a lot more than he normally would. He can also covert a lot of AKs to patrol type ships and older DDs to E type ships. The Japanese player also gets the full planned amount of the super class type of DD where in real life they only built one. I forget the class name but I think he gets about a dozen. There is a flood of DDs in late 44 45 and 46 but they are mostly escort types and not very good. Still there are a lot of them. The Allies get more and better but Greyjoy has got a long way to go before the Japanese DD fleet is done with.


Ah, I stand corrected crsutton. Put it down to me not knowing scenario 2. I'm only familiar with the OOB of scenario 1.


_____________________________

Luck is the residue of design - John Milton

Don't mistake lack of talent for genius - Peter Steele (Type O Negative)

(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 1695
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 4:39:51 AM   
crsutton


Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: SqzMyLemon

quote:

ORIGINAL: crsutton

Actually, in scen 2 Japan does get a gazillion DDs. Well, at least a lot more than he normally would. He can also covert a lot of AKs to patrol type ships and older DDs to E type ships. The Japanese player also gets the full planned amount of the super class type of DD where in real life they only built one. I forget the class name but I think he gets about a dozen. There is a flood of DDs in late 44 45 and 46 but they are mostly escort types and not very good. Still there are a lot of them. The Allies get more and better but Greyjoy has got a long way to go before the Japanese DD fleet is done with.


Ah, I stand corrected crsutton. Put it down to me not knowing scenario 2. I'm only familiar with the OOB of scenario 1.



Yeah, I walked into it assuming that it gave the Japanese player a "little help." Just read the intro and figured what the heck, it can't be that bad.....Well, it is.


_____________________________

I am the Holy Roman Emperor and am above grammar.

Sigismund of Luxemburg

(in reply to SqzMyLemon)
Post #: 1696
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 9:27:12 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Hi all,

been pretty busy with GF yesterday evening and didn't have time to play or update the AAR.

Opening the turn this morning i pretty knew what was waiting for me.
The CVE Copahee, already hit yesterday, and left beyond by the rest of the fleet which was steaming away from the subs, was finished today by I-17, pulling down with her to the bottom 25 more F4Fs along with their crack USMC pilots. Only few of them survived, taken aboard of the DD Kalk that was escorting the wounded CVE.

For the rest was a pretty quiet turn turn in the Solomons. Rader is organizing his next blow, with fighters massing at Shortland and Choiseul Bay, with bases building up everywhere south of Shortland and with the whole Combined fleet refueling and refilling at Rabaul. There wasn't any air battle over Tulagi or Lunga today...i'm pretty sure he's simply waiting to have an overwhelming air force to smash once for all my Cactus Air Force.

We bombed again with 50 2Es the enemy beachheads at Tulagi. No opposition encountered.

We also managed to bring an Corp HQ at Tulagi in order to help the defenders. Won't send for the moment any more Infantry units cause i'm already struggling the keep the garrison supplied (18k today level, despite 150 C47s managed to bring in supplies for 2 days in a row). Think i'll move to Lunga all my fighters cause they do drain really too many supplies in order to keep them flyin!

At Karachi was another bloody day with waves of fighters and bombers (1000 each day!) storming over the fortress. Despite the odds really against us (20 vs 1) we managed to shoot down 44 enemy planes against only 11 of ours. Unfortunately we couldn't help letting the bombers bomb our AFs...and we've lost more 20 planes on the ground. But, as i said, that's the price i have to pay in order to keep him bleeding.

We've lost another DD today due to a lucky 250 kg bomb dropped by a Betty during one of these raids (this was an anti-naval raid) that smashed the poor little DD.

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Feb 02, 43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Pukapuka at 158,160

Japanese Ships
SS I-17

Allied Ships
CVE Copahee, Torpedo hits 1, on fire, heavy damage
DD Kalk




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on TF, near Karachi at 40,8

Weather in hex: Light cloud

Raid detected at 108 NM, estimated altitude 9,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 37 minutes

Japanese aircraft
A6M2 Zero x 42
G4M1 Betty x 39



Allied aircraft
Hurricane IIc Trop x 10
Kittyhawk III x 3
P-39D Airacobra x 1
P-40K Warhawk x 6


Japanese aircraft losses
A6M2 Zero: 2 destroyed
G4M1 Betty: 1 damaged

Allied aircraft losses
P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed

Allied Ships
DD Decoy
DD Encounter
DD Napier, Bomb hits 1, and is sunk




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on 5th Division, at 114,137 (Tulagi)
Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid spotted at 29 NM, estimated altitude 7,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes


Allied aircraft
Spitfire VIII x 10
B-25C Mitchell x 27
B-26 Marauder x 20
B-26B Marauder x 10
P-38G Lightning x 13
P-39D Airacobra x 31
P-400 Airacobra x 1
P-40E Warhawk x 8
P-40K Warhawk x 15
F4F-4 Wildcat x 28


No Allied losses

Japanese ground losses:
79 casualties reported
Squads: 0 destroyed, 4 disabled
Non Combat: 0 destroyed, 6 disabled
Engineers: 0 destroyed, 0 disabled


Also attacking 36th Infantry Regiment ...
Also attacking 38th Division ...
Also attacking 4th Division ...
Also attacking 13th Ind.Mixed Brigade ...
Also attacking 2nd Area Army ...
Also attacking 5th Division ...
Also attacking 36th Infantry Regiment ...
Also attacking 5th Division ...
Also attacking 38th Division ...
Also attacking 4th Division ...
Also attacking 5th Division ...
Also attacking 36th Infantry Regiment ...



(in reply to crsutton)
Post #: 1697
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 11:02:17 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Ok, here's the situation.

Rader is up to his big next push. He knows my CVs are coming so my bet is that he'll be using the hammer. He for sure wants to have his CVs at their max potentials and he probably still needs to refill after the tremendous Kates losses suffered last week during his raid at Ndani.
So here's my countermove:

I'll be bombing Torobika, which is where his bombers are all placed. Moved my 4Es to Lunga (a bit overstacked, i know...). 25 (but probably less due to overstacking penalities) will sweep Torobika, followed by 80 (probably 60) 4Es. Weather will be a component...extreme overcast forecasted over Torobika, but anywhere else is storming weather...let's see.
There are 250 fighters at Shortland and 30 more at Torobika...so for sure we'll face some leaky CAP. But my gamble relies over the fact that i do think Rader is going to sweep Lunga or Tulagi before committing his CVs...and if all those 250 fighters are on sweep mission, they won't be CAPping...the other variable is the presence of the KB...if the KB moves towards Shortland, i risk to face all the leaky CAP from the KB also...and that would be a problem...but hey, if you wanna obtain something you must be ready to risk...

At the very same time a small 2DDs SCTF will move at flank speed towards Munda, Vella la Vella and Choiseul Bay, in order to give him some of his same medicine, while a brand new TF composed of the CL Honolulu and 6 modern Sim Class DDs will move to Lunga. I don't wanna have surprises (say Bombardment TFs) while all my eggs are in a single basket (lunga).
200 crack fighters will provide CAP over Lunga and Tulagi.

The general idea is to interdict with his plans. If i manage to close that AF, catching all those bombers on the ground (the best would be to have them grounded due to weather), i'll delay his hammer plans for a counteroffensive and i will gain so enough time to let my CV airgroups to get in place in time.

Which are the risks? Well the main risk is to see our 4Es get slaughtered by the KB leaky CAP...but i think it's a sustainable risk and if i manage to slow him down in the process of closing down the Solomons AFs, well, it would have been well worth imho!

Oh, almost forgot, we're also sending 20k supplies to Tulagi, escorted by 4 modern DDs acting as a screening force

Let's see...finger crossed




Attachment (1)

< Message edited by GreyJoy -- 7/27/2011 4:54:41 PM >

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1698
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/27/2011 11:35:31 PM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Didn't go like i wanted to...

He swept me to oblivion with his zeros!

Tulagi was swept by not less than 400 A6M3s...my guys did what they could but most of those bastards were the crack KB pilots and we suffered badly (lost nearly 50 planes over Tulagi, and among them 3 Spits VIII )...my P-38s weren't coordinate over Torobika and they went in after the bombers...heavy CAP found and we lost 10 4Es, destroying 44 planes on the ground...not enough...his Helens weren't there!

Now he's building up bases at a pace too fast for me to try to close them...he landed a para-unit at Thousand Bay Island...he has almost encircled me!!!!

I cannot stand those sweeps...they simply destroy any ability to defend from the upcoming air bombing...even if my planes aren't shot down, they remain grounded for the next bombing raid...no matters how many fighters i manage to assemble...he has too many of them to throw at me regardless losses.

His subs are encircling all the Fiji area...my CVs are trapped at Suva...today he sunk 6 transports of mine only with his dreaded subs...i spot them with my air ASW...but at night they're free to do whatever they want...

My DD raid didn't catch a damned thing...all his ships fled away in time...why mines don't do the same remains a mistery to me.

At Karachi he destroyed the last attempt of resistance...

AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Feb 04, 43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Kirakira  at 115,141

Japanese Ships
     SS I-159

Allied Ships
     CM Prins van Oranje, Torpedo hits 1,  on fire,  heavy damage



SS I-159 launches 4 torpedoes
I-159 diving deep ....
Sub escapes detection


SWEEPSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 38 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 22



Allied aircraft
     Spitfire VIII x 5
     Spitfire Vc Trop x 3
     P-39D Airacobra x 17
     P-400 Airacobra x 13
     P-40E Warhawk x 12
     P-40K Warhawk x 6
     F4F-4 Wildcat x 30
     F4U-1 Corsair x 4


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M3a Zero: 5 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     P-400 Airacobra: 5 destroyed

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 19 NM, estimated altitude 36,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 25



Allied aircraft
     Spitfire VIII x 5
     Spitfire Vc Trop x 3
     P-39D Airacobra x 14
     P-400 Airacobra x 4
     P-40E Warhawk x 7
     P-40K Warhawk x 6
     F4F-4 Wildcat x 26
     F4U-1 Corsair x 4


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M3a Zero: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     F4F-4 Wildcat: 1 destroyed


 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 18 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 30



Allied aircraft
     Spitfire VIII x 5
     Spitfire Vc Trop x 2
     P-39D Airacobra x 11
     P-400 Airacobra x 4
     P-40E Warhawk x 7
     P-40K Warhawk x 4
     F4F-4 Wildcat x 19
     F4U-1 Corsair x 3


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M3a Zero: 5 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed
     P-40K Warhawk: 1 destroyed
     F4F-4 Wildcat: 1 destroyed
     F4U-1 Corsair: 1 destroyed


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 15 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 27



Allied aircraft
     Spitfire VIII x 5
     Spitfire Vc Trop x 1
     P-39D Airacobra x 6
     P-400 Airacobra x 3
     P-40E Warhawk x 6
     P-40K Warhawk x 1
     F4F-4 Wildcat x 9
     F4U-1 Corsair x 1


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M3a Zero: 3 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     Spitfire VIII: 1 destroyed
     P-400 Airacobra: 2 destroyed
     P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed
     P-40K Warhawk: 1 destroyed
     F4F-4 Wildcat: 3 destroyed

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 41 NM, estimated altitude 36,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 23



Allied aircraft
     Spitfire VIII x 4
     Spitfire Vc Trop x 1
     P-39D Airacobra x 4
     P-40E Warhawk x 4
     F4F-4 Wildcat x 2


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M3a Zero: 2 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     P-39D Airacobra: 2 destroyed
     P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 23 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 23



Allied aircraft
     Spitfire VIII x 4
     Spitfire Vc Trop x 1
     P-40E Warhawk x 1
     F4F-4 Wildcat x 1


No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
     Spitfire VIII: 1 destroyed
     P-40E Warhawk: 1 destroyed


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
And by now all my fighters were grounded....

Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137


Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 30 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 8 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 26



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     26 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 38 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 11 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 25



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     25 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 42 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 12 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 36



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     36 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 24 NM, estimated altitude 36,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 19



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     19 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 23 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 6 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 22



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     22 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet




At Karachi?.....the same story....
 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Karachi , at 40,8

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 37 NM, estimated altitude 36,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 10 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M2 Zero x 39
     Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 35



Allied aircraft
     Hurricane IIc Trop x 28
     Kittyhawk III x 3
     Kittyhawk III x 8
     P-40K Warhawk x 2


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M2 Zero: 4 destroyed
     Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     Hurricane IIc Trop: 1 destroyed

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 26 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 7 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 38



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     38 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Karachi , at 40,8

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 15 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M2 Zero x 28
     Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 21



Allied aircraft
     Hurricane IIc Trop x 18
     Kittyhawk III x 3
     Kittyhawk III x 8
     P-40K Warhawk x 2


Japanese aircraft losses
     Ki-44-IIa Tojo: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     Hurricane IIc Trop: 3 destroyed
     Kittyhawk III: 1 destroyed
     Kittyhawk III: 1 destroyed


 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 13 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 3 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 29



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     29 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 15 NM, estimated altitude 33,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 4 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 27



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     27 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 166 NM, estimated altitude 32,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 49 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 6



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
      3 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
      3 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 217 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 64 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 67



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     19 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     21 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     27 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Moderate rain

Raid detected at 222 NM, estimated altitude 36,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 66 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 7



No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
      3 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
      4 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Karachi , at 40,8

Weather in hex: Overcast

Raid detected at 212 NM, estimated altitude 35,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 58 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M2 Zero x 24
     Ki-44-IIa Tojo x 5



Allied aircraft
     Hurricane IIc Trop x 4
     Kittyhawk III x 1
     Kittyhawk III x 2


No Japanese losses

Allied aircraft losses
     Hurricane IIc Trop: 1 destroyed



Aircraft Attacking:
      4 x Ki-44-IIa Tojo sweeping at 31000 feet * 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid detected at 19 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 5 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 19



Allied aircraft
     P-39D Airacobra x 9
     P-400 Airacobra x 3
     P-40E Warhawk x 5
     F4U-1 Corsair x 2


Japanese aircraft losses
     A6M3a Zero: 1 destroyed

Allied aircraft losses
     P-39D Airacobra: 1 destroyed
     P-400 Airacobra: 2 destroyed
     P-40E Warhawk: 2 destroyed


 
- 

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Morning Air attack on Tulagi , at 114,137

Weather in hex: Light rain

Raid detected at 214 NM, estimated altitude 34,000 feet.
Estimated time to target is 64 minutes

Japanese aircraft
     A6M3a Zero x 285
 


No Japanese losses



Aircraft Attacking:
     17 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     19 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     22 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     27 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     27 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     36 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     19 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     19 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     21 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     22 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     29 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet
     27 x A6M3a Zero sweeping at 31000 feet




Any suggestion to how to counter this mess???

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1699
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 12:07:21 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Another turn and another tragedy.... another CVE sunk by subs between Pago and Suva...i have 20 DDs in that convoy, and there's also an ASW TF following....result? 2 sub attacks, 2 torpedo hits...not a single ASW hit...com'on....

However i'm losing the battle for the solomons...he has taken his time to mass his forces...and now i simply cannot stand...another day of 300 sweeps over Lunga, followed by 200 Helens bombing the base...and he captured with paras another base north of Tulagi...i'm sorrounded...
He sunk 4 of my AKs that tried to slip towards Tulagi...i'm toasted. I'll fight cause i have no other options...but there's no way i will be able to defend my bases against a counterlanding. CVs or not he outnumbers me 3-1 (at least) and with the "sweep system" every base remain voulnerable...no matter how many fighters you put on defence

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1700
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 12:17:44 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		AFTER ACTION REPORTS FOR Feb 06, 43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ASW attack near Tongatapu at 137,165

Japanese Ships
SS I-7

Allied Ships
DD Lardner
BB Warspite
DD Cony
DD Gillespie
DD Gansevoort
DD Bancroft
DD Bailey



SS I-7 launches 6 torpedoes at DD Lardner
DD Gillespie fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Gansevoort attacking submerged sub ....
DD Gansevoort is out of ASW ammo
DD Gansevoort is out of ASW ammo
DD Bancroft fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Bailey fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Gillespie fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Gansevoort fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Tongatapu at 137,165

Japanese Ships
SS I-15

Allied Ships
CVE Suwannee
DD Gansevoort
DD Lansdowne
DD Gillespie
DD Bancroft
DD Bailey
DD Woodworth



SS I-15 launches 6 torpedoes at CVE Suwannee
I-15 diving deep ....
DD Gillespie fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Bancroft fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Bailey fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Woodworth fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Gillespie attacking submerged sub ....
SS I-15 eludes DD Gillespie by diving deep
DD Gillespie fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Gillespie fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Gillespie fails to find sub, continues to search...
DD Gillespie attacking submerged sub ....
DD Gillespie cannot reach attack position over SS I-15
Escort abandons search for sub


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sub attack near Tongatapu at 137,165

Japanese Ships
SS I-24

Allied Ships
CVE Chenango, Torpedo hits 2, on fire, heavy damage
BB Warspite
DD Cony
DD Gillespie
DD Bancroft
DD Bailey
DD Woodworth



SS I-24 launches 6 torpedoes at CVE Chenango
DD Gillespie fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Bancroft fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Bailey fails to find sub and abandons search
DD Woodworth fails to find sub, continues to search...
Escort abandons search for sub



(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1701
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 12:46:13 AM   
ADB123

 

Posts: 1559
Joined: 8/18/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Any suggestion to how to counter this mess???


1 - Don't fly P-39s, P-400s, P-40Es, Kittyhawks and other 1941 generation planes against A6M3as....

2 - Disband your air units in the Solomons and rebuild them in 60 days on the West Coast with better planes...

3 - Pull out your forces from the New Hebrides/New Caledonia and put them into New Zealand

As far as the Japanese subs around Suva:

1 - Put ALL of your bombers (including CV bombers) on 100% ASW at 1000 feet - keep them within half of their max range

2 - Send out ALL of your ASW ships in multiple ASW TFs towards all Japanese subs within a one turn distance

3 - Set ALL of your Floatplanes (not Cats) to Night Naval Attack at 1000 feet - they will have a chance to attack the enemy subs

As I said before "There are no Solomons"...

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1702
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 12:52:11 AM   
Itdepends

 

Posts: 937
Joined: 12/12/2005
Status: offline 		If it was an invasion force I'd have the amphib force following a SCTF or Bombardment TF. Wouldn't you have better ASW results if you had the CVE TF following the ASW TF?

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1703
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 12:53:30 AM   
ADB123

 

Posts: 1559
Joined: 8/18/2009
Status: offline
quote:

Another turn and another tragedy.... another CVE sunk by subs between Pago and Suva..


Actually, come to think of it, this is the best thing that could happen to you right now.

Why? Because without any CVEs you will be less likely to throw away all the rest of your CVs in a huge, hopeless gamble.

Now, harass the Japanese subs for the next couple of turns, then form up your CVs in a BIG TF and send it home - preferably to the West Coast, and leave it there until you can replace ALL of the Wildcats with Hellcats.

I know, you want to bravely attack - but think of it this way, if you do what I say, in four months time you can attack with some hope of success. If you throw away your CVs it will be 10 months before you can bravely attack again...

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1704
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 1:34:59 AM   
ny59giants


Posts: 9869
Joined: 1/10/2005
Status: offline 		I would have formed multiple ASW TF composed of a DD and 2 or 3 SC/PC. Each ASW TF would be ordered to follow the one before them from one hexes behind so you had a small train of ships. The hex with the CVEs would be following 2 ASW TF in that same hex. So your ships will be spread out over about 5 hexes max. Old CLs would have their FP trained up in ASW skill and range set to 2 hexes. Maybe not to hit his subs, but to spot them. Those SC/PC have poor crew experience, but I would rather have them sunk than your CVEs.

_____________________________


(in reply to ADB123)
Post #: 1705
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 2:15:07 AM   
wpurdom

 

Posts: 476
Joined: 10/27/2000
From: Decatur, GA, USA
Status: offline
quote:

Actually, come to think of it, this is the best thing that could happen to you right now.

Why? Because without any CVEs you will be less likely to throw away all the rest of your CVs in a huge, hopeless gamble.

Now, harass the Japanese subs for the next couple of turns, then form up your CVs in a BIG TF and send it home - preferably to the West Coast, and leave it there until you can replace ALL of the Wildcats with Hellcats.

I know, you want to bravely attack - but think of it this way, if you do what I say, in four months time you can attack with some hope of success. If you throw away your CVs it will be 10 months before you can bravely attack again...


It seems to me that you have agreed to house rules which neutralize the ability to either resist Japanese thrusts or conduct amphibious campaigns of your own prior to the Essex class CV's and the Hellcats.

When Allied players engage KB in late 42 they typically rely on a network of bases and the 4e and 2e LBA to attrite KB fighters. As many say, your 4e bombers are your best fighters as the Allies. When they engage in amphibious attacks they generally rely on a network of bases, often seizing several bases together or striking within support distance of an existing network. By massing 2e and 4e planes, KB cannot engage the network without risk and vulnerability. With a one squadron per base limitation, KB can support an air domination campaign with impunity! It makes it difficult to maintain yourself in air bases or provide cover for a surface force presence. The other way Allied players sometimes successfully engage KB is by surface force ambush when it ventures to near Allied bases. But you can't provide adequate air cover to enable you to keep you surface forces close to the action or engage in the surface force attrition which favors the Allies.

(in reply to ny59giants)
Post #: 1706
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 6:26:41 AM   
String


Posts: 2661
Joined: 10/7/2003
From: Estonia
Status: offline 		Have your CV TF follow the ASW TF and not the other way around. This way the ASW TF comes into the hex first.

_____________________________

Surface combat TF fanboy

(in reply to wpurdom)
Post #: 1707
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 7:01:30 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Unfortunately ADB is right again. I had to "Dunkirk" the Solomons when i could...but now...how can i do that?
How can i evacuate the equivalent of 3 divisions, 4 Tanks BNs, tons of eng, base forces, artillery etc etc....??
If i let them there they will simply be bombed to dust and then captured. If i try to evacuate them without a decent air cover Rader is going to annihilate my forces with KB+SUPER-LBA.

What can i do? I can use my 150 C-47s...but i'll have to leave behind all the heavy equipment and for sure most of the units won't be saved...

Should i try to organize a inverse-Tokyo Express evacuation style? Would it be worth?

You know that i cannot let my best Marines Divisions to simply rot there...

Again...Greyjoy...you've overvaluated your chances and your forces...and now you pay the heavy price of your own stupid bad plans.

(in reply to String)
Post #: 1708
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 7:07:05 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		To reply to String, NY59G and the others...no, i had the CVTF leading followed by the ASWTF...Ok, i'll try that new disposition...it's too late now but better late than never right? :-)

...still thinking on how can i evacuate...i think i have to decide which unit will be sacrificed ald left behind...and concentrate only on the real valuable units....what a PITA!!!!!

You know that this is gonna be the 4th major land disaster of the war...and possibly the worst one right!? I mean, China, India, PM and now this...


(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1709
RE: The RN Worst Day - 7/28/2011 7:55:48 AM   
GreyJoy


Posts: 6750
Joined: 3/18/2011
Status: offline 		Ok, drawing now the plans for the operation "Waterfalls"...the evacuation of SOPAC

(in reply to GreyJoy)
Post #: 1710
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