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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/4/2011 10:07:46 PM

princep01

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CR, this question might breach op sercurity protocol, but I assume you will use southern Sumatra as a launching pad for at least part of your eventual offensive action. Do you plan to retake Java to secure the right flank of that thrust or will you opt for a deeper strike designed to isolate the Japanese troops on Java? I am a bit too conservative and would opt to secure Java rather than by pass it. Other more bold souls would probably launch a deep strike onto Borneo or an island in the Phillipines rather than engaging and destroying the troops in Java.

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Post #: 1711

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/4/2011 10:14:05 PM

Canoerebel

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It's so early in the game that the Allies have to be very careful in choosing their battles. Japan has a multitude of infantry divisions available, so there's no way the allies can go toe-to-toe in a major ground campaign until much later in the game.

So the Allies will ignore Java while looking to the very inviting island bases to the north that are still Allied controlled. The Allies can occupy these at low risk, but each will put a great deal of pressure on Japan since the airfields can be built large. Once Steve sees infantry and engineers at Billiton Island, for instance, he's got to react violently. He's already in bad shape in the DEI, but losing control of the Java Sea and seeing growing enemy airfields heading north is going to get his full attention.

Job one for the Allies through the end of '42 is to remain vigilant in protecting Sumatra. Job two is to apply pressure that forces/persuades Japan to make mistakes. So this isn't really about territory; it's about creating a pressure cooker. That's something the Allies can do effectively even this early in the war.

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Post #: 1712

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/4/2011 10:37:22 PM

paullus99

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The more airfields you have, the better - since he will eventually (either on purpose or a reaction to your moves) concentrate his airpower against you, the ability to have multiple large airbases will make it difficult, if not impossible for him to shut you down before you can do catastrophic damage to his LBA.

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Post #: 1713

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/4/2011 11:07:03 PM

Canoerebel

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That's a big part of the equation. Already, Palembang and Benkolen are level seven fields (the latter is on the way to level nine); Oosthaven is a nine; Padang is a four; and Djambi, Lahat, and Prabaemolith have small fields which can be built large. So Steve will have trouble shutting down that many fields, especially given the amount of supply and numbe of engineering units around.

Establishing new airfields forward is going to ratchet up the pressure. I think the prospect of losing contorl of the Java Sea, plus airfields that much closer to Balikpan, etc., will hit him right in the gut. He's got to react and violenty, which are conditions in which players can make mistakes. It might also help reduce the pressure against Sumatra, and most likely would make Cocos Island a bit of a backwater.

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Post #: 1714

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/4/2011 11:11:43 PM

vettim89

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

It's so early in the game that the Allies have to be very careful in choosing their battles. Japan has a multitude of infantry divisions available, so there's no way the allies can go toe-to-toe in a major ground campaign until much later in the game.

So the Allies will ignore Java while looking to the very inviting island bases to the north that are still Allied controlled. The Allies can occupy these at low risk, but each will put a great deal of pressure on Japan since the airfields can be built large. Once Steve sees infantry and engineers at Billiton Island, for instance, he's got to react violently. He's already in bad shape in the DEI, but losing control of the Java Sea and seeing growing enemy airfields heading north is going to get his full attention.

Job one for the Allies through the end of '42 is to remain vigilant in protecting Sumatra. Job two is to apply pressure that forces/persuades Japan to make mistakes. So this isn't really about territory; it's about creating a pressure cooker. That's something the Allies can do effectively even this early in the war.

My thinking on this is that your opponent still has four major oil/refinery centers. While not having Palembang certainly puts a serious crimp on the Japanese economy and freedom of operations, it does not mean instant death. That said, Strategic Bombing and/or isolation of those remaining centers is not going to be much of a leap for you. You can be sure that Java will be heavily garrisoned and fortified with such a large Allied force just across the Selat Sunda, so, initially I agree that a counterinvasion there is a bad idea. That said, the one thing Java holds is a shipyard. At present, you center of operations is far away from any major Allied shipyard. If Chez does indeed fortify Java, Malaya becomes much more attractive. That is still months away but the big kuhuna of Singers looks mighty tasty from my stand point.

You can island hop across the western Java Sea to Serawak, Pontianak, and even Kuching. That will effective shut off Miri/Brunei. Then you could then either move toward Bandjermasin to cut off the Strait of Malucca or toward the southern PI to cap the entire SRA. Lots of options here. While this is going on if you keep just a moderate amount of pressure in the NorPac, you will truly strain the Japanese ability to fight on either front with max effort. By developing bases in the western Java Sea, you may eventually be able to use LBA alone to cover your advances. If you are able to do that, your carrier forces can then cause a lot of problems in the Pacific. My thinking is to gradually increase the pressure in the DEI until you can overwhelm the Japanese. If you time it right, the rest of the Pacific may collapse under the weight of even a moderate strength attack

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Post #: 1715

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/5/2011 6:48:22 PM

Canoerebel

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7/24/42

Some folks might be wondering why the Allies aren't pushing even harder than they are. There are two primary reasons: (1) the incredible shortage of political points for the Allies. I have continually drained the pool to permit the operations that have taken place to date, making it hard to orchestrate large new operations that would draw on restricted units; and (2) I have a bit of a transport shortage in the Pacific. Actually, I have quite a few good APs at Pearl Harbor, but I'm careful about using those, reserving them for invasion use rather than routine shuttling of troops from the West Coast to Hawaii. At the moment, I don't have enough xAP available to efficiently handle things. I'm working on that.

DEI: APDs will deliver 1st Marine Raiders to Siberot Island tonight. The APDs will then report to Oosthaven, where I intend to use them in some shuttling of troops to Billiton and Bangka islands (just north of Oosthaven). A base force and an engineer unit bound for Billiton and Toabali (on Bangka) begin loading on transports at Cochin, India, tonight. The Japanese have just landed at Mataram, east of Java, so Steve is attending to some house cleaning in the area.

China: In about two days, Steve will find out that the Chinese are on the move east of Changsha.

NoPac: Transports loaded with a US Army RCT will depart Adak Island tonight and then rendezvous with the combat ships, Wasp, and supply TFs well to the north. I believe these ships will each Para and vicinity in about a week. I'm looking forward to this "raising of the ante" and seeing how Steve reacts.

CenPac: I'm ready to move garrison troops plus engineers to Vanua Lava and Ndeni, but this operation is the vicitm of my xAP shortage at San Diego. I have a bunch of infantry units at Pearl that are prepping for Mili, but Steve is now strongly garrisoning and building that island. So, instead I will divert many of those units to the Santa Cruz operation, which will be effective because it will seriously compromise Steve's LOC to his outposts in New Caledonia, Fiji, and Savaii.

SoPac: Japan's airfield at Savaii just went to level two. Steve is clearly very focused on the campaign in the Samoa region, even though it's taking alot of time, with alot more still to come.

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Post #: 1716

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/5/2011 7:44:10 PM

Canoerebel

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Spurred on by my own thoughts in writing the previous post, I decided to move forward with the Santa Cruz operation. These islands are still Allied territory. I'm hoping I can send in garrisons and engineers "on the quiet," without encountering opposition. But I don't want to risk all my APs that far forward, so I'm going to divide the operation into several segments.

The first segment will be to garrison and begin building Ndeni. 27th RCT, several batallions of 132nd Infantry Division (135 AV; with the rest currently on Ocean Island), and 804 EAB will be sent to Ndeni from Pearl Harbor. I'll be using about eight APs, so this is a pretty "valuable" operation.

As things progress, the Allies will then proceed with the garrisoning of Vanua Lava.

At about the same time, the Allies might try a quicky raid on the IJ base at Luganville. That airfield is still a level zero, suggesting it may be very lightly garrisoned. I'm prepping about 350 AV for that target.

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Post #: 1717

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/5/2011 8:00:35 PM

princep01

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Ndeni is a bold move, but I sure like it. Even given a Scenario 2 game and the fact that it is just July 42, the IJN losses have been significant enough to justify a real offensive. I applaud your brazen courage:). Of course, I would think that getting in clean (unspotted) would be the key to a near bloodless coup de main, but even if you are spotted, it is doubtful he will be in a position to quickly intervene unless he has already disengaged those CVs around Savaii. It is alway possible that they might happen to stumble onto you in your approach. But, short of pure bad luck, you can abort the mission if it is compromised too soon. Lots of time. But, even an aborted mission will have a very negative affect on his already flimsy psychic and set off a rash of alarms.

Good luck. If successful, this will surely force a reduction in his perimeter or isolate most effectively the troops on Fiji and Samoa. Excellent strategy.

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Post #: 1718

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/5/2011 8:52:57 PM

crsutton

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

7/24/42

Some folks might be wondering why the Allies aren't pushing even harder than they are. There are two primary reasons: (1) the incredible shortage of political points for the Allies. I have continually drained the pool to permit the operations that have taken place to date, making it hard to orchestrate large new operations that would draw on restricted units; and (2) I have a bit of a transport shortage in the Pacific. Actually, I have quite a few good APs at Pearl Harbor, but I'm careful about using those, reserving them for invasion use rather than routine shuttling of troops from the West Coast to Hawaii. At the moment, I don't have enough xAP available to efficiently handle things. I'm working on that.

I can't speak for the Japanese side but the designers have done a great job with the PP allotments. My campaign is in 1944 and I am still always short of PP. You get enough but never so many that you can do what you would like to do. I only hope you JFBs are feeling the pinch as well.

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/5/2011 11:27:45 PM

Cribtop

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Oh, yeah. We do. Not quite as acutely IMHO as we have fewer units to buy, but so long as you have to pay PPs to cross boundaries the IJA will have a lot of extra AS in Manchuria and Japan (even China at times) cooling its heels waiting for PPs

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 12:11:23 AM

zuluhour

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CR sorry for the hijack:
Any of you Maryland boys want to meet at Annapolis on a Saturday, tour the museum, gift center (really nice) and swallow some swill on the docks? Im looking at October 20th.

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 1:47:35 AM

JeffroK

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Running 3+ ops, are they going to be able to be "coordinated" so you get Chez running around the Pacific working out how to react to them all?

Should make good reading on page 3 of the magazine.

"Scenic sights of the Kurils, Solomons and South China Sea"

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 2:28:34 AM

rader

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffK

I think CR, and to an extent GreyJoy have shown up a weakness in the methods used by many JFB. (Sorry if I've missed others, I dont read all AAR and I am sure there are JFB showing up weaknesses of AFB)

Many JFB use the KB like a bull in a china shop and dont worry a lot about a solid strategy, they get away with a lot as many AFB go into a shell, do the Sir Robin and allow the JFB to stay on the offensive.

CR marked his line in the sand at Palembang and threw Chez's "plans" into disarray, GreyJoy got cajoled into defending Gcanal and Rader didnt have any other options up his sleeve. Both JFB have then committed major errors and are suffering.

I could imagine both Chez & Rader had plans to sweep across the map (Rader nearly succeeded) and no plans to deal with a determined Allied player.

I hope Chez doesnt throw it in as many illinformed are suggesting, It could be good for JFB to have to fight from this position and in this time period. It would at least provide tips for others. (Maybe lack of an AAR by Chez has taken away some of the support from the crowd that might keep his interest up)

What is that supposed to mean? What major errors?

Sorry for hijacking the thread CR, but this just caught my attention as I was catching up on your AAR. This game is WAYYYY over. Although it could be fun to sweep up the remains of the Japanese Empire in 1943...

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Post #: 1723

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 5:24:47 AM

Ketza

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quote:

ORIGINAL: zuluhour

CR sorry for the hijack:
Any of you Maryland boys want to meet at Annapolis on a Saturday, tour the museum, gift center (really nice) and swallow some swill on the docks? Im looking at October 20th.

I work in Annapolis and know of a nice little spot nearby right on the river across from the Academy.

I am in!

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 6:12:18 AM

JeffroK

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quote:

ORIGINAL: rader

quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffK

I think CR, and to an extent GreyJoy have shown up a weakness in the methods used by many JFB. (Sorry if I've missed others, I dont read all AAR and I am sure there are JFB showing up weaknesses of AFB)

Many JFB use the KB like a bull in a china shop and dont worry a lot about a solid strategy, they get away with a lot as many AFB go into a shell, do the Sir Robin and allow the JFB to stay on the offensive.

CR marked his line in the sand at Palembang and threw Chez's "plans" into disarray, GreyJoy got cajoled into defending Gcanal and Rader didnt have any other options up his sleeve. Both JFB have then committed major errors and are suffering.

I could imagine both Chez & Rader had plans to sweep across the map (Rader nearly succeeded) and no plans to deal with a determined Allied player.

I hope Chez doesnt throw it in as many illinformed are suggesting, It could be good for JFB to have to fight from this position and in this time period. It would at least provide tips for others. (Maybe lack of an AAR by Chez has taken away some of the support from the crowd that might keep his interest up)

What is that supposed to mean? What major errors? Sorry for hijacking the thread CR, but this just caught my attention as I was catching up on your AAR. This game is WAYYYY over. Although it could be fun to sweep up the remains of the Japanese Empire in 1943...

Your game or this?

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 8:10:41 AM

JeffroK

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rader,

I apologise for making comment about yur game, as I would find it hard to explain without making comment about GreyJoy's positions and tactics.

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Post #: 1726

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 1:11:22 PM

rader

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quote:

ORIGINAL: JeffK
Your game or this?

CR's game of course. In GJ/my game, I hope it's not the end, the beginning of the end, or even the end of the beginning (well, it probably is the last of those...

).

Haha, and I don't mind Jeff. Just raised my eyebrows

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Post #: 1727

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 3:37:49 PM

Canoerebel

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7/25/42

I know what rader means about the game being over - about Japan apparently stopped in its tracks too early and with too much untaken. But the game is as exciting to me as any other that I've played, simply because both sides are locked in a taught battle. The only difference is that this battle is taking place in an unusual locale for July '42. Japan remains very powerful - its air hasn't been touched and it has a massive army; so it should be very difficult for the Allies to make progress at this early date. That makes the game challenging. That and my hope that I can whup up on Japan enough to persuade Steve to offer an unconditional surrender. But that won't happen, I think, until the KB is truly destroyed.

NoPac: The reinforcement TF left Adak Island today. Most of the supply TFs and Wasp are already well north of Attu Island. They'll stay there a few days while waiting for the troops, combat TFs, and one lagging supply TF (leaving Dutch Harbor tonight). All these ships should be in position to go into Para (or stand off, in some cases) in about six days. I'm still scrounging to get fighter squadrons to the western Aleutians that can make the hop to Para's airfield. I should have at least one Marine F4F, one Army P-39, plus Wasps' fighters, should I elect to move them to land. I have more coming, but getting them from the West Coast to the western Aleutians is often a hodge-podge effort that sometimes includes using air transport TFs to make the move from Juneau to Adak (because every squadron I send to Juneau seems to incur massive disablement problems that are slow in resolving).

CenPac: The Ndeni force departed Pearl Harbor yesterday.

SoPac: SigInt that more IJ troops are bound for Savaii Island.

DEI: Marine raiders landed at Siberot Island yesterday. An Indian tank unit comes ashore at Oosthaven tomorrow, barring interference. This unit will be "swapped" for an infantry unit, which I plan to transport via APD to either Toabali or Billiton Island. The window following the Battle of Oosthaven in which the Allies had no battleships in the DEI is about to close. BC Repulse will arrive at Cocos Island in two days. BB Valiant will arrive there in about five days. Warspite and North Carolina are currently midway between New Zeland and Melbourne. They should be on station in ten days to two weeks.

China: Tomorrow, two CHinese stacks will reach the "jump off" hexes east of Changsha. The larger stack (6100 AV) will be one hex west of Nanchang, which I believe is lightly held, and which is not on a railroad, making reinforcement by Japan a challenge. The smaller stack (2300 AV) will be across the river to the south, facing - and hopefully holding in place - an IJ army of three units (believed to include at least one division).

< Message edited by Canoerebel -- 10/6/2011 3:42:08 PM >

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Post #: 1728

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 5:25:20 PM

obvert

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How is your supply in China? It seems to be good if you're undertaking offensive campaigns there.

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Post #: 1729

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 5:39:42 PM

Canoerebel

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Good question.

Chinese supply is mixed, but thus far hasn't reached crisis levels anywhere in the game - mostly because Japan has been on the defensive.

My big stack east of Changsha is fully supplied, as is Changsha itself. My small stack a bit to the south at Pingsiang has real supply problems. My other big stack, up in the cournty between Nanning and Chengchow, is a bit short of supply.

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/6/2011 9:57:15 PM

crsutton

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CR, I checked out the web site for your magazine. Looks interesting. I am a cracker myself. Born in Villa Rica. My family home is in Clarkston. My great aunt deeded the place to the City Parks in 1970 and it is now a nature preserve. My dad is buried there and I have not been down in three decades. Planning a trip soon.

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 2:43:39 AM

rader

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Canoerebel

I know what rader means about the game being over - about Japan apparently stopped in its tracks too early and with too much untaken. But the game is as exciting to me as any other that I've played, simply because both sides are locked in a taught battle. The only difference is that this battle is taking place in an unusual locale for July '42. Japan remains very powerful - its air hasn't been touched and it has a massive army; so it should be very difficult for the Allies to make progress at this early date. That makes the game challenging. That and my hope that I can whup up on Japan enough to persuade Steve to offer an unconditional surrender. But that won't happen, I think, until the KB is truly destroyed.

Sorry, I didn't mean "over" as in it wouldn't be a fun spirited game, I just meant that Japan at this point has virtually no chance of winning without having access to Palembang, ever. This shouldn't mean that it can't still be fun for both players to play out to the bitter end. And Japan should be able to kick for a while yet. I'm quite interested to see how it goes. I'll just shut up and let you get on with the AAR...

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Post #: 1732

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 3:02:31 AM

zuluhour

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great! Im planning on visiting USNA mid morning around lunch (sorry again for hijack) I ll PM ya soon.
crsutton? you up

< Message edited by zuluhour -- 10/7/2011 3:03:58 AM >

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 4:14:58 AM

Cribtop

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CR,

Did your Chinese supply situation result from holding industry under Allied control? Flying in supplies over the Hump? Keeping the Burma Road open? Judicious limits on offensive Ops?

Inquiring minds about to play a PBEM as Allies for the first time want to know.

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RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 8:58:40 AM

obvert

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quote:

CR,

Did your Chinese supply situation result from holding industry under Allied control? Flying in supplies over the Hump? Keeping the Burma Road open? Judicious limits on offensive Ops?

Inquiring minds about to play a PBEM as Allies for the first time want to know.

Inquiring minds playing their first PBEM and wanting to play Allies want to know as well! It's always a bit of a mystery in China for me. Chunking holds onto a lot, and the region around Changsha seems to do well, but everywhere else seems on the verge of collapse for me even with the B R open.

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Post #: 1735

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 2:25:36 PM

Canoerebel

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Unfortunately, I can't boast of doing anything by design to keep the Chinese in decent supply. No supply has gone over the hump (it's going to Schewebo to keep the Allied Expeditionary Army in Burma supplied). Early in the game, when the Burma Road was still open, I landed supply at Rangoon, but it wasn't much and I'm not sure any of it went to China. So neither of these two stratagems are the reason the supply situation is decent.

I don't have abundant supply in China, but I do have decent levels, especially around Changsha. The Sian sector, on the other hand, seems pretty short.

Japan hasn't been aggressive in China in the game - the Chinese offensives hae instead kept Japan on its heels most of the time. The Chinese roughed up at least seven IJA divisions, so now Japan is on the defensive, hunkered down in major cities. As a result, the Chinese still hold the important supply centers (Sian, Changsha, etc.). Also, while the Chinese have engaged in some focused offensive activity, they haven't been going bezerk all over the place for extended periods. This has probably helped with the supply situation.

India is flush with supply with all the convoys coming in from Abadan and Capetown since the beginning of the game. It is possible that some of this is trickling hex-by-hex across the map into China. But that's just a guess.

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Post #: 1736

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 3:43:26 PM

Canoerebel

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7/26/42

CenPac: The KB, or part thereof, is on a SE course east of Makin Island and Tarawa. Gar missed Zuikaku (the only carrier sighted, but there should be more) with a spread of six torps, and patrols picked up the TF later in the day. Allied transports to the south will spread out and flee to the south, though there's nothing really important anywhere close. With enemy carriers in CenPac, the Allies will have to be careful in the operation to occupy and build Ndeni and Vanua Lava, but it's worth a shot.

NoPac: Most of the TFs have rendezvoued to the NW of Attu Island. The final supply TF is probably two days away. The resupply/reinforcement TFs will likely go in to Para in five or six days.

SoPac: More signs of IJ focus on Savaii Island and Pago Pago (SigInt: a unit bound for IJ-controlled Savaii, and another prepping to attack Pago Pago).

DEI: The APDs are at Oosthaven. They'll make a quick supply run to Toabali, pre-positioning some supply for the troops that will follow in a week or so. It will be dangerous duty for the APDs - Oosthaven is forward port exposed to enemy combat ship raids, and any exposure at Toabali or Billiton will likely draw massed enemy air attacks. There is a good chance the APDs will encounter disaster sooner or later, but this is the kind of duty they are perfect for. Rather than stripping any units from Sumatra, I may await arrival of several combat units currently enroute from India, including an American RCT and the East African unit. Those two will likely go to Toabali and Billiton, respectively. I need engineers at both bases - one unit is enroute from India; the other I may have to take from Oosthaven (probably the Kiwi pioneer unit). Ent and York are ready at Colombo, but they'll wait two days for CAs San Francisco and Indianapolis to finish upgrades.

IO/Burma: No apparent and imminent Japanese moves on Port Blair or upper Burma.

China: The big Chinese stack just arrived across river from Nanchang and report two units. The stack will now proceed to attack. This should take three or four days before the crossing occurs.

(in reply to Canoerebel)

Post #: 1737

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 4:54:07 PM

crsutton

Posts: 9590
Joined: 12/6/2002
From: Maryland
Status: offline

quote:

ORIGINAL: zuluhour

great! Im planning on visiting USNA mid morning around lunch (sorry again for hijack) I ll PM ya soon.
crsutton? you up

Thanks for the offer but I am off to Austin today for some fun. Gonna go see BB King and then hang out at the clubs. Great Music everywhere.

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(in reply to zuluhour)

Post #: 1738

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 5:28:35 PM

zuluhour

Posts: 5244
Joined: 1/20/2011
From: Maryland
Status: offline

I was at BB Kings joint on 42nd street this year, Luciles I think it was called. I asked for a VT and some Buddy Guy, I was quickly oblidged. Have fun.

(in reply to crsutton)

Post #: 1739

RE: Das darf nicht var sein! - 10/7/2011 5:57:19 PM

Cribtop

Posts: 3890
Joined: 8/10/2008
From: Lone Star Nation
Status: offline

Come on down, crsutton! Most of us Austinites will be in Dallas for the Texas - OU game, but enjoy the town while we're away.

Speaking of which, it's 11:55am and OU still sucks!

Despite that, I predict we play them tight but lose. We're better, but not quite ready for a top 5 team.

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(in reply to zuluhour)

Post #: 1740